Anti-vaxxers

bocaman

Anti-vaxxers are a bunch of selfish ignorant people who think only of themselves.

arccosh

Igotadose wrote: »

You might want to raise that question in one of the Covid threads; short answer, there *ARE* long term effects. Lung damage, organ damage, neurological impacts. You don't want this virus.

fully agree..


I'm studying 3rd level at the moment, so have the fortunate access to the most up date research papers that are stuck behind paywalls for most.... some of the "long term" (8-12months) research so far doesn't sound great

Igotadose

bocaman wrote: »

Anti-vaxxers are a bunch of selfish ignorant people who think only of themselves.

That's part of it. At the top, they're grisly grifters like Wakefield and Bigtree. Failed scientists and doctors convinced of their righteousness in ripping people off at the expense of lives..

The 'rank and file' are a small minority of agitators probably externally funded (Russia) and a vast bunch of selfish, fearful eejits.

Seth Brundle

Igotadose wrote: »

The 'rank and file' are a small minority of agitators probably externally funded (Russia) and a vast bunch of selfish, fearful eejits.

I'd include the term "extremely gullible" in there also.

paul71

Anybody spot the Irony of a Jim Carry meme on this thread. Another Pro-death cultist.

McGinniesta

Vaccines are fine. The ones that work and have no long term health consequences.

However, what if anti vaxxers are correct, at least in part. How do we know that there are not potentially dangerous vaccines on the market and how would we know before taking them?

ancapailldorcha

McGinniesta wrote: »

Vaccines are fine. The ones that work and have no long term health consequences.

However, what if anti vaxxers are correct, at least in part. How do we know that there are not potentially dangerous vaccines on the market and how would we know before taking them?

What evidence do you have that vaccines are harmful?

McGinniesta

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

What evidence do you have that vaccines are harmful?

I don't. That's why I ask. My question was what if Anti vaxxers may be right at least partly?

ancapailldorcha

McGinniesta wrote: »

I don't. That's why I ask. My question was what if Anti vaxxers may be right at least partly?

Obviously they should be taken off the market in that scenario. Thalidomide was found to be dangerous so women no longer use it to treat morning sickness.

McGinniesta

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Obviously they should be taken off the market in that scenario. Thalidomide was found to be dangerous so women no longer use it to treat morning sickness.

So how can anyone say with 100% certainty that another example of this may not exist now or in the future.

I don't have a particular position on vaccines. I don't have kids but I don't see an issue with questioning things within reason.

However, I don't think any reasonable person would question valid vaccines and their usefulness.

ancapailldorcha

paul71 wrote: »

Anybody spot the Irony of a Jim Carry meme on this thread. Another Pro-death cultist.

I prefer cat memes:

McGinniesta wrote: »

So how can anyone say with 100% certainty that another example of this may not exist now or in the future.

I don't have a particular position on vaccines. I don't have kids but I don't see an issue with questioning things within reason.

Who's saying anything with 100% certainty? I can't get on the Tube with 100% certainty that there won't be a disaster or cross with road with 100% certainty that some motorist won't hit me.

mountai

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

What evidence do you have that vaccines are harmful?

H1N1 Flu vaccine damaged many people . Millions paid out in compensation . Narcolepsy

---

Ever heard of it ??

ancapailldorcha

mountai wrote: »

H1N1 Flu vaccine damaged many people . Millions paid out in compensation . Narcolepsy

---

Ever heard of it ??

Prove it.

dalyboy

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Prove it.

Boom .....
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/history/narcolepsy-flu.html

ancapailldorcha

dalyboy wrote: »

Boom .....
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/history/narcolepsy-flu.html

How many children out of the total administered got narcolepsy?

Lady Spangles

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

How many children out of the total administered got narcolepsy?

1 in 55,000 according to this:

https://www.narcolepsy.org.uk/resources/pandemrix-narcolepsy

The study was conducted on 14-18 year olds. It was very rare.

ancapailldorcha

Lady Spangles wrote: »

1 in 55,000 according to this:

https://www.narcolepsy.org.uk/resources/pandemrix-narcolepsy

That's what I expected but since mountai's decided to trot out this disproven nonsense again I wanted to show that he didn't even bother to read the link he just dumped.

Lady Spangles

Considering around 54,999 14-18 year olds had the vaccine and did not develop narcolepsy, how did they even establish that link between the two? Statistically speaking, it looks like a freak event and not much of anything at all for the anti-vaxxers to go on.

mountai

dalyboy wrote: »

Boom .....
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/history/narcolepsy-flu.html

I just wonder , if a child belonging to one of the " Medical Stormtroopers" suffered from this vaccine , would they be asking " How many other children suffered " . Dont think so .

ancapailldorcha

mountai wrote: »

I just wonder , if a child belonging to one of the " Medical Stormtroopers" suffered from this vaccine , would they be asking " How many other children suffered " . Dont think so .

You didn't read it, did you? That's why you've to resort to the usual pro-plaguer victimhood trope.

Seth Brundle

mountai wrote: »

H1N1 Flu vaccine damaged many people . Millions paid out in compensation . Narcolepsy

---

Ever heard of it ??

mountai wrote: »

I just wonder , if a child belonging to one of the " Medical Stormtroopers" suffered from this vaccine , would they be asking " How many other children suffered " . Dont think so .

What actual evidence is there that the vaccine causes narcolepsy to the point that it becomes a real risk?
The CDC report claims that studies show that it does not cause narcolepsy yet you seem quite sure of your "facts".

mountai

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

You didn't read it, did you? That's why you've to resort to the usual pro-plaguer victimhood trope.

Oh I read it ok . I also read about the Aoife Bennett case which cost the state approx 6 million . I suppose the other 100 cases that the state is trying to bully into settlements through a tribunal dont exist either . The problem with "Medical Stormtroopers" is , they cant see the wood for the trees .

ancapailldorcha

mountai wrote: »

Oh I read it ok . I also read about the Aoife Bennett case which cost the state approx 6 million . I suppose the other 100 cases that the state is trying to bully into settlements through a tribunal dont exist either . The problem with "Medical Stormtroopers" is , they cant see the wood for the trees .

Still no evidence.

VicMackey1

Just because a specific trigger has not yet been found does not mean that it has been disproven. All the statistical data shows a very strong link between narcolepsy and the H1N1 vaccine. Very little research is been done at the moment on the vaccine link. Even an expert group set up by the HSE concluded that there was a 13 fold increase in narcolepsy after the H1N1 vaccine. From experience I would say that the vast majority of Irish consultants accept that the vaccine caused an increase in narcolepsy.

The state's behavior surrounding the whole matter is absolutely sickening. Their tactics have been very underhand and certainly don't do anything to promote vaccination in a good light. Its just giving anti vaxxers more ammo.

ancapailldorcha

VicMackey1 wrote: »

Just because a specific trigger has not yet been found does not mean that it has been disproven. All the statistical data shows a very strong link between narcolepsy and the H1N1 vaccine. Very little research is been done at the moment on the vaccine link. Even an expert group set up by the HSE concluded that there was a 13 fold increase in narcolepsy after the H1N1 vaccine. From experience I would say that the vast majority of Irish consultants accept that the vaccine caused an increase in narcolepsy.

What statistical data, exactly? Unless cause is definitively established, it'll take a lot more than pro-plaguer drivel to convince me that the vaccine causes narcolepsy.

VicMackey1 wrote: »

The state's behavior surrounding the whole matter is absolutely sickening. Their tactics have been very underhand and certainly don't do anything to promote vaccination in a good light. Its just giving anti vaxxers more ammo.

If you're that concerned, contact your TD instead of spreading vaxxtard nonsense.

VicMackey1

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

If you're that concerned, contact your TD instead of spreading vaxxtard nonsense.

Not vaxtard nonsense at all. A recent example of their pathetic behavior was the offer of settlements to the narcolepsy claimants. The settlements could only procede provided that all of the settlement offers were accepted before a certain date. So if only 1 claimant refused the offer it would cancel all other settlement offers to claimants. Also, it could not possibly work because settlements for children would have to go before the court for approval. So basically that settlement offer was made just so that it could be published in the newspapers to make them look pro active.

VicMackey1

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

What statistical data, exactly? Unless cause is definitively established, it'll take a lot more than pro-plaguer drivel to convince me that the vaccine causes narcolepsy.

If it was all pro plaguer drivel, the state would not be paying out millions in compensation to claimants.

ancapailldorcha

VicMackey1 wrote: »

If it was all pro plaguer drivel, the state would not be paying out millions in compensation to claimants.

So you have no evidence then. Same as before.

CramCycle

Lets take the above at face value, that the vaccine causes Narcolepsy in 1:55,000 people in the 14 - 18yo age range.
Current population: 4.904million
Based on 2016 census: 12.1% of the population is between 14 and 25 (so we are exaggerating greatly the numbers here
That leaves us with an over estimated 593384 possible people
With a 1:55000 got the vaccine, getting Narcolepsy, is going to happen to 10.7 people.
If everyone on the Island, with no correction for age or demographics, it is 89.16 people get Narcolepsy.

H1N1 particularly affected the young, a mortality rate of between 0.001 and 0.007% so in Ireland that would have been between 49 and 343 deaths.

To put it more in perspective, its estimated that 1:2000 people here suffer Narcolepsy, that is 2452 people.

Just some figures to mull over.

Also the H1N1 vaccine was included in the seasonal flu vaccine in the following years, for those who didn't know.

Seth Brundle

VicMackey1 wrote: »

If it was all pro plaguer drivel, the state would not be paying out millions in compensation to claimants.

How much in legal fees would it have costed the taxpayer to contest all of the claims?