Ibrahim Halawa acquited(mod warning in op-Heed it)

gozunda

First Up wrote: »

So nothing else with basis in fact then.

I presume you can actually read?

If 'yes' then the last post remains relevant .... :sigh:

gozunda wrote:

Are you asking a loaded rhetorical question with no basis in reality or are you just looking for a good old slagging match?

First Up

gozunda wrote:

I presume you can actually read?

Sure can, and there was a marked absence of the words Ibrahim or Halawa in it.

gozunda

BillyBobBS wrote: »

All the the while an elected official in Zappone standing there smiling and waving like an utter fool. Ironic thing is it will be those same people shouting Allah Akbar that won't be giving her the time of day if they have their way.

The good folks in Egypt probably can't believe their luck in washing their hands of that lot - unfortunately they also most likley think we are a complete bunch of gullible gob$hites ....

gozunda

First Up wrote: »

Sure can, and there was a marked absence of the words Ibrahim or Halawa in it.

Ah theres none so blind that cannot see - no worries keep up the dogs reading lessons and you'll be grand ...

givyjoe

Omackeral wrote: »

He said he doesn't like Islam and that makes him a bigot?! I don't like Islam or Christianity or any religion for that matter so I guess I'm a double/triple/keep-going bigot? Labeling someone a bigot because they disagree with a religious ideology is daft. You can dislike Islam but but that doesn't mean you hate all Muslims. Same way you can dislike Christianity but not hate all Catholics. There's a difference, maybe you could learn that.

It was clearly tongue in cheek. But lets not pretend that most of the merry band here.. aren't part of 'Im not racist, but...' brigade.

FYI, a bigot is defined as '..a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.' I'm fairly sure many folks here quite easily meet that criteria.

It's rather depressing to see so many disturbingly prejudiced views in one place.

Billy86

Omackeral wrote: »

You're either being deliberately obtuse or you're not getting the very simple point I'm making. Liberal, as a word, has been and continues to be a general word that can be used in a variety of different ways e.g. someone can be of liberal political views (as you've referred to), one could apply layers of sauce or dressing liberally, meaning generously, or maybe one could be liberal (free/loose) with their interpretation of a set of rules. Point is, the word has many different meanings and has been around for ages.

Alt-right is only something I've ever seen written online, usually by idiots.

I'm not at all - my point is alt-right is a self proclaimed identifier just like liberal or conservative, or indeed fascist or communist to use another two examples. It's got a stigma to it because people whose views do not match up with the alt-right typically want nothing to do with them. Applying sauce liberally is of course different to having a liberal political opinion also, otherwise a liberal political opinion would just mean having a lot of an opinion. Like I said initially, there is not a set amount of time an identifier has to be around to be deemed legitimate, otherwise fascist would have been a nonsense buzzword back in the 1930s when it was a very new term, as would have communist when during the mid 19th century when it first came into use. What I would ask then is, if those two terms back then were 'nonsense buzzwords' then how long did it take for them to become legitimate terms?

gozunda

givyjoe wrote: »

It was clearly tongue in cheek. But lets not pretend that most of the merry band here.. aren't part of 'Im not racist, but...' brigade.

FYI, a bigot is defined as '..a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.' I'm fairly sure many folks here quite easily meet that criteria.

It's rather depressing to see so many disturbingly prejudiced views in one place.

Ah here now givyjoe - you can't go quoting me without at least some acknowledgement can you - here's the relevant post ...

gozunda wrote:

A Little Pony wrote:

If not liking Islam makes me or the millions of people who dislike Islam bigots, then that's fine with me. Many of us expose it for the nonsense it is.

givyjoe wrote: »

Yep, that's exactly what makes you a bigot. Glad you've accepted it. If only others here could be so honest.

Hehe oh givyjoe - you do know what the word 'Bigot actually means?

Let me help you out there ...

oxforddictionary wrote:

Bigot
a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.

Here is your reply reply to one of my posts earlier...

givyjoe wrote:

.. I find many things distasteful, such as your points of view.. your posting style and also the views of some other religions.. both Christianity and Islam actually..

So does that make you a bigot? :eek:

givyjoe

gozunda wrote: »

Ah here now givyjoe - you can't go quoting me without at least some acknowledgement can you - here's the post ...



So does that make you a bigot? :eek:

I didn't quote or see your post. As I was typing, I knew someone would follow up with a clownish response similar to the above.

Let me get an even better one for you which may enlighten you as to who is actually a bigot: '...a person who has very strong, unreasonable beliefs or opinions about race, religion or politics..' So, recognise yourself and your mates here now?:rolleyes:

gozunda

givyjoe wrote: »

I didn't quote or see your post. As I was typing, I knew someone would follow up with a clownish response similar to the above.

Let me get an even better one for you which may enlighten you as to who is actually a bigot: '...a person who has very strong, unreasonable beliefs or opinions about race, religion or politics..' So, recognise yourself and your mates here now?:rolleyes:

Ah another member of the "none so blind as cannot see" brigade . Yours was the prizewinning clownish post- showing yourself bigoted in your own words of intolerance.

It didn't need for anyone to follow up your post - You had already put yourself up for exactly what you attribute to others ... what was it you said again? Ah yes

givyjoe wrote:

.. I find many things distasteful, such as your points of view.. your posting style and also the views of some other religions.. both Christianity and Islam actually..

Nice ...

First Up

gozunda wrote:

Ah theres none so blind that cannot see - no worries keep up the dogs reading lessons and you'll be grand ...

You must have great eyesight if you spotted stuff the heavily biased Egyptian prosecutors and courts didn't but its good to know that your vigilance will keep (some of) us safe.

givyjoe

gozunda wrote: »

Ah another member of the "none so blind as cannot see" brigade . Yours was the prizewinning clownish post- showing yourself as a bigot by your own words of intolerance.

It didn't need for anyone to follow up your post - You had already put yourself for exactly what you attribute to others ... what was it you said again?

Ha, toddle on now. No real answer to that definition now do you?:rolleyes:

Call me intolerant all you like, you're free to hold your bigoted views all you like.. Thing is, I don't think you should be locked up without trial for 4 years because of your religious or political views.

I don't really see the relevance of your quoting my post, regarding your points of view. They are distasteful, but you're free to hold them.

yourdeadwright

Can someone explain to me what the issue is some people are having with this ?
Surely its clear he was locked up for four years for no apparent reason ?
Why do people have problem with the guy ?

gozunda

givyjoe wrote: »

Ha, toddle on now. No real answer to that definition now do you?:rolleyes:

You really are class 1

You making up your own definitions now then :rolleyes:

"givyjoe wrote: »

Call me intolerant all you like, you're free to hold your bigoted views all you like.. Thing is, I don't think you should be locked up without trial for 4 years because of your religious or political views.

I didn't call you A Bigot you did that YOURSELF

Here it is again just so you are in no doubt ...

givyjoe wrote:

.. I find many things distasteful, such as your points of view.. your posting style and also the views of some other religions.. both Christianity and Islam actually..

"givyjoe wrote: »

I don't really see the relevance of your quoting my post, regarding your points of view. They are distasteful, but you're free to hold them.

No seriously ? Other than at least to point out that your words are hypocritical? And as being free etc - well that's very big of you but you very clearly pointed out not only my views but also stated that you dislike the views of both ... Christianity and Islam?

Your are therefore clearly bigoted in your very own words ...

Thanks for letting us know in such an unequivocal manner....

Kivaro

So here is what I learned from the pro Muslim Brotherhood/Halawa brigade posted here since yesterday:

1. Halawa just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, which resulted in his arrest ........ even though there is irrefutable evidence of the many days protest preparation by the Halawas in their attempt to help overthrow the Egyptian government.
2. Irish women are treated as bad as the women in Saudi Arabia ............. the mind boggles.
3. Posters who do not have personal experience with the Muslim Brotherhood do not have the right to judge them .............. even though that they are a proscribed terrorist organisation with Sharia Law being their number 1 goal.
4. Posters should not have the audacity to suggest that Halawa may have to answer questions relating to his activities in Egypt and the subsequent cost to the Irish State to get him released. These posters are bigoted, or racist, or just saying it because Halawa is brown ............ this tactic of calling a person racist because they have a differing opinion is one rooted in ignorance and it is the approach of those who want to stifle discussion.

Methinks that the Halawa facade may be crumbling in the eyes of the Irish public.

Hitman3000

yourdeadwright wrote:

Can someone explain to me what the issue is some people are having with this ? Surely its clear he was locked up for four years for no apparent reason ? Why do people have problem with the guy ?

Maybe educate yourself to the activities of this lad during his 'holiday' in Egypt. The lies his sister's have told. Two good places to start with. Might help you understand why some people have an issue with this fellow and his wider family.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

david75 wrote: »

What do yis want to happen here?
Deport him?
Put a 24hour Garda surveillance on him?
And presumably all of his family and those of his faith?
He’s a threat to the country arrest him?


In a paragraph what’s your actual problem? Try and form that thought and type it out.

He and his family got themselves into a mess of their own making. Considerable public resources and money had to be used to extricate them from it.
Instead of Ibrahim Halawa being quietly brought home and swiftly moved through Dublin Airport and out to a waiting car, he gets a hero's welcome, an opportunity to make grandiose statements to the media and photocalls beside a beaming Government Minister.
That is our problem, and it has been stated many times on this thread. Constantly asking posters to re-state their position is really a sign that you're running out of arguments.

Hector Savage

w.b. yokes wrote: »

Ibrahim Halawa's backwards Islamist positions realistically have no place in a country like Ireland where we collectively agree that women should have rights and killing homosexuals is ****ing despicable. I'm glad he's home and I he's entitled to his positions but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be condemned.

Spot on really, and I think people are misunderstanding people who critisize him, like Mark Humphrys - we don't want this guy to be just thrown in jail.
It's the hero status we don't understand.
He seems to hold very dangerous beliefs, Ireland has just come out of a bad ideology we don't need a new one.

Hector Savage

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Can someone explain to me what the issue is some people are having with this ?
Surely its clear he was locked up for four years for no apparent reason ?
Why do people have problem with the guy ?

I may be shot for posting this, but here is a good place to start

http://markhumphrys.com/halawa.html

mfceiling

givyjoe wrote: »

FYI, a bigot is defined as '..a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.' I'm fairly sure many folks here quite easily meet that criteria.

It's rather depressing to see so many disturbingly prejudiced views in one place.

I'm a bigot so.

I don't belive women should be treated like dirt. That they should be covered head to toe in fabric with a tiny slit to see out of. That they must walk behind their husband in public. That they can't drive. That gay men and women are shunned and treated like second class citizens.

I was in madrid in august. Was going down in the lift with my 3 daughters. The lift stopped on a floor. A muslim man stepped in with his child. When his wife tried to enter the lift with the pram and his baby he kicked the pram back out and shouted something at her. There was plenty of room in the lift for all if us. He smiled at me but I blanked him completely. No way do I want my daughters exposed to that shìt where they are treated like dirt.

yourdeadwright

Hitman3000 wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote:

Can someone explain to me what the issue is some people are having with this ? Surely its clear he was locked up for four years for no apparent reason ? Why do people have problem with the guy ?

Maybe educate yourself to the activities of this lad during his 'holiday' in Egypt. The lies his sister's have told. Two good places to start with. Might help you understand why some people have an issue with this fellow and his wider family.

That what im asking ? i'm not on either side im trying to

Hitman3000 wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote:

Can someone explain to me what the issue is some people are having with this ? Surely its clear he was locked up for four years for no apparent reason ? Why do people have problem with the guy ?

Maybe educate yourself to the activities of this lad during his 'holiday' in Egypt. The lies his sister's have told. Two good places to start with. Might help you understand why some people have an issue with this fellow and his wider family.

That my question , I'm not educated in this at all I haven't read about it , Any where I can read all this ?

Roger Hassenforder

This poor lad was on holidays and that '"rally" was just the queue for the pyramids.

Hitman3000

Hector Savage wrote:

I may be shot for posting this, but here is a good place to start

Always amused me how the defenders of all things Halawa never explained why the family never took action against Humphries despite claiming his claims were nonsense even defamatory.
Also the speed at which the family tried to delete their social media presence. Almost successful but not quite.

RustyNut

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

From the ashes of the Coptic Christian places of worship in Egypt I say fcuk you Ibrahim and all that you stand for. We will not be conquered.

Nothing like a little histrionics in the morning.

Hector Savage

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Always amused me how the defenders of all things Halawa never explained why the family never took action against Humphries despite claiming his claims were nonsense even defamatory.
Also the speed at which the family tried to delete their social media presence. Almost successful but not quite.

Exactly,
Mark tweeted this morning
https://twitter.com/markhumphrys/status/923082831424819200

I was lucky to be a student of Marks years ago back in DCU
Logical to the end and a great lecturer.

Will I Am Not

Silas Most Keypunch wrote: »

He and his family got themselves into a mess of their own making. Considerable public resources and money had to be used to extricate them from it.
Instead of Ibrahim Halawa being quietly brought home and swiftly moved through Dublin Airport and out to a waiting car, he gets a hero's welcome, an opportunity to make grandiose statements to the media and photocalls beside a beaming Government Minister.
That is our problem, and it has been stated many times on this thread. Constantly asking posters to re-state their position is really a sign that you're running out of arguments.

Pretty much how I feel. I don’t feel he’s a threat to the country, I don’t have any strong, negative feelings towards him as an individual.
It’s the media fanfare, the ‘we were just on holiday’ spiel, the changing stories, the labelling of anybody that questions anything.

More than anything, it’s the ‘it’s cos he’s brown’ brigade. The irony/hypocrisy of that statement is hilarious, because he wouldn’t have got anything of the sort of coverage he got if this was a young, white Irish lad from Finglas.

givyjoe

gozunda wrote: »

You really are class 1

You making up your own definitions now then :rolleyes:



I didn't call you A Bigot you did that YOURSELF

Here it is again just so you are in no doubt ...





No seriously ? Other than at least to point out that your words are hypocritical? And as being free etc - well that's very big of you but you very clearly pointed out not only my views but also stated that you dislike the views of both ... Christianity and Islam?

Your are therefore clearly bigoted in your very own words ...

Thanks for letting us know in such an unequivocal manner....

Mate, please go and educate yourself. Your complete inability to understand quite simple words and definitions is really embarrassing. I didn't make up any definition. You just don't seem like that it neatly puts you into the bigot bucket.

Please go and educate yourself on what intolerance and being bigoted actually means, type 'examples of (insert type) of bigotry' as maybe a start. A distaste or dislike of ones views etc is not intolerance or bigotry, no matter how much you'd like to make it so.

Calling out someone with bigoted views, does not make said person a bigot. Really, it's that simple.

yourdeadwright

Does anyone know why his links to the Brother hood where not written about in the main stream media ?
After reading Mark Humprys write up on the whole thing surely himself and his family should be on a extremist watch list if it is all true ?

givyjoe

mfceiling wrote: »

I'm a bigot so.

I don't belive women should be treated like dirt. That they should be covered head to toe in fabric with a tiny slit to see out of. That they must walk behind their husband in public. That they can't drive. That gay men and women are shunned and treated like second class citizens.

I was in madrid in august. Was going down in the lift with my 3 daughters. The lift stopped on a floor. A muslim man stepped in with his child. When his wife tried to enter the lift with the pram and his baby he kicked the pram back out and shouted something at her. There was plenty of room in the lift for all if us. He smiled at me but I blanked him completely. No way do I want my daughters exposed to that shìt where they are treated like dirt.

Right, so one Muslim guy (I'll take your word for it that he was Muslim) was a complete d!ck in a lift. Soo, all Muslims are d1cks? Who will treat all women in precisely the same way, should they be in a lift?:rolleyes: Just such a weird and irrelevant example.

Sure, some Muslim countries do have some pretty fcuked up laws that treat women as second class citizens.. We do have some of our own those fcuked up laws too.

Will I Am Not

givyjoe wrote: »

A distaste or dislike of ones views etc is not intolerance or bigotry, no matter how much you'd like to make it so.

Calling out someone with bigoted views, does not make said person a bigot. Really, it's that simple.

Correct me if I’m wrong here. This is what I remember...
You called somebody a bigot for disliking Islam. You then went on to say you disliked Islam yourself?

Is that what happened?

givyjoe

The Fake Sheikh wrote: »

Correct me if I’m wrong here. This is what I remember...
You called somebody a bigot for disliking Islam. You then went on to say you disliked Islam yourself?

Is that what happened?

No, if you wish.. feel free to go back and make direct quotes from posts and I'll be happy to clear anything up for you. On Islam specifically, I said dislike (many as it happens) of the views associated.

I also dislike the views of many other religious faiths. I do however respect the fact that people are entitled to those beliefs and they shouldn't be treated less favourably than others because of those views (i.e. discriminated against).