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Major Hurricane Irma

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,023 ✭✭✭Donegal Storm


    Jpmarn wrote: »
    I heard that Irma is down to a Category 1. I hope Florida escaped with only relatively minor damage. I don't know what the Keys are like when it was hit by then a category 4 storm yesterday morning. It looks like St Martin and the British Virgin Islands won't be ready for visitors until next year. I have visited these places that have been ravaged by Irma in the past few days.

    The Keys didn't even get cat1 winds so should be fine in that respect, not sure what the situation is like re flooding though.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,991 ✭✭✭sword1


    traco wrote: »
    DJbFSiDX0AABZux.jpg:large

    Was there not alot of 100+ mph gusts reported, what am I missing, is this only for the last few hours


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    sword1 wrote: »
    Was there not alot of 100+ mph gusts reported, what am I missing, is this only for the last few hours

    Looks around Naples. Otherwise yes, all below 100 mph.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,023 ✭✭✭Donegal Storm


    sword1 wrote: »
    Was there not alot of 100+ mph gusts reported, what am I missing, is this only for the last few hours

    No they're the max gusts for the whole event, only a handful of coastal stations topped cat1 gusts never mind cat4 sustained winds. The stations in the Keys aren't shown in the image, a few of those had gusts above 100mph


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭carltonleon


    Yes it looks like the winds didn't cause the damage that was being predicted but still really bad damage from the storm surge which will take even longer to fix as a lot of the damage will be internal in peoples houses, shops, workplaces etc. Still a devastating outcome but externally it probably does not look as bad as expected.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,991 ✭✭✭sword1


    Looks around Naples. Otherwise yes, all below 100 mph.

    Thanks, actually missed that, hard to believe that a country used to getting hit by hurricane s has 6 million people without electricity when only one area was hit with 100+mph gusts


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,235 ✭✭✭Oneiric 3


    josip wrote: »
    Do ye remember back in 2006 and 2007 when Bertie and the building industry would dismiss any economist making a reasoned case why it was a property bubble and unsustainable?
    Anyone at the time who presented data challenging the mainstream agenda, was dismissed as a naysayer or worse.
    .

    Exactly but you'll always have those who will defend the 'Establishment' and established mainstream opinion regardless. Such people are to be avoided because such people are incapable of even the faintest semblance of critical thought.

    New Moon



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    No they're the max gusts for the whole event, only a handful of coastal stations topped cat1 gusts never mind cat4 sustained winds. The stations in the Keys aren't shown in the image, a few of those had gusts above 100mph

    One station between Key West and Marathon has a 120-mph gust. Neither Key West nor Marathon showed anything near 100 mph but the wind reports stopped coming before the eye hit, so we'll never know.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,629 ✭✭✭traco


    Everglades City in a bad way from what I can make out - very little info coming out about it. No access and very high storm surge.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,235 ✭✭✭lucernarian


    Oneiric 3 wrote: »
    Exactly but you'll always have those who will defend the 'Establishment' and established mainstream opinion regardless. Such people are to be avoided because such people are incapable of even the faintest semblance of critical thought.
    That kind of groupthink cropped up here, when someone describing a video of storm force winds calls it that, and gets treated like an insensitive or egotistical troublemaker. Then they unironically call out one person who's actually providing raw stats throughout this thread. Other regulars who should know better are responding to the one poster talking about forecast interpretation, when what's being posted are on-the-ground observations.

    Similar stuff happens on the weather forum from time to time but this was OTT.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 441 ✭✭hogandrew


    One station between Key West and Marathon has a 120-mph gust. Neither Key West nor Marathon showed anything near 100 mph but the wind reports stopped coming before the eye hit, so we'll never know.

    There was a lot of people on Snapchat had shared videos of the hurricane.In Key west there seemed to be a lot of people able to stand out at around 7,8,9 EDT and film from their phones

    The lower keys such as summerland key seemed to be hit far worse but mainly from water.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    sword1 wrote: »
    Thanks, actually missed that, hard to believe that a country used to getting hit by hurricane s has 6 million people without electricity when only one area was hit with 100+mph gusts

    Well Florida hasn't had a hurricane since 2005 so a lot of people will not have experienced one ever before. In most cases they don't affect the whole state like IRMA did.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    I just heard one Miami official say "We were expecting a Big Mac but we got a kid's cheeseburger".


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,235 ✭✭✭Oneiric 3


    That kind of groupthink cropped up here, when someone describing a video of storm force winds calls it that, and gets treated like an insensitive or egotistical troublemaker. Then they unironically call out one person who's actually providing raw stats throughout this thread. Other regulars who should know better are responding to the one poster talking about forecast interpretation, when what's being posted are on-the-ground observations.

    Similar stuff happens on the weather forum from time to time but this was OTT.

    It is one thing when such 'group think' occurs with something as simplistic as the weather on a weather forum, but another when it applied within the realms of wider society and politics. We have only to look as the phenomena of J23 and the cretins this has brought of the woodwork to see evidence of this.

    Only today. I was reading in the Irish Independent about the faux moral outrage of a few people ON TWITTER about some loud mouth being given media air time. Why was this even reported? Was it because the journalist in question was short on actual substantial material to report on, or was to reinforce wider public opinion that a person whose opinions they don't agree with is to be tut tutted upon and shunned from good society?

    New Moon



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,917 ✭✭✭Storm 10


    Just looking at CNN and the damage is unreal in Florida


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,559 ✭✭✭abarkie


    Just been out by Palm Parkway / Lake St / Apoka Vineland - Lake Buena Vista Area

    Some photos attached


  • Registered Users Posts: 6 mdennehydub


    That kind of groupthink cropped up here, when someone describing a video of storm force winds calls it that, and gets treated like an insensitive or egotistical troublemaker. Then they unironically call out one person who's actually providing raw stats throughout this thread. Other regulars who should know better are responding to the one poster talking about forecast interpretation, when what's being posted are on-the-ground observations.

    Similar stuff happens on the weather forum from time to time but this was OTT.

    Brick


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,589 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    I just switched on Sky News to see what the latest was, and it does appear that it's no longer top billing.

    They did run some images and it does appear that Florida got off lightly compared to those Caribbean islands

    Do you think there is a danger of crying Wolf on this one? Next time a biggie comes along will the public think it's being hyped up and stay put when told to evacuate.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,653 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    NIMAN wrote: »
    I just switched on Sky News to see what the latest was, and it does appear that it's no longer top billing.

    They did run some images and it does appear that Florida got off lightly compared to those Caribbean islands

    Do you think there is a danger of crying Wolf on this one? Next time a biggie comes along will the public think it's being hyped up and stay put when told to evacuate.

    Theres always that danger, but the reality is they're far better off erring on the "exaggerating" side of things. It might be quite a while before Florida is struck again by a hurricane, and certainly a lot of the Keys was truly badly hit. Also there are plenty of other storms that serve as reminders of what happens when warnings are ignored - Katrina will remain in the public consciousness longer than an Irma.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,235 ✭✭✭Oneiric 3


    Brick

    We all glow under the same light.

    New Moon



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,235 ✭✭✭lucernarian


    MJohnston wrote: »
    Theres always that danger, but the reality is they're far better off erring on the "exaggerating" side of things. It might be quite a while before Florida is struck again by a hurricane, and certainly a lot of the Keys was truly badly hit. Also there are plenty of other storms that serve as reminders of what happens when warnings are ignored - Katrina will remain in the public consciousness longer than an Irma.
    The US as a whole gets hit more often by a hurricane somewhere or other. If next year a hurricane is to hit Texas instead, what happens when a bunch of people think back to Irma and figure the risk of looting an abandoned city is worse than the "exaggerated" risk of a hurricane?

    Also, the NHC was praised for the (accurate) information and warnings prior to Katrina. I was reading Boards back then, and I remember that the models were fairly accurate beforehand, as was the guidance. There was one particularly dire warning which saved maybe thousands of lives, as people still clutched to the idea it would land as a Cat 3 and the levees would protect them as designed. The hurricane was knocking on the door of Cat 4 when it landed, but much of the city had evacuated thanks to those warnings. Point is, it's good to have strong warnings when they're needed but there's no harm in discussing the factual basis for those warnings or "observations" on a forum for weather nerds :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    CNN has just shown a graphic showing José making a possible beeline for the US east coast.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,653 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    The US as a whole gets hit more often by a hurricane somewhere or other. If next year a hurricane is to hit Texas instead, what happens when a bunch of people think back to Irma and figure the risk of looting an abandoned city is worse than the "exaggerated" risk of a hurricane?

    That's the risk, but then theres also the risk of understating a storm. If I was running a news network, I would always *always* want to be erring on the "exaggeration" side.
    Also, the NHC was praised for the (accurate) information and warnings prior to Katrina. I was reading Boards back then, and I remember that the models were fairly accurate beforehand, as was the guidance. There was one particularly dire warning which saved maybe thousands of lives, as people still clutched to the idea it would land as a Cat 3 and the levees would protect them as designed. The hurricane was knocking on the door of Cat 4 when it landed, but much of the city had evacuated thanks to those warnings. [Point is, it's good to have strong warnings when they're needed but there's no harm in discussing the factual basis for those warnings or "observations" on a forum for weather nerds :)

    My point wasnt about the guidance of Katrina vs the reality, it was that people will remember how dangerous hurriances be far more than they'll remember storms that some perceive to have been exaggerated. Katrina, Andrew, Sandy, Harvey - they'll stick in the mind. I think the "boy who cried wolf" effect is what is exaggerated myself.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,235 ✭✭✭Oneiric 3


    Ah yes, the 'CNN model'...

    EC12 has it more as a near miss but nothing can be ruled out this early I guess.

    render-atls18-98f536083ae965b31b0d04811be6f4c6-8.png

    New Moon



  • Registered Users Posts: 21,389 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    The 1979 Fastnet Race is what happens when the Met Service gets it wrong.
    BTW the Irish Met got it right.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    MJohnston wrote: »
    That's the risk, but then theres also the risk of understating a storm. If I was running a news network, I would always *always* want to be erring on the "exaggeration" side.

    Because news sells.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,184 ✭✭✭pad199207


    Some reports on twitter showing that the Florida keys are no more, Jesus Christ!


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,653 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    Because news sells.

    No, because people in the line of fire rely on news during storms. And given that weather forecasts, particularly those of hurricanes, never possess significant certainty until too late a stage to act (particularly in Florida where the geography makes evacuation an especially acute problem), I think it's much wiser for them to err on the upper ends of that uncertainty range.


  • Registered Users Posts: 29,331 ✭✭✭✭HeidiHeidi


    pad199207 wrote: »
    Some reports on twitter showing that the Florida keys are no more, Jesus Christ!

    Links?

    Because of the wind or the water or both?

    Or is this a wind-up?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,822 ✭✭✭CelticRambler


    Not much about Irma on Morning Ireland?
    No doubt when/if it makes landfall on the US coast there will be non stop coverage, a very grave looking Catriona Perry will be on our screens and airwaves morning, noon and night!
    At the moment it looks to me that Irma will hit the Leeward Islands, Antigua, Barbuda, St Kitts And Nevis, Anguilla, US and British Virgin Islands, Monserrat, Puerto Rico, Cuba and no doubt many other tiny islands where people will be unable to get into their cars and drive inland.
    RTE not covering Irma, obviously waiting for it to hit the US when it will be a REAL hurricane.

    Having followed this thread from the beginning, and seen the recent spat over Goath Laidir's interpretation of the data, not to mention the "ah sure it's grand, now that it's fizzled out" it seems that RTE caters perfectly to the boards.ie audience! :p

    Whatever Irma might have been when she stomped across Florida, she has caused massive devastation in other places. The top story and follow-up feature on the French news this evening was a about the complete destruction of the legal system in Saint Martin and Saint Barthélemy. The principal courthouse has been destroyed, along with the attorney general's office. The have lost just about every file on everyone who was due to go to trial.

    They've brought in the army to restore a semblance of law and order, because those concerned citizens who would like to report looting (and worse) can't phone 999 - because there are no phones.

    The island's main hospital was also destroyed. They're treating people in a marquee for the time being - as best they can until they figure out where their doctors and nurses have ended up.

    So maybe if the media weren't quite so obsessed with showing videos of windswept journalists, shelter "victims" complaining about not having had a shower for 24 hours, and holiday-makers who had cut short their too adventurous adventure, people might realise that while Florida ultimately escaped with minor damage this time, the evacuation was a good rehearsal for the Cat 4 or 5 that'll make a direct hit on the state in the future.


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