Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

Liam O

I think Martial would make a very good second striker or AM. I seen him play there for France once and he was brilliant. He wouldn't be a traditional No. 10 in that his game isn't about passing but his ability to run from deep and pull players out of position is great and means he can play people through as well as go for goal himself. It won't happen but it's something I've always wanted to see tried.

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Mata, Martial, Micki should be our pen takers. Very quick feet and highly accurate. Also quick decision makers so able to read the keeper well.

bucketybuck

Deleted User wrote: »

I thought Martial had a poor game against Basel, however I think that days like today show that he gets a harder ride than Rashford from fans.

Rashford has earned that easier ride though, he gets a pass for a poor game because of all the times he stepped up and put in a performance. He is far from the finished article but he has more good games than bad.

Martial used to get that easy ride, he coasted on a good start to his United career for a long long time. But at this point there are far more underwhelming performances than there are overwhelming ones, so a bad performance will get noted as more of the same while praise for a good game has to be given cautiously, because its likely to be followed by another disappearance.

Thats not the fans fault, its all on the players and their consistency. If Martial ever starts putting a run of consistently good games together then he will get a pass on the odd blip as well.

Small sample size but not a big fan of lukaku taking the freekicks on goal. 2 really poor efforts in a few games. Only small complaint after the game

Liam O

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Small sample size but not a big fan of lukaku taking the freekicks on goal. 2 really poor efforts in a few games. Only small complaint after the game

I know he was off for the Lukaku one but no idea why Mata doesn't take all the frees. He was unbelievably good at them while at Chelsea and just seems to get bullied out of them at United.

brinty

how.gareth wrote: »

Jesus you sound so drunk ye might need a pump out!

Get fellaini to do it
He'd love that

jayo26

He is back

brinty

jayo26 wrote: »

He is back

Mick will love that one

adox

adox wrote: »

I agree that Rashford was poor today. You could nearly see from the start that he wasn't at it, couldn't get his feet sorted etc.

However I think he still offers more playing poorly than Martial does playing poorly. He can play that wide left channel more naturally. He still found space, made some good runs and dragged a CB out on numerous occasions. Martial more often than not comes inside into traffic and runs into a dead end(when not playing well).

I think Rashford is a more intelligent footballer out wide than Martial. I think Martial is currently a more intelligent centre forward than Rashford. Martial actually has more natural talent to beat a player or two but Rashford is no slouch with the hall at his feet and uses his pace more than Martial when out wide. He makes the right runs most of the time.

It's why I still think Lingard is still a very important squad player for the team. He is by far the most intelligent forward for making runs and finding space which is essential against both teams playing defensively and also counter attacking. Unfortunately he doesn't have the footballing ability of the other two.

Eventually I'd like to see both Martial and Rashford playing in the wider forward positions this season. The formation is set up perfectly for two fast wide players.

Mata I think is leading a bit of a charmed life at the moment getting a starting position. Only for Martial not really showing form when staring I think Mata would be out of the team or competing with Miki for that no 10 position.

I agree with a lot of that, especially about Rashford's intelligence out on the wing and his work-rate overall. I think at the moment Martial pips Rashford in technical ability, but as you say, Rashford is no slouch with the ball at his feet either.

I also agree that Martial's invisibility act in a match by default is a lot worse than Rashford's. Rashford is better at being 'quiet but effective' than Martial. However, it can go both ways. Between these two games this week where I reckon they both had a very poor starting performance each - Martial played a nice, first time through-ball in the first half against Basel for one of our lads (think it was Mkhi) and it lead to our best (non-scoring) chance of the first half. He was poor overall in that game, but still provided that near all-important moment of magic.

Don't get me wrong by the way, I'm a big fan of Rashford and don't want to see numerous posts criticising him. I'm a big fan of both of them and think we're lucky to have them and their potential. Rashford even said himself recently that the competition between he and Martial is driving him on to be better. So despite criticism I have great hope for both of them, I just think some people, not necessarily you adox, I just used your post to make a point, relish getting the chance to stick the boot into Martial rather than applying objective criticism.

bucketybuck wrote: »

Rashford has earned that easier ride though, he gets a pass for a poor game because of all the times he stepped up and put in a performance. He is far from the finished article but he has more good games than bad.

Martial used to get that easy ride, he coasted on a good start to his United career for a long long time. But at this point there are far more underwhelming performances than there are overwhelming ones, so a bad performance will get noted as more of the same while praise for a good game has to be given cautiously, because its likely to be followed by another disappearance.

Thats not the fans fault, its all on the players and their consistency. If Martial ever starts putting a run of consistently good games together then he will get a pass on the odd blip as well.

I agree about Rashford building up a bit more good will. Even during a goal drought last season, Rashford was contributing very well elsewhere and had his manager singling him out for praise. But I don't think that's just it when it comes to the criticism Martial can receive. Rashford hasn't exactly been world class in a lot of his games himself, certainly not enough to get so much of a pass over Martial for performances like against Everton. Were you not saying yourself in the past that Rashford was one of the ones who needed to step-up last season with goals? (Apologies if I'm mistaken) IMO, they're both on a similar quest in needing to improve on last season and 'passes' are limited enough for both of them.

With Martial this season so far, I'd suggest (and did in a response to you last week which might have went unseen) that the poor Basel performance which was typical of too many of Martial's last season, was the exception to a good start to the new season for him. So there might have been definitely were far more underwhelming performances than overwhelming ones last season, but this season he is showing some positives so far and it's a lot more promising from him than foreboding.

What metric are we trying to judge him by anyway? Because there is a middle-ground between underwhelming and overwhelming which is quite acceptable for our players to perform at. Are we looking for him to get a goal or an assist every appearance? That consistent run you want to see him going on, what is it? He's not doing too bad at the moment. I do agree that that that could turn to shít very quickly, and that's why there should be caution, but it's ok for us to give him some plaudits and/or just not single him out for criticism in the meantime.

You say that praise has to be given cautiously for Martial and I agree. It's just I never see it given at all from some people, only criticism, some of it unwarranted, despite him now showing a bit of the form we expect from him.

There was a time early on in his United career when he looked dangerous on the ball and could possibly do anything with it. Then there was a time where he looked more clueless on the ball and could do fúck-all with it. At the moment it seems he is getting a bit of that danger back to his game which has fans anticipating what's going to happen when he gets on the ball. Unlike last season where there would be regular mass moaning after he tripped over the ball or mis-passed it, there have been cheers and celebrations with 3 goals and 1 assist in the short span of games.

No we shouldn't be breaking out the champagne yet, but he can only be punished so much for last season's form. All he can do to make up for it and the only thing he can do to make up for it really, it seems he's trying to do that at the moment. Basel was a poor game for him no doubt and a cautious reminder, but it doesn't negate the start he's had to the season.

Morning all..

Heading into work....

brinty

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Morning all..

Heading into work....

thats not a phil jones face....

PhlegmyMoses

If/when Rashford learns how to finish, he will be very close to being our most decisive player. His overall ability with the ball at his feet and his blistering pace are beyond anything we have seen at the club in a long time. I havent seen a fullback completely shackle him in any game yet, and he has played against the best Europe has to offer. Unfortunately, he lacks composure when delivering a final pass at times and hasn't got his technique down in 1 on 1s with the keeper. You have to believe that in time, he will improve these areas and will become an absolute machine.

Adamocovic

Delighted to see Phil have another good game. Long may his reign continue!!

PhlegmyMoses

brinty wrote: »

thats not a phil jones face....

I'm a simple man. If somebody posts the gif of Phil Jones scutting along the ground like a dog, I thank it.

thelad95

Just an aside on yesterday's game, that Lukaku elephant penis chant is still going strong and was clearly audible on sky sports coverage. I really hope it doesn't catch on permanently as it's in really bad taste and let's face it, it's also casually racist.

hufpc8w3adnk65

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Morning all..

Heading into work....

9:49am and only heading into work... well la-dee-fûcking-da!!

brinty

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

If/when Rashford learns how to finish, he will be very close to being our most decisive player. His overall ability with the ball at his feet and his blistering pace are beyond anything we have seen at the club in a long time. I havent seen a fullback completely shackle him in any game yet, and he has played against the best Europe has to offer. Unfortunately, he lacks composure when delivering a final pass at times and hasn't got his technique down in 1 on 1s with the keeper. You have to believe that in time, he will improve these areas and will become an absolute machine.

I think we need to temper the critiquing of Rashers.. he's still a teenager learning his trade. I agree with your sentiment in time he will be unbelievable but we must allow him to make a few mistakes..

ElChe32

Spare a thought for Bangkok today, his head must be pounding.

The_Kew_Tour

I only real saw 2nd half proper as I had one eye on GAA yesterday.

Good win and even though we struggled at times I still feel we have more control over our play this season.

Still plenty to improve on but I would have been delighted with 13 points from 15.

MrMac84

MrMac84 wrote: »

9:49am and only heading into work... well la-dee-fûcking-da!!

Actually here since 7...
Historical trip to work :P

Matic got MOTM yesterday. Still can't get over the madness that was selling him to Utd.
And how so many were writing him off before he left, he was called a player in decline and won't recover :pac:

Jose made a good point yesterday, so many teams have become ultra defensive.

Oh and David De Gea is the best goalkeeper in world football. Bye bye Neuer

brinty

ElChe32 wrote: »

Spare a thought for Bangkok today, his head must be pounding.

Fcuk him...

man the heck up ye drunken monkey...

he's been very quiet this morning ... maybe he was caught in a rooney type incident... with Fellaini...

https://twitter.com/ManUtd_HQ/status/909709602937360384

Trigger

M!Ck^ wrote: »

https://twitter.com/ManUtd_HQ/status/909709602937360384

The save from Mata's postage stamp Free kick was one of the best I've ever seen

Liam McPoyle

Burton in the cup is coming at a nice time, I'd be expecting/hoping for a nearly completely different starting 11 than we saw yesterday, give some of the lads a chance to stake a claim.

Hoping Shaw starts.

bucketybuck

Business Cat wrote: »

Burton in the cup is coming at a nice time, I'd be expecting/hoping for a nearly completely different starting 11 than we saw yesterday, give some of the lads a chance to stake a claim.

Hoping Shaw starts.

I'll say it now, we should be demanding big games from a few players in this game, if the likes of Shaw, Martial, Lindelof or Herrera want to push for regular first team places then this is where it starts. A solid 1/2 goal win at home to Burton Albion won't cut it, they need to get out there and put on a show.

pjohnson

4-1-2-2-1

Romero
Shaw Lindelöf Tuanzebe Darmian
Carrick (C)
Herrera McTominay
Mitchell Lingard
Rashford

jayo26

Would we be surprised if Jose puts out a near full strength team ha.

I think romero, Darmian, smalling, Victor, shaw, carrick, ander, fellaini, Jesse, martial and rashford.

I'm reality we will get a strongest possible lineup

Trigger

pjohnson wrote: »

4-1-2-2-1

Romero
Shaw Lindelöf Tuanzebe Darmian
Carrick (C)
Herrera McTominay
Mitchell Lingard
Rashford

Shaw and Mitchell on the right Flank is a bit dodge imo

bangkok

brinty wrote: »

Fcuk him...

man the heck up ye drunken monkey...

he's been very quiet this morning ... maybe he was caught in a rooney type incident... with Fellaini...

only thing that will cure this hangover is another pint!!

MagicIRL

Romero
Darmian - Smalling - Lindelof - Blind
Carrick - Herrera
Lingard - Mata - Martial
Rashford

Maybe we'll see Wilson, McTominay, Tuanzabe, Mitchell? Maybe only from the bench?

Mitch Connor

The Mata free save.
The double save with his feet around a minute in.
The save from Torres header (to reach back and pull the ball back away)
The save from the close range suarez volley.

Some crackers in there.

brinty

bangkok wrote: »

only thing that will cure this hangover is another pint!!

Now you are a man my son...

Giggsy11

MagicIRL wrote: »

Romero
Darmian - Smalling - Lindelof - Blind
Carrick - Herrera
Lingard - Mata - Martial
Rashford

Maybe we'll see Wilson, McTominay, Tuanzabe, Mitchell? Maybe only from the bench?

We should play Shaw to get him back to full fitness, very good game for him. Home to lower league team who are struggling should be good enough.

Also Tuanzebe was very good whenever he played, so hopefully he gets chances. Good time to switch to 3 at the back to accommodate Tuanzebe, Lindelof and Smalling as CBs with Darmian and Shaw playing as wingbacks.

jayo26

Giggsy11 wrote: »

We should play Shaw to get him back to full fitness, very good game for him. Home to lower league team who are struggling should be good enough.

Also Tuanzebe was very good whenever he played, so hopefully he gets chances. Good time to switch to 3 at the back to accommodate Tuanzebe, Lindelof and Smalling as CBs with Darmian and Shaw playing as wingbacks.

Shaw is actually fully fit and pretty much match fit Jose said in the presser the weekend he had to earn his place in matchdsy squad id assume that means very limited match day squad time for a few week or so.

Giggsy11

jayo26 wrote: »

Shaw is actually fully fit and pretty much match fit Jose said in the presser the weekend he had to earn his place in matchdsy squad id assume that means very limited match day squad time for a few week or so.

I think he meant not injured anymore type fit, he played only 120 or so mins for U23 after 6 months injury lay off, so this is very good game for him to play. Full fit and firing Shaw will make lot of difference to our team.

Nalz

Is Wilson not injured again?

jayo26

Nalz wrote: »

Is Wilson not injured again?

He has been in u23 squad in recent times.

pjohnson

jayo26 wrote: »

He has been in u23 squad in recent times.

He crumpled injured in the Arsenal defeat I thought?

jayo26

pjohnson wrote: »

He crumpled injured in the Arsenal defeat I thought?

Oh really fuk time most be running out for him.

jayo26

Martial definitley deserves more game time love to see him and rashford get a few games on each wing together and allow them interchange.

Giggsy11

jayo26 wrote: »

Martial definitley deserves more game time love to see him and rashford get a few games on each wing together and allow them interchange.

Hopefully one game we go with Mkhitaryan Rashford Martial and Lukaku, Pogba and Matic in the midfield.

jayo26

jayo26 wrote: »

Martial definitley deserves more game time love to see him and rashford get a few games on each wing together and allow them interchange.

This is definetly one of them times, stats dont tell the whole story.
The 2 lads have been playing total different games when on the pitch.
Martial has mainly been coming on fresh via opponents chasing a game, who are leaving more gaps then earlier in the game.

Thats not to take away from Martial either as he has done a great job exploiting them opportunities

Trigger

jayo26 wrote: »

Oh really fuk time most be running out for him.

Went off with a hip injury 2 weeks ago. Not sure if he is still injured though, he played on for a good 15 mins after it happened

jayo26

[Deleted User] wrote: »

This is definetly one of them times, stats dont tell the whole story.
The 2 lads have been playing total different games when on the pitch.
Martial has mainly been coming on fresh via opponents chasing a game, who are leaving more gaps then earlier in the game.

Thats not to take away from Martial either as he has done a great job exploiting them opportunities

Rashford is doing a good job but if we are going to critique martial on his goals then look at rashford what he has contributed a goal after coming on as a sub and a goal that bounced off his head.

Martial has came on and made impacts it's not because of fatigue it's because he has an end product and its something rashford has to work on.

RobertKK

Rashford is a really good player, but Martial has more talent.

0gac3yjefb5sv7

I think Martial coming on against tired legs is the difference. If he starts, he's just as fatigued as the full back by the last 20 mins. I'd like to see them both play left and right against a lower team at home.

Mitch Connor

RobertKK wrote: »

Rashford is a really good player, but Martial has more talent.

I think Rashford could go further as he has, imo, a better attitude. Martial, though, could improve in that respect, and seems to be heading that way this season. Jose certainly seems happier with him this season than last.

v3ttel

We should take a second to appreciate how much we've upgraded our problems....

That youtube video, "Man Utd lack dynamism without Paul Pogba".......after a 4-0 win against Everton....our third 4-0 win in five Premier League games. It's a far cry from the 10 home draws we had last year, the turgid 0-0s we watched under LVG, and the disaster under Moyes.

The debate on Martial/Rashford, two seasons ago Martial was the only shining light we had, now it's a legitimate debate on whether he should be in our starting 11 or not, and it's not like that's because he has gone backwards as a player. When he does come on, he's been on fire.

jayo26

v3ttel wrote: »

We should take a second to appreciate how much we've upgraded our problems....

That youtube video, "Man Utd lack dynamism without Paul Pogba".......after a 4-0 win against Everton....our third 4-0 win in five Premier League games. It's a far cry from the 10 home draws we had last year, the turgid 0-0s we watched under LVG, and the disaster under Moyes.

The debate on Martial/Rashford, two seasons ago Martial was the only shining light we had, now it's a legitimate debate on whether he should be in our starting 11 or not, and it's not like that's because he has gone backwards as a player. When he does come on, he's been on fire.

I totally agree and I wasn't comparing the two to show rashford is bad I was saying martial doesn't get enough credit for what he does and he definitley don't get enough game time.