Anti-vaxxers

Andreas77

Seth Brundle wrote: »

So you ignored a professional and chose not to vaccinate. You put your child's life (and the life of children around them) at risk because you were uncomfortable in your ignorance.

A despicable attitude. She had not heard about this vaccine, and she had not time to research it. She was right to postpone the treatment until further study. Doctors and scientists are not infallible. I have witnessed very poor standards of care in Ireland, including false diagnoses, a minority of course, but enough that I will not be getting a vaccine jab, or any other serious medication out of the blue because it is trending in some medical literature hot off the press. It is important to take an interest in your own health and wellbeing, and make decisions for yourself, after consultation with a professional. Indeed a few years ago I spent twelve months as a vegetarian, and in this time the only sweet treat I liked was starch disks with sherbet inside, and for dinner, Dr.Oetker frozen pizzas,: Spinaci, fungi, mozzarella,. It was a period of depression in my life, with a spell of little to no sexual activity, to explain, I would sometimes close the blinds during the day, even when it was very sunny outside, very fearful and depressed, eating these frozen pizzas and sherbets, but during this time I put on weight, my breasts became shapely like a woman's (breast tissue with some discharge from nipples), and I developed a pale saggy bumbag. I got speckled marks on my penis. Reason being, medication I had been prescribed and told was safe.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Oh god. What kind of research?

The old Dr. Google, searching until you find some angle that agrees with your own viewpoint.

Seth Brundle

Andreas77 wrote: »

A despicable attitude. She had not heard about this vaccine, and she had not time to research it. She was right to postpone the treatment until further study. Doctors and scientists are not infallible. I have witnessed very poor standards of care in Ireland, including false diagnoses, a minority of course, but enough that I will not be getting a vaccine jab, or any other serious medication out of the blue because it is trending in some medical literature hot off the press. It is important to take an interest in your own health and wellbeing, and make decisions for yourself, after consultation with a professional. Indeed a few years ago I spent twelve months as a vegetarian, and in this time the only sweet treat I liked was starch disks with sherbet inside, and for dinner, Dr.Oetker frozen pizzas,: Spinaci, fungi, mozzarella,. It was a period of depression in my life, with a spell of little to no sexual activity, to explain, I would sometimes close the blinds during the day, even when it was very sunny outside, very fearful and depressed, eating these frozen pizzas and sherbets, but during this time I put on weight, my breasts became shapely like a woman's (breast tissue with some discharge from nipples), and I developed a pale saggy bumbag. I got speckled marks on my penis. Reason being, medication I had been prescribed and told was safe.

WTF is this crap that I'm after reading?

Brian?

stefanovich wrote: »

And yet they settled...

I would never just trust my doctor's word or that of the HSE. The amount of times I or a family member have been prescribed medication without any mention of side effects or risks and, on closer inspection, we have decided it is not worth it or even dangerous.

Doctors are good at examination and diagnosis but they are never going to care as much about you and your family as you yourself.

My advice is to do your own research and make your own decisions. Don't just pop every pill they give you. You are only a statistic after all.

Yeah, why take a medical professionals advice when you can take the advice of Judy, mother of 2 and part time yoga teacher.

Dohnjoe

Brian? wrote: »

Yeah, why take a medical professionals advice when you can take the advice of Judy, mother of 2 and part time yoga teacher.

Excuse me, Judy has a holistic degree from the University of Youtube

moonage

Some observations from Dr Malcolm Kendrick from his blog posts:

"—Pharmaceutical companies do their own safety testing on vaccines (somewhat like Boeing did on the 737 Max 8). The regulatory authorities have been, effectively, side-lined.
—Many safety studies have only lasted days, with little or no research on any long-term effects. In fact, as far as I can establish, there has been no long-term safety research [see under Pandemrix]
—Some vaccines have been proven to cause neurological damage
—The preservatives and adjuvants in vaccines have not been studied for safety
—There has never been a randomised controlled clinical study on the efficacy of any vaccine – beyond looking for a raised level of antibodies
—Some/many people can suffer from the diseases they have been vaccinated against – and this is not monitored in any way."

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2019/07/09/my-feelings-about-the-vaccine-debate/

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2019/07/29/a-second-look-at-vaccination-answers-that-cannot-be-questioned/

Igotadose

moonage wrote: »

BLAH

So, being a contrarian on cholesterol didn't pay well enough?

ancapailldorcha

moonage wrote: »

Some observations from Dr Malcolm Kendrick from his blog posts:

"—Pharmaceutical companies do their own safety testing on vaccines (somewhat like Boeing did on the 737 Max 8). The regulatory authorities have been, effectively, side-lined.
—Many safety studies have only lasted days, with little or no research on any long-term effects. In fact, as far as I can establish, there has been no long-term safety research [see under Pandemrix]
—Some vaccines have been proven to cause neurological damage
—The preservatives and adjuvants in vaccines have not been studied for safety
—There has never been a randomised controlled clinical study on the efficacy of any vaccine – beyond looking for a raised level of antibodies
—Some/many people can suffer from the diseases they have been vaccinated against – and this is not monitored in any way."

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2019/07/09/my-feelings-about-the-vaccine-debate/

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2019/07/29/a-second-look-at-vaccination-answers-that-cannot-be-questioned/

Can you cite any studies which prove this? Blogs from ideologues are worthless I'm afraid.

moonage

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Can you cite any studies which prove this? Blogs from ideologues are worthless I'm afraid.

Dr Kendrick provides some citations at the end of his blogs.

I would consider him the opposite of an ideologue. He's not dogmatic and close-minded and he is not afraid to question the current orthodoxy.

Igotadose

moonage wrote: »

Dr Kendrick provides some citations at the end of his blogs.

I would consider him the opposite of an ideologue. He's not dogmatic and close-minded and he is not afraid to question the current orthodoxy.

Dr. Kendrick (a GP - so, not an immunologist) was actually called out on his lies by that paragon of UK journalism, the Daily mail. He's a fraud.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-6764117/Devastating-investigation-reveals-impact-deadly-statin-denier-propaganda.html

Seems like the cholesterol gig stopped paying once HMG paid attention to this fraud. So, now (in fact seems like Dr. Kendrick started trying to sup at the anti-vax trough this year), he's moved on.

ancapailldorcha

moonage wrote: »

Dr Kendrick provides some citations at the end of his blogs.

I would consider him the opposite of an ideologue. He's not dogmatic and close-minded and he is not afraid to question the current orthodoxy.

The link provided by Igotadose suggests otherwise.

I'm not clicking that so you'll have to back up your claims here instead of just pasting links.

hcf500

The narcolepsy cases being taken against the hse could end up costing the taxpayer €300 million, possibly even more! How much will it cost gsk? Zero! Even gsk lawyers costs are being covered in full by the taxpayer! Im not begrudging them their compensation. They fully deserve it but its crazy that gsk walk away unhurt! The argument that they are saving money by settling doesn't hold water because their is plenty more claims to follow this one. Already another one lined up!

ancapailldorcha

hcf500 wrote: »

The narcolepsy cases being taken against the hse could end up costing the taxpayer €300 million, possibly even more! How much will it cost gsk? Zero! Even gsk lawyers costs are being covered in full by the taxpayer! Im not begrudging them their compensation. They fully deserve it but its crazy that gsk walk away unhurt! The argument that they are saving money by settling doesn't hold water because their is plenty more claims to follow this one. Already another one lined up!

Yeah. Odd how anti-vaxxers don't seem too perturbed by that though. Then again, I suppose it's another excuse for them to spout their nonsense instead of lobbying their TD to hold the HSE to account.

fryup

alright lets cut to the chase, when we're talking about anti-vaxxers we're basically talking about eco warriors/new age hippies...yes?

Dohnjoe

fryup wrote: »

alright lets cut to the chase, when we're talking about anti-vaxxers we're basically talking about eco warriors/new age hippies...yes?

People who deny that vaccines work effectively and this new fad of lay-people who claim to be "just concerned about vaccine safety" (but in reality are very similar to anti-vaxxers)

Igotadose

fryup wrote: »

alright lets cut to the chase, when we're talking about anti-vaxxers we're basically talking about eco warriors/new age hippies...yes?

Lots of ultra conservative religious anti-vax types unfortunately. Not sure you can pick one group as more or less antivax. Not worth thinking.along those lines imo.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

fryup wrote: »

alright lets cut to the chase, when we're talking about anti-vaxxers we're basically talking about eco warriors/new age hippies...yes?

Not at all. It's a diverse group, including right wing religious groups. We even had posts here referring to cervical cancer as an STD preventable by abstinence.

ancapailldorcha

fryup wrote: »

alright lets cut to the chase, when we're talking about anti-vaxxers we're basically talking about eco warriors/new age hippies...yes?

Those were the days...

No, now anti-vaxxers include a vocal portion of today's right as well.

stefanovich

Igotadose wrote: »

Your agenda seems obvious. Why should we believe you vaccinated your child? You've been caught out lying in the past.

Your just an anti-vaxxer.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_pharmaceutical_settlements


Not trusting big pharma does not make me anti vaccination.

Graces7

stefanovich wrote: »

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_pharmaceutical_settlements


Not trusting big pharma does not make me anti vaccination.

Agree totally. Trusting blindly is a fool's game. As many have found to the cost of their long term health, myself included.

And if all is well? What harm is there in asking pertinent and searching questions?

Seth Brundle

Graces7 wrote: »

Agree totally. Trusting blindly is a fool's game. As many have found to the cost of their long term health, myself included.

And if all is well? What harm is there in asking pertinent and searching questions?

So if your GP prescribes something for you, what are you going to ask? At what point will you be satisfied that the GP's educated decision should not be questioned by your ill-informed scepticism?
Has it been the case that you did not take prescribed medication because you were not satisfied with your knowledge of the medication?

ancapailldorcha

stefanovich wrote: »

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_pharmaceutical_settlements


Not trusting big pharma does not make me anti vaccination.

Nobody trusts big pharma. It's why we have agencies which scrutinise their trial data.

Graces7 wrote: »

Agree totally. Trusting blindly is a fool's game. As many have found to the cost of their long term health, myself included.

And if all is well? What harm is there in asking pertinent and searching questions?

I remember what you posted about girls with cervical cancer earlier in this thread. Unfortunately, I don't see myself ever forgetting that so this pretence at being moderate is fooling nobody.

ollkiller

Graces7 wrote: »

Agree totally. Trusting blindly is a fool's game. As many have found to the cost of their long term health, myself included.

And if all is well? What harm is there in asking pertinent and searching questions?

Hah you're back. I'm off to grab some popcorn. Can't wait to see what you come out with next.

VicMackey1

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Nobody trusts big pharma. It's why we have agencies which scrutinise their trial data.

It's a problem when some of those agencies cant be fully trusted though! I've seen people who were not anti-vax turn against vaccines because of how these agencies handled the swine flu vaccine.

ancapailldorcha

VicMackey1 wrote: »

It's a problem when some of those agencies cant be fully trusted though! I've seen people who were not anti-vax turn against vaccines because of how these agencies handled the swine flu vaccine.

I don't see how supplanting regulators with crackpots and scam artists improves things.

Surely, the best thing to do would be to lobby for the HSE to be held to account.

VicMackey1

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I don't see how supplanting regulators with crackpots and scam artists improves things.

Surely, the best thing to do would be to lobby for the HSE to be held to account.

I completely agree. Unless there are very large numbers though, lobbying tends to fall on deaf ears! Usually, worst-case scenario for those who should be accountable is resignation on a large pension.

Igotadose

Some anti-vax whiners posted 'calling us anti-vaxxers is ruining our fifis.' The internet reacted appropriately: https://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/antivaxxers-are-asking-people-to-stop-calling-them-antivaxxers-because-its-highly-offensive/

ancapailldorcha

Would "Pro disease activists" be a suitable alternative or does that marginalise women as well?

Dohnjoe

Anti-vaxxer arrested in Samoa

Mr Tamasese had spoken out against vaccines on Facebook, instead promoting using ineffective remedies such as papaya leaf extract to treat the deadly illness.

Before his arrest, he had described the government's mass vaccination programme as "the greatest crime against our people", and falsely claimed vitamin C could cure the infected children.

Samoa's low vaccination rates are in part due to the deaths in 2018 of two children wrongly being attributed to vaccination against measles, mumps and rubella.

However, their deaths were due to nurses mixing the vaccine with a muscle relaxant instead of water, and not the vaccine itself.

The cases had nonetheless raised local fears, and were exploited by people seeking false proof that vaccines are harmful.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-50682881

Igotadose

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Would "Pro disease activists" be a suitable alternative or does that marginalise women as well?

I liked the recommendation to call them bioterrorists.