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Gambling addiction..
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Thank you Koolhanger. Everyone must have will power if I can do this
I can't seem to quote two comments for some reason :d
The dream never stops is right. I have recently decided that it's time to be happy with what I have and not want the unrealistic things in life like fancy cars and big mansions and so on. Personally I think this is a big downfall as it can depress you not having all these things. At least I got the hot girlfriend which is enough for me
Pics or I don't believe you 😂😂😂😂
In all serious though FairPlay it's a powerful addiction, I gave up fags and couldn't imagine giving up gambling but thank god I only have about 20 bets a year all small scale0 -
https://vimeo.com/265604468
Baz Ashmawy hosts this Documentary on Rte tonight.
He divides opinion but hopefully his presence doesn't stop people taking this seriously as i think this could finally be the chance for people to open their eyes and realise the gambling problem we have in this country and put the squeeze on the Government to tighten up on bookmakers.
I'm all for people making their own choices at the end of the day but the lack of restrictions on how bookmakers promote their products and operate their business(show any competence on betting horse racing for example and get limited on your account but still informed you can still bet on their casino games to any stake) can't be good for the country in the long run both in terms of wellbeing and the racing industry.
I rarely bet in shops these days as a bookmakers is more like an Arcade these days to my eye, roulette on the t.v, Virtual horse racing&car races and one day i even seen a virtual coin toss gameI'm not a master in psychology or anything like that but surely betting events like that are purely aimed at problem gamblers.
In a pub if someone is drunk out of their minds, the barperson is not allowed serve them anymore by law. In a bookies if a member of staff refused to take a bet off a customer because they had lost too much they'd be looking for a new job i suspect.0 -
posturingpat wrote: »https://vimeo.com/265604468
Baz Ashmawy hosts this Documentary on Rte tonight.
He divides opinion but hopefully his presence doesn't stop people taking this seriously as i think this could finally be the chance for people to open their eyes and realise the gambling problem we have in this country and put the squeeze on the Government to tighten up on bookmakers.
I'm all for people making their own choices at the end of the day but the lack of restrictions on how bookmakers promote their products and operate their business(show any competence on betting horse racing for example and get limited on your account but still informed you can still bet on their casino games to any stake) can't be good for the country in the long run both in terms of wellbeing and the racing industry.
I rarely bet in shops these days as a bookmakers is more like an Arcade these days to my eye, roulette on the t.v, Virtual horse racing&car races and one day i even seen a virtual coin toss gameI'm not a master in psychology or anything like that but surely betting events like that are purely aimed at problem gamblers.
In a pub if someone is drunk out of their minds, the barperson is not allowed serve them anymore by law. In a bookies if a member of staff refused to take a bet off a customer because they had lost too much they'd be looking for a new job i suspect.
Baz is a bit of an addict himself, hypocrites never look in the mirror. Leave punters alone Baz, and I won't tell you to pack in what you like. Freedom of choice is a wonderful thing.0 -
posturingpat wrote: »In a pub if someone is drunk out of their minds, the barperson is not allowed serve them anymore by law. In a bookies if a member of staff refused to take a bet off a customer because they had lost too much they'd be looking for a new job i suspect.
I've been told in Australia they can tell someone to **** off if they feel a punter is too drunk or when their stakes become erratic if they're a regular.
Not that they should have to though. Most of the time the people behind the counter are just kids. I don't think they should have to get involved like that with a punter who may react in any number of ways.
It's sh1t when you're in the height of it and I'm speaking from experience in saying that, but at the end of day we need to take responsibility for ourselves.0 -
As i say lads i'm very much in the we're all grown ups camp but it's how some of the business is conducted that irks me.
Basically to my eye their target customer isn't us guys who like a bet and can take it or leave it but rather the people that will continually compulsive gamble and never have a chance of turning a profit.
On a selfish note if there was legislation in place to limit some of these "products" offered to compulsive gamblers it'd surely mean bookmakers having to try perform their initial job and take bets on horse racing without looking for clearance:rolleyes:.0 -
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I was in a bookies on Friday evening to place a bet on the Scottish champion hurdle. Was a decent sized bet each way on a horse to win about a grand if it won. I had to wait for about 5-10mins while the staff faffed about on the phone calling head office doing the usual ****e.
Meanwhile there was a guy in there drunk out of his mind dropping 20s and 50s on dogs/virtual dogs/american racing/virtual racing anything he could get his hands on.
Not a bother to them taking his bets. He dropped at least 250 while I was there and I'm not sure if he had a winner.
Absolutely sickening stuff really.
They eventually took the bet and I said to them when I was leaving that if it was that guy I wouldn't have had to wait to long. The staff looked a bit embarrassed but I doubt they gave a **** really.0 -
I was in a bookies on Friday evening to place a bet on the Scottish champion hurdle. Was a decent sized bet each way on a horse to win about a grand if it won. I had to wait for about 5-10mins while the staff faffed about on the phone calling head office doing the usual ****e.
Meanwhile there was a guy in there drunk out of his mind dropping 20s and 50s on dogs/virtual dogs/american racing/virtual racing anything he could get his hands on.
Not a bother to them taking his bets. He dropped at least 250 while I was there and I'm not sure if he had a winner.
Absolutely sickening stuff really.
They eventually took the bet and I said to them when I was leaving that if it was that guy I wouldn't have had to wait to long. The staff looked a bit embarrassed but I doubt they gave a **** really.
This is the kind of thing that is ridiculous. A market that they should have full faith in their traders on and liability of a Grand they're ringing it in.
Embarassing for the bookmaker concerned whoever it was.0 -
posturingpat wrote: »This is the kind of thing that is ridiculous. A market that they should have full faith in their traders on and liability of a Grand they're ringing it in.
Embarassing for the bookmaker concerned whoever it was.
Agree 100%, happens lots and lots. What if you went shopping and the bill came to 25 quid, and the person at the checkout said to hang on, comes back and says its 30 quid. Lay the price or don't put it up. If its cut in that's grand. If not lay the bet. Virtual and dog punters are rarely refused a bet0 -
Yep definitely. I don't want the thread to drag to much off topic.
I have no problem waiting for a bet or being refused if there are similar restrictions put in place to help the problem gamblers also. If i get on or not is not going to make or break my day/week there will always be more opportunities to get on.
This guy i mentioned above had no business in a bookies never mind dropping a weeks wages in a couple of hours(a presumption on the rate he was betting) and the staff didn't even question it. (maybe they did but not in the 10 mins i was there)
The staff should be better educated to be able to either refuse people or something. Im not really sure what to do in that sense and am not singling them out. But their employers should be providing them with training and resources to help.0 -
Yep definitely. I don't want the thread to drag to much off topic.
I have no problem waiting for a bet or being refused if there are similar restrictions put in place to help the problem gamblers also. If i get on or not is not going to make or break my day/week there will always be more opportunities to get on.
This guy i mentioned above had no business in a bookies never mind dropping a weeks wages in a couple of hours(a presumption on the rate he was betting) and the staff didn't even question it. (maybe they did but not in the 10 mins i was there)
The staff should be better educated to be able to either refuse people or something. Im not really sure what to do in that sense and am not singling them out. But their employers should be providing them with training and resources to help.
You do see a lot more even within the last 2-3 years. Coffee machines and biscuits are a curse in a bookies, some of the local characters only come in for Tea/Coffee, which is OK, but a lot of people who never punted came in for it, and it turned into an expensive cup. You get genuine loop the loops in there as well. A chap kept asking me did I win anything at Cheltenham, and this was last year 10 or 12 weeks after the meeting. I was a few quid behind at Sandown that day, and a fancied horse won the Military Gold Cup. The jockey was a chap called Captain Guy Disley, and he lost a leg in Afghanistan. When he passed the post some fruitcake said its an advantage to have only one leg, as he would carry less weight. I didn't bother answering, how could you. Addiction is terrible in any form, but the Wexford postman and Baz with his self promoting documentary are not the best people to highlight it. The Wexford man said tony10, his betting account was his alter ego, a different person. That is an astonishing cop out0 -
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As someone who never bets, I still find it amazing that driving through our small local town at 9pm, the four major bookies are still open & quite busy. Half the shops are still unoccupied, but the bookies are thriving.
The bombardment of mobile & TV ads would be very tempting to an addict too, I presume.0 -
I watched this one day on a youtube TED talk binge i was having. If anyone has 20 minutes its well worth a watch.
The Rise and Fall of a gambling addict. Fairly frightening what this guy was doing to have a bet. Hard to relate to but its certainly interesting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AN3VLLlkdI0 -
Mysterypunter wrote: »You do see a lot more even within the last 2-3 years. Coffee machines and biscuits are a curse in a bookies, some of the local characters only come in for Tea/Coffee, which is OK, but a lot of people who never punted came in for it, and it turned into an expensive cup. You get genuine loop the loops in there as well. A chap kept asking me did I win anything at Cheltenham, and this was last year 10 or 12 weeks after the meeting. I was a few quid behind at Sandown that day, and a fancied horse won the Military Gold Cup. The jockey was a chap called Captain Guy Disley, and he lost a leg in Afghanistan. When he passed the post some fruitcake said its an advantage to have only one leg, as he would carry less weight. I didn't bother answering, how could you. Addiction is terrible in any form, but the Wexford postman and Baz with his self promoting documentary are not the best people to highlight it. The Wexford man said tony10, his betting account was his alter ego, a different person. That is an astonishing cop out
I've ordered that book, has anyone read it? I'm also currently reading Cathal McCarron's book. I've struggled for around 10 years myself now with addiction. I've stolen from family members, lost girlfriends and fallen out with nearly everybody I know over it.
I've found GA meetings haven't helped me at all. I'm self excluded from every bookie there is now apart from one. I haven't been able to bring myself to close the final one and I know nothing will start to change until I do. Online is the real killer for me, I find it harder to part with say €50 in a shop but online I have done multiple bet's on the football/horses of €1,000 without blinking which is just crazy considering I wouldn't dream of that in a shop. I put €1,000 on a horse called Kandinski a few years ago in a maiden hurdle at Ballinrobe. :rolleyes: Needless to say it came second and it was the most horrible feeling I've ever experienced.
I only back the odd horse now but I'm still backing far too much football. My problem used to be if I watched a horse race and a horse I fancied won and I hadn't backed in the race I would get pissed off that I didn't have anything on it.0 -
Very honest post there, Johner. I think a lot of people have potential addiction issues with gambling; but they're just unwilling to admit it to themselves. For me personally I treat it as a bit of entertainment, in so far as I don't expect to make money in the long term from it as I simply don't put in the effort/study as I don't have enough time outside of work/family life.
On the whole Tony10 thing, for him to only serve 18 months inside was laughable. He should still be banged up now in my eyes. However, for Paddy Power to allow him lodge bundles of cash (according to the Racing Post article by Richie Forristal yesterday he was lodging up to 25k a week in cash to his account through a Powers shop next door to where he worked), without asking a single question or making any attempt to intervene just proves what utter vermin the big bookmaking companies are now.
All they want in the UK are zombies shovelling cash into the FOBT's.0 -
I've ordered that book, has anyone read it? I'm also currently reading Cathal McCarron's book. I've struggled for around 10 years myself now with addiction. I've stolen from family members, lost girlfriends and fallen out with nearly everybody I know over it.
I've found GA meetings haven't helped me at all. I'm self excluded from every bookie there is now apart from one. I haven't been able to bring myself to close the final one and I know nothing will start to change until I do. Online is the real killer for me, I find it harder to part with say €50 in a shop but online I have done multiple bet's on the football/horses of €1,000 without blinking which is just crazy considering I wouldn't dream of that in a shop. I put €1,000 on a horse called Kandinski a few years ago in a maiden hurdle at Ballinrobe. :rolleyes: Needless to say it came second and it was the most horrible feeling I've ever experienced.
I only back the odd horse now but I'm still backing far too much football. My problem used to be if I watched a horse race and a horse I fancied won and I hadn't backed in the race I would get pissed off that I didn't have anything on it.
Fair play Johner.
There is a serious problem with how gambling is presented to the consumer in this country. It is biased and all pure marketing trash.
Cigarette manufacturers have had to attach pictures and plain packaging to their products and i would argue (and im not saying your on this level.) but gambling has the same if not a worse destructive power than smoking has. It ruins lives of people and also in extreme cases their families and is presented as this fluffy nice product. Green and blue and fantastic. All you need to do is add a small disclaimer or two and your sorted.
I mean it could be worse as it is in the UK but that's another story. But there needs to be better legislation in place i feel.
Sorry for the ramble.
Enjoy the racing and the sport again. Money is just paper and numbers. Sport brings another sort of emotion all encompassing, spine tingling, utter despair and also infinite joy!
Easy for me to say but best of luck with your fight!0 -
I've ordered that book, has anyone read it? I'm also currently reading Cathal McCarron's book. I've struggled for around 10 years myself now with addiction. I've stolen from family members, lost girlfriends and fallen out with nearly everybody I know over it.
I've found GA meetings haven't helped me at all. I'm self excluded from every bookie there is now apart from one. I haven't been able to bring myself to close the final one and I know nothing will start to change until I do. Online is the real killer for me, I find it harder to part with say €50 in a shop but online I have done multiple bet's on the football/horses of €1,000 without blinking which is just crazy considering I wouldn't dream of that in a shop. I put €1,000 on a horse called Kandinski a few years ago in a maiden hurdle at Ballinrobe. :rolleyes: Needless to say it came second and it was the most horrible feeling I've ever experienced.
I only back the odd horse now but I'm still backing far too much football. My problem used to be if I watched a horse race and a horse I fancied won and I hadn't backed in the race I would get pissed off that I didn't have anything on it.0 -
In my view, gambling is something nobody can shake off, people just manage it in different ways or replace it with something that involves the same buzz but perhaps without the financial element e.g. multi-player gaming.
How about turning to stock markets or cryptocurrencies or any sort of trading where you don't lose everything you 'bet' after a fixed amount of time?
Provided you don't use leverage, it's extremely difficult to lose €1000 for example just trading shares but you may get the same 'kick'. Over a year you might end up with €500 if you're particularly unlucky but in general you're never going to lose big because it's not an 'all or nothing' type of bet.
You could even focus on a specific niche like gambling companies and start trading their shares, monitoring company news, regulation news, new technologies etc... it's the same buzz only you're being more productive and not losing big money.0 -
I'd probably put myself down as a gambling addict too although I controlled it myself without ever having to tell anyone. Never stole or was never in debt thank God but definitely felt the emptiness of it all and the ridiculous betting patterns of an addict. Lied to family and friends over it mad. I'd be a bottler about things in general, you'd never know what was going on in my mind although I realise it is an awful way to be. Every weekend someone would say "any luck today" and I'd say "no only had the one bet" when in reality I'd have thirty of forty. You could never really tell if I won or lost money. One Saturday at work I won 4000 and didn't tell a soul, I probably didn't even smile. I probably had to re-deposit into that account a few days later.
Punting hundreds on South American third division football late at night, betting on things like cricket without having the foggiest of ideas of the rules. Betting hundreds @1.1 for a tennis player to hold their serve. Never went down the virtual betting route besides maybe throwing a fiver on it on a very boring day but that was once in the blue moon. I feel so sorry for people who actually bet on those regularly.
I'd spend hours in work picking bets out instead of working. My analysis was good, still is mind you but it wasn't until I copped on many thousands lost later that I realised the game is rigged from the get go more often than not. I always knew about value betting and bank roll management but it wasn't until I learned about overround and the mighty uphill battle that you face versus the bookies that cooled by gambling down a little.
But yeah it definitely affected me hard. Getting angry at others for no reason, simply because my mind was so frazzled by gambling losses and thinking how I'd get it back. Social life turns to ****, even the times you were out it was filled with thoughts of betting. "Jesus I forgot to put a bet on the Aussie soccer in the morning" at 4am. I'd definitely be one of those people that would get angry for not betting on something when you felt like it would win. I'd easily place 100 bets a day back in the peak degen days and I'd have more picks shortlisted that I wouldn't follow through on...and if they won they'd hurt the most that I didn't follow through on my gut and that would just lead me to betting more and more.
Wins felt like nothing, not even relief, just more to add to the balance in the top right corner to punt away. I hated betting shops, hated the sight of seeing old lads shaking with the stress of years and years of gambling away their wages and pensions and thought "I'm not one of them". Yet I'd be there at lunch time casually placing hundreds on an in play game on who'd get the next corner whilst pretending to have a laugh with the lads over work chatter. Lads would be talking about not being able to afford something worth 100 hundred quid for their kid whereas I'm placing 500 on some random lad in a Tennis youth tournament. Insanity. The money just isn't real on that screen.
I worked in an office where lots of others bet which didn't help. The rare day you wouldn't feel like betting on something, someone at work would have got a tip, you'd tail and while you were at it you'd spot another ten bets you'd like. I lost count of times the lads would say "did you bet on that as well?" and I'd just nod and smile, trying to hide the anger and sadness inside me for losing another one. Thinking back on it I was probably one of the better bettors, only that I was using much bigger stakes so I was the one who was crippled. Often I'd have the weeks wages punted off by Monday afternoon. Imagine having to work a whole week only to be still down money for the week because you punted it off on some stupid Chinese friendly game on a Monday morning. I still shake my head thinking back to the days of myself telling my brain "sure its fine your wages will cover that loss".
I'd say the thing that woke me up from my daze was one Christmas. I had just over 8k in my account at the start of the month that would do nicely for a lovely Christmas, presents, going out, general life expenses etc. with plenty left to start the new year nicely and still have enough to bet. A week before Christmas I'd less than 100 pound...no presents bought and no rent paid as it was due on the last week on the month. I can still feel the heat of the redness from my face when the error message came up on the deposit screen and then checking Open24 and seeing I was skint. In a way it would be better that I'd go broke as it would have saved me some hassle down the line but somehow I managed to spin up 100 into 4 grand and cover my arse. Once Christmas and rent was covered I blew the rest of course. Its a story I have since told many people and the mixture of reactions, both from utter disgust and shock to respect is amazing. I am both ashamed to death and proud of that month, but it is something I hope I never have to do again.
But yeah that was a thorn in the side of my gambling. I slowly started to fall out of love with it, couldn't catch a break in the footie and I didn't have enough money to punt big on things like Boxing and Tennis. Studying about odds and over round and the exchanges definitely helped me, I went from using Paddy Power as my main bookie to barely using them at all now unless a special comes up. Since January I've placed less then 20 bets with a bookie I'd say, a flutter at Cheltenham or on a Boxing fight, things the normal lad does with his tenner on a weekend after a hard week's work. Fine and healthy sort of betting really. How I got to that stage is a bit fuzzy tbh, but I went cold turkey for a long time, just by uninstalling the apps and emptying the accounts seemed to work for me. I was murder for having my paypal topped up as it meant easy deposits and nothing on the bank statement so I had to even stop using that for buying worthwhile things online as temptation would have been too great.
It is a huge problem in the country and in the world. I'd still follow a lot of betting forums and the like, more so because I have grown to love how odds are made and I am studying about Betfair trading so learning about the market's feelings and that is enlightening and I see anger and depression and gambling problems everywhere. Reddit's betting forums are especially humbling as you'd see a username very active for a month or two before he disappears only to resurface again saying he was broke and had to quit. In reality he's stopped until he gets more money to start again.
I must grab a hold of that Cathal McCarron book, I really enjoyed the interviews he gave when it came out.0 -
Unfortunately gambling addiction is in my dad’s side of the family and I know I’m one myself but I do my upmost to control it, similar to somebody with alcoholism in their family.
Like Sprinter Sacre said above, I’ve no debt or never stole ect thankfully, but I do sometimes be worried if things could spiral out of control.
There’s been a few times where i’d go out for a few pints with mates and would be in an hour early to the pub and would back a horse, that would lose and i’d start chasing and eventually be left without a penny for the evening to enjoy myself.
Imo it’s all about the way you approach it and whether you can control yourself ect0 -
I've ordered that book, has anyone read it?
In my opinion he knew nothing about sport, and spent no time assessing odds.
At one stage O'Reilly ran €5k up to €462k over about two days. He got a call at work from his bookmaker saying that as the website was down he could phone in his bets. A day later he had lost the €462k in about 30 bets.
His typical bet was ~ €10k on a five event accumulator, perhaps a couple of soccer matches in Malaysia or Turkey, a tennis match, a horse race, and a basketball game. All his selections appeared to be on heavy odds on chances.0 -
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I had a run in with a downward spiral in betting about 8 or 9 years ago. I used the bank card of someone in the family to make bets while I was unemployed and chased loses. It is one of my lowest moments and I remember the utter shame of what I had done. I'd lied, I'd behaved aggresively with people I loved, disrespected them. I basically broke down and came clean with everything cause that is really the only way to seek forgiveness from others and yourself. If you can't be 100% honest then you'll forever be trapped in a spiral of lies and that is not a place you want to be.0
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Nulty, it must be difficult to post that on the forum, but it could help you and others.
Well done for having the courage to say it.
One of the things I got from reading this thread and the Tony O'Reilly book (€1.75 gambling loss) is that people chase losses believing they can get them back.0 -
It seems they are very close to lowering the FOBTs in the UK to a £2 stake with news this morning that MP Philip Hammond has accepted a proposal.
A bunch of bookies share prices have also dropped 10%+ in light of the news.0 -
Nulty, it must be difficult to post that on the forum, but it could help you and others.
Well done for having the courage to say it.
One of the things I got from reading this thread and the Tony O'Reilly book (€1.75 gambling loss) is that people chase losses believing they can get them back.
Ah jesus, he didn't do too badly so! :pac::pac:0 -
Ireland and the government really needs to get their act together and introduce proper rules and support to protect the vulnerable as the self regulation that is occurring at the moment is a joke. A Gambling bill that has really good things like setting up independent regulator and have the gambling companies contribute to a fund that would be used to help people get treatment for gambling addiction has been sitting on a shelf in Dail since 2013-
http://www.thejournal.ie/gambling-independent-regulator-3790987-Jan2018/
A disgrace really- if there was proper penalties and legislation in place, PP would have got in serious trouble for the way they enabled tony o reilly and didnt do proper source of fund checks for the amount he was depositing.0 -
deathtocaptcha wrote: »In my view, gambling is something nobody can shake off, people just manage it in different ways or replace it with something that involves the same buzz but perhaps without the financial element e.g. multi-player gaming.
How about turning to stock markets or cryptocurrencies or any sort of trading where you don't lose everything you 'bet' after a fixed amount of time?
Provided you don't use leverage, it's extremely difficult to lose €1000 for example just trading shares but you may get the same 'kick'. Over a year you might end up with €500 if you're particularly unlucky but in general you're never going to lose big because it's not an 'all or nothing' type of bet.
You could even focus on a specific niche like gambling companies and start trading their shares, monitoring company news, regulation news, new technologies etc... it's the same buzz only you're being more productive and not losing big money.
Lol - i put 1.5 k into crypto currency in early january - by middle of march it was worth 450€.
On the way back up thankfully - currently at 900€ but the swings are crazy. The ultimate gamble if you will0 -
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Yes. I read the Tony O'Reilly book... He got a call at work from his bookmaker saying that as the website was down he could phone in his bets.HandsomeBob wrote: »Very sound of them.
It was Paddy Power Jr. who rang him personally.Ah jesus, he didn't do too badly so! :pac::pac:
The scary thing is, he actually didn't. By the time he closed his PP account his total amount staked was €10,413,699.66. Total amount won was €9,013,035.03. Yeah, he lost over a million quid but the relative loss is pretty small. I guess that's what keeps people in the game.0 -
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It’s unregulated. That’s the elephant in the room. Now I’m all for freedom of choice, however, before internet, you had to physically walk to bookie or casino or card room to gamble. There is a reason bookies were forced to look unattractive from the outside. Nowadays your just a click away.
I’ve made this point before on here when the topic has come up but will repeat. With drink if you’ve had too much, you fall over and cannot drink anymore. It’s a natural barrier until the hangover clears. With gambling you can bet the house in a session and keep going until everything is gone. This is why it needs urgent regulations. If a postman is able turnover 10mln in bets and the bookie can sign off their anti money laundering checklist then I’m the sultan of Brunei, load of bullshxt. Urgent and rigorous regulations required, with hefty fines and penalties, but that’s about a decade away.0
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