Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

Trigger

Robson99 wrote: »

I hope I'm wrong and hope he can change his stlye to try and be positive in the big games.
I agree City have been unreal this season and it has been a couple of years in the making. But if thats the level the bar is being set at well then its up to Club and the Manager to reach that bar. How I dont know maybe throw another € 200 or € 300 million at it

Alex Ferguson, the GOAT, typically lined up with a 5 man midfield and played a direct counter attacking game against the biggest teams..

With regards losses and points totals,Just look at the losses and draws in his last season..

Losses
Everton
Spurs
Norwich
City
Chelsea

Draws
Swansea
Spurs
West Ham
Arsenal
And the mad 5 all with West Brom

pjohnson

astradave wrote: »

Alex Ferguson, the GOAT, typically lined up with a 5 man midfield and played a direct counter attacking game against the biggest teams..

With regards losses and points totals,Just look at the losses and draws in his last season..

Losses
Everton
Spurs
Norwich
City
Chelsea

Draws
Swansea
Spurs
West Ham
Arsenal
And the mad 5 all with West Brom

You could always trust Park and Fletcher to step in for the big games.

Robson99

astradave wrote: »

Alex Ferguson, the GOAT, typically lined up with a 5 man midfield and played a direct counter attacking game against the biggest teams..

With regards losses and points totals,Just look at the losses and draws in his last season..

Losses
Everton
Spurs
Norwich
City
Chelsea

Draws
Swansea
Spurs
West Ham
Arsenal
And the mad 5 all with West Brom

How did tthe late great Sir Matt Busby do in his last season as a matter of interest ?

wanderer100

Good point. Refereeing in the PL is a joke at times

https://twitter.com/telegraphducker/status/936158122284068865

Tylerdurex

Robson99 wrote: »

There is none of them managing one of the top teams in the world

Conte Arsene and Poch are

TheDoc

bangkok wrote: »

Wayne Rooney hat trick.... last goal from inside his own half

I'm actually unsure if Joe hart has arms. Like I know there is something in his sleeves, but they might actually be a load of sponges to give the perception he does have hands.

What a horrendous keeper, can't believe the general media outrage over Pep binning him, he so terrible.

Great strike and finish from Rooney. Was happy for him and Everton who are in the pits. Be cool for him to lead a revival.

I run a series of "**** X says" (x being mte in work) as he typically has a hilarious outlook on football, mostly to make me bite on stuff but this mornings posit on the wall is

Rooney playing at six is like if the jip bank had a mare, and sperm from Pirlo, Lampard and Roy Keane all got thrown in a mixer by accident

TheDoc

thelad95 wrote: »

One season wonder who’s failed miserably at Chelsea and Roma.

lul wut?

TheDoc

nullzero wrote: »

Just when the league looked like becoming interesting.

How has Pep Guardiola managed to take this group of rag tag journeymen to this level of footballing brilliance? The man in either a genius or a miracle worker.

I'd hope that doesn't become a narrative to belittle a rival.

We have a manager who builds teams in the same way, and has the same requirements before he can believe himself in a position to start doing things properly. They are basically the same manager, apart from their footballing ideals.

One has a team absolutely spitfiring like monsters, the other has definitely improved the club and team, but has been unable to arrest the inconsistency and propensity for brutal performances that were present before he arrived and has continued under his stewardship.

Mitch Connor

wanderer100 wrote: »

Good point. Refereeing in the PL is a joke at times

https://twitter.com/telegraphducker/status/936158122284068865

Jose was mid match (and a joke he got sent off for it), Pep was celebrating a goal. Completely different. Same way the players aren't booked for running off the pitch or subs booked for coming on to the pitch when celebrating.

Pep's berating of Redmond should possibly be looked at but its not like he shoved him so I dunno....

TheDoc

nullzero wrote: »

Honestly, with they money that's been invested into that club they should have won the league every year for the last seven years.
I'd be delighted to see the wheels fall off, obviously because city have no business being in the position they find themselves in these days but perhaps more so to do with the fact that Guardiola is a manager who has had every advantage it's possible to have had in his career and is treated as if he's working miracles in the same way Brian Clough did with Derby and Forest. Guardiola is the perfect hero figure for the modern world, full of hot air.

Oh so you did go there......

The only issue I take with City is the fact their success is on the back of where the money comes from, and how that money is made. But that's a level of principle that likely most football fans care about, not least City fans or player or managers.

Going to be a bit grim if this is the sort of guff though people come out about Guardiola, especially considering you can replace the name with Mourinho and it still hold weight in nearly every sentence or paragraph you see written where someone takes this line or stance.

Trigger

Robson99 wrote: »

How did tthe late great Sir Matt Busby do in his last season as a matter of interest ?

Or maybe judge an era with an appropriate era?

Mitch Connor

TheDoc wrote: »

Oh so you did go there......

The only issue I take with City is the fact their success is on the back of where the money comes from, and how that money is made. But that's a level of principle that likely most football fans care about, not least City fans or player or managers.

Going to be a bit grim if this is the sort of guff though people come out about Guardiola, especially considering you can replace the name with Mourinho and it still hold weight in nearly every sentence or paragraph you see written where someone takes this line or stance.

I'd argue Jose winning the CL with Porto and (possibly less so) Inter were huge achievements.

Winning the league with Porto, Chelsea and Madrid would have been expected given the squads and money he had and the circumstances (with Inter - Juve, Milan issues).

TheDoc

TheDoc wrote: »

I'm actually unsure if Joe hart has arms. Like I know there is something in his sleeves, but they might actually be a load of sponges to give the perception he does have hands.

What a horrendous keeper, can't believe the general media outrage over Pep binning him, he so terrible.

Great strike and finish from Rooney. Was happy for him and Everton who are in the pits. Be cool for him to lead a revival.

I run a series of "**** X says" (x being mte in work) as he typically has a hilarious outlook on football, mostly to make me bite on stuff but this mornings posit on the wall is

Ha brilliant..... I agree he's a poor goalie and always has been

Robson99

astradave wrote: »

Or maybe judge an era with an appropriate era?

Neither have any relevance to the current situtation nor should be used to compare. The game has moved on since SAF retired

pjohnson

TheDoc wrote: »

I'm actually unsure if Joe hart has arms. Like I know there is something in his sleeves, but they might actually be a load of sponges to give the perception he does have hands.

What a horrendous keeper, can't believe the general media outrage over Pep binning him, he so terrible.

Great strike and finish from Rooney. Was happy for him and Everton who are in the pits. Be cool for him to lead a revival.

I run a series of "**** X says" (x being mte in work) as he typically has a hilarious outlook on football, mostly to make me bite on stuff but this mornings posit on the wall is

I think most of the outrage over the Hart thing was due to Claudio Bravo supposedly being the improvement

Tylerdurex

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I can see us beating Arsenal, I struggle to see us beating City.

The league being over is something I have a struggle with. I just don't know how to process that hypothetical - because of two facts.

1. Points wise - we are having one of our strongest seasons ever.
2. City's results are INSANE.

The only way United could be ahead of City is if we had won every single match in the league this season. City have dropped points by dropping points in one match, in one draw, this season. I know City have done this, but I don't think that run of form/results is something you can expect from any side. That United aren't matching that....I just can't get worked up over it. In terms of points I don't think dropping 10 points over 14 games is a huge failure - maybe we could have a reasonable expectation to be maybe 4 points better off? (win vs Huddersfield and a draw vs Chelsea). The performances vs Stoke and Liverpool were disappointing but I don't think the results themselves are something people can really argue are unacceptable if you consider you are going to drop points at some point over a full season (unless you are chelsea...)

United could finished on 90 points this season and still finish 10 points off City (just an example). 10 points off the title sounds like failure - but how could hitting 90 points really be considered a failure?

City's insane form is making our results look poor by comparison, but in isolation I don't think our results arethat bad that Jose should be under real pressure.

Despite what your saying we are very far from being the finished article.

We are relying on two 20 year old too much and Rashford is way over rated. It should be one or the other on the left wing. Even at that Jose still wanted Perisic. We need a fully developed right forward like Robben his his prime.We lack a midfielder that can control a game like Kroos or Verratti . Pogba is over rated. I mean what exactly is he? Doesn't want to do any defensive work so can't be trusted in a 2 man midfield but also doesn't quite have the creativity or goals output of a pure number 10. Look at the size of the fecker . He should be like Patrick Vieira on Steroids .Instead he looks like a kid on a school yard playing 5 aside. None of the very top sides would have had any interest in lukaku except maybe Chelsea but they ended up with the better player . We need 2 full backs. The need for a left back is obvious and whilst Valencia is is a good athlete his delivery into the box is woeful . He's also 33 now that pace won't last forever. All the things I mentioned Jose had in spades in his first Chelsea team . I'd fancy that team to do a number in this city team . For Jose to get the most out of his system he needs killers for forwards . Lukaku and Rashford ain't Drogba or Robben

Trigger

Robson99 wrote: »

Neither have any relevance to the current situtation nor should be used to compare. The game has moved on since SAF retired

Then you can’t use the phrase(or similar) “it’s not the Man Utd way” the game has moved on as you yourself has stated..

Robson99

astradave wrote: »

Then you can’t use the phrase(or similar) “it’s not the Man Utd way” the game has moved on as you yourself has stated..

Moving on does'nt mean entertaining football has ceased. The Man Utd way is entertaining football. Barca, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich Man City all play entertining football

Robson99

Robson99 wrote: »

Moving on does'nt mean entertaining football has ceased. The Man Utd way is entertaining football. Barca, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich Man City all play entertining football

Oh Dear this again

So you have not been entertained this season by Utd scoring 32 goals?

Robson99

Robson99 wrote: »

When people talk abouth the top teams / clubs in the world the usually talk about Barcelona, Real Madrid Manchester United. But I think you know what I meant. Let me rephrase it - one of the biggest clubs in the world

And Utd are Challenging on all fronts
Maybe wait until the end of the season to pass judgement
If you believe Utd are under pressure in the position they are in at this stage of the season I really think you are being unreasonable

Robson99

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Oh Dear this again

So you have not been entertained this season by Utd scoring 32 goals?

In some of the games against piss poor opposition yes. In the bigger games not one bit

Robson99

Robson99 wrote: »

In some of the games against piss poor opposition yes. In the bigger games not one bit

Do you actually remember Fergusons reign?
Do you consider the rework that has had to be done since Fergies final days / Moyes & LVG all adding to the task?

pjohnson

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Oh Dear this again

So you have not been entertained this season by Utd scoring 32 goals?

Why accept mediocrity? Why not 62 goals?

Trigger

Robson99 wrote: »

Moving on does'nt mean entertaining football has ceased. The Man Utd way is entertaining football. Barca, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich Man City all play entertining football

We play entertaining football for the majority of games.. if you class Ferguson’s tenure as playing the Man Utd way you will also class this season as it.. Ferguson regularly packed the midfield and killed the games against the big teams and also built great teams on defensive stability and counter attacking football..

Imo “the Man Utd Way” is pure bull**** and used by spoiled fans looking for a way to criticise the manager..

Robson99

M!Ck^ wrote: »

And Utd are Challenging on all fronts
Maybe wait until the end of the season to pass judgement
If you believe Utd are under pressure in the position they are in at this stage of the season I really think you are being unreasonable

Fair enough and maybe my expectations are high but I dont think its unreleastic to expect us to go out and have a go in the big games. I hope we go at Arsenal and City like we should have Liverpool. IMO we would have beaten Liverpool if we went for the kill. There comes a stage when you have to start beating your nearset rivals rather that being afraid to lose against them

Mitch Connor

pjohnson wrote: »

Why accept mediocrity? Why not 62 goals?

2nd highest scorers in the league is mediocrity?

Yes, I'd love us to be the hightest, and top of the league having won 14 of 14 - but I don't think where United are should be seen as a failure.

Mitch Connor

Robson99 wrote: »

Fair enough and maybe my expectations are high but I dont think its unreleastic to expect us to go out and have a go in the big games. I hope we go at Arsenal and City like we should have Liverpool. IMO we would have beaten Liverpool if we went for the kill. There comes a stage when you have to start beating your nearset rivals rather that being afraid to lose against them

We should have been more attacking vs Liverpool but players playing crap cost us more there than the base formation, imo. We have played a similar formation/style before and done well and looked good with it.

We should be looking to be more offensive vs Arsenal.

I don't think we can afford to go after City - they are too good in attack. The City game will require a solid defensive performance and quick breaks well executed to try stretch them defensively.

Robson99

Mitch Connor wrote: »

2nd highest scorers in the league is mediocrity?

Yes, I'd love us to be the hightest, and top of the league having won 14 of 14 - but I don't think where United are should be seen as a failure.

I think he was having one of his Brendan O Carroll moments

Trigger

Mitch Connor wrote: »

We should have been more attacking vs Liverpool but players playing crap cost us more there than the base formation, imo. We have played a similar formation/style before and done well and looked good with it.

We should be looking to be more offensive vs Arsenal.

I don't think we can afford to go after City - they are too good in attack. The City game will require a solid defensive performance and quick breaks well executed to try stretch them defensively.

The base formation and tactics were absolutely spot on against Liverpool, it’s absolutely the way to play against them.. the players let the club down that day.. they couldn’t pass the ball 5 yards sideways for most of the match

Trigger

Mitch Connor wrote: »

2nd highest scorers in the league is mediocrity?

Yes, I'd love us to be the hightest, and top of the league having won 14 of 14 - but I don't think where United are should be seen as a failure.

You might need to turn up your sarcasm detector there Mitch

TheDoc

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Who's behind him?

GIVE IT TEH GIGGSY

TheDoc

astradave wrote: »

So in the Hypothetical situation that we lose and perform badly in both, you would presumably want Jose out of the club, who, in your opinion, would you like to replace him with realistically?

Also directed at Secman who seems to ignore me every time I ask this question to him.

You know the way they say family skills and genes can skip a generation. Like I'm not good at stuff my Dad is good at, but am good at what my grandad was good at.

Anyone having a look at Fergies grandkids?

Trigger

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I don't think we can afford to go after City - they are too good in attack. The City game will require a solid defensive performance and quick breaks well executed to try stretch them defensively.

Also I believe a 352 would be the way to go against City and use the Wingbacks to push up into the space left open by the attacking fullbacks on the City team

pjohnson

Mitch Connor wrote: »

2nd highest scorers in the league is mediocrity?

Yes, I'd love us to be the hightest, and top of the league having won 14 of 14 - but I don't think where United are should be seen as a failure.

I think you missed my sarcasm.......

TheDoc

Drumpot wrote: »

Any other season united would be much closer to city or top. City’s form has been exceptional and record breaking, so why judge Jose against a record that even SAF didn’t match?

In fairness I'd be of the opinion that managers are judged on the current environment and scenario, not what went before or the likes.

Fergie couldn't deal with Mourinho first time around, and only for that self implosion things could have been a lot different.

He certaintly had his struggles dealing with City at times. But one of his brilliance was going away in a summer, likely before, and hed work out what needed to happen to get back to being champions.

City playing this sort of football is no surprise. A team under Guardiola looking like a sure thing, shouldn't be a surprise. You would have to be the biggest Pep sceptic to not have seen this sort of thing coming.

So I definitly don't think it's an excuse for us. Just because they are playing so well. That just means you need to keep the pace, beat the rest, and then go toe to toe in the head to heads. We've dropped silly points, City havn't. They might still do, but we defo cant afford anymore. We definitely need to go and win the big games.

Harping back to what Fergie did, or what normally was fine, or "oh look at Poch his big game record is rubbish" is just smokescreens, diversions. It's not good. You need to be doing whats required in the current scenario, in the current environment. Everything else is just an excuse which really shouldn't be accepted by fans of a club our size.

When its all said and done, only one team can win it. You can have run a good race and lose, and its not a catastrophe. There is every chance of finishing the season with silverware and not the league.

But I'd prefer if it was the scenario that we can sit there and say, and I say we, I know most will, I mean mostly the club, the players, particularly our manager, just simply be like " They were phenomonal, we tried our best and we couldn't do it" and there wont be any problems.

But this excuses crap being put forward on behalf of our team and players, that just doesn't sit well with me. That basically says that we just need to wait for Pep to leave or retire before we get back in the mix?

No way. Expect our club and manager to go away and figure it out, try something new, have a plan.

And I still, be it nievely, believe City will have a crack at somepoint. It's all about if we can keep applying the pressure to compound the pressure. No use them dropping points, and us doing the same, which we tend to do.

I still don't buy into this "City is the best squad by miles" I think we are both very comparible in terms of quality and I actually think we have much better squad depth, so for me I'm not buying into things being wrapped up and think we still have every chance. But we very much need to approach the big games differently.

Trigger

TheDoc wrote: »

You know the way they say family skills and genes can skip a generation. Like I'm not good at stuff my Dad is good at, but am good at what my grandad was good at.

Anyone having a look at Fergies grandkids?

Once they don’t take after either of their dads at ALL.. dodgy agents and mediocre manager

TheDoc

beno619 wrote: »

José was under pressure a couple of weeks ago if we were to draw the next two games or worse I don't think it's crazy to suggest he would be under pressure again. Regardless of how good/bad a job the fanbase believe he has done.

I'd imagine his messing around with PSG and his contract likely won't provide him a lot of goodwill if things do turn sour quickly.

But I don't think we will see the levels of Van Gaal pressure, cause Mourinho would likely just get himself fired or something

TheDoc

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I'd argue Jose winning the CL with Porto and (possibly less so) Inter were huge achievements.

Winning the league with Porto, Chelsea and Madrid would have been expected given the squads and money he had and the circumstances (with Inter - Juve, Milan issues).

They are indeed huge achievements. But for you to say you'd argue, would imply you think Pep's Barca CL victories were just a given, and anyone could have done it?

TheDoc

pjohnson wrote: »

I think most of the outrage over the Hart thing was due to Claudio Bravo supposedly being the improvement

Well it was really about the England No.1 getting canned wasn't it?

But like, he is dire for England, he's just a really bang average PL keeper. Nothing special about him what so ever. It's kind of hilarious.

I'm waiting for Bilic to come out to speak a bit about his West Ham issues and I'd except/hope to read

"Of course we leaked goals, of course. You watch football yes? MY employers went and brought Joe Hart to the club at great expense, so I'm pressured into picking him. Have you seen Joe Hart? Of course we conceeded goals."

TheDoc

Robson99 wrote: »

Moving on does'nt mean entertaining football has ceased. The Man Utd way is entertaining football. Barca, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich Man City all play entertining football

To you it was.

To most the definition of the United way, was glory and success, and winning. We played as much garbage, had as much shock results and poor performances and tactical ineptitude under Ferguson as we had since.

His extended spell seems to just make people forget the bad stuff and remember all the good, and of course there was loads. But we are seeing so much in microcosm of three managers since that it clearly distorts peoples views.

I remember many, MANY a saturday afternoon especially, it was always the saturday early kickoffs, being bored of my tits watching us at Old Trafford, go through a run of the mill victory, or sometimes poor result. That is such a vivid thing for me. Wonder if its based in any reality, just feels something that happened a lot. Some **** bag team coming to stack up players and try the counter and we just coasted

Jayop

Mitch Connor wrote: »

2nd highest scorers in the league is mediocrity?

Yes, I'd love us to be the hightest, and top of the league having won 14 of 14 - but I don't think where United are should be seen as a failure.

Whoosh

PJ is in fine form this morning. Made me lol twice.

astradave

astradave wrote: »

The base formation and tactics were absolutely spot on against Liverpool, it’s absolutely the way to play against them.. the players let the club down that day.. they couldn’t pass the ball 5 yards sideways for most of the match

christ we didnt beat the first man with one corner all game so ****ing poor that day

Jayop

[Deleted User] wrote: »

christ we didnt beat the first man with one corner all game so ****ing poor that day

Couldn't agree more wity regards the liverpool game. We hadn't set up ultra defensive at all in my view, it was the fact we were unable to retain possession for more than 2 passes. I'll never get over the throw ins that day. Every time we had one it was back with them within 3 seconds. Remarkable.

J. Marston

Screenshots of 3 year old posts? Chriiiiist. Did he delete the post? I can only see the quoted stuff.

Wonder if he has a file on me? I remember talking shít about Coutinho around 18 months ago.

Liam McPoyle

J. Marston wrote: »

Screenshots of 3 year old posts? Chriiiiist. Did he delete the post? I can only see the quoted stuff.

Wonder if he has a file on me? I remember talking shít about Coutinho around 18 months ago.

Didn't you realise that what ever you post on Boards is your firm belief forever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever.

Your opinions cannot change.

You cannot admit you were wrong.

If you posted it then you will die by it.

Trigger

TheDoc wrote: »

Well it was really about the England No.1 getting canned wasn't it?

But like, he is dire for England, he's just a really bang average PL keeper. Nothing special about him what so ever. It's kind of hilarious.

I'm waiting for Bilic to come out to speak a bit about his West Ham issues and I'd except/hope to read

"Of course we leaked goals, of course. You watch football yes? MY employers went and brought Joe Hart to the club at great expense, so I'm pressured into picking him. Have you seen Joe Hart? Of course we conceeded goals."

Hart was an extremely gifted underage keeper with potential to develop into one of the very best. He unfortunately never pushed on and developed the mental side of the game that is so important to a top level keeper IMO.. the likes of Nueur Cortuois and DeGea have that confidence and concentration level that they can stand around for 89 mins and the 1 time they are needed they are on the ball.. Hart seems to lack that element from his game and his concentration drifts so he seems to be out of position a lot when the shots come in and his reactions are late also..

S.M.B.

TheDoc wrote: »

It kinda doesnt matter about that original point, there has been a clear and present trend of "Pogba isn't important" going through the thread for some time now. So it's somewhat natural when people are talking they are probably going to roll into the higher level debate that has been here

While that may happen it doesn't mean it should. Just like any small but potentially valid criticism of the team or Jose shouldn't automatically lead to a higher level debate within a handful of posts.

It's taking one posters comment and filtering it through months and months of disagreement and hostility.

Is it not a bit sad when the original point of comment on a discussion forum 'doesn't matter'?

J. Marston

J. Marston wrote: »

Screenshots of 3 year old posts? Chriiiiist. Did he delete the post? I can only see the quoted stuff.

Wonder if he has a file on me? I remember talking shít about Coutinho around 18 months ago.

Mitch Connor

TheDoc wrote: »

They are indeed huge achievements. But for you to say you'd argue, would imply you think Pep's Barca CL victories were just a given, and anyone could have done it?

In a way yes. Barcelona were the best team with some of the best players ever to play football. I don't think winning with them marks you as an amazing manager. I wouldn't say they were a given but they were favourites every time they played and thus any loss (including the final) would be an upset.

I would say Bayern failure to win the CL under pep is more a black mark than winning it with barca was a gold star.

I haven't seen pep win anything that they weren't Strong favorites for.

I think he is an excellent manager, and I wish he was united manager, but the trophies he's won are what would have been expected of him.

In fact, I would say city's end results last season should be considered a failure and hugely disappointing.

TheDoc

S.M.B. wrote: »

While that may happen it doesn't mean it should. Just like any small but potentially valid criticism of the team or Jose shouldn't automatically lead to a higher level debate within a handful of posts.

It's taking one posters comment and filtering it through months and months of disagreement and hostility.

Is it not a bit sad when the original point of comment on a discussion forum 'doesn't matter'?

I'd say it doesn't matter to a poster responding if they feel there is "thing" of cherry picking a specific to suit their point of view.

Not saying that was the case, I just posted about it being a thing in the thread for the last while, and thought I'd take the rare opportunity to side in with Bangkok before we go back to our opposite sides of the fence