Autumn 2017 - General Discussion

sryanbruen

Gonzo wrote: »

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Too hot to sleep, seriously, there's never been a night for me anyway where I could sleep without a blanket. You all must be going through menopause or something. Or I'm anaemic.

I don't understand it either, most nights during the summer we only get 12 or 13C. This is not a warm country under any stretch of the imagination.

We do however lack air conditioning and maybe that is why some people complain of not being able to sleep. I always have a heavy blanket and douvet 365 nights a year, its needed in this country. There are probably no more than 3 or 4 days per year where we would need air conditioning in our homes.

In most European countries air conditioning is standard and once the temp goes above 25C, you have a nice cool room to stay/sleep in and the high temperatures outside are not relevant.

You just answered your own question. I'd like to add on the fact that Ireland's humidity is high compared to many countries.

I could have sworn we already talked this through in the Summer thread.

Oneiric 3

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Too hot to sleep, seriously, there's never been a night for me anyway where I could sleep without a blanket. You all must be going through menopause or something. Or I'm anaemic.

Nope, no menopausal happenings here. Healthy lad, if a bit underweight for my height. I have a very fast metabolism though so maybe that has something to do with it. Can't put on an ounce.

nagdefy

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Aren't we already in a conveyor belt of muck? We have been for ages!

10,000 yrs or so:D Since the last ice age!

Gonzo

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

Its not a cold country either.

cool, wet summers and mild, windy and damp winters, we just can't do seasons other than Autumn and maybe Spring.

Dr Crayfish

Gonzo wrote: »

I don't understand it either, most nights during the summer we only get 12 or 13C. This is not a warm country under any stretch of the imagination.

We do however lack air conditioning and maybe that is why some people complain of not being able to sleep. I always have a heavy blanket and douvet 365 nights a year, its needed in this country. There are probably no more than 3 or 4 days per year where we would need air conditioning in our homes.

In most European countries air conditioning is standard and once the temp goes above 25C, you have a nice cool room to stay/sleep in and the high temperatures outside are not relevant.

Well personally I don't like it so the 3 weeks I was in Spain just now I was sleeping with window and door open trying to get some air flow going on. I got used to the heat eventually.

I change duvet in Ireland, use a lighter one when it gets to June or so and you'll be fine, pretty soon I'll be going back to winter one though I think!

Dr Crayfish

It's funny our houses aren't air conditioned and most are badly insulated for winter, I've lived in houses here where I may as well have been sleeping outside some winter nights!

acequion

Ah the usual bunch are at it again. Letting on that we had anything resembling heat this summer and that this autumn is anything other than horrible. Talk about self delusionists!

I live in a timber framed, very well insulated modern house with a south facing bedroom and I would know all about it if it were hot at night. All this summer I needed a duvet, albeit a light one, but there was no night I could throw it off or needed to bring the fan down from where it normally lives, in the back of a press in the attic.

As for gentle autumn temperatures, well considering that most of the year temps don't vary much between 12 and 17, this year,though on the cool side, temps aren't too out of the usual,but so far it's still been a hugely disappointing season with all the muck. On a good autumn day the colours and the berry picking are indeed lovely, but that's such a rare pleasure in the land of muck, this year especially.

And as for air con in Ireland, that's like installing a swimming pool in the back garden and sunbathing in the rain! :rolleyes: Air con is so unnecessary in Ireland. Air con is for when outside temps climb above a minimum of about 27 degrees, a rarity in Ireland. I've lost count of the amount of times I've entered a veritable fridge,in the guise of a shop, from an already chilly street,only to emerge goose pimpled and thankful for the relative warmth of the chilly street. 18 deg is gorgeous after being in a freezer! They even do that to hapless diners in restaurants, freeze them out of it while they try to enjoy a nice meal.But I guess we must be trendy and have air con.:rolleyes:

So it's not just the posters on here who are in denial about our gloomy,chilly climate.

JCX BXC

I'm often outdoors and find the weather perfectly fine the majority of the time.

Why are you so upset that I don't partake in your misery? I don't think the weather here is as awful as it's so poetically made out, however if you tell yourself it is youll think it is.

And I would like statistics showing that years ago there was better weather here please, because I'm a firm believer that it's simply nostalgia and that memories paint everything in a great light. It's quite likely that the weather didn't bother you when you were younger, foreign holidays were nearly unheard of and when good days came you made the most of them.

sryanbruen

JCX BXC wrote: »

And I would like statistics showing that years ago there was better weather here please, because I'm a firm believer that it's simply nostalgia and that memories paint everything in a great light. It's quite likely that the weather didn't bother you when you were younger, foreign holidays were nearly unheard of and when good days came you made the most of them.

I have never heard truer words than this on the weather forum so far.

acequion

JCX BXC wrote: »

I'm often outdoors and find the weather perfectly fine the majority of the time.

Why are you so upset that I don't partake in your misery? I don't think the weather here is as awful as it's so poetically made out, however if you tell yourself it is youll think it is.

And I would like statistics showing that years ago there was better weather here please, because I'm a firm believer that it's simply nostalgia and that memories paint everything in a great light. It's quite likely that the weather didn't bother you when you were younger, foreign holidays were nearly unheard of and when good days came you made the most of them.

So,are you denying the existence of climate change? And are you seriously suggesting that the Irish climate has not worsened considerably in the recent past? Just because you probably weren't yet born 40,50,maybe even 30 years ago you assume that the older generation are suffering from collective nostalgia! It's ironic that a self delusionist accuses others of self delusion.

If you're happy with the Irish climate, good for you. But please realise that it's not misery to point out the truth. This is a weather forum,that's what we talk about here. And I like to tell the truth. That the Irish climate is miserable and that it's got a great deal worse since climate change.

pistolpetes11

KEEP IT ON TOPIC PLEASE , IE: Someones age is not on topic

JCX BXC

acequion wrote: »

So,are you denying the existence of climate change? And are you seriously suggesting that the Irish climate has not worsened considerably in the recent past?

No, not whatsoever, again, buzzwords don't help an argument.

I'd like statistics please, cold hard statistics, saying summer's were warmer, winters were colder etc. Every few years I hear of the warmest day in ***years. Longest heatwave in *** years. Things like that.

George Sunsnow

Jeepers I get accused of misery all the time for saying what a good summer it was in the south east
No complaints

On climate change,it's important to drive forward within reason measures to avert it for future generations sake
But I'm also of the view that there's no way anyone can state climate change has already happened
That's absolute nonsense
You'd need a 1000 years data to get some kind of accurate picture
We don't have that and we won't see what things will be like in a few hundred years by then

All we have is the science of what *could* happen and direct policy to avoid it
We will never experience either the climate change itself or whether we have avoided it

Oscar Bravo

1700 reports
Cork airport Gust 28 knots
Oak Park Carlow Gust 21 knots.
Sherkin Islands Gust 36 knots.
Valentia Gust 32 knots.

sryanbruen

The only "climate change" I've seen is that severely cold Winter months have become less common (but obviously still possible - December 2010 proves this), other than that, no change. If the atmosphere set ups correctly for severely cold Winter months more often, then climate change is completely out the window for me on Ireland.

nagdefy

'I think it's wet mostly. I think we have a lot of fine weather. One should get out in the weather and enjoy it no matter what. I slept in the nip over the summer, i needed a duvet. I got my quota of summer sun. I'm back from the Bahamas and i feel miserable. I don't like Atlantic muck. I love berry picking in the autumn sun.'

The thread is so funny. Weather is subjective. Personally i'll walk around in January in a t shirt at 5C in January and not feel cold, another will wear a jumper at 20C. So really none of us are wrong and none are right.

Irish weather is like a regular savings deposit account. You're pretty sure what you'll get. Not like an investment portfolio where there's major risk.. one where you're guranteed hot weather but maybe have rainfall like in Texas, Hurricane Irma or an earthquake.

I suppose how we all feel about the weather is valid, it's our reality.

Just sign off with this for today

sryanbruen

nagdefy wrote: »

'I think it's wet mostly. I think we have a lot of fine weather. One should get out in the weather and enjoy it no matter what. I slept in the nip over the summer, i needed a duvet. I got my quota of summer sun. I'm back from the Bahamas and i feel miserable. I don't like Atlantic muck. I love berry picking in the autumn sun.'

The thread is so funny. Weather is subjective. Personally i'll walk around in January in a t shirt at 5C in January and not feel cold, another will wear a jumper at 20C. So really none of us are wrong and none are right.

Irish weather is like a regular savings deposit account. You're pretty sure what you'll get. Not like an investment portfolio where there's major risk.. one where you're guranteed hot weather but maybe have rainfall like in Texas, Hurricane Irma or an earthquake.

I suppose how we all feel about the weather is valid, it's our reality.

Just sign off with this for today

Love that comparison nagdefy :pac:, a regular savings deposit account. Ah man, you cracked me up there.

MJohnston

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Too hot to sleep, seriously, there's never been a night for me anyway where I could sleep without a blanket. You all must be going through menopause or something. Or I'm anaemic.

I would never say it was too 'hot' to sleep, but there were certainly many nights this year in Dublin where it was too humid for it. Tis grand if you live somewhere you can leave the windows wide open all night, but we don't.

acequion

JCX BXC wrote: »

No, not whatsoever, again, buzzwords don't help an argument.

I'd like statistics please, cold hard statistics, saying summer's were warmer, winters were colder etc. Every few years I hear of the warmest day in ***years. Longest heatwave in *** years. Things like that.

"Buzzwords" What buzzwords? Climate change is a buzzword now is it?
Statistics don't always prove an argument. Real life experience does. Why don't you go and ask your grand parents or parents or any of the older generation in your life what seasons were like years back in Ireland or have they any family snaps of sunny holidays in places like Bundoran or Ballybunion or Christmases in home grown snow and they might actually surprise you. Or would you dismiss that type of evidence as nostalgia? Do you assume that because you weren't there,though here is one person that was there telling you for a fact what it was like, that the person who was there must have imagined it all?

I'll find you statistics if that's what you want, but go back and read my posts of a few days ago or are you just more interested in winning some statistical argument? The weather in Ireland, while never great and always rainy,was better years back and that is a fact. Now if you are happy with the Irish climate, good for you as I've already said. But I think it's absolutely miserable.Many other people would happen to agree with me. Maybe you should be more respectful of differing opinions!

JCX BXC

"Maybe you should be more respectful of differing opinions!"

What? You're telling me I'm wrong and that you're right, insulting everyone who disagrees with you and then telling me to be respectful of differing opinions?

Right, besides that, let's keep on point. Quite frankly I'll trust statistics over a vague 40 year old memory. Memories fade, statistics don't.

I don't understand why you're getting so annoyed, I don't agree that the weather has gotten so much worse in Ireland over previous years. Posting the word climate change to justify your point without it being used in any correct context, is using buzzwords really.

If statistics show that the weather has significant changed in the past 40 years, and my memory of some of that is truly awful, I'll concede that I am wrong, however I feel that I'm not and your use of deviation and insults only make even more sure of my position.

Rock Lesnar

I have no stats to back this up, just what i see out the window, but this has to be the wettest august/september i can remember since i moved here nearly 15 years ago now, the pond across the road that was in from the edges nearly 10 feet in may/june has now completely filled out to the edge and is starting to move out into the field now, and there is now water lying in the field beside our house, it always been late october when it started to happen

By the way, its raining fairly heavy here since the afternoon

MJohnston

It is possible to believe climate change is 100% real and not think that it's had much of an effect on Ireland's climate (yet) in terms of giving us weather we haven't always had.

Oneiric 3

I agree with others. While Ireland's climate is excruciatingly mediocre 99.9% of the time, it is very rarely 'bad' in the real sense of the word.

sryanbruen

I forgot about this parody by Breakfast Republic of Charlie Puth's 'Marvin Gaye'. :cool:

https://soundcloud.com/rte2fm/breakfast-republic-lets-met-eireann-and-get-it-wrong

Dr Crayfish

Lovely cycling home in the downpours on bike, feet are like blocks of ice, need to turn on heat to dry my stuff. I usually can go months without getting wet on bike believe it or not, but I think it's way worse in the supposedly warmer months for rain than winter, going on how often I get wet, never seem to in Winter. This is pretty awful, hopefully we get some dry and mild weather soon.

pauldry

8.8c when i got up today and 8.7c now

Markree is 10c so maybe theres milder air coming

It was 9 to 11c in Sligo all day

acequion

JCX BXC wrote: »

"Maybe you should be more respectful of differing opinions!"

What? You're telling me I'm wrong and that you're right, insulting everyone who disagrees with you and then telling me to be respectful of differing opinions?

Right, besides that, let's keep on point. Quite frankly I'll trust statistics over a vague 40 year old memory. Memories fade, statistics don't.

I don't understand why you're getting so annoyed, I don't agree that the weather has gotten so much worse in Ireland over previous years. Posting the word climate change to justify your point without it being used in any correct context, is using buzzwords really.

If statistics show that the weather has significant changed in the past 40 years, and my memory of some of that is truly awful, I'll concede that I am wrong, however I feel that I'm not and your use of deviation and insults only make even more sure of my position.

Hey steady on there,who am I insulting? That's a bit rich coming from somebody who has already been cautioned for your attitude.

You seem to be projecting your own annoyance on to me. You seem to think that I'm insisting that I'm right and you're wrong when it's you who are the one doing that. In fact I find it insulting that you call my memories "vague" when they are anything but.

I don't care who's wrong and who's right if either of us actually are. I've better things to be doing than proving a point to some random stranger on the Internet. I will look up statistics and other evidence [because statistics alone are not foolproof] when I get time, mainly because it interests me personally and not to make you concede defeat. Sorry but I really couldn't care less on that point.

However I will reiterate that in my 50 plus years on this planet and in this country I have seen the weather in the south west of Ireland worsen significantly. I have seen it and experienced it and I find it disrespectful that anyone would dismiss my first hand account.

In my line of work I know something about debating and proving arguments. So please be aware that anecdotal evidence carries as much weight as does statistical. So it might be no harm to ask the older generation in your life what they think.

JCX BXC

So, basically you're just attacking me as opposed to my post, and then saying that I should just believe you because you're older than me (which I'd like to ask how you'd know this) and that your personal memory is better than any statistic.

Think we've reached the limit of any intelligible discussion here, let's just agree to disagree?

Oneiric 3

I feel a few stats coming on..

acequion

JCX BXC wrote: »

So, basically you're just attacking me as opposed to my post, and then saying that I should just believe you because you're older than me (which I'd like to ask how you'd know this) and that your personal memory is better than any statistic.

Think we've reached the limit of any intelligible discussion here, let's just agree to disagree?

Absolutely, I'm starting to find this conversation extremely tiresome.

But if I find some good statistics and evidence for you, I will post them.;)

km79

So how about this autumn weather eh?

pauldry

I actually like to see people arguing about weather

It shows passion and that they care about it

sryanbruen

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

I feel a few stats coming on..

Lol, it'll take quite a while to calculate stats for what I would say - thus why I have not posted my argument yet but here's what I would say without the calculated stats:

acequion wrote: »

In my line of work I know something about debating and proving arguments. So please be aware that anecdotal evidence carries as much weight as does statistical. So it might be no harm to ask the older generation in your life what they think.

If so, you'd wanna start showing it instead of relying on memory and telling us your "opinion" is fact. I'm a very bad debater thanks to my short temper, lazy attitude etc but I do know what makes a good debate. One of the things is in-depth research on your argument. All you've showcased here is that your "research" is memory. Just memory. Nothing else. No other evidence. I have you know that this is not the first time, we've had a long run of poor Summer months - I've said this numerous times through this year so far. 1960-1974 was an example of a long run of poor Summer weather with very little Summer-like moments. Two rare examples during it that come to my mind being June 1960 & June 1970. As I said, I am calculating stats - including the IMTs for months in the 1960s and before. But this takes a long time, especially as I go further and further back.

Anyway, I'm finding this laughably bad discussion tiresome also, so let's end it.

sryanbruen

km79 wrote: »

So how about this autumn weather eh?

Lol well there's nowhere else to post this sh!t.

Rock Lesnar

Still lashing rain here, and the field beside the house now has quite a decent flood in it, could do with it stopping soon enough

Gaoth Laidir

acequion wrote: »

However I will reiterate that in my 50 plus years on this planet and in this country I have seen the weather in the south west of Ireland worsen significantly. I have seen it and experienced it and I find it disrespectful that anyone would dismiss my first hand account.

In my line of work I know something about debating and proving arguments. So please be aware that anecdotal evidence carries as much weight as does statistical. So it might be no harm to ask the older generation in your life what they think.

Absolute nonsense.

Please point out in the charts below where how the weather has been getting "worse". What does that even mean?

All charts from Met.ie.

acequion

sryanbruen wrote: »

Lol, it'll take quite a while to calculate stats for what I would say - thus why I have not posted my argument yet but here's what I would say without the calculated stats:



If so, you'd wanna start showing it instead of relying on memory and telling us your "opinion" is fact. I'm a very bad debater thanks to my short temper, lazy attitude etc but I do know what makes a good debate. One of the things is in-depth research on your argument. All you've showcased here is that your "research" is memory. Just memory. Nothing else. No other evidence. I have you know that this is not the first time, we've had a long run of poor Summer months - I've said this numerous times through this year so far. 1960-1974 was an example of a long run of poor Summer weather with very little Summer-like moments. Two rare examples during it that come to my mind being June 1960 & June 1970. As I said, I am calculating stats - including the IMTs for months in the 1960s and before. But this takes a long time, especially as I go further and further back.

Anyway, I'm finding this laughably bad discussion tiresome also, so let's end it.

So are you the sidekick, the one cheering on my combatant from the sidelines? Your tone is even worse. "Laughably bad" So who's rating the discussions? I thought boards.ie was a place where people post opinions,sometimes facts,sometimes get into arguments with other posters,but not the Trinity debates competition. Just as well as you've just told us yourself [emboldened above] how poor a debater you are.

I never said my opinion is "fact",I said my memory is fact,which it is. And I also said that good anecdotal evidence is as reliable as good statistics when arguing a point. I happen to know that for a fact and the operative word there in both cases being "good."

As for your "evidence" above, you have not cited the source of your statistics.An absolute necessity in debating,otherwise we could all be merrily making up stuff. I remember the sixties and seventies and don't remember a long run of bad summers. I remember an expert about twenty years back then saying that three bad summers in a row was unusual. But I cannot prove this until I find some evidence.

But I'm not remotely interested in squabbling with you,so unless you have something interesting to say to me, kindly go elsewhere with the snide remarks!

acequion

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Absolute nonsense.

Please point out in the charts below where how the weather has been getting "worse". What does that even mean?

All charts from Met.ie.

You're obviously another who knows little about the skills of debating if you discount real anecdotal evidence.

Thanks for posting your charts but I have a few questions for you. Are you suggesting:

1. that the run of extremely wet summers since 2007 [excepting 2013] is normal Irish weather?
2. that increasing instances of flash flooding and real flooding that we have experienced in recent years is normal weather?
3. that jet stream activity is not changing?
4. that the recent run of very mild winters is normal Irish weather?
5. that climate change is not impacting on our tiny island?

I would like your opinion rather than a flurry of statistics.

Gaoth Laidir

acequion wrote: »

You're obviously another who knows little about the skills of debating if you discount real anecdotal evidence.

Thanks for posting your charts but I have a few questions for you. Are you suggesting:

1. that the run of extremely wet summers since 2007 [excepting 2013] is normal Irish weather?
2. that increasing instances of flash flooding and real flooding that we have experienced in recent years is normal weather?
3. that jet stream activity is not changing?
4. that the recent run of very mild winters is normal Irish weather?
5. that climate change is not impacting on our tiny island?

I would like your opinion rather than a flurry of statistics.

Answers a question with a run of other questions. A real debater, this guy.

JCX BXC

acequion wrote: »

You're obviously another who knows little about the skills of debating if you discount real anecdotal evidence.

You mean, only your evidence, which we must not dare discount by our scary and accurate statistics.

Didn't the church run a similar gag for years?

acequion

JCX BXC wrote: »

You mean, only your evidence, which we must not dare discount by our scary and accurate statistics.

Didn't the church run a similar gag for years?

The above remark is offensive but hardly surprising with your attitude.

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Answers a question with a run of other questions. A real debater, this guy.

Clearly no point engaging with you either.

Gaoth Laidir

acequion wrote: »

The above remark is offensive but hardly surprising with your attitude.



Clearly no point engaging with you either.

Pathetic.

Oneiric 3

In fairness, stats on their own don't give you the 'real feel' or recreate the actual human experience of weather. Someone being blown down on their arse in a car park on a wet windy winter's evening doesn't need a stat to confirm what happened to them. :P

JCX BXC

acequion wrote: »

The above remark is offensive but hardly surprising with your attitude.



Clearly no point engaging with you either.

We've tried our best to engage with you, however you've just resorted to attacking us and affirming that your posts are factual, and gospel like. I'm don't think there's any debate to be had here. Gaoth Laidir actually supplied the statistics, very clear concise statistics, however you decided to discount them for no clear reason.

Yes statistics don't give you real feel, however I can't imagine the only thing this supposed massive climate change effect affects is real feel. Not much has changed yet.

acequion

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Pathetic.

A pretty accurate description of your contribution.

Oneiric 3

JCX BXC wrote: »

Not much has changed yet.

Well from what I know from my own locality (going by both stats and experience) is that cold/snowy spells in winter are becoming less and less frequent, as are significant winter storms. Trivial you might say, but for a humble weather enthusiast like moi, substantial all the same, and certainly noticeable.

acequion

JCX BXC wrote: »

We've tried our best to engage with you, however you've just resorted to attacking us and affirming that your posts are factual, and gospel like. I'm don't think there's any debate to be had here. Gaoth Laidir actually supplied the statistics, very clear concise statistics, however you decided to discount them for no clear reason.

Yes statistics don't give you real feel, however I can't imagine the only thing this supposed massive climate change effect affects is real feel. Not much has changed yet.

You have in no way tried to engage with me. You have at every point dismissed my views and twisted it so that it seems like you're the one being attacked. Your last point comparing me to some dictatorial church was downright offensive and I have reported you for it. I can see from following this thread that I'm not the first poster you've attacked and you have been warned about it. I won't be talking to you again.

Gaoth Laidir

acequion wrote: »

You have in no way tried to engage with me. You have at every point dismissed my views and twisted it so that it seems like you're the one being attacked. Your last point comparing me to some dictatorial church was downright offensive and I have reported you for it. I can see from following this thread that I'm not the first poster you've attacked and you have been warned about it. I won't be talking to you again.

What about me? Will you be answering my question?

Oneiric 3

No of days (Summer JJA) with 1mm or more at Valentia, Co. Kerry:

Lumi

Mod Note

As this forum is part of the Science Category, robust & reasoned debate is encouraged. Let's try to do so without personalising arguments and trading insults please!

Thanks.