What do you look for in New tenants?

AlmightyCushion

davo10 wrote: »

Is there a bank paying worthwhile interest now? If there is, after tax, it would be a couple of Euro a year.

Who says they'd leave it in a bank? They could put it in their pension where it is instantly worth far more than the €4000 they'd be giving the landlord or they could invest it.

davindub

davindub wrote: »

Bit naive really.

WRC is fairly effective at what they do, to the point of ruthlessness. This goes for equal status acts and employment cases, so in my opinion, the bigger risk would be defending a equal status act rather than ending up with a bad tenant. After the press surrounding the last award, 30k+, you will see a lot more testing of the waters.

Unless you tell the tenant blatantly to their face they are being refused for hap or any of the other grounds then they have no case so you have no worries about the wrc.

I would be breaching more than 2/9 grounds if I was picking tenants but I would of course be keeping my real reasons in my head and giving allowed reasons for not taking tenants.

The simplest one as I've always said is always have given someone else "first refusal" even when meeting your first perspective tenant then you have your perfectly legimate reason for refusing anyone you want, the place was taken by the first person who viewed.

Snoopy1 wrote: »

This is ridiculous. Who has the money.for 3 months. Its hard enough for some people to pay the month deposit and month upfront, as rents are so high now.
Also this isnt nyc its ireland

A large number of people will have far far in excess of 6k at their disposal. Anyone who is saving for a house deposit will need multiples of this for example.

_Dara_

davo10 wrote: »

Is there a bank paying worthwhile interest now? If there is, after tax, it would be a couple of Euro a year.

Lots of people care about earning bank interest on their savings. Or they could invest it. And it’s a lot of hard-earned cash that many people would like to see in their own savings account. Having lots of savings doesn’t mean you are any more happy to hand it over to a landlord. And with no proper deposit-holding scheme in Ireland (where the tenant can still earn interest), it’s an even less attractive prospect. Handing 6k over to an amateur landlord? No thanks.

__..__

davindub wrote: »

You are recommending breaching 2 of 9 listed grounds grounds of the equal status act.

All it really takes is someone to bring a case, the questions you ask can be used to determine discrimination.

Using the RTB database is equally unwise, after 13 years, you will find a lot of names, but no other identifying information.

You dont ask the questions.
Tenants already know what to tell a landlord about themselves to out themselves to the top of the list and will offer that info without being asked.
If you dont get answers to all of the questions you cant ask volunteered by a tenant on first contact then you move on.

davo10

Snoopy1 wrote: »

I rented my last place for 5 years. If I was looking again I certainly would not be able to afford 3 minths rent in one go as I lived on my own. I also woukdnt have a clue who my last landlords prior to that were.
But I also know I am an incredibly good tennant. Rent plus bills payed on time, also kept the place in great condition.
Just because I dont have excessive funds or the paperwork, does not mean I woukd leave you high and dry. In fact the opposite, ive been ripped off by so many landlords

Snoopy, you wouldn't know if a LL is going to rip you off when you view a property, just like the LL won't know just by meeting you if you are a good/bad tenant. But because it is so difficult to dislodge a bad tenant and there are so many taking advantage of the RTB to raise vexatious dispute claims, LL must mitigate the risk in any way they can. That includes getting as much info about the tenant and as much of a deposit/rent in advance as possible. You will be paying rent and benefiting from use of the property, the LL has a lot more at stake, a valuable asset with a mortgage which must be paid.

__..__

_Dara_ wrote: »

I wouldn’t have a notion how to contact anyone but my last landlord. I don’t even know if I have her details, to be honest. Who keeps note of the contact details of the landlord they had two or three rentals ago?

You really should find out, because if you move soon you will severely limit your opportunities if you dont have these.

davindub

davo10 wrote: »

Ok, I thought I was clear, but maybe I wasn't clear enough. The LL does not ask, the tenant will give that info. The LL should never say they do not accept HAP, that would be discrimination as per the WRC ruling.

You know very well, in the recent WRC case the LL blatantly refused to accept HAP and stupidly informed the tenants. LL do not want to have to deal with HAP/RAS but should under no circumstances inform the tenant that they are refusing it, now that would be naive.

No the landlord refused to sign the forms for sitting tenants. But you can treat this as only one case, but the motivation for others to pursue claims now as well.

Anyway, you can look at the WRC cases yourself, there are 8 other grounds aside from the housing assistance ground (recently inserted) so worth seeing how they adjudicate complaint on those, you will find a lot of cases refer to a single ground, also you can look at their interpretations of other legislation, if you are an employer, you will know them, you don't want to end up there.

davo10

_Dara_ wrote: »

Handing 6k over to an amateur landlord? No thanks.

Dara if that is what the LL is asking, then you won't get the property and someone else most assuredly will.

__..__

Snoopy1 wrote: »

I rented my last place for 5 years. If I was looking again I certainly would not be able to afford 3 minths rent in one go as I lived on my own. I also woukdnt have a clue who my last landlords prior to that were.
But I also know I am an incredibly good tennant. Rent plus bills payed on time, also kept the place in great condition.
Just because I dont have excessive funds or the paperwork, does not mean I woukd leave you high and dry. In fact the opposite, ive been ripped off by so many landlords

A prospective landlord simply cant take the chance on believing a good word your current landlord says about you. There is simply too much risk nowadays to leave themselves open to it.

davo10

davindub wrote: »

No the landlord refused to sign the forms for sitting tenants. But you can treat this as only one case, but the motivation for others to pursue claims now as well.

Anyway, you can look at the WRC cases yourself, there are 8 other grounds aside from the housing assistance ground (recently inserted) so worth seeing how they adjudicate complaint on those, you will find a lot of cases refer to a single ground, also you can look at their interpretations of other legislation, if you are an employer, you will know them, you don't want to end up there.

I understand the point you are making, we all do.

_Dara_

__..__ wrote: »

You really should find out, because if you move soon you will severely limit your opportunities if you dont have these.

Think about this for a second. You meet a prospective tenant who ticks all the boxes... except they don’t have the contact details for one of their previous landlords. So easily that can happen. You turn them down because of it. Your next choice is less perfect but has all the landlord contact details you request. You go with them because of that. That makes the kind of sense that doesn’t.

__..__

_Dara_ wrote: »

Lots of people care about earning bank interest on their savings. Or they could invest it. And it’s a lot of hard-earned cash that many people would like to see in their own savings account. Having lots of savings doesn’t mean you are any more happy to hand it over to a landlord. And with no proper deposit-holding scheme in Ireland (where the tenant can still earn interest), it’s an even less attractive prospect. Handing 6k over to an amateur landlord? No thanks.

Your prerogative of course.
Nobody would force you to hand it over if you dont want to.

Fol20

Goat the dote wrote: »

I might have to leave the family home with my son and our dog and this really worries me. I'd be a HAP tenant, and would not take the piss but it seems to be so hard to get someone who will accept both HAP and a dog. It's a non shedding housetrained dog.
One lady I text just responded that the property was gone, yet renewed it on daft less than a week later

I’m afraid you have a double whammy. I wouldn’t want pets more so than HAP and tbh if your renting, people should have dogs and cats as nearly all landlords in Ireland don’t want pets in their property. It’s for good reasons as well. Animals can do a lot of damage to everything. One of my tenants who I had to get rid of hid pets in the house when I checked the place. After he moved out. He left a mound of poop in the back behind the shed, scratch’s on the bottom of doors and couches etc. this couple with HAP will make it extremely difficult unless your looking for a dive of a place that no one wants. If you look at it from their point of view. One tenant, might be a working professional, no kids,no dogs, no HAP vs all of those. Based on the above it’s a no brained if both candidates are the same in everything else

Ultimate Seduction

My current landlord told me flat out when I emailed him about the house, that he won't accept any rent allowance, HAP or RAS.

Can I sue for discrimination? I still have the email..

_Dara_

davo10 wrote: »

Dara if that is what the LL is asking, then you won't get the property and someone else most assuredly will.

Yup, I’m aware. We’d be mutually happy with the situation. You could miss out on very financially secure, excellent tenants because of the demand though. (People who are shrewd with their money know how best to make it work for them) Totally up to you of course.

_Dara_

__..__ wrote: »

Your prerogative of course.
Nobody would force you to hand it over if you dont want to.

Obviously.

__..__

_Dara_ wrote: »

Think about this for a second. You meet a prospective tenant who ticks all the boxes... except they don’t have the contact details for one of their previous landlords. So easily that can happen. You turn them down because of it. Your next choice is less perfect but has all the landlord contact details you request. You go with them because of that. That makes the kind of sense that doesn’t.

Well they couldnt have ticked all the boxes as I dont have enough to go on.
My first and biggest box to be ticked is an abundance of good experiences and zero bad experiences with their previous landlords.
I could have missed out on a saint alright. But always better not to bet either way. Just go on as much info as you can get and make your choice based on that. If the info isnt there to settle my mind, i move on. Nobody fault. Just a lack of info to come to form a solid picture.

__..__

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

My current landlord told me flat out when I emailed him about the house, that he won't accept any rent allowance, HAP or RAS.

Can I sue for discrimination? I still have the email..

What a silly landlord tbh.

davo10

_Dara_ wrote: »

Yup, I’m aware. We’d be mutually happy with the situation. You could miss out on very financially secure, excellent tenants because of the demand though. (People who are shrewd with their money know how best to make it work for them) Totally up to you of course.

That's the nature of risk, no matter how much you guard against it, there is no guarantee that things won't go wrong.

Dial Hard

Ultimate Seduction wrote:

My current landlord told me flat out when I emailed him about the house, that he won't accept any rent allowance, HAP or RAS.

Can I sue for discrimination? I still have the email..

How exactly did he discriminate against you if you're living there???

Ultimate Seduction

__..__ wrote:

What a silly landlord tbh.

I was joking about sueing him, but what are the consequences if someone was to take some kind of action?

_Dara_

Realistically you are cutting out a huge swathe of people there by asking for numerous landlord references compared to other checks you can do. It’s a very blunt tool. I imagine a landlord would be also be surprised to get a call about a tenant from several years ago. “Who?” would be the likely response.

the_pen_turner

_Dara_ wrote: »

Think about this for a second. You meet a prospective tenant who ticks all the boxes... except they don’t have the contact details for one of their previous landlords. So easily that can happen. You turn them down because of it. Your next choice is less perfect but has all the landlord contact details you request. You go with them because of that. That makes the kind of sense that doesn’t.

I think the point is that if you have been renting for 10 years and say your a perfect tenant but can only back it up with references for 2 years that is only worth 2 years , the other 8 years is a big question mark. too many potential bad reasons for the missing years

someone else has references for all 5 years they have been renting . even if they all say they are good but not as perfect as you . their full picture is worth more than your patchy but perfect history

I know I would go for the second person.

__..__

_Dara_ wrote: »

Realistically you are cutting out a huge swathe of people there compared to other checks you can do. It’s a very blunt tool. I imagine a landlord would be also be surprised to get a call about a tenant from several years ago. “Who?” would be the likely response.

Of course you would be cutting the numbers. Thats the point of getting all the info. So you can cut the numbers and choose the one you you trust has the least risk.
If I got a "Who?" response, that would be a major red flag and I would cut right then and there and move on to the next person.

_Dara_

__..__ wrote: »

Of course you would be cutting the numbers. Thats the point of getting all the info. So you can cut the numbers and choose the one you you trust has the least risk.
If I got a "Who?" response, that would be a major red flag and I would cut right then and there and move on to the next person.

But, like, cutting the numbers to your detriment. Who retains information about the landlord they had three rentals ago? Very few, I would imagine. So it genuinely seems like you’d be shooting yourself in the foot here. Kinda makes me think there’s a such a thing as being way too cautious. I mean, knock yourself out, but I can’t see it as a useful decider at all. A “who?” response at the mention of a former tenant would tell me nothing. If anything, it would tell me that they we’re inoffensive and didn’t put a foot wrong. Not being memorable, not such a bad thing in a former tenant.

_Dara_

_Dara_ wrote: »

Think about this for a second. You meet a prospective tenant who ticks all the boxes... except they don’t have the contact details for one of their previous landlords. So easily that can happen. You turn them down because of it. Your next choice is less perfect but has all the landlord contact details you request. You go with them because of that. That makes the kind of sense that doesn’t.

You move to the next tenant and the next tenant until you find one who ticks all the boxes and can provide all the paper work you want.

_Dara_

Ismael Thankful Clip wrote: »

You move to the next tenant and the next tenant until you find one who ticks all the boxes and can provide all the paper work you want.

And by doing so, you might not end up with the best tenant. Turning down someone with good financials, good references from previous and work and who you just get a good feeling about (very important) because they don’t have contact details for someone they rented from five years ago? Really?

My point is, being a total jobsworth about your “checks” could see you missing out on a great tenant.

davo10

_Dara_ wrote: »

But, like, cutting the numbers to your detriment. Who retains information about the landlord they had three rentals ago? Very few, I would imagine. So it genuinely seems like you’d be shooting yourself in the foot here. Kinda makes me think there’s a such a thing as being way too cautious. I mean, knock yourself out, but I can’t see it as a useful decider at all. A “who?” response at the mention of a former tenant would tell me nothing. If anything, it would tell me that they we’re inoffensive and didn’t put a foot wrong. Not being memorable, not such a bad thing in a former tenant.

Most tenants are good Dara, there is a high probability that the next person is just as good as you, has the references and the money. But some tenants, and indeed landlords, are bad, you cannot blame LLs for trying to find out as much as possible before letting their property.

Dara the reality is that some landlords will ask for more references/money than others, you refusal to agree to either just means you will not be considered for those properties. Given the dearth of good properties available and the large numbers looking for them, unfortunately it is you who is limiting your scope.

_Dara_

Davo, will ya stop dramatically repeating that I’d be cutting myself out of running for places? I realise that. Big deal. I’ve never had a problem finding rentals in all kinds of markets.

I just think some of the checks are a bit daft.

davo10

_Dara_ wrote: »

Davo, will ya stop dramatically repeating that I’d be cutting myself out of running for places? I realise that. Big deal. I’ve never had a problem finding rental in all kinds of markets.

All those reports of property shortages must be wrong, fake news maybe.