Kids on Flights

anewme

caniask86 wrote: »

If you are not prepared for unpredictable circumstance which flying is unpredictable and you have no control over noise on a flight then maybe you shouldn't fly.

Well maybe circumstances like a death in the family might make that decision for me.

You don't care about anyone else's circumstances only your own.

caniask86

anewme wrote: »

Well maybe circumstances like a death in the family might make that decision for me.

You don't care about anyone else's circumstances only your own.

Actually it's you who doesn't care for anyone else situation except if they are quiet and that's ok then.

I know when i flew i can't choose who i fly with and i try to be as positive as possible and get through the flight. i don't roll my eyes and tut tut because how does that help!

anewme

anewme wrote: »

Well maybe circumstances like a death in the family might make that decision for me.

You don't care about anyone else's circumstances only your own.

I genuinely recommend noise cancelling headphones. Seriously, if you're sensitive about noise and find it hard to cope with, it's not just kids that would disturb you. They're well worth the money if you have trouble flying. You don't have to listen to anything, you can have silence.

John_Rambo

caniask86 wrote: »

It seems to me that patience for children is an all time low here. In my husbands home country Children are celebrated and welcomed and encouraged. In Ireland I don't really feel that happens. Mostly, people are impatient, irritated and have the opinion that children should sit still and be quiet. I experience this in supermarkets, cafes, trains buses. I do feel that an airplane and its limited spaces is being solely blamed on people angered. and stress from a child screaming but I've been in the city of Dublin with my son have a meltdown and getting similar reactions.

Regards to another poster who wrote about their cousin who was Autistic, I just couldn't help feel that their attitude about Autism was such a inconvenience for everybody and the 'poor child is better of in the car where they want'
Children without special needs want to eat ice cream all day long but the parent makes sure that doesn't happen. Its the same with special needs or not, we need to encourage and teach etc.

Anyway we were all children once, without children there would be no adults.
It scares me the attitudes on this thread to be honest. It scares me for my sons future and just proves that Ireland has a long long way to go.

It's actually got better here Canaisk. I know it's hard to believe.. but a lot of people in Ireland come from a pub culture where kids wouldn't be the norm. We're slowly moving to a cafe and restaurant culture, but in days gone by a restaurant for some people would be a very special event, a mature, grown up adult affair with money spent that could be "saved" from eating at home so people have an unrealistic expectancy of dining. Basically they think they should be treated like royalty and any perceived (I use perceived specifically) disturbance is met with disapproval and frowns.

It's the same with air travel. Some people do it once a year and pay a lot to do it and seem to think they're in some sort of 1950's avantegard jetset elite group and any minor (again) perceived annoyance is eating in to their moment of affluence and prestige.

You can see it down through this thread. Normal folk taking a flight or a dinner in a restaurant thinking their highfalutin, affluent people attending the height of culture and worldliness.

When really... they're on a Ryanair flight or in a family friendly Bistro. Not at the opera.

They're just not used to it. And it shows when they start tut-tuting at families with kids that are most likely more used to dining out and traveling abroad.

caniask86

Candie wrote: »

I genuinely recommend noise cancelling headphones. Seriously, if you're sensitive about noise and find it hard to cope with, it's not just kids that would disturb you. They're well worth the money if you have trouble flying. You don't have to listen to anything, you can have silence.

I found a great pair on amazon very reasonable too for my son, they're called ear defenders but they also come in adult sizes. I wear then sometimes too

caniask86

John_Rambo wrote: »

It's actually got better here Canaisk. I know it's hard to believe.. but a lot of people in Ireland come from a pub culture where kids wouldn't be the norm. We're slowly moving to a cafe and restaurant culture, but in days gone by a restaurant for some people would be a very special event, a mature, grown up adult affair with money spent that could be "saved" from eating at home so people have an unrealistic expectancy of dining. Basically they think they should be treated like royalty and any perceived (I use perceived specifically) disturbance is met with disapproval and frowns.

It's the same with air travel. Some people do it once a year and pay a lot to do it and seem to think they're in some sort of 1950's avantegard jetset elite group and any minor (again) perceived annoyance is eating in to their moment of affluence and prestige.

You can see it down through this thread. Normal folk taking a flight or a dinner in a restaurant thinking their highfalutin, affluent people attending the height of culture and worldliness.

When really... they're on a Ryanair flight or in a family friendly Bistro. Not at the opera.

They're just not used to it. And it shows when they start tut-tuting at families with kids that are most likely more used to dining out and traveling abroad.

Sometimes it's hard see the progress but thanks for the reminder. it's easy to look at the negativity and miss the positive side of things.

anewme

Candie wrote: »

I genuinely recommend noise cancelling headphones. Seriously, if you're sensitive about noise and find it hard to cope with, it's not just kids that would disturb you. They're well worth the money if you have trouble flying. You don't have to listen to anything, you can have silence.

I don't think it would normally bother me, as I travel ok but we all have journeys that we don't want to face and there is nothing wring with wanting those particular journeys to go as smoothly as possible.

caniask86

caniask86 wrote: »

I found a great pair on amazon very reasonable too for my son, they're called ear defenders but they also come in adult sizes. I wear then sometimes too

I have fancy Bose ones now but I used to take an aviation headset with me before I got them, just in case there was noise when I wanted to sleep. There are things you can do, people can be proactive in assuring their own comfort. If you're genuinely distressed by noise and don't want to take chances, then it's worth forking out for the noise canceling headsets.

anewme

caniask86 wrote: »

Actually it's you who doesn't care for anyone else situation except if they are quiet and that's ok then.

I know when i flew i can't choose who i fly with and i try to be as positive as possible and get through the flight. i don't roll my eyes and tut tut because how does that help!

I don't tut at all, if you read my posts throughout this thread, I think it's unhelpful.

But don't let that stop your rant.

caniask86

Candie wrote: »

I have fancy Bose ones now but I used to take aviation headphones with me before I got them, just in case there was noise when I wanted to sleep. There are things you can do, people can be proactive in assuring their own comfort. If you're genuinely distressed by noise and don't want to take chances, then it's worth forking out for the noise canceling headsets.

I must look into them. Exactly i know myself that i am prepared for each flight with everything i possible can bring, i do to help my son and keep him comfortable so he is happy and content on a flight. it's not always possible and those earphones would come in handy for other people. it would be a great idea actually if the airline rented them.

caniask86

caniask86 wrote: »

I must look into them. Exactly i know myself that i am prepared for each flight with everything i possible can bring, i do to help my son and keep him comfortable so he is happy and content on a flight. it's not always possible and those earphones would come in handy for other people. it would be a great idea actually if the airline rented them.

They're standard in business class. I wonder if they'd be a money spinner for the airlines if they rented them for a few euro per flight though, that might be something they could think about if there was enough demand.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

anewme wrote: »

I don't tut at all, if you read my posts throughout this thread, I think it's unhelpful.

But don't let that stop your rant.

I tut, I can't help it. My mother must have indulged me as a child

John_Rambo

caniask86 wrote: »

Sometimes it's hard see the progress but thanks for the reminder. it's easy to look at the negativity and miss the positive side of things.

I'm with you.. Look, since I've had kids I've rarely dined out without then and I've rarely traveled without them. Although they're in the minority unfortunately the luddites make a bigger impression than the well traveled, more educated people appreciate the kids that will grow up used to travel and dining.

caniask86

John_Rambo wrote: »

I'm with you.. Look, since I've had kids I've rarely dined out without then and I've rarely traveled without them. Although they're in the minority unfortunately the luddites make a bigger impression than the well traveled, more educated people appreciate the kids that will grow up used to travel and dining.

We also frequently dine out and fly regularly as my husband isn't from Ireland. it's a lovely experience to bond as a family and we want our son to know his family who are abroad.

caniask86

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I tut, I can't help it. My mother must have indulged me as a child

I think it's up to each person to take responsibility of how they behave as adults

John_Rambo

caniask86 wrote: »

We also frequently dine out and fly regularly as my husband isn't from Ireland. it's a lovely experience to bond as a family and we want our son to know his family who are abroad.

Same here, don't forget for every fool, there's at least 100 people that understand, appreciate, acknowledge and like kids involved in travel and food. They just don't resonate as much as the tutters!!!

caniask86

anewme wrote: »

I don't tut at all, if you read my posts throughout this thread, I think it's unhelpful.

But don't let that stop your rant.

I was also referring to other posters on this thread. i'm am sorry if i miss quoted you. i also don't go out of my way to stress people on flights.

anewme

John_Rambo wrote: »

I'm with you.. Look, since I've had kids I've rarely dined out without then and I've rarely traveled without them. Although they're in the minority unfortunately the luddites make a bigger impression than the well traveled, more educated people appreciate the kids that will grow up used to travel and dining.

You must be living in the past...EVERYONE, educated or not, can travel. Call it the Ryanair effect.

caniask86

John_Rambo wrote: »

Same here, don't forget for every fool, there's at least 100 people that understand, appreciate, acknowledge and like kids involved in travel and food. They just don't resonate as much as the tutters!!!

That is very true and we have had some nice experience too. Deep breath and carry on with life

John_Rambo

anewme wrote: »

You must be living in the past...EVERYONE, educated or not, can travel. Call it the Ryanair effect.

Yes. I'm aware of that, and it's fantastic, but you missed my point altogether. I avail of Ryanair flights all the time! But, it's a Ryanair flight, there's going to be kids, they might talk out loud, cry or shout. That's ok. Some people think on this thread think that's unacceptable. It's not.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

It's only the uneducated oafs with no money that expect kids to learn manners

caniask86

LexieOnRale wrote: »

It's only the uneducated oafs with no money that expect kids to learn manners

No but maybe people who think they're experts on how children should or shouldn't behave.

anewme

John_Rambo wrote: »

Yes. I'm aware of that, and it's fantastic, but you missed my point altogether. I avail of Ryanair flights all the time! But, it's a Ryanair flight, there's going to be kids, they might talk out loud, cry or shout. That's ok. Some people think on this thread think that's unacceptable. It's not.

screaming , screeching, head banging, pulling hair for an hour and forty five minutes at high decibels might upset people.

That does make them low class or uneducated.

It does not make them bad people.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

I think it's fairly reasonable to assume you aren't expected to be subjected to someone else's child scream hysterically for close on two hours in a confined space. I can't imagine expecting reasonable behaviour is an outlandish demand, unless the parents are the type to think their child is the only one on the flight and thecrest of the passengers should smile and look encouraging as tantrum is in full swing, smiling for all 105 mins of screaming and seat kicking

caniask86

anewme wrote: »

screaming , screeching, head banging, pulling hair for an hour and forty five minutes at high decibels might upset people.

That does make them low class or uneducated.

It does not make them bad people.

It's ok to be upset,that was never in debate. Most people who seen this behavior would conclude that something else is going on with the child. It's ok to be upset by the noise but it's not ok to make the situation worse by going on like a child yourself.

That one hour and forty minutes is what parents might be going through every day for hours. It does not mean the parent is not trying to calm the child just because the screaming does not stop.

caniask86

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I think it's fairly reasonable to assume you aren't expected to be subjected to someone else's child scream hysterically for close on two hours in a confined space. I can't imagine expecting reasonable behaviour is an outlandish demand, unless the parents are the type to think their child is the only one on the flight and thecrest of the passengers should smile and look encouraging as tantrum is in full swing, smiling for all 105 mins of screaming and seat kicking

The parent was trying to calm the child. The child had Autism and couldn't calm down. How in the world does tutting and rolling your eyes help the situation. The point being grow up and deal with it and if you can't deal with then put on earphones. Are you more annoyed that the child is throwing a tantrum and you don't agree with the parents parenting style or because a precious snowflake can't understand that some situations can't be avoided.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

caniask86 wrote: »

The parent was trying to calm the child. The child had Autism and couldn't calm down. How in the world does tutting and rolling your eyes help the situation. The point being grow up and deal with it and if you can't deal with then put on earphones. Are you more annoyed that the child is throwing a tantrum and you don't agree with the parents parenting style or because a precious snowflake can't understand that some situations can't be avoided.

Other people's children are not my problem

anewme

caniask86 wrote: »

It's ok to be upset,that was never in debate. Most people who seen this behavior would conclude that something else is going on with the child. It's ok to be upset by the noise but it's not ok to make the situation worse by going on like a child yourself.

That one hour and forty minutes is what parents might be going through every day for hours. It does not mean the parent is not trying to calm the child just because the screaming does not stop.

Agreed I think I would know when it is something more than just a bold child and leave it at that.

caniask86

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Other people's children are not my problem

Exactly, they are not. What exactly do you feel should of happened with this situation on the plane?

John_Rambo

anewme wrote: »

screaming , screeching, head banging, pulling hair for an hour and forty five minutes at high decibels might upset people.

That does make them low class or uneducated.

It does not make them bad people.

No, of course not, a bad choice of words on my behalf. I didn't mean uneducated in a classical or scholarly sense.

I'd say if someone feels selfishly put out by a child's negative reaction to an unusual situation and feels that they're feeling more pain than the child and the parents of the child I'm with you 100%. They are neither uneducated, lower class (don't know where you got that one from) nor bad people.

They are obviously morons. It's a very short hour and forty five minutes of their lives.

caniask86

anewme wrote: »

Agreed I think I would know when it is something more than just a bold child and leave it at that.

Not everyone is like you though unfortunately.

anewme

caniask86 wrote: »

Exactly, they are not. What exactly do you feel should of happened with this situation on the plane?

If the mother wanted to thank aer lingus for their help, why did she not send a card and a box of chocs, or a private message to aer lingus.

Instead, while admitting her child screamed for an hour and 45 mins, she called other people ignorant for not wanting to put up with it on Facebook.

This approach was creating additional drama.

caniask86

anewme wrote: »

If the mother wanted to thank aer lingus for their help, why did she not send a card and a box of chocs, or a private message to aer lingus.

Instead, while admitting her child screamed for an hour and 45 mins, she called other people ignorant for not wanting to put up with it on Facebook.

This approach was creating additional drama.

I took it as she was trying to create awareness for Autism and showing how kind words and reactions can make all the difference. Matter of perspective maybe.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

caniask86 wrote: »

Exactly, they are not. What exactly do you feel should of happened with this situation on the plane?

The parent had no right to try shame other people for not being enthralled with her child. Their reactions to her child's disruptive behaviour is their own personal reactions. She has no right to demand people show tolerance and not ask to be moved away because her child kicked off. I understand the child can't help it, that's fair enough but she put the child (for whatever reason, it doesn't matter) in a situation that was uncomfortable for everyone. At worst it was annoying, nobody died, nobody was injured, everyone will get over it, but to call for people NOT to show a reaction to a disturbance shows how intolerant of other people she is so it's very ironic she's pleading for tolerance

caniask86

LexieOnRale wrote: »

The parent had no right to try shame other people for not being enthralled with her child. Their reactions to her child's disruptive behaviour is their own personal reactions. haShe s no right to demand people show tolerance and not ask to be moved away because her child kicked off. I understand the child can't help it, that's fair enough but she put the child (for whatever reason, it doesn't matter) in a situation that was uncomfortable for everyone. At worst it was annoying, nobody died, nobody was injured, everyone will get over it, but to call for people NOT to show a reaction to a disturbance shows how intolerant of other people she is so it's very ironic she's pleading for tolerance

I'm not sure what to say to be honest. I don't think she was demanded tolerance but rather upset people didn't show it. She had told the airline that her child had special needs so I am sure when people complained they were made aware of the situation. Most people this would be enough for them to understand it's unavoidable and the mother was trying.

She brought the child on a holiday Lexie, she didn't leave the child behind because it might make 'people uncomfortable' imagine if we kept people inside or away from combined spaces because they make people uncomfortable.

Honestly you need to have a word with yourself with your attitude.

anewme

caniask86 wrote: »

I took it as she was trying to create awareness for Autism and showing how kind words and reactions can make all the difference. Matter of perspective maybe.

Maybe.

I took it as passive aggression.

I don't agree with her approach.

Sh failed to take anyone feelings or reasons for travelling into account. It was all about her and her family, fck the rest of the passengers, who might have God Knows what going in in their lives.

caniask86

anewme wrote: »

Maybe.

I took it as passive aggression.

I don't agree with her approach.

Sh failed to take anyone feelings or reasons for travelling into account. It was all about her and her family, fck the test of the passengers, who might have God Knows what going in in their lives.

It's like you think it was premeditated. There is no predictor that says a child will throw a tantrum or behave. We cannot stay indoors with fear in case it happens and affect other people.

anewme

caniask86 wrote: »

It's like you think it was premeditated. There is no predictor that says a child will throw a tantrum or behave. We cannot stay indoors with fear in case it happens and affect other people.

No I didn't think it was premeditated, but I think she should have concentrated on her holiday and family instead of writing that post after the event. There was nothing to be gained, only drama. She failed to see anything from any perspective only her own.

Agree about trying sto shame other people, there was no need at that point.

deandean

Hopefully the parents of the kid will have learnt from this flight. There is a straightforward remedy for this which will help the child, the parents and all the passengers on the plane. Mum goes to her friendly GP and gets a couple of little tablets, one for the outward journey and one for the return. The kid will relax / sleep. Happy days all round.

caniask86

deandean wrote: »

Hopefully the parents of the kid will have learnt from this flight. There is a straightforward remedy for this which will help the child, the parents and all the passengers on the plane. Mum goes to her friendly GP and gets a couple of little tablets, one for the outward journey and one for the return. The kid will relax / sleep. Happy days all round.

No this is not a simple solution for many reason in fact if you did a little bit of research some children with autism can have the opposite reaction with sedative as we have experienced with our own child during a procedure, also GPs don't hand out sedatives for children. Most sedatives aren't safe for adults let along children under 12.

little foot

Sweet Jaysus lads. Bunch of moaning fools. Did it ruin ur holiday? Is it eating u up? Kids are hard enough to deal with let alone an autistic child. Wish i had de perfect family but ders no such ting!! One thing is for sure though, moaners will moan and inconsiderate saps will always be inconsiderate saps

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

caniask86 wrote: »

I'm not sure what to say to be honest. I don't think she was demanded tolerance but rather upset people didn't show it. She had told the airline that her child had special needs so I am sure when people complained they were made aware of the situation. Most people this would be enough for them to understand it's unavoidable and the mother was trying.

She brought the child on a holiday Lexie, she didn't leave the child behind because it might make 'people uncomfortable' imagine if we kept people inside or away from combined spaces because they make people uncomfortable.

Honestly you need to have a word with yourself with your attitude.

My attitude is fine thanks, I wasn't on the flight nor have I been affected by children on a flight. I have had a brat swing his legs sitting in front of me on the train, kicking my legs for most of the journey. Having given the child's mother ample opportunity to remedy the situation, she chose to ignore her child's behaviour so I had a loud phone conversation with my friend about the child and her parenting skills while sitting next to them. As far as I can recall, only then did she tell the child to stop kicking me.

caniask86

LexieOnRale wrote: »

My attitude is fine thanks, I wasn't on the flight nor have I been affected by children on a flight. I have had a brat swing his legs sitting in front of me on the train, kicking my legs for most of the journey. Having given the child's mother ample opportunity to remedy the situation, she chose to ignore her child's behaviour so I had a loud phone conversation with my friend about the child and her parenting skills while sitting next to them. As far as I can recall, only then did she tell the child to stop kicking me.

I was in a train one time and the lady was complaining and talking loudly on her phone. Annoying all the passengers over something pretty petty. Being an adult is hard... Poor poor you.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

caniask86 wrote: »

I was in a train one time and the lady was complaining and talking loudly on her phone. Annoying all the passengers over something pretty petty. Being an adult is hard... Poor poor you.

Well isn't it a good life lesson for the kids at least

Bitches Be Trypsin

caniask86 wrote: »

I was in a train one time and the lady was complaining and talking loudly on her phone. Annoying all the passengers over something pretty petty. Being an adult is hard... Poor poor you.

Being kicked in the leg isn't petty. I have juvenile onset arthritis and if I was kicked in the knee repeatedly I could literally be crippled for days.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

Bitches Be Trypsin wrote: »

Being kicked in the leg isn't petty. I have juvenile onset arthritis and if I was kicked in the knee repeatedly I could literally be crippled for days.

Never mind being anemic and being easily bruised, as long as the child wants to swing his legs and kick whoevers in front of him. I DGAF about kids as long as they don't impact on me, your kid puts a mark on my body, then we have a problem.

flas

Was on a flight recently and a child couldn't handle the air pressure,screaming crying from the pain of its ears popping,load of the older people on the plane started giving out,tutting and one shouted "shut that child up,its ruining my holiday"..what an absolute prick thing to do,the child was obviously distressed,the parents apologized,even though they didnt have to,everyone around stuck up for the kid and made the old fu ckers complaining feel like ****e,good enough for them

caniask86

Bitches Be Trypsin wrote: »

Being kicked in the leg isn't petty. I have juvenile onset arthritis and if I was kicked in the knee repeatedly I could literally be crippled for days.

We going by the logic of this thread maybe you shouldn't go on public transport then in order no to inconvenience people with your special needs as regards to your arthritis. Shocking isn't it and unfair.

caniask86

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Never mind being anemic and being easily bruised, as long as the child wants to swing his legs and kick whoevers in front of him. I DGAF about kids as long as they don't impact on me, your kid puts a mark on my body, then we have a problem.

Your anemia is not my problem not so IGAF. You should stay indoors where it is safe. This is how you'd reason anyway.

Bitches Be Trypsin

caniask86 wrote: »

We going by the logic of this thread maybe you shouldn't go on public transport then in order no to inconvenience people with your special needs as regards to your arthritis. Shocking isn't it and unfair.

I'm obeying social standards. The child kicking is not. Maybe kids kicking should not be allowed in public.