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Kerry GAA discussion thread #2

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    #3212
    dobman88
    Registered Users Posts: 6,493 ✭✭✭dobman88


    Rosita wrote: »
    Only problem is that there is no objection when David Moran's mistakes are pointed out or when it is implied he was the cause of the defeat.

    Because he has done it consistently in big games and has the experience or should have it, to know better. If Clifford is still there in 10 years making the same stupid mistakes, I'll say the same about him.


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    #3213
    Audioslaven
    Registered Users Posts: 1,385 ✭✭✭Audioslaven


    kerryjack wrote: »
    Cork like Tyrone yesterday. I must have been watching a different game. The game I was watching looked timid enough affair.

    Cork didn't go at Kerry yesterday in all out attacking. They kept it tight, foul out the field and bring the game to a dog fight. This is what Tyrone do and love when you get involved in this type of game with Lots of lateral hand passing, back and forth stuff. Granted conditions were bad but the scoring matched this as well.

    They did a "Tyrone" on Kerry yesterday imo. Teams like that do not want an open game and I agree that Keane got this wrong with a defensive mindset but the same time these are intercounty players and should rise above that. This is why I say the players are also accountable.


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    #3214
    kerryjack
    Registered Users Posts: 1,567 ✭✭✭kerryjack


    A small bit of positively those of you who were around 2001 Kerry v Meath we got hammered out the gate I was half way back down to kerry for the final whistle, and look what happened after that so keep the faith and we back in action in a few months.


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    #3215
    BENDYBINN
    Registered Users Posts: 1,851 ✭✭✭BENDYBINN


    kerryjack wrote: »
    A small bit of positively those of you who were around 2001 Kerry v Meath we got hammered out the gate I was half way back down to kerry for the final whistle, and look what happened after that so keep the faith and we back in action in a few months.

    Yes, and a few weeks later the same Meath got hammered by Galway in the final.......


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    #3216
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    kerryjack wrote: »

    2001 Kerry v Meath we got hammered out the gate I was half way back down to kerry for the final whistle,

    Good to see that you're a man who'll go down with the ship come what may! :D


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    #3217
    siblers
    Registered Users Posts: 12,526 ✭✭✭✭siblers


    kerryjack wrote: »
    A small bit of positively those of you who were around 2001 Kerry v Meath we got hammered out the gate I was half way back down to kerry for the final whistle, and look what happened after that so keep the faith and we back in action in a few months.

    I was at that match unfortunately . Meath completely blitzed them that day, they were unreal. Yesterday was as bad if not worse


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    #3218
    kerryjack
    Registered Users Posts: 1,567 ✭✭✭kerryjack


    siblers wrote: »
    I was at that match unfortunately . Meath completely blitzed them that day, they were unreal. Yesterday was as bad if not worse
    Ya we got it off the Meath suporters as well that day, they didn't spare us.


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    #3219
    Poor_old_gill
    Registered Users Posts: 2,894 ✭✭✭Poor_old_gill


    siblers wrote: »
    I was at that match unfortunately . Meath completely blitzed them that day, they were unreal. Yesterday was as bad if not worse

    That Meath defeat was a bad day, 2011 was probably still the worst.
    99 against Cork was bad too but I’d easily rank yesterday up there amongst those performances


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    #3220
    siblers
    Registered Users Posts: 12,526 ✭✭✭✭siblers


    Poor_old_gill wrote: »
    That Meath defeat was a bad day, 2011 was probably still the worst.
    99 against Cork was bad too but I’d easily rank yesterday up there amongst those performances

    I remember Cluxton taking forever to take the free. It took up pretty much all of injury time and the fecking ref blew it up straight after. It was a mixture of rage and heartbreak when it was blown up


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    #3221
    Poor_old_gill
    Registered Users Posts: 2,894 ✭✭✭Poor_old_gill


    siblers wrote: »
    I remember Cluxton taking forever to take the free. It took up pretty much all of injury time and the fecking ref blew it up straight after. It was a mixture of rage and heartbreak when it was blown up

    Absolute robbery, never have I seen so many decisions go against a team as went against us that day.
    The free was awarded with around 68.30 gone and there was 2 mins injury time yet it was blown up more or less straight after the free.

    It was, at best, terrible officiating


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    #3222
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    Poor_old_gill wrote: »
    Absolute robbery, never have I seen so many decisions go against a team as went against us that day.
    The free was awarded with around 68.30 gone and there was 2 mins injury time yet it was blown up more or less straight after the free.

    It was, at best, terrible officiating

    Just in the interests of fairness.......the free was awarded at 70.51 and the whistle was blown at 72.11. Don't beat yourself up over that.


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    #3223
    dobman88
    Registered Users Posts: 6,493 ✭✭✭dobman88


    Rosita wrote: »
    Just in the interests of fairness.......the free was awarded at 70.51 and the whistle was blown at 72.11. Don't beat yourself up over that.

    :pac: jaysus


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    #3224
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,552 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    BENDYBINN wrote: »
    Yes, and a few weeks later the same Meath got hammered by Galway in the final.......

    Remember coming out the gate Galway were red hot favourites for the hurling and Meath after hammering us looked red hot for the football. Galway had given Kilkenny a hiding in the hurling semi-final. I remember other Kerry lads talking about Meath, I said Galway coukd beat them but lose the hurling to Tipp an ould fella agreed with me.

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #3225
    wonga77
    Registered Users Posts: 4,451 ✭✭✭wonga77


    That Meath game was mad, I was in a state of shock heading out the gate. I was delighted the ole ole Meath fans got their comeuppance a few weeks after


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    #3226
    Radio5
    Registered Users Posts: 1,953 ✭✭✭Radio5


    There is an element of hype about the result in that it's the first time since 2000 we have a knockout championship. If there was a qualifier route this year, would anyone be writing Kerry off and hyping up Cork's win this much? Probably not.

    Cork played the game on their terms, keep it low scoring and slowing it down to a crawl. The wet weather was known about for days in advance, surely we could have come up with some game plan to allow for that. It appears that we didn't . When our 2 lead forwards were clearly having off days, it would appear there was nobody to stand up and do anything about it, until Spillane and O'Brien came on. They should have been brought on earlier than they were. Ref was inconsistent but that's usual at this level and we shouldn't be surprised.


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    #3227
    flasher0030
    Registered Users Posts: 2,638 ✭✭✭flasher0030


    Poor_old_gill wrote: »
    Absolute robbery, never have I seen so many decisions go against a team as went against us that day.
    The free was awarded with around 68.30 gone and there was 2 mins injury time yet it was blown up more or less straight after the free.

    It was, at best, terrible officiating

    Not forgetting Kevin McMenamin taking about 10 steps for the crucial goal.
    I remember some Dub trying to justify it on TV - on the basis that "he was taking small quick steps". So, somehow that makes it different!!


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    #3228
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    Radio5 wrote: »

    There is an element of hype about the result in that it's the first time since 2000 we have a knockout championship. If there was a qualifier route this year, would anyone be writing Kerry off and hyping up Cork's win this much? Probably not.

    .


    I genuinely don't get the point of this post about hype. Of course if there was a qualifier route this year people wouldn't be writing Kerry off. Because they'd still be in it. Kerry were beaten by Cork in 2006/08/09 and came back to reach the All-Ireland Final. If they had the second chance this year the same might happen so of course they would not be written off.

    But the whole significance of Cork's win is that Kerry are out. And it's not hype. Hype suggests exaggeration as if Kerry were beaten but not really out. If there was this reaction to a game which was not knockout then you could justifiably call it hype. But this is very different. It is a proper defeat with actual terminal repercussions.


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    #3229
    KIB4Life
    Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭KIB4Life


    flasher0030 wrote: »
    Not forgetting Kevin McMenamin taking about 10 steps for the crucial goal.
    I remember some Dub trying to justify it on TV - on the basis that "he was taking small quick steps". So, somehow that makes it different!!

    Every player now probably over carries the ball, if a player is going forward or running forward with the ball, they are never pulled for it. It’s when a player hesitates or goes backwards or sideways it’s when they seem to be pulled for over carrying. Also if a player is being tackled they seem to be able to take an extra few steps.


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    #3230
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    dobman88 wrote: »
    Because he has done it consistently in big games and has the experience or should have it, to know better. If Clifford is still there in 10 years making the same stupid mistakes, I'll say the same about him.

    Darragh Ó Se's column today is illuminating on this. Cork 19 shots, Kerry 29, Clifford missing 14 and 20 metre frees, Cork 5 wides, Kerry 12. Clifford, Brosnan and Clifford 17 scoring chances between them with just 7 converted. Not a single mention of David Moran.


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    #3231
    dobman88
    Registered Users Posts: 6,493 ✭✭✭dobman88


    Rosita wrote: »
    Darragh Ó Se's column today is illuminating on this. Cork 19 shots, Kerry 29, Clifford missing 14 and 20 metre frees, Cork 5 wides, Kerry 12. Clifford, Brosnan and Clifford 17 scoring chances between them with just 7 converted. Not a single mention of David Moran.

    Oh right.


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    #3232
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    dobman88 wrote: »
    Oh right.

    Right indeed. Not making a big deal of it but there is life beyond group-think.


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    #3233
    SecretsOfEarth
    Registered Users Posts: 967 ✭✭✭SecretsOfEarth


    Rosita wrote: »
    Right indeed. Not making a big deal of it but there is life beyond group-think.

    There must be life beyond being condescending to multiple people expressing the same opinion about a clear and unequivocal observation too! :rolleyes:


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    #3234
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    SecretsOfEarth wrote: »
    There must be life beyond being condescending to multiple people expressing the same opinion about a clear and unequivocal observation too! :rolleyes:


    Oh right. No doubt you know best.


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    #3235
    dobman88
    Registered Users Posts: 6,493 ✭✭✭dobman88


    Rosita wrote: »
    Right indeed. Not making a big deal of it but there is life beyond group-think.

    You seem to be making more of a deal of it than anyone tbh. I've held this opinion on Moran for a few years now. And I'm not seeing any evidence to change it. A former player has chosen to focus, rightly imo, on the extremely poor games that our marquee players had. It happens, i dont think any player played particularly well and he could have written about any number of things.

    I'm not sure what you hope to achieve on a Kerry thread by gloating over the deserved win and having a pop at posters for "group think". But here we are.


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    #3236
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    dobman88 wrote: »
    You seem to be making more of a deal of it than anyone tbh. I've held this opinion on Moran for a few years now. And I'm not seeing any evidence to change it. A former player has chosen to focus, rightly imo, on the extremely poor games that our marquee players had. It happens, i dont think any player played particularly well and he could have written about any number of things.

    I'm not sure what you hope to achieve on a Kerry thread by gloating over the deserved win and having a pop at posters for "group think". But here we are.


    I replied once on the matter. Then I pointed out what "a former player" said on the matter simply because the other view was the only show in town here. That's all.


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    #3237
    dobman88
    Registered Users Posts: 6,493 ✭✭✭dobman88


    Rosita wrote: »
    I replied once on the matter. Then I pointed out what "a former player" said on the matter simply because the other view was the only show in town here. That's all.

    Right so.


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    #3238
    Raoul Duke
    Registered Users Posts: 955 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke


    Rosita wrote: »
    I replied once on the matter. Then I pointed out what "a former player" said on the matter simply because the other view was the only show in town here. That's all.

    Why do you consider his view "other"? Just because he didn't write about Moran's brain farts, doesn't mean that he thinks he had a great game.
    It easier to write about Kerry's misses, because anyone can have an off-day. If our forwards had been a bit sharper, then we'd have won. That's true. It's the easiest option to choose when "writing" a piece for public.
    It's harder to criticise Moran publicly because his continual errors point to a character flaw.
    I love Moran by the way. Love the way that he plays heads-up football. When in possession he appears to have 90% of his brain working out who to give the ball to, and 10% to deal with the guys tackling him. But he should be ordered not to shoot from more than 20 metres away.


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    #3239
    keane2097
    Registered Users Posts: 17,771 ✭✭✭✭keane2097


    I don't know why this needs to be an argument, I'm sure everyone accepts that both Davids made two or three really bad mistakes in a game we lost with the last kick.


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    #3240
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    Raoul Duke wrote: »
    Why do you consider his view "other"? .


    I don't. I referred to the view not offered by the former Kerry player as "other", as in a different view to his. You are misinterpreting me completely.


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    #3241
    Rosita
    Registered Users Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Rosita


    keane2097 wrote: »
    I don't know why this needs to be an argument, I'm sure everyone accepts that both Davids made two or three really bad mistakes in a game we lost with the last kick.

    It needs to be an argument because some people maintain that in the case of one David the mistakes matter and in the case of the other it doesn't. I don't understand that given that David the younger has two All Star awards in the past two years. Big rewards bring big expectations and big scrutiny.


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