Sold car, gave logbook. Owner no longer wants the car

passatman86

There is a scam where people ask for payment to fix a problem that occurs in a recently private purchased car.when in fact the car is perfect. If you are interacting with him ask him to e-mail a video to you showing all the problems/damage - he might not be able if the car has no faults. I dont belive you have to pay/refund him to fix/return the car. If its genuine then to be honest its bad form for an engine to sh1t itself so soon , but ya cant predict these things

Supergurrier

So he took your car still in your name and broke it.

Tell him to go S***e

Next time handle logbook side of things properly.

goochy

I would not buy a car in car park . People have been buying cars From homes for years and if someone wants to sell in car park I would avoid. Sure the log book has their address Any way

robtri

How long did the OP have the car? 1.5 months
how many others has he sold "privately" during the year..

this can have a huge bearing on it being a private sale or if OP has bought and sold a few cars over the past year or two .. can be classified as a dealer.... and then its not as simple as buyer beware...

jasper100

robtri wrote: »

How long did the OP have the car? 1.5 months
how many others has he sold "privately" during the year..

this can have a huge bearing on it being a private sale or if OP has bought and sold a few cars over the past year or two .. can be classified as a dealer.... and then its not as simple as buyer beware...

Not sure about that. Yes there are plenty of wheeler dealers out there who buy cars, NCT them, tidy them up etc. and flog them for a profit. But its not as if the guy buying the car was under the impression he was buying from a dealer and expected dealer comeback.

mac1ntosh

Why did you hand him the log book? You always keep the log book. At least you'll know for again.

edburg

mordajedna wrote: »

I have recently sold the car.
The car had new nct etc.
After inspection, the new owner paid me the agreed amount.
(bank transfer so there is a proof of it)

Now:
I have given the log book to the new owner. (I know, my stupid mistake!)

Apparently, the timing chain in the car has snapped.
The new owner now wants to return the non-working car claiming that it is still technically mine. He refuses to sign the change of ownership documents. He also wants to drop the car at my apartment.

Has anyone been in this situation? What can I do?

This electronic bank transfer as in gave him your bank details for him to transfer or the old cheque type bank transfer???

If electronic i'd keep an eye on your accounts and maybe talk to bank and make them aware your having issue's over car sale and your worried about it being a possible scam.

Bank most likely not do anything but will at least have a record of your call should something happened.


Hopefully its just unlucky case of unseen circumstances.

Keep a note of any correspondance (date/time, whats said) over it all, just in case, but as far as anything goes car was sold as seen and there no comeback for buyer.

Jobs OXO

robtri wrote: »

How long did the OP have the car? 1.5 months
how many others has he sold "privately" during the year..

this can have a huge bearing on it being a private sale or if OP has bought and sold a few cars over the past year or two .. can be classified as a dealer.... and then its not as simple as buyer beware...

Aha! In trouble so...

Alan_007_

robtri wrote: »

How long did the OP have the car? 1.5 months
how many others has he sold "privately" during the year..

this can have a huge bearing on it being a private sale or if OP has bought and sold a few cars over the past year or two .. can be classified as a dealer.... and then its not as simple as buyer beware...

If he was at that kinda thing though, would he not have kept the car out of his own name, as in take the logbook without transferring ownership and then sell it on to the next person. That would avoid the car having extra owners on the book along with the obvious tax implications. He also got the money electrically transferred to his bank, not something you're likely to do if you're a dodgy dealer.

Maybe you're right and he is a backyard dealer, but he genuinely could just like buying cars and keeping them until he sees something else that he likes.

Or he could have bought it for cheap, knowing that he might turn a profit on it if he could get it through the nct handy enough....if it's only a one time thing that doesn't really make him a dealer either does it?

robtri

Alan_007_ wrote: »

If he was at that kinda thing though, would he not have kept the car out of his own name, as in take the logbook without transferring ownership and then sell it on to the next person. That would avoid the car having extra owners on the book along with the obvious tax implications. He also got the money electrically transferred to his bank, not something you're likely to do if you're a dodgy dealer.

Maybe you're right and he is a backyard dealer, but he genuinely could just like buying cars and keeping them until he sees something else that he likes.

Or he could have bought it for cheap, knowing that he might turn a profit on it if he could get it through the nct handy enough....if it's only a one time thing that doesn't really make him a dealer either does it?

anything is possible.. but if he is classified as a dealer, backyard or enthusiast.. he would have other obligations, like ensuring the car is fit for sale and cant hide behind buyer beware...

doesnt matter if he likes buying cars and selling them when soemthing else catches his eye, if he is deemed to be selling enough cars to be classified as a dealer then he has obligations...

something says if u sell more than 4 or 7 cars a years revenue class u as a dealer...

not saying he is selling enough a year to be classed as a dealer, but having a car for 1.5 months is possible indictive he is buying and selling a few cars

bludcrazetiger

mordajedna wrote: »

I have recently sold the car.
The car had new nct etc.
After inspection, the new owner paid me the agreed amount.
(bank transfer so there is a proof of it)

Now:
I have given the log book to the new owner. (I know, my stupid mistake!)

Apparently, the timing chain in the car has snapped.
The new owner now wants to return the non-working car claiming that it is still technically mine. He refuses to sign the change of ownership documents. He also wants to drop the car at my apartment.

Has anyone been in this situation? What can I do?

Ur foooked!! I guarantee you, he goes to his bank and gets his money bank, he will be left with a full refund, and ur car/log book.
he has scammed you.
keep us updated.

Alan_007_

robtri wrote: »

something says if u sell more than 4 or 7 cars a years revenue class u as a dealer...

Got a source for that?

Vic_08

robtri wrote: »

How long did the OP have the car? 1.5 months
how many others has he sold "privately" during the year..

this can have a huge bearing on it being a private sale or if OP has bought and sold a few cars over the past year or two .. can be classified as a dealer.... and then its not as simple as buyer beware...

If the OP was one of these black market "private sale" dealer types he would have known enough not to hand over the log book to the buyer so I think we can rule that scenario out.

jacksie66

This post has been deleted.

mordajedna

I assure you. I'm not a private market seller. This was the first car I got since Feb 2016.

Later today his mechanic called me "recommending that I give him something to fix the engine because he wants to go to court".

Ehh, has to paint the kitchen out of this stress

ainecaine

Also bank cannot take the money from your account without your permission. They can onky fix their own mistakes.

CiniO

edburg wrote: »

This electronic bank transfer as in gave him your bank details for him to transfer or the old cheque type bank transfer???

If electronic i'd keep an eye on your accounts and maybe talk to bank and make them aware your having issue's over car sale and your worried about it being a possible scam.

Bank most likely not do anything but will at least have a record of your call should something happened.

Why would OP want to keep an eye on his account?
Buyer after transferring money to OP's account has not a hope to get it back.
Also buyer having OP's account number gives him absolutely nothing.
All he can do with it, is to transfer more money to the OP, nothing else.

I'm really curious where is this fear of giving someone your account number coming from.
I've always given my account number to various people to pay me for items I was selling and I had no hesitation about that at all.

bludcrazetiger wrote: »

Ur foooked!! I guarantee you, he goes to his bank and gets his money bank, he will be left with a full refund, and ur car/log book.
he has scammed you.
keep us updated.

Can you explain how on earth could he do that?

CiniO

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Sold as seen.. they checked it out and were happy to hand over the cash as a result. Unfortunate that this has happened, but not your problem OP

This stuff though (and you see a lot of these threads) is why I'd always pay more and buy/sell through a reputable dealer unless it was for money I could afford to write-off if it came to it.
Not having to deal with some of the chancers and time-wasters I read about here - plus having some sort of actual warranty/come-back - is worth paying the extra IMO

The problem with that is when buying from a dealer you're also not protected against things like that.
Warranties are not obligatory, and very often they exclude timing belt/chain issues.
When buying from a dealer car must me of merchantable quality, fit for purpose and as described.
However timing chain or belt failing few days after sale, provided is wasn't overdue change, and there wasn't any symptoms it might go at time of sale, is just pure bad luck, and dealer could wash hands the same as private seller.

the_syco

mordajedna wrote: »

Later today his mechanic called me "recommending that I give him something to fix the engine because he wants to go to court".

Sounds like one of the buyers mates.

edburg wrote: »

This electronic bank transfer as in gave him your bank details for him to transfer or the old cheque type bank transfer???

There's no way for the buyer to magically get their money back via the bank. And if they did, the OP could bring the bank to court for thousands of thousands.

TheShow

mordajedna wrote: »

I assure you. I'm not a private market seller. This was the first car I got since Feb 2016.

Later today his mechanic called me "recommending that I give him something to fix the engine because he wants to go to court".

Ehh, has to paint the kitchen out of this stress

Block the "mechanics" number, block the buyers number and do the affadavit thing as suggested. Then grab yourself a nice cold beer, sit back and forget about the whole thing as its not your problem.

Also dont worry about the bank thing, theres no way for him to get/reverse the transfer. Some people in here believe in hokem.

bazz26

mordajedna wrote: »

I assure you. I'm not a private market seller. This was the first car I got since Feb 2016.

Later today his mechanic called me "recommending that I give him something to fix the engine because he wants to go to court".

Ehh, has to paint the kitchen out of this stress

Tell him you and your solicitor look forward to hearing from his solicitor around the court date of his case. Absolute chancer.

tom_k

Firstly, get the transfer of ownership sorted via Shannon, this guy has already gone through the M50 toll once without paying - it's not like barrier free tolling is a new thing. Parking and speeding fines may also be on the way.

The buyer sounds like a pure chancer getting a supposed "mechanic" to harass you on his behalf. The very fact that the car was capable of driving the M50 shows that it was at least running after this no comeback private sale.

Secondly, if you choose to answer any future calls fom the buyer or any of his representatives, explain that the sale has been finalised and that you do not wish to receive any further contact which you will consider harassment and will report as such.

On the issue of how many car sales makes a person a motor dealer for Revenue purposes - be it 4 or 7 or some other number - I'd love to see a source for this. A friend of mine is on his 4th car this year already - he routinely buys anything he finds "interesting" and sells them often within a few months for little or no profit. His drives have included everything from the Nissan Tiida to a Porsche Boxter - he would be an eccentric enthusiast!

Anyway, in the absence of a link to legislation/regulations it is my opinion that if one was contacted by Revenue about multiple car sales as long as one could satisfy them that a dealing business does not exist there would be no problem. Revenue are a department, I have found, that does not believe in wasting their time on persons with no case to answer.

ELM327

tom_k wrote: »

On the issue of how many car sales makes a person a motor dealer for Revenue purposes - be it 4 or 7 or some other number - I'd love to see a source for this. A friend of mine is on his 4th car this year already - he routinely buys anything he finds "interesting" and sells them often within a few months for little or no profit. His drives have included everything from the Nissan Tiida to a Porsche Boxter - he would be an eccentric enthusiast!

Anyway, in the absence of a link to legislation/regulations it is my opinion that if one was contacted by Revenue about multiple car sales as long as one could satisfy them that a dealing business does not exist there would be no problem. Revenue are a department, I have found, that does not believe in wasting their time on persons with no case to answer.

I've bought 8-10 cars in a year before and not been contacted by revenue.

dr.fuzzenstein

My guess, there is fcuk all wrong with the car.
Buyer wants to bully OP into handing over money for "repairs" that don't exist.

coylemj

CiniO wrote: »

I'm really curious where is this fear of giving someone your account number coming from.
I've always given my account number to various people to pay me for items I was selling and I had no hesitation about that at all.

It's an internet myth (repeated twice in this thread and complete rubbish) that having someone's bank account details means you can extract money from the account or at the very least reverse a transfer you previously made into the account.

It ignores the reality that when you give someone a personal cheque, you are handing over all of those details and it's never caused anyone a problem.

Wildcard7

XsApollo wrote: »

That's good.
Still doesn't mean it's not a sh*t attitude to have.
As soon as you sell something, block their number and run.

You seem a decent person, fair play, but it's starting to get a bit boring now.

When you buy a car privately, it's buyers beware. That's the way it is. The seller knows that, the buyer knows that. Anything can happen. These are the rules of the game.

The buyer plays a lottery, the outcome of which he can influence a bit by carefully checking the car and the seller.
The seller does not play a lottery, he gets a certain amount of money, full stop. However this amount is substantially lower than if he was a garage and would offer any sort of warranty.

-> The seller already pays a flat fee for anything that could happen by selling the car at a cheaper price.
-> The buyer can choose to pay that flat fee instead, and get rid of all the risk involved, by buying from a garage.

This works perfectly well. The seller goes as low as he must with his price, the buyer as high as he thinks the risk makes it worth it. Everyone knows what they're in for.

What you're saying is the same as "I don't understand why people who only turn up when the film already started can't skip the queues". It's simple. Because then everybody would do it and the whole construct wouldn't work anymore.

Henry Ford III

ELM327 wrote: »

I've bought 8-10 cars in a year before and not been contacted by revenue.

The system is one of self assessment. It's up to you to contact them.

MarkR

I've been looking at the revenue site, can't see anything about that?

antodeco

OP, depending on your phone, download a good call recordered (ACR if android). Next time any of them call, you will have the call recorded. If you want, you can tell them the call is being recorded (no legal requirement to do so) and see does he bugger off.

PukkaStukka

I can't believe that this thread is worthy of 7 pages of responses thus far and is still going. It's a non issue.