Herniated disc L5-S1

kate07

Have a herniated disc since Feb 16, got mri and physio and it settled every time it flared up last year (pain was just in back).
Until April this year now I'm crippled with sciatica, cant sit, can barely stand some days, can't sleep, im 34. Got referral to Mater Private and consultant recommended surgery. (Microdiscetomy l5,s1)due to length disc has been an issue and constant pain near 5 months. This will cost me 5,500, but I'm desperate. Had physio, amatsu and gone to other so called professionals and I'm worn out with the b*ull I'm told and pain!
I have a public appointment with Mayo General in two weeks for a second opinion.
Anyone any advise on best way forward or if you suffered same problem how did you fix it?
I'm fairly desperate now, I'd love to avoid surgery but I'm not sure if I've other options!
Consultant said I could try the injections, said its only a temp measure and with the length my disc has been a problem he can't see it making a big impact!

theoldbreed

kate07 wrote:

Have a herniated disc since Feb 16, got mri and physio and it settled every time it flared up last year (pain was just in back). Until April this year now I'm crippled with sciatica, cant sit, can barely stand some days, can't sleep, im 34. Got referral to Mater Private and consultant recommended surgery. (Microdiscetomy l5,s1)due to length disc has been an issue and constant pain near 5 months. This will cost me 5,500, but I'm desperate. Had physio, amatsu and gone to other so called professionals and I'm worn out with the b*ull I'm told and pain! I have a public appointment with Mayo General in two weeks for a second opinion. Anyone any advise on best way forward or if you suffered same problem how did you fix it? I'm fairly desperate now, I'd love to avoid surgery but I'm not sure if I've other options! Consultant said I could try the injections, said its only a temp measure and with the length my disc has been a problem he can't see it making a big impact!

Hi Kate07,
Sorry to hear you're in so much pain, I know exactly what you're going through. My herniated disc as the same and I tried everything and I mean everything but nothing worked. I eventually went to the Mater Private to Pauric O Neill, it cost me the same but best money I ever spent. I got my quality of life back and was pain free for the first time in over 7 years.
Am I 100%? No. I have to be careful what exercising and training I do, I have to listen to my body because if I don't I'm in pain for a few days. I swear by Pilates.
I know how you feel, surgery was the only thing that worked for me. The injections had no effect whatsoever. You'll never be 'fixed' but you can live a regular, painfree life.

Good luck :-)

calfmuscle

I'm in agreement with the above poster. I work with people with herniated discs day in day out. You've tried everything and its not working. Listen to your consultant. If your really nervous try the injection first just so you know you tried everything possible before surgery.

Best of luck it's awful to be in pain!

kate07

Thanks, people seem to against the surgery it makes me wary but I currently have no quality of life and pain 90% of the time. The last person I went to made it so much worse that I can't walk for longer than 2 minutes now without excruciating pain. So now I can't walk or sit.

Yeah I think I will go for it, I feel injections are probably only going to drag the whole getting 'back to normal' process out even longer.

Thanks for the supportive advice.

Lickin2me

Had surgery twice same problem. First time relief was brilliant. I was able walk next day. But i never took advice to not lift things and to lose weight strenghten my belly muscles etc. My back went again. This time i took it easy. It takes a year to heal. No its never same. But compared to pain i was in and restrictons i had in mobililty. Its a pleasure. Id recommend surgery, but take it easy when recovering it will take a long time. You stop feeling pain and are able to move near pain free but u got to not be over doing it. And ifvyour fat lose weight. Sorry for being blunt. Only solution. Im sure my back gave way because of my fat gut. Putting pressure on my back. Best luck

ErinGoBrath

Hi,

I've a herniated disc L4-L5 for about 15 months now.

After a year of physio I finally got an MRI and referred to Mater provide. Consultant recommended surgery but said I should try the injection if I haven't had one before.

Got the injection and disappointed after two weeks as I hadn't got any relief from sciatica down the left leg which was limiting my range of motion considerably.

Fast forward a few months and it's started to work. Range of motion greatly increased, I'm back running pain free. I'm continuing my strength program the physio gave me previously so hope to be completely recovered soon.

Best of luck, I know how frustrating it is.

kate07

Yeah I've seen it takes a year to fully recover, and I'm sure when you feel great you don't think twice about bending or twisting!
I've got a second consultation next week and will make my decision then, I'm basically f**ked now, went to a guy last week who said twas kinda mind over matter and I just needed to stretch my nerves, now I can't stand for more than 2 minutes and it's showing no sign of settling...i think the second opinion will help me make my final decision, sciatica is a living nitemare, I'm at a stage now where I can't remember how easy life is to just be able sit or walk!
Thanks for all your advise, it's gratefully appreciated.

LegacyUser

Hope this works kate. I have bulging disc and stenoosis l5s1 and cant stand up. 1 month of physio made me much worse. Need to go back 2 gp to ask for pain meds and referral if possible. Walking home from mri from james i was nearly vomitting from pain. Absolute hell.

10 weeks ive been like this. Not that long conpared to you but i cant take it anyome. I cant shower or stand up for 5mins.

theoldbreed

kate07 wrote:

Yeah I've seen it takes a year to fully recover, and I'm sure when you feel great you don't think twice about bending or twisting! I've got a second consultation next week and will make my decision then, I'm basically f**ked now, went to a guy last week who said twas kinda mind over matter and I just needed to stretch my nerves, now I can't stand for more than 2 minutes and it's showing no sign of settling...i think the second opinion will help me make my final decision, sciatica is a living nitemare, I'm at a stage now where I can't remember how easy life is to just be able sit or walk! Thanks for all your advise, it's gratefully appreciated.

Yes I remember a doctor telling me it was all in my head too, this at a stage when I couldn't sit in a position that wasn't​ causing pain. I'd come home from work and get straight into bed and cry.

Anyway I hope the injection works for you, if you do have the surgery take my advice and look after your back like it's your baby. No heavy lifting or high impact training. As i said I swear by Pilates and i can do hiit training with some adaptations. As a previous poster said if you need to, lose weight. Be mindful of how you bend and turn and sit!

If only I'd taken better care of my back years ago but you never expect it. I have had all different kinds of pain but sciatica is the worst I've ever had along with back spasms.

kate07

No it's surgery for me, both consultants said injections were a waste of time.
I'm scared sh*tless, but if it gets rid of my leg pain it'll be worth it! I intend to mind it and mind myself like crazy after the operation, this is something once is enough to go through in a lifetime! I've broken bones and it's not as bad as this constant nerve pain day and night!
I'm looking forward to been able walk pain free to start with, most people say they are back walking miles within weeks!
Anyone that has had the operation any advise? My biggest worry for after is getting in and out of bed and getting dressed! I dread a reherniation.

horsey63

I had my first microdiskectomy/decompression/cyst removal in 2009 and a reherniation in 2013, but let me reassure you, you are going to be amazed how 'easy' this surgery is !! I was not one of those patients that woke up 'cured' but over the first 4 weeks I was 90% improved and ended up with over 95% improvement, just the odd day with a few darts of pain in my leg. I have had to go on to have a spinal fusion but honestly, I dont regret any of the surgeries, life is so so much better.

Beasty

My problems go back over 25 years when I initially herniated L5-S1. 3 years later I had a discectomy. Shortly after I needed a similar operation on L4-L5. After that everything was quite stable, except for the odd back spasm, until 17 years ago when I needed further surgery on L5-S1, and again on L4-L5 two years later.

I was under one of the top orthopaedic surgeons in the UK at the time (he also advised some of the top Man United players, including the likes of Peter Schmeichel and Gary Pallister). He indicated that if necessary he could operate again, just taking out the bulging part of the disc.

Since then I've been largely clear of problems. I took up some serious cycling when I moved to Ireland 10 years ago (and have taken part at very high levels of masters racing since). Cycling helped me lose around 40kg, which definitely helped. I still suffered the off spasm, but never as bad as it had been leading up to the operations.

I've never regretted the operations at all. I did have an epidural a couple of years before the first one but that didn't provide any long term improvement.

Last year I was involved in a motoring incident when someone (deliberately!) rammed into the back of my car (twice!!). Since then I've had recurring problems with my back with resultant sciatica, and had an MRI back in January.

I saw one of the leading neurosurgeons a few months ago. There is a significant bulge at L3-L4 and lesser ones at the two lower joints. I've had both facet joint and epidural injections. the epidural improved one side of my back but the other side has worsened.

I saw the specialist again a few weeks ago. He's telling me to try and keep active and certainly keep the weight down. Beyond that I have 3 choices - continued use of painkillers, some kind of heat treatment which kills the "guilty" nerve for a year or so thereby dampening/eliminating the pain, or fusion at the bottom 2 joints. He said though that the fusion option would work at those levels but in all likelihood move the problem up the spine with further issues resulting within a couple of years. Hence I'm going for the 2nd option and am currently awaiting an appointment with a pain specialist

Techniques have move on enormously over the past 25 years and there are more options available, but I've never regretted having those operations. Ultimately we put ourselves in the hands of the specialists, but their abilities are incredible and you have to be very unlucky not to see some long term benefit if they are recommending surgery.

BTW - with the first operation the specialist advised I would be in hospital for a week and off work for 6 weeks. I turned out I was in for 6 days and off for 5 weeks. It reduced with each subsequent operation and by the 4th I was back to work in not much more than 3 weeks. This was with full rather than micro discectomies. Obviously my experience of having gone through the procedures previously helped, but each time I did feel different again (until the next episode!)

kate07

Thanks for all the positive stories, had my second opinion with Dr McCabe last week and he said the exact thing so with both surgeons agreeing it made the decision easier!
Just had pre op today and the journey to dublin cemented how much pain and agony life is at the moment, so operation this day next week, I'm looking forward to working my way back to normal, No tablets, no cancelling plans cause I can't sit or stand longer than 2 mins in pain, time to get back to the real world!
I'm going to give my self 6 weeks before I go back working or do anything intensive.
I'm still slightly terrified about the actual operation but for surgeons it's a minor operation, so just gotta keep that on mind!
I feel terrible for anyone going through this, really is the worst constant pain I've ever experienced.

horsey63

The microdiskectomies are the least invasive procedure you can have and I am sure that you will be like me and get great relief. The best of luck and I look forward to you posting in a few weeks telling us all that you're feeling much better !

oakshade

Hi OP, not sure if you had the surgery yet but I hope you are doing OK?

I'm 5 days post discectomy surgery and so far so good. I'm being really strict with myself and taking the surgeons advice not to sit down for 14 days. Not sitting is hell but I'm 99% pain free on relatively weak pain relief compared to previously. Any pain I'm experiencing is at the wound site, my leg is perfect!!

I have had back problems with years but my latest incident capped it all. I was bed/couch bound for a six weeks before the surgery. The MRI report showed a herniated disc and my GP recommended the surgery as the only long term fix. The consultant agreed and due to the severity of my symptoms, operated within a week.

Based on the other posts here and from chatting to some folk who had the surgery, I know I have to behave myself throughout the recovery period and beyond, but there is no way I'm ever going back to that level of pain or debilitation again!

Best of luck

1983ish

I had the nerve root block a few years ago at L4 that worked great. Then 9 months later, after being in a car crash, I burst L5s1. They said they'd try another injection there but didn't have much hope of avoiding surgery. It worked great also. Im now 4 years pain free and while I'm not out running marathons I'm moderately active.
It might be worth a go, surgery on the spine should be the last resort imo although one of your specialist said it was a large "burst" mine was small enough but still excruciating because of L5s1's location
Best of luck

kate07

Hey, yeah I had my operation last Tuesday so I'm a week post op today!!
It's amazing, I'm still very tired and get tired after an hour of been up but my leg pain has gone from a 10 plus to a 0.5 and that's mainly wound soreness, I get the odd tingle, little bit of pins and needles in my foot..nothing compared to before the operation! Find sitting so unnatural cause I've not been able sit in months.
At the moment, it's the best thing I could have done, before I went I couldn't walk or sit at all without intense pain so I'd really no other option other than the operating table!
I'm very nervous about reherniating it, surgeon said the part he had to take was very large and be very careful coughing or sneezing!! But after been laid up for months I think I can give myself the time to let it heal, im going to follow the instructions exactly and he only wants me to be walking 30 or 40 mins by the time I see him in the middle of November, i was told not to push myself, that this is not the time, to listen to my body - if I'm tired, rest!
Thanks for all the positive advice, it helped me so much leading up to it, sometimes my mind would think the worst case and been able to read others positive stories rather than Google scare stories really helped!

sharkfox

How did you get it all done so quickly? I have nearly the same issues as you and I've been on medication and waiting lists for 8/9 years. Passed from one consultant to the next and never given any concrete idea of what's actually being done. Constant pain and sometimes not able to walk. Frustrating to say the least

oakshade

sharkfox wrote:

How did you get it all done so quickly? I have nearly the same issues as you and I've been on medication and waiting lists for 8/9 years. Passed from one consultant to the next and never given any concrete idea of what's actually being done. Constant pain and sometimes not able to walk. Frustrating to say the least

In my case I was lucky enough to have private medical insurance (six weeks from injury to operation) but I was told my herniated disc was particularly bad.

Waiting that long is horrible shark fox, could the national treatment purchase fund do anything?

kate07

I paid!
I unfortunately had no health insurance, my pain levels were insane, so I got a referral for the spinal clinic in the Mater Private, got a recent MRI and then got an operation within a few days of ringing to book operation!

I'd been referred to UCHG on the public system in may/June, from what I've heard the waiting list is 18 months at least, and that's just to have the consultation.
It was a big expense, one id definitely rather not have had to pay but at the moment worth every cent!
From seeing the consultant to operation it was just a month and that was because I wanted to get a second opinion!

sharkfox

oakshade wrote: »

In my case I was lucky enough to have private medical insurance (six weeks from injury to operation) but I was told my herniated disc was particularly bad.

Waiting that long is horrible shark fox, could the national treatment purchase fund do anything?

I'm not sure, I'd love if it could help in some way. I've been told so many different things by doctors and specialists, some even contradictory. For years I was on 15 tablets a day for it, I reduced the amount myself because it was so much. It seemed my doctor was just happy to hand out anything. I've been on morphine and fentanyl, I've even had the injections in to my spine. It's no way to live. I just wish there was an end in sight for it but between waiting lists and all the other crap I'm not holding my breath.

sharkfox

kate07 wrote: »

I paid!
I unfortunately had no health insurance, my pain levels were insane, so I got a referral for the spinal clinic in the Mater Private, got a recent MRI and then got an operation within a few days of ringing to book operation!

I'd been referred to UCHG on the public system in may/June, from what I've heard the waiting list is 18 months at least, and that's just to have the consultation.
It was a big expense, one id definitely rather not have had to pay but at the moment worth every cent!
From seeing the consultant to operation it was just a month and that was because I wanted to get a second opinion!

My last appointment was January last year, I was told to wait for a surgeon and neurologist to send me an appointment. Surely by the time that comes I'll need another mri and that's more waiting.

kate07

Yeah, as far as I know most consultants want a MRI less than 6 months old!
It's terribly frustrating and soul distroying for anyone suffering the pain and having to deal with waiting lists, plus been told different things by different consultants! Thanlfully both my consultants said the exact same thing, totally identical so least I knew then it was the right track I was on.

sharkfox

kate07 wrote: »

Yeah, as far as I know most consultants want a MRI less than 6 months old!
It's terribly frustrating and soul distroying for anyone suffering the pain and having to deal with waiting lists, plus been told different things by different consultants! Thanlfully both my consultants said the exact same thing, totally identical so least I knew then it was the right track I was on.

It's good to hear that you got it sorted properly, hopefully your recovery goes well and the pain is gone for good.

oakshade

sharkfox wrote:

My last appointment was January last year, I was told to wait for a surgeon and neurologist to send me an appointment. Surely by the time that comes I'll need another mri and that's more waiting.

In my experience of the public system, you have to keep chasing them and following up. I know there are conditions around the treatment purchase fund but it's certainly worth a Google. Best of luck

Garrett81

Iv a recent post you should read . I’m out with l1 and l2 disks along with osteoarthritis in my facet joints. Tried everything from physio, osteopaths. Saw a consultant and said he wouldn’t do the surgery as it would only make it worse, as cutting nerves and bone. I got injections yesterday and I’m like a new man, no pain and inflammation has dramatically reduced and will be getting another in the next month. Hopeing not to rely on injections to keep me well. iv been out of work since last December it has crippled me so bad and ruined my daily living. Injections only provide you with a window of opportunity, get them done and go and do reformer pilates, Yoga or trx, sounds tough but you need to raise you fitness levels to a high standard and get the diet in check. That’s what I’m doing. Avoid surgery until you try all other options.

Best of luck

LordSutch

Beware Peripheral-compression neuropathy.

L5-S1 successful operation many moons ago, and still pain free ever since!

But, and here's the but, I thought I could then go back to my beloved long distance running regime without issue, and for a few years I did. All was well and I was running better than ever, albeit with a very small deficit of power in my left calf, but still small enough not to affect my running and walking!

Then slowly after about 12 years post opp I started to limp very slightly, this limp then became more pronounced (still pain free), but my running days were over, then the pain free limp had got worse due to something called 'Peripheral-compression neuropathy' which the doctors put down to me punding my nerves into total submission post opp

MRIs look clean enough, but the best the specialists can come up with is this lower limb neuropathy, caused by pounding the pavements in the years after my back opp.

Have had three "nerve block injections" to try and help issues re lack of power, but to no avail.

So my message to all you post opp people is "Do not carry on as normal in the years post opp". Yes you may feel great and that you are 'fixed', and that your back pain gone and you can run again > but don't take off again without due consideration of future possible consequences ...

Take it easy & enjoy your pain free life, always remembering that it doesn't take much to upset those nerves again, which might either result in great pain or numbness, or total lack of power (lower legs) which is my problem.

(I also retain full lower leg sensation, strong lower leg pulse, and full feeling).

Take up some non load bearing exercise like swimming or pilates or yoga.

Power is totally gone in both calfs, but as I say, I'm still totally pain free, which is some consolation I guess.

oakshade

LordSutch wrote:

L5-S1 successful operation many moons ago, and still pain free ever since!

LordSutch wrote:

Beware Peripheral-compression neuropathy.

Really appreciate the post and the heads up. Can I ask when you had your surgery was it keyhole or open? I had a discussion with my consultant about my brother in law who had the 'open' surgery 12+ years back and had an initially poor recovery. His response was the surgery and technique had changed and improved dramatically over the years. Of course he would say that but I'm interested to know what lies ahead.

LordSutch

Scar on lower spine about 2" or 3" long, so it's compact, but I'm not sure it's keyhole surgery?
Operated on in the mid 90s, the horrendous pain in my left leg had finally gone, and the only problem I had was a slight weakness in my left foot/left calf, which over the years came back!

I returned to running, and the rest is history...

Shazamm

Beasty wrote: »

My problems go back over 25 years when I initially herniated L5-S1. 3 years later I had a discectomy. Shortly after I needed a similar operation on L4-L5. After that everything was quite stable, except for the odd back spasm, until 17 years ago when I needed further surgery on L5-S1, and again on L4-L5 two years later.

I was under one of the top orthopaedic surgeons in the UK at the time (he also advised some of the top Man United players, including the likes of Peter Schmeichel and Gary Pallister). He indicated that if necessary he could operate again, just taking out the bulging part of the disc.

Since then I've been largely clear of problems. I took up some serious cycling when I moved to Ireland 10 years ago (and have taken part at very high levels of masters racing since). Cycling helped me lose around 40kg, which definitely helped. I still suffered the off spasm, but never as bad as it had been leading up to the operations.

I've never regretted the operations at all. I did have an epidural a couple of years before the first one but that didn't provide any long term improvement.

Last year I was involved in a motoring incident when someone (deliberately!) rammed into the back of my car (twice!!). Since then I've had recurring problems with my back with resultant sciatica, and had an MRI back in January.

I saw one of the leading neurosurgeons a few months ago. There is a significant bulge at L3-L4 and lesser ones at the two lower joints. I've had both facet joint and epidural injections. the epidural improved one side of my back but the other side has worsened.

I saw the specialist again a few weeks ago. He's telling me to try and keep active and certainly keep the weight down. Beyond that I have 3 choices - continued use of painkillers, some kind of heat treatment which kills the "guilty" nerve for a year or so thereby dampening/eliminating the pain, or fusion at the bottom 2 joints. He said though that the fusion option would work at those levels but in all likelihood move the problem up the spine with further issues resulting within a couple of years. Hence I'm going for the 2nd option and am currently awaiting an appointment with a pain specialist

Techniques have move on enormously over the past 25 years and there are more options available, but I've never regretted having those operations. Ultimately we put ourselves in the hands of the specialists, but their abilities are incredible and you have to be very unlucky not to see some long term benefit if they are recommending surgery.

BTW - with the first operation the specialist advised I would be in hospital for a week and off work for 6 weeks. I turned out I was in for 6 days and off for 5 weeks. It reduced with each subsequent operation and by the 4th I was back to work in not much more than 3 weeks. This was with full rather than micro discectomies. Obviously my experience of having gone through the procedures previously helped, but each time I did feel different again (until the next episode!)

How's the back now?
How many discectomies have you had?

chases0102

Hi folks,

Just to jump in here - recently received results of MRI, and I have two herniated discs in lower back - L4/L5 extrusion, L5, S1 protrusion.

An appointment with a Consultant in Santry Sports Clinic is on its way.

Has anyone had any experience with going to a physio, and creating an exercise plan in order to maintain a fit and healthy lifestyle?

I would be a keen gym-goer, but not certainly do not want to do any heavy lifting that may exacerbate the situation (such as Deadlifts, Squats, etc.)

Can other exercises safely fill these voids?

Sting2015

@chases0102 How did you get on with this?

Deleted by poster

PoisonIvyBelle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2057782630/herniated-disc-l5-s1

I'd recommend the surgery. I went to the consultant too late thanks to a sh1t physio who never picked up on it. And by that time it was a case that the nerve had been impinged so long he described it as a heavy piece of furniture sitting on a carpet for years, was unlikely to spring back up, so was no longer an option. After that, the years of sciatica resulted in fibromyalgia, or that's why they think was the cause anyway, as it then moved into my other leg and eventually became a whole body chronic pain issue.

Do the surgery.

I'm sort of in a similar situation, ish anyway. I can definitely feel your pain and frustration, OP.

S3nDL0v3

I got “lucky”. I can put up with pain most wouldn’t but since last Christmas I developed sciatica in both legs along with the persistent back pain and by May I could hardly walk. My GP called in favours and I had surgery in the Mater Private (stenosis and bulging discs). Surgeon wanted to do it the next day but I wanted time to think it over and booked it for 2 weeks later. Though it’s early days (7 to be precise), 5 hours after the op, no sciatica and I stopped pain meds except paracetamol 2 days ago. I know not to be stupid and bend, lift etc, but I and another patient cried with relief before we left the hospital. Hopefully it can only get better from hereon.

apache

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120870640#Comment_120870640

That's great you are like that 7 days post op. I wish you well in your recovery. About 10 years myself post op spinal fusion. No problems with pain since. I count myself lucky in that regard. I know what the pain can be like.