Dublin V Mayo .. opinions on the final

Stoner

Shurimgreat wrote:

I think you are over-reacting. The "Dublin Joe" thing is a bit of a joke. No-one takes it seriously, no more than anyone takes the Mayo Curse seriously.

We had to beat Kerry three more times for them to realise it was a joke after 2011!!!

yop

Stoner wrote: »

We had to beat Kerry three more times for them to realise it was a joke after 2011!!!

Its "Mayo Gough" now

MayoAreMagic

wazzer1 wrote: »

He reffed 1 training game ever. Talk about getting the excuses in early, if anything hes been more favourable to Mayo. Maybe have a look at the free count from recent meetings.

Well sorry but the vast majority of Dublin fans swear blind that he reffed none at all, so I think you will understand if people are slow to accept your figures. One? Ten? Who knows for definite? Definitely not none anyway, that is for sure... Bottom line it is true.

On the topic of free counts propaganda - two points:
1. Can you actually point to instances of frees given that weren't actually frees? The logic seems to be, well the number was high so it must be wrong, which obviously isn't going to be taken seriously by anyone. The free count was high, but very few were incorrect decisions. I don't see how this is anyone elses than Dublin's fault. If you want a lower free count stop fouling.

2. With that many fouls, surely there should have been some more cards handed out? You would imagine a team fouling that often should have about 6 guys on yellow cards. Look at the Kerry-Mayo replay from this year for example. A similarly feisty game had 3 red cards in it and a raft of yellows.

That is the reality, Dublin were overly aggressive in the tackle on the day (even dubs beside me were saying this) and mayo kept running at them. The end result was a foul in every 2 out of 3 attacks, and then of course, a load of cynical fouling at the end probably pushed up the numbers no end. They were lucky to not have at least one player sent off on a double yellow. Talk about looking a gift horse in the mouth...

MayoAreMagic

blanch152 wrote: »

First you imagine he referees a vs b games, then you imagine he gets paid. You know, you might eventually might be able to imagine Mayo winning an All-Ireland!

Do you ever think that you might be slandering certain referees? It is fair game to say about a referee that he made a mistake here or a mistake there - all of us make mistakes.

It is another level of accusation as you do, to suggest certain referees have a consistent bias in favour of one team or another.

Im stating what I have seen and have given examples to back it up. I would call that analysis of performances over time.
As for mcquillan coming in to ref games for Dublin, well why wouldn't the guy get paid? Do you work for free yourself? As I said, no problem.
Re Deegan, I have already stated that I don't think he is doing this on purpose. He might just be the type of guy who thinks the favourites will probably win out, which could filter into some decisions he makes.

That isn't slander. Calling people divers and cheaters on the other hand...

MayoAreMagic

bucketybuck wrote: »

So they got an intercounty ref to come in for a training match.

Two questions then, what is stopping every other county doing the exact same thing? And what was the backup plan if a different ref had been picked for the final?

Here, I'll save you the time and just answer the first question for you. There is nothing stopping any other county asking a ref to come to a training session, and it happens in other counties every goddamn season.

Don't bother with the 2nd question either, I don't want to listen to tinfoil hat rubbish about a fix when it comes to ref selection. :rolleyes:

If it isn't an issue why do so many pretend it didn't happen? Why are Dubs still cribbing about Horan pointing it out all of 5 years later?

If it is happening all the time then why was it mentioned at all? Why did Pat McEneaney come out with a dodgey statement trying to cover the refs tracks? Why would those things need to happen if what you say is true?

If a county team asks a ref to come in and ref games for them, I think you will find they now will not do it... Which speaks volumes. Proper order too. It isn't fair.

If you read posts instead of assuming what I am saying and thinking, you would see that I don't have an issue with McQuillan reffing the game. I simply took issue with guys pretending that the training games thing never happened. I also pointed out why that happening wasn't fair, and pointed out why the Dubs who say mcquillan is actually against them, is nonsense, by showing the logic they were using about free counts is flawed.


To my mind it is just propaganda. The Dub fans seem to want to spin everything to suit the Dubs. Mayo cynically foul Dublin in 12, 'Mayo are cheats and should have had guys sent off', Dublin do the same in 13, 'mcquillan is giving too many frees against Dublin'. Keegan grabs Connolly in a headlock, it becomes a chokehold and the guy is in fear of his life, Connolly grabs a Westmeath guy in the very same 'chokehold' and it morphs back into a headlock and a bit of messing in general.
Cillian O'Connor is a thug, a cheat and a diver, yet Philly McMahon is a just a tough player.

Are ye for real like? The lack of self-awareness is unbelievable.

yop

Any chance of a private "Discussion" room for a few lads from this thread.

Shurimgreat

Anyways getting away from the ref thing and back to the match.

We beat Kerry because they had noticeable weaknesses such as in their full back line and also didn't know how to use the sweeper.

Dublin have no noticeable weaknesses, are experts at the sweeper, perfect kick out strategy, a brilliant 1-15 and will have a brilliant 16-21 coming off the bench. On paper this should be a comfortable Dublin victory.

MayoAreMagic

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Anyways getting away from the ref thing and back to the match.

We beat Kerry because they had noticeable weaknesses such as in their full back line and also didn't know how to use the sweeper.

Dublin have no noticeable weaknesses, are experts at the sweeper, perfect kick out strategy, a brilliant 1-15 and will have a brilliant 16-21 coming off the bench. On paper this should be a comfortable Dublin victory.

They are a fine team but nobody is without weaknesses. Assuming they line up as normal they dont really have anyone to match DOC height-wise. Going for mobility in mf means you can be got at in the air, while some of their main forwards are yet to experience/do well in the cauldron that is coming. Their bench is strong, but have they enough games played recently? They also haven't had a tough game yet. Plenty room to manoeuvre for mayo there

flasher0030

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

They are a fine team but nobody is without weaknesses. Assuming they line up as normal they dont really have anyone to match DOC height-wise. Going for mobility in mf means you can be got at in the air, while some of their main forwards are yet to experience/do well in the cauldron that is coming. Their bench is strong, but have they enough games played recently? They also haven't had a tough game yet. Plenty room to manoeuvre for mayo there

And how do you think the ref will perform?

flasher0030

It will be interesting the matchups in the game. Would it be an idea for Rochford to try to have Keegan marking Kilkenny. Kilkenny likes to think he is the orchestrator of the team - the Pirlo as someone on these forums alluded to. It would be interesting to put him on the back-foot, and try to have Keegan making the odd burst up the pitch. Boyle on Scully (if he's playing). Barrett on Mannion - if he can handle the eagerness and pace of James O'Donoghue, he should be able to keep Mannion relatively quiet. Harrison to keep tabs on Andrews. Higgins to pick up O'Callaghan, and again try to have him on the back-foot with his upfield runs. I'm not sure who on Rock - but he is the least dangerous of the forwards from play anyway.

Anyway, I say all of this. But it's not even the issue for Mayo. How the hell are S O'Shea and Parsons going to shade McCarthy and Fenton in midfield. And which of the forwards is going to act like a defender to stop Jack Mc's sprints. It's McCarthys running that is going to cause problems for Mayo, as it will make it easy for the forwards to create room for themselves. McLoughlin is not the man for it. D O'Connor hasn't hit form this year. Rochford may put Higgins there. Or he may go all defensive from the off and put someone like Stephen Coen or Drake in wing forward and told to man mark. Of course, this limits Mayos forward options even more.

MayoAreMagic

flasher0030 wrote: »

It will be interesting the matchups in the game. Would it be an idea for Rochford to try to have Keegan marking Kilkenny. Kilkenny likes to think he is the orchestrator of the team - the Pirlo as someone on these forums alluded to. It would be interesting to put him on the back-foot, and try to have Keegan making the odd burst up the pitch. Boyle on Scully (if he's playing). Barrett on Mannion - if he can handle the eagerness and pace of James O'Donoghue, he should be able to keep Mannion relatively quiet. Harrison to keep tabs on Andrews. Higgins to pick up O'Callaghan, and again try to have him on the back-foot with his upfield runs. I'm not sure who on Rock - but he is the least dangerous of the forwards from play anyway.

Anyway, I say all of this. But it's not even the issue for Mayo. How the hell are S O'Shea and Parsons going to shade McCarthy and Fenton in midfield. And which of the forwards is going to act like a defender to stop Jack Mc's sprints. It's McCarthys running that is going to cause problems for Mayo, as it will make it easy for the forwards to create room for themselves. McLoughlin is not the man for it. D O'Connor hasn't hit form this year. Rochford may put Higgins there. Or he may go all defensive from the off and put someone like Stephen Coen or Drake in wing forward and told to man mark. Of course, this limits Mayos forward options even more.

Kilkenny changes the plan for dublin. It seems to be a set thing. He goes backwards, his teammates take it as their cue to go wide. Turn him over and there is a goal on. Higgins could be detailed for him, or boyle. Id like to see keegan but he might be needed elsewhere.
The mayo defenders matched up well with the dublin forwards last time out. Id expect similar matchups.
Re the midfield, parsons is as mobile as anyone in this position - stuck with and outplayed barry in the replay, while keegan or vaughan could operate in there too. And sos was mayos best player in the replay last year and is after getting the better of david moran - the best mf out there, so i wouldnt say it is cut and dried here. There is an awful lot of bodies around the middle this season in general - could be why fenton isnt as prominent - so it could be more attritional.
I actually think mccarthy might be switched into defence, with flynn/mdmc coming in at mf. He was detailed to mark doherty in the replay last year after doherty done a fair bit of damage in the first game. He done a good job in fairness so with doherty in good form i wouldnt be surprised if that happened again.
I wonder will lowndes play at wing forward again with durkan/higgins/keegan in mind?

ThunbergsAreGo

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Some supporters of every county blame the ref when they lose. Stand beside a Dublin supporter in Croke Park if the ref isn't being generous to them and you will get an earful.

Lets hope the ref is fair and balanced, and may the better team win in a fair and sporting contest.

And lets hope AOS is protected for a change.

Hasn't AOS won a crazy amount of frees this year?
Actual frees given to a "big man"

irishgeo

naughtb4 wrote: »

Hasn't AOS won a crazy amount of frees this year?
Actual frees given to a "big man"

he has to carefully about the barging.

mayo seem to have cut that out of late but hey still get caught out.

i hope the refs and his assistant are watching out for players being taken out off he ball. peter harte was taken out off the ball while making a run more than once by dublin players.