World Boxing Super Series Thread

RezwoK

Avni Yildirim

walshb wrote: »

You are right, he did miss a lot, but so did Breidis.

The close scoring punches rds IMO should have been scored for the man effectively pushing the pace and applying effective aggression and controlling the flow of the fight. That man, for the most part was Usyk.

Think I’ll rewatch and score it again during the week. I just felt breidis landed the cleaner shots and Usyk missed a lot. Usyks popping left jab missing so much also takes the shine of punches dmhe does actually land maybe. Agression and control in Usyks favor yes but the I feel Breidis just landed better and more often.

normanoffside

Avni Yildirim

normanoffside wrote: »

Usyk is a huge CW.
We just happen to be operating in the higher class of boxing when we have these fights, it’s fooking great to see.
I’d have no doubt that Breidis or his like would spark a lot of heavyweight bums such as Whyte or Brown given the chance.
Remember Manuel Charr!

Remember Breidis vs Charr ( the WBA Heavyweight regular Champ)

megadodge

RezwoK wrote: »

Think I’ll rewatch and score it again during the week. I just felt breidis landed the cleaner shots and Usyk missed a lot. Usyks popping left jab missing so much also takes the shine of punches dmhe does actually land maybe. Agression and control in Usyks favor yes but the I feel Breidis just landed better and more often.

I thought an awful lot of Breidis punches were blocked by Usyk's good guard. He landed some lovely punches, but I'd wager that Usyk landed more.

walshb

Rob Brant

normanoffside wrote: »

Remember Breidis vs Charr ( the WBA Heavyweight regular Champ)

I remember it...

Still reckon it’s quite unlikely that Breidis, an average sized CW would be close to any kind of threat to the big natural talented HWs...

Same for Usyk, who is a big CW. The best HWs would brutalize him..

normanoffside

Avni Yildirim

walshb wrote: »

I remember it...

Still reckon it’s quite unlikely that Breidis, an average sized CW would be close to any kind of threat to the big natural talented HWs...

Same for Usyk, who is a big CW. The best HWs would brutalize him..

Who are these 'Best HWs' though?
Barring Joshua who is out there?
Boxrec have Povetkin ranked#2 behind AJ. Would these boys really be that far behind a (non-Juiced) 220-230lb Povetkin?

selectamatic

Mairis Briedis

normanoffside wrote: »

Who are these 'Best HWs' though?
Barring Joshua who is out there?
Boxrec have Povetkin ranked#2 behind AJ. Would these boys really be that far behind a (non-Juiced) 220-230lb Povetkin?

Hard answer that really as the likes of povetkin, wach etc. Are at the stage where they can age overnight as the cliché goes.

Wach was a shadow of himself in that last fight against Miller so it's hard know how a decent cruiser would do in a similar situation.

That said a few posters on here who reckoned usyk had a right to be smiling while watching the Joshua Takam fight would wanna take their head out of the clouds.

Cruisers can absolutely make the jump but it's not something that can happen instantaneously.

Urindanger

Very few Heavyweights if any could stick with the pace the two lads last night kept. Joshua would be blowing out his arse after three or four rounds trying to chase down Usyk last night. Usyk's movement and ability to box on the outside and avoid the inside work is very good and will be something different to the usual plodding. You see what Tyson Fury could do with his movement and boxing ability.

If prime Marco Huck went up to Heavyweight and got robbed vs Povetkin, then Usyk, Briedis, Dorticos and Gassiev can be contenders at HW at the very least.

NollagShona

Watching this fight today- heard it was a cracker

walshb

Rob Brant

AJ is 6 feet 6 and 250 lbs. Why would he need to chase Usyk anywhere? Usyk to win, has to get in range, has to throw shots. Once there he gets in range he gets hit and knocked clean out..

This pace? What about it? No use to Usyk when he’s flat on his back the second he gets hit clean. And he will not avoid getting hit clean..

Morrison J

Avni Yildirim

Just caught up with it. Very good fight between two very good fighters but the right guy definitely won for me. Thought Usyk's jab was the main differentiator really.

1. Briedis
2. Usyk
3. Briedis
4. Briedis
5. Usyk
6. Usyk
7. Usyk
8. Usyk
9. Briedis
10. Usyk
11. Usyk
12. Usyk

116-112 Usyk.

Really like Usyk. Fights anyone, anywhere without fuss. Proper champion.

titan18

walshb wrote: »

AJ is 6 feet 6 and 250 lbs. Why would he need to chase Usyk anywhere? Usyk to win, has to get in range, has to throw shots. Once there he gets in range he gets hit and knocked clean out..

This pace? What about it? No use to Usyk when he’s flat on his back the second he gets hit clean. And he will not avoid getting hit clean..

Whilst I think Joshua would win, he struggled a bit against Takam. Usyk is taller than Takam, Breidis has a similar reach to Takam and the same height, and both Usyk and Breidis are far more talented, so I don't think it's a clear cut Joshua win as you're suggesting, and that's just Joshua. Usyk beats everyone else in that division with the potential exception of Wilder (even though I'd favour Usyk there)

I mean Haye moved up and was a contender and HW champion, Usyk is a better CW than Haye was imo, and they're both similar sized.

blade1

titan18 wrote: »

Whilst I think Joshua would win, he struggled a bit against Takam. Usyk is taller than Takam, Breidis has a similar reach to Takam and the same height, and both Usyk and Breidis are far more talented, so I don't think it's a clear cut Joshua win as you're suggesting, and that's just Joshua. Usyk beats everyone else in that division with the potential exception of Wilder (even though I'd favour Usyk there)

I mean Haye moved up and was a contender and HW champion, Usyk is a better CW than Haye was imo, and they're both similar sized.

I don't think Joshua struggled against Takam at all.
Takam done well but there was always only going to be one winner.

walshb

Rob Brant

Takam is a career HW. Big man overall size. Usyk I don’t think is remotely comparable in terms of size and styles, nor Breidis, who is not even that big at CW..

Sure, either could beat average run of the mill heavies, but strong and big and heavy handed HWs IMO would pose serious risks to both..

walshb

Rob Brant

titan18 wrote: »

Whilst I think Joshua would win, he struggled a bit against Takam. Usyk is taller than Takam, Breidis has a similar reach to Takam and the same height, and both Usyk and Breidis are far more talented, so I don't think it's a clear cut Joshua win as you're suggesting, and that's just Joshua. Usyk beats everyone else in that division with the potential exception of Wilder (even though I'd favour Usyk there)

I mean Haye moved up and was a contender and HW champion, Usyk is a better CW than Haye was imo, and they're both similar sized.

Haye and Usyk are not remotely similar in terms of styles. Haye was an explosive puncher who could drop and really hurt HWs. Usyk is a boxer mover worker. Haye had IMO the kind of style and traits to transition better to HW.. heavy hands, elusive and awkward..and a decent enough size..

selectamatic

Mairis Briedis

Usyk and breidis being compared to takam is exactly the type of head in the clouds talk I was referring to earlier.

17 stone Takam who looked in fantastic shape at the weight; abs visable, arms pumped, a neck on him like a Belgium blue bull and a block of a head. This build of a man isn't in any way shape or form similar to a current cruiserweight.

Also talent at one weight doesn't transfer seamlessly to the other.

titan18

selectamatic wrote: »

Usyk and breidis being compared to takam is exactly the type of head in the clouds talk I was referring to earlier.

17 stone Takam who looked in fantastic shape at the weight; abs visable, arms pumped, a neck on him like a Belgium blue bull and a block of a head. This build of a man isn't in any way shape or form similar to a current cruiserweight.

Also talent at one weight doesn't transfer seamlessly to the other.

Takam is a similar height. It's not like Usyk isn't going to put on weight if he went to HW. He's clearly got the build to put on weight as there are guys of a similar or smaller height to him at HW. Parker is only a few cms taller and with a similar reach, and is only marginally bigger than Usyk's reported walking around weight. He fought and beat Super HWs in the amateurs (Joe Joyce for one who went and won silver in Olympics), so clearly has the skills to fight bigger guys, and he's a far higher skilled boxer than anyone at the HW division.

selectamatic

Mairis Briedis

The thing is I don't fully disagree with you nor do I think it'd be impossible.

However I do disagree with the notion that it'd be easy which seems to be implied by the blasé way in which many refer to this possible situation.

There are so many variables and just looking at it from a height and reach perspective is far too simplistic.

How does one make the jump from circa 14-15 stone to 16-17 stone in a relatively short space of time without any negative impacts.

Generally speaking:
Cardio suffers
Speed suffers
Movement suffers

And that's before we get into the nitty gritty of things like whether his power, chin, guard, clinchwork and shot accuracy would transfer sufficiently to deal with natural and seasoned HW's.

walshb

Rob Brant

Usyk is the perfect height for an AJ or Wilder to smash through...

Like to see Bellew in against him. Be a good clash of styles, with Bellew having a very decent fight changing type dig on him.. yes, Usyk would be favorite, but it would be interesting to see what would happen when Bellew lands flush..

walshb

Rob Brant

I didn’t think they actually fought as amateurs? Sparred, yes. Bellew spoke about this. He’s hugely impressed with Usyk, but does say that it could be interesting because you can nail him. That was my point. Bellew has very decent CW power. Anyway, Usyk a deserved favorite. I just think it would be a great clash of styles.

Urindanger

Bellew got slapped around by Adonis Stevenson and somehow luck boxed his way to beating peg leg David Haye and struggled to even stop in until late in the fight when Haye's achilles was pure spaghetti and could no longer stand. And his CW title win was pretty lucky as well, fighting an interim instead of the actual champ. Him beating any of the top 4 CWs would be one of the upsets of the decade. He's a horrendous over achiever in the sport.

normanoffside

Avni Yildirim

walshb wrote: »

Sure, either could beat average run of the mill heavies, but strong and big and heavy handed HWs IMO would pose serious risks to both..

As I said, apart from AJ (who I agree probably beats all of these CWs) which HWs dominate the top Cruisers?

If the CW limit had stayed at 189lbs most of these guys would be fighting at a natural 210-220lbs which was always big enough to compete at heavyweight.

walshb

Rob Brant

normanoffside wrote: »

As I said, apart from AJ (who I agree probably beats all of these CWs) which HWs dominate the top Cruisers?

If the CW limit had stayed at 189lbs most of these guys would be fighting at a natural 210-220lbs which was always big enough to compete at heavyweight.

Wilder KOs all them as soon as he lands...and he will land...

normanoffside

Avni Yildirim

Bellew says he'll go back to CW to fight the WBSS winner
http://www.bbc.com/sport/boxing/42871431

nacho libre

Avni Yildirim

I don't see Uysk being a force at heavyweight. He doesn't seem to have great power, which he will need at Heavyweight. He is a skillfull fighter, but when he gets tagged by the likes of Joshua and Wilder i doubt he will able to take it.

nacho libre

Avni Yildirim

pac_man wrote: »

Gassiev and Dorticos this weekend. It should be another cracker.

Who do you think will win?

nacho libre

Avni Yildirim

pac_man wrote: »

Leaning towards Gassiev. He's more compact and seems less open. It helps that it's in Russia. It's hard to know how good of a boxer Dorticos is. He went life and death with Kalenga who would be around European level. I can't read too much into that win against Kudryashov. Kudryashov is just a puncher. Who do you fancy?

It's Gassiev for me too. I think Dorticos will struggle to land clean punches on him.

walshb

Rob Brant

Anyone purchased the Groves-Eubank fight?

I just did. 19.95 Euro. Register online account for ITV box office first and then purchase the fight depending on your tv platform. Sky channel 493

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/boxing/0/watch-groves-vs-eubank-jr-fight-tv-channel-live-stream-details/

normanoffside

Avni Yildirim

Dorticos vs Gassiev is on ITV4 tomorrow starting at 6:45pm.
Russian time is 3 hours ahead so the Main event should be on a little ahead of normal (maybe 9pm?)

normanoffside

Avni Yildirim

I just watched the Dorticos Kalenga fight for the first time.

Dorticos is very hittable but he seems to hold a lot of great attributes namely:
Great Engine
Teak tough Chin
Great power which he carries late into the fight.

Has Gassiev's chin been properly tested? Any signs of weakness?
I think Dorrticos' only chance is by KO but if Gassiev proves to be as tough as him then Gassiev should win easy enough.

megadodge

nacho libre wrote: »

It's Gassiev for me too. I think Dorticos will struggle to land clean punches on him.

I'm interested in why you think that.

Gassiev is not exactly renowned for his defense. He's as straight-forward a fighter as you'll get. In my eyes he's a poor man's Golovkin.

He is tremendously strong and seems to have a good chin, but his workrate is nothing special and there are question marks over his stamina. He's not particularly skilful and he's facing a Cuban!!

I'm not saying he has no chance, but I think people are overrating Gassiev in a big way. I think he has a puncher's chance, but I'm with Dorticos here.