Anti-vaxxers

mickrock

Ashbourne hoop wrote: »

The uptake rate of the HPV vaccine is reportedly down to 50%.....With all the scientific evidence available, there are still a growing number of anti vaxxers.

It's troubling that the pharmaceutical companies are the only ones with full access to the raw data:

'As for the data behind the HPV vaccines, it’s a question of whether anyone has seen the full data set. “The answer is no-one outside the vaccine manufacturers. Not the drug regulators and certainly not independent scientists” says Jefferson. “So if you were to ask me what I think of HPV vaccines, I would say ‘I don’t know’ because I haven’t seen the full data set”.'

https://blogs.bmj.com/bmjebmspotlight/2018/09/16/cochrane-a-sinking-ship/

Queen Cleopatra

Neighbour told me last night that the solicitors suing over the narcolepsy cases are now looking for aggravated damages and exemplary damages. Seems a bit ott. Something to do with an article in the BMJ about the HSE. I'll post a link but I can't open it for some reason. Maybe someone could give a little breakdown of what it is about. Love to all. Cleopatra

https://www.bmj.com/content/362/bmj.k3948

seamus

Queen Cleopatra wrote: »

Neighbour told me last night that the solicitors suing over the narcolepsy cases are now looking for aggravated damages and exemplary damages. Seems a bit ott. Something to do with an article in the BMJ about the HSE. I'll post a link but I can't open it for some reason. Maybe someone could give a little breakdown of what it is about. Love to all. Cleopatra

https://www.bmj.com/content/362/bmj.k3948

These would be punitive damages.

There's an allegation that internal reports in GSK suggested that it was clear there were serious issues with Pandemrix - it had a "complications" rate which was eight times higher than a competing vaccine (which was functionally identical).

The issue is not so much that "vaccines are bad", but "there's something wrong with Pandemrix", and this was clear from the internal data. According to the documents, both GSK and the HSE knew about this but chose to not poke at it further and instead just proceeded to rush Pandemrix to the public.

"Aggravated" damages are generally awarded where the severity of the injury is compounded by the defendant's actions. In this case, had GSK/HSE came out to the public and made this data known, or paused the vaccination programme while they investigated, then people may still have been injured but at least the defendant attempted to do the right thing.

Exemplary damages are intended as pure punishment; to make an example of the defendant and serve as a warning.

Queen Cleopatra

seamus wrote: »

These would be punitive damages.

There's an allegation that internal reports in GSK suggested that it was clear there were serious issues with Pandemrix - it had a "complications" rate which was eight times higher than a competing vaccine (which was functionally identical).

The issue is not so much that "vaccines are bad", but "there's something wrong with Pandemrix", and this was clear from the internal data. According to the documents, both GSK and the HSE knew about this but chose to not poke at it further and instead just proceeded to rush Pandemrix to the public.

"Aggravated" damages are generally awarded where the severity of the injury is compounded by the defendant's actions. In this case, had GSK/HSE came out to the public and made this data known, or paused the vaccination programme while they investigated, then people may still have been injured but at least the defendant attempted to do the right thing.

Exemplary damages are intended as pure punishment; to make an example of the defendant and serve as a warning.

I see. I wonder though who would get the exemplary damages if they were awarded? If the narcoleptics got it then they could end up with a very large settlement. I see the Dutch have set aside 5 million to be split between 7 to 11 people. And the solicitors there seem to think it could easily be doubled which would give them payouts of approximately 1 million each. Irish courts are fairly generous so could end up being more here I guess. That's a lot of cash for a young person!!

seamus

My understanding in Irish law is that large punitive damage awards are generally payable to the state, who will usually earmark them for something specific, related to the case. In this case, an assistance fund or similar for those who've been affected.

It's basically unheard of in Ireland for situations to occur where a single individual receives punitive damages in the hundreds of millions, as sometimes happens in the US.

Class-action cases cannot occur in Irish law, where a group of people all share a compensation payout between them. However, as we saw in the church abuse situation, it's common enough for the defendant to agree to pay a settlement to all new claimants who appear after the initial case has concluded. It means one person has to do all the legal legwork, and then anyone who comes later on gets their case settled automatically.

Queen Cleopatra

EMA response to the BMJ article on Pandemrix. Looks like the BMJ are spouting misinformation! Thought they were supposed to be a credible source of information!

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.ema.europa.eu/documents/other/european-medicines-agency-rapid-response-british-medical-journal-pandemrix_.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjS_4uU893dAhWpAcAKHYafCVIQFjADegQICBAB&usg=AOvVaw1CU9RT6QNkW2FyFKwFMSIZ

gctest50

Queen Cleopatra wrote: »

EMA response to .,..........

That shower ? 80 per cent of its budget comes from the pharmaceutical industry

Up for fraud, and they might want to pay their rent

gctest50

The EMA are in London, need to move because of brexit

Dublin won maximum points in a competition to host the EMA, so did six other cities.

They are off to Amsterdam, but in true corrupt Irish fashion, they'll keep licking

Queen Cleopatra

According to the EMA the vaccine was fully tested before release. This data is not fabricated from thin air. I've read articles and heard radio interviews where the victims claim it was an untested vaccine! They ain't going to get far claiming agrivated damages!!

Quote from EMA
Pandemrix was developed for use specifically in a flu pandemic. It was authorised in the European Union (EU) on 29 September 2009 to immunise citizens against the H1N1 pandemic influenza strain.
Information from clinical trials in more than 6,000 subjects was assessed as part of an extensive review of the vaccine’s safety profile before its authorisation, and the outcome of the assessment is available on the EMA website (1,2

Dr Brown

So called Anit-Vaxxers are mostly people are have been harmed by vaccines and want to warn other people of the dangers.

WinnyThePoo

Dr Brown wrote: »

So called Anit-Vaxxers are mostly people are have been harmed by vaccines and want to warn other people of the dangers.

do you just take every despicable position for the craic?

dexter_morgan

Dr Brown wrote: »

So called Anit-Vaxxers are mostly people are have been harmed by vaccines and want to warn other people of the dangers.

Not at all true. There number of people harmed by vaccines is insignificant. Most people I know that are anti vaccines also happen to be quacks who are all about homeopathy and could never have been harmed by a vaccine because they never received any vaccines. I feels sorry for anyone who has a genuine vaccine injury because wolf has been cried so many times already that nobody will listen. Thankfully vaccine injuries are extremely rare. I believe the swine flu vaccine only affected about 1 in 50000 or maybe even 1 in 100000. No sure but I heard one of those numbers somewhere bedore.

Dr Brown

dexter_morgan wrote: »

Not at all true. There number of people harmed by vaccines is insignificant. Most people I know that are anti vaccines also happen to be quacks who are all about homeopathy and could never have been harmed by a vaccine because they never received any vaccines. I feels sorry for anyone who has a genuine vaccine injury because wolf has been cried so many times already that nobody will listen. Thankfully vaccine injuries are extremely rare. I believe the swine flu vaccine only affected about 1 in 50000 or maybe even 1 in 100000. No sure but I heard one of those numbers somewhere bedore.

They are not "extremely rare" we have seen from the HPV Vaccine Scandal that health professionals don't even record adverse reactions most of the time.


If Vaccines are that safe why has the US Vaccine injury court paid out over 3 Billion dollars in compensation ?

endacl

Dr Brown wrote: »

They are not "extremely rare" we have seen from the HPV Vaccine Scandal that health professionals don't even record adverse reactions most of the time.


If Vaccines are that safe why has the US Vaccine injury court paid out over 3 Billion dollars in compensation ?

So, what are you a doctor of?

dexter_morgan

Dr Brown wrote: »

They are not "extremely rare" we have seen from the HPV Vaccine Scandal that health professionals don't even record adverse reactions most of the time.


If Vaccines are that safe why has the US Vaccine injury court paid out over 3 Billion dollars in compensation ?

What scandal surrounds the HPV vaccine?

VicMackey1

Dr Brown wrote: »

So called Anit-Vaxxers are mostly people are have been harmed by vaccines and want to warn other people of the dangers.

No, they are not. A member of my family was harmed by a vaccine but my family are all entirely pro-vaccine. The support group for others harmed by that vaccine are pro-vaccine. Anytime there is an interview with the group (Sound), one of the first statements they make is that they are in favor of vaccines. This is because they do not want to be associated with the likes of Regret which are hardline anti-science, anti-vaccine, anti-medicine loops. Not one of there members will be able to prove that they have been harmed in any way by the HPV vaccine. One thing I believe all anti-vaxxers have in common is that they are all gullible idiots.

Capt'n Midnight

dexter_morgan wrote: »

What scandal surrounds the HPV vaccine?

Wasn't it the Daily Mail that had HPV campaigns here and in the UK at the same time ?

Here they trying to get it introduced and in the UK where it had already been introduced they were scaremongering.


The Daily Mail is a monger of scares. Have you ever see the list of things the Daily Mail says gives you cancer ?

rawn

Dr Brown wrote: »

They are not "extremely rare" we have seen from the HPV Vaccine Scandal that health professionals don't even record adverse reactions most of the time.


If Vaccines are that safe why has the US Vaccine injury court paid out over 3 Billion dollars in compensation ?

How many petitions have been awarded compensation?
According to the CDC, from 2006 to 2016 over 3.1 billion doses of covered vaccines were distributed in the U.S. For petitions filed in this time period, 5,531 petitions were adjudicated by the Court, and of those 3,749 were compensated. This means for every one million doses of vaccine that were distributed, one individual was compensated.

Since 1988, over 19,772 petitions have been filed with the VICP. Over that 30-year time period, 17,380 petitions have been adjudicated, with 6,159 of those determined to be compensable, while 11,221 were dismissed. Total compensation paid over the life of the program is approximately $3.9 billion.

https://www.hrsa.gov/vaccine-compensation/data/index.html

banie01

I have a friend who is a qualified nurse, who up until recently I had great time for...
Suddenly start spouting virulent Anti-Vax ****e with particular emphasis on the HPV vaccine.

When people who have medical training and are seen by their peers as professional, start linking unsubstantiated and outright false claims, one has to worry about the impact that will have on vaccination rates and uptake.

Dr Brown

VicMackey1 wrote: »

Anytime there is an interview with the group (Sound), one of the first statements they make is that they are in favor of vaccines.

They have to say that to be Politically Correct. I think its pathetic my self. Its like someone saying they are pro Immigration after they have been attacked by Immigrants.

This is because they do not want to be associated with the likes of Regret which are hardline anti-science, anti-vaccine, anti-medicine loops. Not one of there members will be able to prove that they have been harmed in any way by the HPV vaccine. One thing I believe all anti-vaxxers have in common is that they are all gullible idiots.

Only a few years ago the HSE denied the swine flu vaccine caused any real harm. Anyone who said otherwise was some sort of lunatic. But fast forward to 2018 and we can see that those people who spoke out the swine flu vaccine were right all along.

Give it 5 years and the likes of regret will be vindicated.

Denmark's national health service have set up specialized medical centers for girls who have been injured by the HPV Vaccine.

But here the HSE won't even acknowledge that there is a problem.

Dr Brown

banie01 wrote: »

I have a friend who is a qualified nurse, who up until recently I had great time for...
Suddenly start spouting virulent Anti-Vax ****e with particular emphasis on the HPV vaccine.

When people who have medical training and are seen by their peers as professional, start linking unsubstantiated and outright false claims, one has to worry about the impact that will have on vaccination rates and uptake.

A Nurse who is on the front line can see the damage the HPV vaccine is doing for more than you or I.

Dr Brown

rawn wrote: »

How many petitions have been awarded compensation?
According to the CDC, from 2006 to 2016 over 3.1 billion doses of covered vaccines were distributed in the U.S. For petitions filed in this time period, 5,531 petitions were adjudicated by the Court, and of those 3,749 were compensated. This means for every one million doses of vaccine that were distributed, one individual was compensated.

Since 1988, over 19,772 petitions have been filed with the VICP. Over that 30-year time period, 17,380 petitions have been adjudicated, with 6,159 of those determined to be compensable, while 11,221 were dismissed. Total compensation paid over the life of the program is approximately $3.9 billion.

https://www.hrsa.gov/vaccine-compensation/data/index.html

3 Billion is just the tip of the ice berg the vast majority of Vaccine injured people will never make it to the Vaccine court.


You need deep pockets and will need to spend years in and out of court to successfully claim compensation.


Most people have neither the time or the money to bring cases to the vaccine court.

paleoperson

I think anyone that uses the term "anti-vaxxer" doesn't know anything about vaccines or about medicine and is a lot more clueless than a lot of the people they attack with it, and is just trying to sound as if they have a clue about something they really don't on the internet.

It's such a stupid word "anti-vaxxer". Every vaccine has to be taken on its own merit. It's like calling people "anti-chemical", shows complete lack of any understanding.

rawn

Dr Brown wrote: »

A Nurse who is on the front line can see the damage the HPV vaccine is doing for more than you or I.

And the other 99.9999% of nurses don't see this damage becaaause...?

Dr Brown

rawn wrote: »

And the other 99.9999% of nurses don't see this damage becaaause...?

Where did you get that figure from ?

rawn

Dr Brown wrote: »

A Nurse who is on the front line can see the damage the HPV vaccine is doing for more than you or I.

Dr Brown wrote: »

Where did you get that figure from ?

:rolleyes:

Dr Brown

paleoperson wrote: »

I think anyone that uses the term "anti-vaxxer" doesn't know anything about vaccines or about medicine and is a lot more clueless than a lot of the people they attack with it, and is just trying to sound as if they have a clue about something they really don't on the internet.

It's such a stupid word "anti-vaxxer". Every vaccine has to be taken on its own merit. It's like calling people "anti-chemical", shows complete lack of any understanding.

Groups like regret can't be anti-vaccine in the first place because they got their daughters vaccinated.

Terms like Anti-vaccine are just used to shut down debate its the same as calling someone a "racist".

It doesn't matter if their arguments don't stand up they just call the person a name like anti-vaxxer or racist etc.

Even people like kevin sharkey are now considered to be "racist".

rawn

Dr Brown wrote: »

Groups like regret can't be anti-vaccine in the first place because they got their daughters vaccinated.

Terms like Anti-vaccine are just used to shut down debate its the same as calling someone a "racist".

It doesn't matter if their arguments don't stand up they just call the person a name like anti-vaxxer or racist etc.

Even people like kevin sharkey are now considered to be "racist".

REGRET are sharks who hone in on any death in the media and try to blame vaccines for it. Look at Christopher Bunch, as an example.

ancapailldorcha

Dr Brown wrote: »

Groups like regret can't be anti-vaccine in the first place because they got their daughters vaccinated.

Terms like Anti-vaccine are just used to shut down debate its the same as calling someone a "racist".

It doesn't matter if their arguments don't stand up they just call the person a name like anti-vaxxer or racist etc.

Even people like kevin sharkey are now considered to be "racist".

If your beliefs are so weak that a single word can shut down debate then they're completely worthless. Also, don't drag the thread off topic please.

VicMackey1

Dr Brown wrote: »

They have to say that to be Politically Correct. I think its pathetic my self. Its like someone saying they are pro Immigration after they have been attacked by Immigrants.

They don't have to say it! I know the people from this group very well and they believe in vaccines. There are of course one or two who have their doubts about vaccines but I wouldn't put them in the same boat as the Regret crowd.

I'll tell you what I think is pathetic. Idiots doing their best to scaremonger people into avoiding the HPV vaccine. One of the most tested vaccines available which has the potential to save many women from an early death. Children are going to have to watch their mothers die as a result of this regret campaign. Anyone involved in this scaremongering will have blood on their hands and should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves.