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Ibrahim Halawa acquited(mod warning in op-Heed it)

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    #752
    Kimbot
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 18,548 Mod ✭✭✭✭Kimbot


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    What? I was robbed in Tenerife a few years back, no money, no passport, paying tax all my life, I dont recall the government getting me a private jet home let alone paying for my ticket. I had to get money sent to me via wester union and pay 25 euro for the emergency passport ffs.

    Well were you locked up in prison for 4 years when you done nothing wrong?


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    #753
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    end of the road wrote: »
    or maybe it's actually accurate? i mean, we weren't there, so we will never know, but given the grave situation at the time i'd reccan both accounts are right. the irish government negotiated safe passage but safe passage wasn't actually deliverable.



    maybe those groups got out before the situation got worse?

    Nope, I wasn't there, but Irish consular officials with experience of the country were.....and they negotiated access to the same process others got.......

    .......and maybe the other groups got out when the situation was at its worst......you see I can play word games too ;)


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    #754
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Thundercats Ho wrote: »
    He's an Irish Citizen, why wouldn't we help bring an Irish citizen home, when they're in trouble?

    My brother and sister in law are holed up in a box room overseas as we speak through no fault of their own. They've two young kids at home. They scrimped and saved and had a long weekend getaway on their own, first since the kids were born. They're Irish citizens, they're stressed. There's hundreds like them at present sleeping rough in poxy airports. Where's the help for all these?


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    #755
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    jonnycivic wrote: »
    Well were you locked up in prison for 4 years when you done nothing wrong?

    Again, how do you know he did nothing wrong?

    Mountjoy is full of people who did nothing wrong, or so they say. Should their words, and the words of their families be sufficient to permit their release?


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    #756
    Donal55
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,023 ✭✭✭Donal55


    Omackeral wrote: »
    My brother and sister in law are holed up in a box room overseas as we speak through no fault of their own. They've two young kids at home. They scrimped and saved and had a long weekend getaway on their own, first since the kids were born. They're Irish citizens, they're stressed. There's hundreds like them at present sleeping rough in poxy airports. Where's the help for all these?

    Talk to Leo. He'll fly them home.


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    #757
    Kimbot
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 18,548 Mod ✭✭✭✭Kimbot


    Jawgap wrote: »
    Again, how do you know he did nothing wrong?

    Mountjoy is full of people who did nothing wrong, or so they say. Should their words, and the words of their families be sufficient to permit their release?

    Well he is been released isnt he, if he done something wrong then surely he wouldnt be released.


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    #758
    Woodville56
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,643 ✭✭✭Woodville56


    jonnycivic wrote: »
    Gringo180 wrote: »
    What? I was robbed in Tenerife a few years back, no money, no passport, paying tax all my life, I dont recall the government getting me a private jet home let alone paying for my ticket. I had to get money sent to me via wester union and pay 25 euro for the emergency passport ffs.

    Well were you locked up in prison for 4 years when you done nothing wrong?

    He probably didn't go meddling in the political upheavals of a foreign country when on holidays so why would he be locked up ?


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    #759
    First Up
    Registered Users Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭First Up


    Bcause 
    Jawgap wrote: »
    end of the road wrote: »



    i'd say we can safely say there was no evidence against him.

    Excellent.......

    ......on what basis?
    Because none was produced?


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    #760
    OnDraught
    Closed Accounts Posts: 310 ✭✭OnDraught


    Omackeral wrote: »
    My brother and sister in law are holed up in a box room overseas as we speak through no fault of their own. They've two young kids at home. They scrimped and saved and had a long weekend getaway on their own, first since the kids were born. They're Irish citizens, they're stressed. There's hundreds like them at present sleeping rough in poxy airports. Where's the help for all these?

    They're on holidays? In a hotel room. That's the same as getting out of prison after almost half a decade as an innocent man alright.


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    #761
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    end of the road wrote: »
    islam is not a race does not get people out of being racist, as religion can be a reason to attack people on the basis of the colour of their skin or other racially motivated reasons.

    I don't think any decent people have a problem with the chap's skin colour. Anyone I know who's commented negatively towards Ibrahim thinks he was a foolish lad at worst and the more extreme people who are against him go against his ideologies, not his skin colour. It's you and others making the leap to racism.

    Also, you only quoted half of my post. The second part said that anyone who taunted him with promises of pork were utter idiots and they are. Bigoted scumbags in my opinion, in fact.


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    #762
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    jonnycivic wrote: »
    Well he is been released isnt he, if he done something wrong then surely he wouldnt be released.

    Seriously?

    To go back to an earlier example......OJ was released after a period of imprisonment and a trial......reckon he done nothing wrong?


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    #763
    Kimbot
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 18,548 Mod ✭✭✭✭Kimbot


    Jawgap wrote: »
    Seriously?

    To go back to an earlier example......OJ was released after a period of imprisonment and a trial......reckon he done nothing wrong?

    He was acquited, the definition of that is:
    free (someone) from a criminal charge by a verdict of not guilty.

    He was found not guilty ffs. This thread isnt about OJ its about Ibrahim Halawa.


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    #764
    OnDraught
    Closed Accounts Posts: 310 ✭✭OnDraught


    Jawgap wrote: »
    Seriously?

    To go back to an earlier example......OJ was released after a period of imprisonment and a trial......reckon he done nothing wrong?

    This thread should be locked. The Juice and Ibrahim...


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    #765
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    First Up wrote: »
    Bcause 

    Because none was produced?

    That doesn't mean there was no evidence......it just means none was presented. For which there are many plausible reasons.......for example (I'm repeating myself)......to protect a source, to protect a method of evidence gathering, failed the balanced of probity test (assuming there is one in Egyptian law), not directly relevant to the charge laid, hearsay, etc etc.....


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    #766
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    The reality is that he spent the last 4 years fraternizing with 500 Islamic extremists in prison. If he wasn't already then it's very likely he has been radicalized. Is it safe to let him back into the country?

    What do you suggest?!? He's from here! He was born and raised here. He's Irish. Hes from Firhouse. He's been in prison for 4 years thanks to an even more f*cked up judicial system than are own. "Nah ya can't come back to where you're from". He wasn't found guilty of any crimes. He's been through more than enough, whether you like certain aspects of his supporters or detractors.


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    #767
    SnakePlissken
    Registered Users Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭SnakePlissken


    end of the road wrote: »
    i'd say we can safely say there was no evidence against him.

    .

    Nope, sorry, you're wrong.


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    #768
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    jonnycivic wrote: »
    He was acquited, the definition of that is:



    He was found not guilty ffs. This thread isnt about OJ its about Ibrahim Halawa.

    It is, I only proffered OJ as an example of its possible for someone to be acquitted, as in found not guilty.....meaning the prosecuting authority failed to meet the burden of proof in respect of the charge levied.....

    .....it doesn't mean the person didn't commit the act or acts complained off......it doesn't mean there was no evidence.....it doesn't mean there is no culpability.


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    #769
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    end of the road wrote: »
    it's just another made up alt-right buzz word.

    The irony.


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    #770
    WinnyThePoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,417 ✭✭✭WinnyThePoo


    Omackeral wrote: »
    My brother and sister in law are holed up in a box room overseas as we speak through no fault of their own. They've two young kids at home. They scrimped and saved and had a long weekend getaway on their own, first since the kids were born. They're Irish citizens, they're stressed. There's hundreds like them at present sleeping rough in poxy airports. Where's the help for all these?

    How is this relevant at all?

    Unfortunate, but being stuck abroad on a holiday is quite a bit of different situation to the one being discussed.

    Perhaps sending Michael o leary a mail would be more productive.


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    #771
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    OnDraught wrote: »
    They're on holidays? In a hotel room. That's the same as getting out of prison after almost half a decade as an innocent man alright.

    They're not on holidays anymore. They budgeted for a weekend city break, they scrimped and saved for it. They're not In a hotel, they're in a dirty hostel now (but coming back tonight). They've a new young child and she's now cursing herself for ever going. Brother is worried about his new job also, was lucky to get the Monday off but now that's become Tuesday and Wednesday too, crap when you're on probation period.

    Not saying it's the same by the way, I'm making the point that there are hundreds of people stranded abroad right now thorough zero fault of their own.


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    #772
    frag420
    Registered Users Posts: 6,158 ✭✭✭frag420


    SnakePlissken wrote: »
    Nope, sorry, you're wrong.

    Have you got the evidence or proof of any evidence?


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    #773
    OnDraught
    Closed Accounts Posts: 310 ✭✭OnDraught


    Omackeral wrote: »
    They're not on holidays anymore. They budgeted for a weekend city break, they scrimped and saved for it. They're not In a hotel, they're in a dirty hostel now (but coming back tonight). They've a new young child and she's now cursing herself for ever going. Brother is worried about his new job also, was lucky to get the Monday off but now that's become Tuesday and Wednesday too, crap when you're on probation period.

    Not saying it's the same by the way, I'm making the point that there are hundreds of people stranded abroad right now thorough zero fault of their own.

    None coming out of an Egyptian prison. I'm sure Ibrahim would strongly consider swapping his private jet and jail time with your brothers hostel and Ryanair flight.


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    #774
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    WinnyThePoo wrote: »
    How is this relevant at all?

    Unfortunate, but being stuck abroad on a holiday is quite a bit of different situation to the one being discussed.

    Perhaps sending Michael o leary a mail would be more productive.

    Well it's relevant as there are parallels. People are saying we've a stressed Irish citizen abroad in need of coming home. We've hundreds of them at the minute stressed with money, family and job worries. I'm not saying it's a mirror image whatsoever, I'm saying we have people misplaced through absolutely zero fault of their own. That's simply all.

    Also, I've had my dealings with Ryanair in the past and won't use them again. They don't reply to mails and you can't get them on the phone. Their customer service is non existent but that's a different topic!


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    #775
    First Up
    Registered Users Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭First Up


    Jawgap wrote: »
    jonnycivic wrote: »
    He was acquited, the definition of that is:



    He was found not guilty ffs. This thread isnt about OJ its about Ibrahim Halawa.

    It is, I only proffered OJ as an example of its possible for someone to be acquitted, as in found not guilty.....meaning the prosecuting authority failed to meet the burden of proof in respect of the charge levied.....

    .....it doesn't mean the person didn't commit the act or acts complained off......it doesn't mean there was no evidence.....it doesn't mean there is no culpability.
    Don't you think that if they had any evidence, they would have presented it?


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    #776
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    OnDraught wrote: »
    None coming out of an Egyptian prison. I'm sure Ibrahim would strongly consider swapping his private jet and jail time with your brothers hostel and Ryanair flight.

    Well my brother didn't go on stage speaking at a politically rally in a foreign country so that's how come he didn't end up in the clink.


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    #777
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    First Up wrote: »
    Don't you think that if they had any evidence, they would have presented it?

    Depends......I've been involved in enough prosecutions to realise that not everyone who should be prosecuted, actually is......not every charge that should be laid actually is......and sometimes it is through the gap between knowing and proving that the unworthy escape justice ;)

    It's quite possible they had some evidence, just not enough to sustain a charge to the point of conviction.


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    #778
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    jonnycivic wrote: »
    Well he is been released isnt he, if he done something wrong then surely he wouldnt be released.

    That he has been released just means the authorities have no/insufficient evidence that he did something wrong, (or that they've decided not to charge him for some reason), not that he didn't do anything wrong!


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    #779
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Anyway, the whole Ryanair thing was just an example of blameless Irish being stuck abroad with no help. Not meaning to take things off track. Just drew a couple of parallels is all.


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    #780
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    I had two flat tyres this morning and had to walk two miles to the shop for milk.


    Where's my jet, Joe? Where's my jet?


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    #781
    dr.fuzzenstein
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,620 ✭✭✭✭dr.fuzzenstein


    Omackeral wrote: »
    My brother and sister in law are holed up in a box room overseas as we speak through no fault of their own. They've two young kids at home. They scrimped and saved and had a long weekend getaway on their own, first since the kids were born. They're Irish citizens, they're stressed. There's hundreds like them at present sleeping rough in poxy airports. Where's the help for all these?

    There will be a plane along for them soon. Or they can book another airline. Or they may even be stuck for a few days. When one goes on holidays, one has to allow and plan for these things, flights can get cancelled, hotel bookings can get messed up, these things happen. As we speak, the airline is trying to sort them out. They're not irrevocably stuck, this can happen when one travels.
    One would have to be a special kind of stupid to compare a cancelled flight to being stuck in an Egyption prison for 4 years. I doubt they're being starved or beaten with chains.


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