Ibrahim Halawa acquited(mod warning in op-Heed it)

atticu

Auguste Comte wrote: »

Would you be good enough to quote where I said this?

Auguste Comte wrote: »

What did I claim?

Auguste Comte wrote: »

There are a lot of things in this life for which conclusive proof is not possible, intelligent people assess all the available evidence and come to a conclusion based on this.

Please read what you posted.

Thank you.

Please don’t ask me to quote this again, I thought once was enough.

atticu

RustyNut wrote: »

Yes I own a car

Do you drive this motor vehicle?

Auguste Comte

But you claimed that I said

That there was no conclusive proof needed to make a claim.

You might be good enough to post conclusive proof that I said that because I most certainly did not.

atticu wrote: »

Please read what you posted.

Thank you.

Please don’t ask me to quote this again, I thought once was enough.

Ken.

Mod-atticu do not post in this thread again. Reason-trolling

SeanW

RustyNut wrote: »

FYP there.

Hitler was democratically elected in 1933. Does that mean that he was a good leader of Germany?

Or do people sometimes get it wrong (like, with say, the Muslim Brotherhood)

Ulysses Gaze

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

His family and O Gorman for starters.

O'Gorman is the head of Amnesty Ireland.

The aim of Amnesty is to highlight wanton abuses of human rights.

Halawa was kept without a fair trial for 4 years. Under international law, this is an abuse of human rights.

Halawa is an Irish citizen. It would be a derogation of O'Gormans responsibilities as the head of Amnesty Ireland NOT to get involved in this case.

Galwayguy35

Immigration policy in this country must have been a joke 22 years ago, Halawas father and sisters should have been deported instead of being given citizenship.

Although back then if illegals had a kid they automatically got Irish citizenship so maybe when junior popped out they all got it.

Anyone who supports the MB who in turn support Sharia Law is someone who needs to be watched very closely.

While Halawa may not have been convicted of any crime his views are very different to most other people born in this country.

The_Kew_Tour

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

O'Gorman is the head of Amnesty Ireland.

The aim of Amnesty is to highlight wanton abuses of human rights.

Halawa was kept without a fair trial for 4 years. Under international law, this is an abuse of human rights.

Halawa is an Irish citizen. It would be a derogation of O'Gormans responsibilities as the head of Amnesty Ireland NOT to get involved in this case.

I never said he should not have got fair Trial. He should have. End of story.

My point and still is is the blatant inconsistency of the whole story right down to his treatment

First Up

The_Kew_Tour wrote:

My point and still is is the blatant inconsistency of the whole story right down to his treatment

Examples?

The_Kew_Tour

First Up wrote: »

Examples?

Done

Obvious Otter

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

O'Gorman is the head of Amnesty Ireland.

The aim of Amnesty is to highlight wanton abuses of human rights.

Halawa was kept without a fair trial for 4 years. Under international law, this is an abuse of human rights.

Halawa is an Irish citizen. It would be a derogation of O'Gormans responsibilities as the head of Amnesty Ireland NOT to get involved in this case.

Halawa burned his Irish passport and went to Egypt to support the Muslim Brotherhead, a terrorist organisation. This country has wasted 20,000 consular hours on this case.

Amnesty are an organisation devoid of any credibility.

First Up

The_Kew_Tour wrote:

Done

Done where?

First Up

Obvious Otter wrote:

Halawa burned his Irish passport and went to Egypt to support the Muslim Brotherhead, a terrorist organisation.

Gosh, that's a lot of rubbish to pack into one sentence.

Phoebas

Obvious Otter wrote: »

Halawa burned his Irish passport ...

Is there any actual evidence of this?
It sounds like something someone on the internet once said and others have been willing to blindly propogate.

AlekSmart

McCrack wrote: »

No the world doesn't revolve around American jurisprudence.

I was referring to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. A right to a fair and speedy trial is a fundamental human right. Human rights don't just evaporate because a person is in a jurisdiction which may not recognise all or some of them.

I have an issue with imprisonment for a lengthy period of time without trial and four years in my view is excessive and an abuse.

How many seperate and public Court Appearances did Mr Halawa have whilst on remand in Egypt ?

Was he actually denied access to Legal representation,as there appears to be a conflict between the actual circumstances in which he was imprisoned,and the reality,as we saw during his appearances where there appered little restriction on both Legal or Medical access to him.

Much of the Halawa family's campaigning appears to have been more Politically focused,rather than on Ibrahim as an individual,with particularly,his sisters constantly driving home points relating to Irish Government POLICY relating to ties with Egypt,which incedentially I believe,will now be pursued with renewed vigour.

In short,a highly politicized,religiously motivated family,with significant animosity towards the current regime in their former home State,decided upon a course of activism from the safety of their Irish base,embarked upon that very obviously dangerous course,and then,fell foul of both the Egyptian State AND a significant cohort of other ORDINARY Egyptian Citizens.(Whose wishes and rights to a stable Country appear to be widely disregarded in this debate).

The rest is now history,and perhaps should be learned from,rather than used as further incitement to encourage more young Egypto/Irish folks to follow suit.

AlekSmart

Phoebas wrote: »

Is there any actual evidence of this?
It sounds like something someone on the internet once said and others have been willing to blindly propogate.

I never put much stead on that claim.
However,I am intreigued by the wording of Minister Coveneys recent remarks in which he refers to Ibrahim's "issues" surrounding the accquisition of an exit Stamp on his passport.

First Up

AlekSmart wrote:

I never put much stead on that claim. However,I am intreigued by the wording of Minister Coveneys recent remarks in which he refers to Ibrahim's "issues" surrounding the accquisition of an exit Stamp on his passport.

That's not what Coveney said. Halawa has a new Irish passport with no entry stamp. That's the "issue".

The_Kew_Tour

Obvious Otter wrote: »

Amnesty are an organisation devoid of any credibility.

Sadly true that

First Up

AlekSmart wrote:

How many seperate and public Court Appearances did Mr Halawa have whilst on remand in Egypt ?

Does it matter? He waited four years for his case to be heard and after all that, no case against him was presented.

It is perfectly obvious that he and others were just left to rot to make a political point.

weldoninhio

RustyNut wrote: »

I don't know, but they must have something going for them to get elected democratically as the legitimate government of Egypt.

Do you believe Hitler had something good for him and the Nazis?? They got elected too.

weldoninhio

Phoebas wrote: »

Is there any actual evidence of this?
It sounds like something someone on the internet once said and others have been willing to blindly propogate.

The video was removed from the internet. If it didn’t exist, why would one of his biggest cheerleaders, Paul Murphy, comment on it??

uck51js9zml2yt

weldoninhio wrote: »

Do you believe Hitler had something good for him and the Nazis?? They got elected too.

I was actually watching program on his rise to power. An eyewitness said that they knew he was mad but they thought they could control him. The parliamentarians were obviously wrong.

Phoebas

weldoninhio wrote: »

The video was removed from the internet. If it didn’t exist, why would one of his biggest cheerleaders, Paul Murphy, comment on it??

Ah right. There was a video of him burning his Irish passport but it was 'removed from the internet'.

You realise how idiotic that explanation sounds?

"The dog ate my homework"

suicide_circus

Not withstanding that the young man comes from a family with deeply unpleasant beliefs, it's good to see him released. Hopefully he won't forget the support he received from the Irish state.

Kivaro

suicide_circus wrote: »

... Hopefully he won't forget the support he received from the Irish state.

You would think so .....

However two of his sisters are currently suing the Irish State for not processing the paperwork of their Egyptian suitors fast enough. Both of these men are Egyptian nationals currently residing in Turkey. The sisters want them in Ireland and they want them here now.

The sisters also allege unlawful discrimination against them as Irish citizens ...... by the Irish Government.
Astounding, but that's the whacky world we have to live in now.

Maybe they will get the Egyptian government to expel the Irish ambassador to Egypt over this?

The_Kew_Tour

Kivaro wrote: »

You would think so .....

However two of his sisters are currently suing the Irish State for not processing the paperwork of their Egyptian suitors fast enough. Both of these men are Egyptian nationals currently residing in Turkey. The sisters want them in Ireland and they want them here now.

The sisters also allege unlawful discrimination against them as Irish citizens ...... by the Irish Government.
Astounding, but that's the whacky world we have to live in now.

Maybe they will get the Egyptian government to expel the Irish ambassador to Egypt over this?

Is this true?

end of the road

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Immigration policy in this country must have been a joke 22 years ago

how so. not liking a particular person because "reasons" doesn't make our immigration policy a "joke"

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Halawas father and sisters should have been deported instead of being given citizenship.

why should they. to suit you?

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Anyone who supports the MB who in turn support Sharia Law is someone who needs to be watched very closely.

i'm sure if there is evidence that someone supports an extremist organisation and that person is of concern, the authorities will deal with it.

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

While Halawa may not have been convicted of any crime his views are very different to most other people born in this country.

so what?

end of the road

Obvious Otter wrote: »

Halawa burned his Irish passport and went to Egypt to support the Muslim Brotherhead, a terrorist organisation. This country has wasted 20,000 consular hours on this case.

Amnesty are an organisation devoid of any credibility.

nope, wrong. he went to egypt and went to a protest when in the area of that protest. the protest was about the overthrow of a democratically elected government and the subsiquent murder of hundreds of protesters by the military. he didn't burn his passport as confirmed by the government. there is no evidence he supports the mb, attending a protest doesn't equal support.
amnesty are a human rights organisation and have full credibility. if one has a problem with a human rights organisation, questions must be asked about whether they are infact perhapse, extremist themselves.

weldoninhio wrote: »

The video was removed from the internet. If it didn’t exist, why would one of his biggest cheerleaders, Paul Murphy, comment on it??

the video never existed. it was made up. there was however, a video of a british citizen supposibly burning a flag and ripping up his passport and burning it. he was a good few years older then ibriham.

Kivaro wrote: »

You would think so .....

However two of his sisters are currently suing the Irish State for not processing the paperwork of their Egyptian suitors fast enough. Both of these men are Egyptian nationals currently residing in Turkey. The sisters want them in Ireland and they want them here now.

The sisters also allege unlawful discrimination against them as Irish citizens ...... by the Irish Government.
Astounding, but that's the whacky world we have to live in now.

Maybe they will get the Egyptian government to expel the Irish ambassador to Egypt over this?

assuming your allegation is correct, for which again there seems to be no evidence, then it's far from wacky and we don't live in any more of a wacky world now then we did a few years ago. the sisters are entitled to take a case and the case will be decided on it's merrits.

gitzy16v

end of the road wrote: »

nope, wrong. he went to egypt and went to a protest when in the area of that protest. the protest was about the overthrow of a democratically elected government and the subsiquent murder of hundreds of protesters by the military. he didn't burn his passport as confirmed by the government. there is no evidence he supports the mb, attending a protest doesn't equal support.
amnesty are a human rights organisation and have full credibility. if one has a problem with a human rights organisation, questions must be asked about whether they are infact perhapse, extremist themselves.



the video never existed. it was made up. there was however, a video of a british citizen supposibly burning a flag and ripping up his passport and burning it. he was a good few years older then ibriham.



assuming your allegation is correct, for which again there seems to be no evidence, then it's far from wacky and we don't live in any more of a wacky world now then we did a few years ago. the sisters are entitled to take a case and the case will be decided on it's merrits.

Lol...so much wrong.

Will I Am Not

There seems to be no evidence?
Did you look?

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/ibrahim-halawas-sisters-sue-minister-for-justice-over-delay-in-husbands-visas-790743.html

https://www.thesun.ie/news/1033418/halawa-sisters-to-sue-state-over-delay-in-allowing-husbands-to-join-them-in-ireland/

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/halawa-sisters-complain-of-delay-in-deciding-if-husbands-can-join-them-in-ireland-1.3092181