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Ibrahim Halawa acquited(mod warning in op-Heed it)

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  • Options
    #2642
    First Up
    Registered Users Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭First Up


    Hitman3000 wrote:
    On my effort to make a comment about the electoral fraud that took place during the elections in the early part of this decade in Egypt I referenced the wrong organisation, my bad. However there was electoral fraud engaged in by all parties running in those elections and the subsequent Presidential election and the attempted change to the constitution by Morsi. All avaible online for anyone willing to look.


    Link please.


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    #2643
    RustyNut
    Registered Users Posts: 3,430 ✭✭✭RustyNut


    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    However there was electoral fraud engaged in by all parties running in those elections and the subsequent Presidential election and the attempted change to the constitution by Morsi.
    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    Cause you say so?Ha ha.

    :rolleyes:


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    #2644
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    RustyNut wrote:
    carried out a report into electoral fraud in Egyptian elections? or are you lying mistaken?


    Addressed this with another poster.


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    #2645
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    givyjoe wrote:
    Sorry, other threads?! Do you expect me to trawl other threads for expansions on points made here?!

    Absolutely not, it seems you are suggesting I should repeat every comment I make on every thread I participate in. Not going to happen.


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    #2646
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    First Up wrote:
    Link please.


    I addressed your request earlier with an explaintation.


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    #2647
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    No court anywhere in the world announces a verdict of innocent??

    Guilty or not guilty...I would have taught

    I believe there are some jurisdictions which do - the one that possibly springs to mind was the Madeleine McCann case where there was a verdict of not proven innocent...

    See:

    https://www.google.ie/amp/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/09/madeleine-mccanns-parents-have-not-ruled-innocent-judge-says/amp/


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    #2648
    RustyNut
    Registered Users Posts: 3,430 ✭✭✭RustyNut


    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    Addressed this with another poster.

    So you made up the report to suit your argument?


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    #2649
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    RustyNut wrote:
    So you made up the report to suit your argument?


    No I didn't, but it won't stop you repeating this claim so fire ahead.


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    #2650
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,857 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    gozunda wrote: »
    I believe there are some jurisdictions which do - the one that springs to mind was the Madeleine McCann case ...

    See:

    https://www.google.ie/amp/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/09/madeleine-mccanns-parents-have-not-ruled-innocent-judge-says/amp/

    Just read that link and you will see that it has no relevance whatsoever to our discussion.


  • Options
    #2651
    quintana76
    Registered Users Posts: 751 ✭✭✭quintana76


    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    There’s some amount of racism, begrudgery and islamophobia on this thread.

    Look at the end of the Ibrahim Halawa was nothing more than a foolish teenager who made a foolish choice and paid for it in the worst way.

    And Luke it or not he was born and raised here - that makes him Irish regardless of his name, religion or the color of his skin.

    Where was daddy? Why did he not take responsibility? Why was he never queried as to his culpability as the father of a 17 year old for his son's foolish actions.


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    #2652
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    elperello wrote: »
    Just read that link and you will see that it has no relevance whatsoever to our discussion.


    I have no idea what discussion you think you are having. I was replying to Tomwaterfords question about jurisdictions that allow for innocence verdict / ruling. In this case Portugal allows for a "not innocent" verdict therefore it would be logical to say that there is an corollary position of that verdict ...I am currently reading through some portugese legalese to verify that for sure ...




    Thanks for your input ... :rolleyes:


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    #2653
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,857 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    Instead of a snide comment would you like to say what manner a verdict is given in a Scottish court seeing as that is the one I mentioned not the rest of the world.

    OK deal.

    I won't be snide to you if you will reciprocate.

    The verdict not proven in Scottish Law is equivalent to an acquittal. Such verdicts are often considered as unwelcome by victims as well as defendants. It is a centuries old aberration and the subject of much debate in Scottish legal circles.

    While all of that is an interesting aside it has little relevance to the matter at hand.


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    #2654
    RustyNut
    Registered Users Posts: 3,430 ✭✭✭RustyNut


    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    Don't tell lies and you won't be called a liar. Simple concept.
    Anyhoo must go work calls.
    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    Not others just you. : ). Btw it's liars or in your case liar.
    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    Never said it was ok, why do you persist in lying? Genuine question?
    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    Never offered support, I said they were the lesser of two evils. You need to read what i wrote. Don't make up stuff, no need for it.
    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    You never heard of the International Electoral and Boundary Commission? Jimmy Carter was once an observer for them. Obviously the last part of your post proves you never even bothered to look just wishing to cast aspiration. I don't lie petal I know in your world it's the norm but it's not for me.
    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    No I didn't, but it won't stop you repeating this claim so fire ahead.

    People in glass houses and all that. :rolleyes:


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    #2655
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,857 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    gozunda wrote: »
    I have no idea what discussion you think you are having. I was replying to Tomwaterfords question about jurisdictions that allow for innocence verdict / ruling. In this case Portugal allows for a "not innocent" verdict therefore it would be logical to state that there is an colerary position of that verdict ...I am currently reading through some portugese legalese to verify that for sure ...




    Thanks for your input ... :rolleyes:

    Have you actually read it?

    There was no criminal prosecution in that case.

    You are welcome.


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    #2656
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    elperello wrote: »
    Have you actually read it?

    There was no criminal prosecution in that case.

    You are welcome.

    Jeez are you adding qualifications and caveats to Tomwaterfords question now?

    Look do go ask your own question by all means and I'll do my very best to answer whatever that is ok ...

    Perversity helps no one....


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    #2657
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,857 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    gozunda wrote: »
    Jeez are you adding qualifications and caveats to Tomwaterfords question now?

    Look do go ask your own question by all means and I'll do my very best to answer whatever that is ok ...

    Perversity helps no one....

    I asked you a question and made a statement. I was trying to be polite.


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    #2658
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    elperello wrote: »
    I asked you a question and made a statement. I was trying to be polite.

    Tomwaterfords asked a question which I replied to. After that I have no idea what you were on about. I can only presume I landed in the middle of a fraccas and it did not register as being overtly polite imo ...


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    #2659
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    RustyNut wrote:
    People in glass houses and all that.


    All about context. You can't just take all my posts in isolation. Disingenuous tbh.


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    #2660
    First Up
    Registered Users Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭First Up


    Hitman3000 wrote:
    I addressed your request earlier with an explaintation.

    You claimed widespread electoral fraud in Egypt. Evidence or withdraw please.


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    #2661
    Kivaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    quintana76 wrote: »
    Where was daddy? Why did he not take responsibility? Why was he never queried as to his culpability as the father of a 17 year old for his son's foolish actions.

    There was no way young Halawa would have been allowed onto the stage to incite the government overthrow without his father's involvement and guiding hand. The father is a dangerous man, but Ireland has him for keeps now.


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  • Options
    #2662
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    elperello wrote:
    The verdict not proven in Scottish Law is equivalent to an acquittal. Such verdicts are often considered as unwelcome by victims as well as defendants. It is a centuries old aberration and the subject of much debate in Scottish legal circles.


    I said not 'not proven' is announced in Scottish courts in response to another posters claim it is only guilty or not guilty that are returned verdicts. As to whether I agree with a 'not proven ' verdict is irrelevant. However you claimed I was wrong about the Scottish courts but yet it appears you completely contradicted yourself.


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    #2663
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    First Up wrote:
    You claimed widespread electoral fraud in Egypt. Evidence or withdraw please.

    I never side widespread fraud. Read what I said please. I said there was was evidence of fraud by all parties to the election and the subsequent change Morsi attempted with the constitution.


  • Options
    #2664
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    Kivaro wrote:
    There was no way young Halawa would have been allowed onto the stage to incite the government overthrow without his father's involvement and guiding hand. The father is a dangerous man, but Ireland has him for keeps now.


    I think the young Egyptian lad was there as a proxy.


  • Options
    #2665
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,857 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    gozunda wrote: »
    Tomwaterfords asked a question which I replied to. After that I have no idea what you were on about. I can only presume I landed in the middle of a fraccas and it did not register as being overtly polite imo ...

    I asked you if you read the text in that link you posted.
    I made a point re. the content.
    I signed off saying "You are welcome"

    Come on, how polite do I need to be?


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    #2666
    quintana76
    Registered Users Posts: 751 ✭✭✭quintana76


    Kivaro wrote: »
    There was no way young Halawa would have been allowed onto the stage to incite the government overthrow without his father's involvement and guiding hand. The father is a dangerous man, but Ireland has him for keeps now.
    Not only him but potential MB fugitives as husbands for the sisters coming in from Turkey.


  • Options
    #2667
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,857 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Hitman3000 wrote: »
    I said not 'not proven' is announced in Scottish courts in response to another posters claim it is only guilty or not guilty that are returned verdicts. As to whether I agree with a 'not proven ' verdict is irrelevant. However you claimed I was wrong about the Scottish courts but yet it appears you completely contradicted yourself.

    Where have I contradicted myself?

    Not proven is the equivalent of an acquittal in Scottish Law.

    You are right, whether you agree with a not proven verdict is irrelevant.

    My substantive point was not that you were wrong about Scottish courts but that you had a poor understanding of it. If you understood it you would not have raised it as another hare in this discussion.


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    #2668
    Kivaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    quintana76 wrote: »
    Not only him but potential MB fugitives as husbands for the sisters coming in from Turkey.

    By suing the Irish State to get these 'husbands' into Ireland “forthwith”, the sisters are really showing their gratitude to the Irish nation for all the effort and money spent on their brother to get him out of jail. Wonder how much this is going to cost us now?

    And of course the sisters added discrimination in their law suit, which coincidentally some MB/Halawa supporters on here are claiming when we ask questions about Halawa's holiday in Egypt.
    Singing from the same hymn sheet ....


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    #2669
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    elperello wrote:
    Not proven is the equivalent of an acquittal in Scottish Law.


    You claimed I was wrong when I said 'not proven' is a verdict given in Scottish courts. You then say this verdict is not pleasing to any party in Scottish courts. You don't see the contradiction? I'm replying no further on this matter.


  • Options
    #2670
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    elperello wrote:
    My substantive point was not that you were wrong about Scottish courts but that you had a poor understanding of it. If you understood it you would not have raised it as another hare in this discussion.


    The comment of not proven was risen in response to a comment by another poster. Your rush to tell me I was wrong highlighted your own ignorance.


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    #2671
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    elperello wrote: »
    I asked you if you read the text in that link you posted.
    I made a point re. the content.
    I signed off saying "You are welcome"
    Come on, how polite do I need to be?

    You made a negative statement and then frivolously asked if I had read the link - why to you think I put it up if I had not read it?
    You demanded I answer your question. Your reply of 'Your welcome' was in reply to an ironic comment of thanks for the input!

    Nothing you said had any relevance whatsoever.

    Look if you just want to mess that's fine. Just don't bother replying to any other of my posts. You are on the ignore list along with your lurking supporter of similar ilk ...


This discussion has been closed.
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