30 Youths go on rampage

realdanbreen

Kaylani Mammoth Cranberry wrote: »

complex family environment, do me a favour

this is scummers acting like scum, destroying private property, and you want to talk about "complex family environments" - nothing about restitution for the people out of pocket no? Nothing about them? Probably their own fault for parking cars in areas where there are "complex family environments".

Jesus christ, excusing these idiots their actions is the absolute root of the problem. Zero accountability, and flimsy excuses like "complex family environments".

They are fúcking scum, lock them up, take their dole.

Exactly! Nothing 'complex' about it. These fukkers and their fathers before them push every law and loophole to the edge and still are regarded by some as victims. And yes I know that some assholes in suits sitting behind desks do the same thing but lets try and address each situation on its own.

Wheeliebin30

Foxhound38 wrote: »

The comments on the Adrian Kennedy facebook thread about this are amazing. Beyond the usual "they are just poor confused lovees" and "I suppose you were never young" shyte, one person is blaming the EU for it

Just waiting for da banks and Leo.

jmayo

DrumSteve wrote: »

They would be right to aswell, because we dont live in a police state.

Ever been to Singapore ?

Very clean, no junkies hanging around, no beggers, where anti-social behaviour is minimal.
And guess what they have managed to have multiple races, multiple religions co-existing in one small tight space with minimal problems.

Their idea of anti social behaviour is choping or hogging seats using tissues as markers so no one else can use them.

I have always favoured the Singaporean justice system where scrots like these guys in Dublin are caned.

In 2010, a Swiss national, Oliver Fricker, pleaded guilty to charges of trespassing into a Mass Rapid Transit depot and spray-painting a train with an accomplice, and was sentenced to five months' jail and three strokes of the cane. On appeal, the High Court increased his total jail term to seven months.

Now that is a proper justice system.

BTW here is what they term anti-social behaviour:

being rude to members of the public
abandoning cars
arson
begging
breaking the peace
casteism
defecating/urinating in public
disturbance
drug dealing/consumption of controlled recreational drugs
drunken behaviour
fare evasion
homophobia
intimidation
littering/fly tipping/dog fouling
loitering
noise pollution
racism
rioting
spitting
stealing/mugging/shoplifting
urban exploration
vandalism/criminal damage

s15r330

Kaylani Mammoth Cranberry wrote: »

complex family environment, do me a favour

this is scummers acting like scum, destroying private property, and you want to talk about "complex family environments" - nothing about restitution for the people out of pocket no? Nothing about them? Probably their own fault for parking cars in areas where there are "complex family environments".

Jesus christ, excusing these idiots their actions is the absolute root of the problem. Zero accountability, and flimsy excuses like "complex family environments".

They are fúcking scum, lock them up, take their dole.

Exactly this.

I dunno who is worse, the scumbags or the soft dikheads defending them.

kylith

kylith wrote: »

As do I. I'd go so far as to jail the parents for the kid's actions if they themselves are too young for jail. You want to be a little shít? Say goodbye to daddy for the next 3 years.

You can't simply pick another family member to punish for a crime.

The legal system here and in many countries simply doesn't allow for substitutes to take the fall.

dd972

They're always going on about how high this country is on the HDI index and all other sorts of quality of life tables yet it doesn't chime with all the f**ing idiots and twats it produces, was in Strasbourg a few months back and if someone was behaving like that there they'd be carted off, put in a straight jacket and signed up to a shrink.

pilly

jmayo wrote: »

Ever been to Singapore ?

Very clean, no junkies hanging around, no beggers, where anti-social behaviour is minimal.
And guess what they have managed to have multiple races, multiple religions co-existing in one small tight space with minimal problems.

Their idea of anti social behaviour is choping or hogging seats using tissues as markers so no one else can use them.

I have always favoured the Singaporean justice system where scrots like these guys in Dublin are caned.



Now that is a proper justice system.

BTW here is what they term anti-social behaviour:

Yeah because 3 strokes of a cane would frighten the life out of them.

kylith

Wanderer78 wrote: »

would it solve anything?

You never know. It might make people think twice about raising vicious little scrotes if they'll be held accountable for their actions.

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

Nobody is saying to give them a hug - that's a false argument. But whataboutery and deflection (such as getting bothered by things said on the internet moreso than the appalling incident itself) just look obtuse.

They are the way they are, though, because of a sh*t upbringing and environment. That's not an excuse - it's just recognition of a reason. If they didn't have such an upbringing, they would be much less likely to behave in such a way. I know there are exceptions (people who have experienced such an awful upbringing don't always turn out to be thugs, and people who have a good upbringing can turn out to be thugs) but generally speaking, it does apply.

They are still little scumbags who are responsible for their own actions and deserve to be punished, but tackling the roots of the problem is needed too, in my opinion. For starters, people should have to get a job and training. They simply should have to.

There is too much acceptance of people having a ludicrous sense of entitlement also. Embodied by Murphy, Coppinger, SF, etc, which is a huge part of this problem too.

the purple tin

Who the hell has 29 friends? Very strange to see a gang of yoots even into double figures.

RoboRat

Dig a large pit, size of a football pitch. Throw all the scummers in and let them fight to the death... last man standing scenario. When you have the last man, shoot him in the head.

Problem solved, you could also sell seats for a €10,000 a seat x 80,000 (if run in Croker) = 800 million. run this annually for 10 years and we raise €8 billion and we can start eating into our national debt all whilst cutting welfare, medical, prison costs.

CucaFace

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

Nobody is saying to give them a hug - that's a false argument. But whataboutery and deflection (such as getting bothered by things said on the internet moreso than the appalling incident itself) just look obtuse.

They are the way they are, though, because of a sh*t upbringing and environment. That's not an excuse - it's just recognition of a reason. If they didn't have such an upbringing, they would be much less likely to behave in such a way. I know there are exceptions (people who have experienced such an awful upbringing don't always turn out to be thugs, and people who have a good upbringing can turn out to be thugs) but generally speaking, it does apply.

They are still little scumbags who are responsible for their own actions and deserve to be punished, but tackling the roots of the problem is needed too, in my opinion. For starters, people should have to get a job and training. They simply should have to.

There is too much acceptance of people having a ludicrous sense of entitlement also. Embodied by Murphy, Coppinger, SF, etc, which is a huge part of this problem also, imo.

I couldn't agree more. And in fact I think this is actually one of the biggest issues this country has, but nobody is really talking about it and nobody wants to address it.

The housing issue right now is actually a direct consequence of this issue. How many social houses are being taken by these lifers who will never do anything but cause problems and reproduce even worse offspring who also as soon as possible play the system for what they can get from it?

The state here has been actively sponsoring fatherless children for a few generations now , and its led to the creation of a race of feral humans. I'm sorry how harsh that sounds, but its the actual truth. We make it financially beneficial to have kids on your own so that you get a free house, and all the other free benefits that go with it. Children need loving happy homes in order to become happy, normal and useful citizens. From what I can see going on around me here in Dublin 1 a lot are not getting this. I'm not saying that a single mother cannot raise children in a good way and give them good ideals, but its far easier to do this in a stable home with 2 parents who actually care about their kids (and don't just have them in order to get benefits which I think which is what happens a lot in certain area's). It would be far easier to pass on good ideals if at least one of their parents were working and were not just looking to take from the social all their lives.

The problem is how can a child who got no love and care do anything different as a parent themselves? But yet they will probably have a child at the age of 16/17 when they are still kids themselves, in order to get themselves on the 'social welfare' ladder and the cycle just gets worse and worse and we are seeing this today in the behaviour of people around the cities.

How to solve this is going to be very difficult, but until we actually admit we have a big problem with this (ie the creation of a feral race of people who only take take take) it will just continue to grow out of proportion.

Maybe compulsory after school care with people who will try and give these kids some care (where the parents do not receive social welfare and child allowance benefits unless they attend) would help to start.

jmayo

pilly wrote: »

Yeah because 3 strokes of a cane would frighten the life out of them.

It does work in Singapore.
BTW don't think it is akin to what teachers used to do in Irish schools or what some British politicians pay certain ladies to carry out.

Some prisoners ask for longer sentences rather than get caned.
The descriptions by people having been caned say the affects last for weeks and going to the toilet can involve pain because basically their rear has been badly bruised.
And they can be left with scars.

And how about the 6/7 months in prison.

Wanderer78

kylith wrote:

You never know. It might make people think twice about raising vicious little scrotes if they'll be held accountable for their actions.

Highly unlikely I'd imagine, life isn't that straight forward, but I'd say some do also believe this

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

then do what with them?

Re-educate them. Give them practical employable skills, and introduce to them the very valid reasons for not behaving this way, and gradually reintroduce them into society, far away from their previous friends/family. Put them on a trial/probationary period, and if they behave well, the past is wiped clean. If not, hit them with a work camp prison sentence for 10-15 years.

Education is key here. Providing proper skills/knowledge for them to get out of the slum mentality. And the chance for their past crimes to be forgiven. If they choose not to accept that chance, then they've made that choice and can be treated as pure scum.

But IMHO we don't have an effective system for dealing with life criminals now. Treating youths as Criminals won't work either. But a genuine effort to educate them and remove the environment that encourages them to behave this way.

And prevent the parents of those children from having more kids. Obviously, they're not suitable parents and shouldn't be creating such messes. No need to fine them money. Just remove their rights to have children until 1) they're financially capable of providing the needs without government support, and 2) that they pass an educational examination on child/teen psychology, biology, etc.

We need to get past this idea that everyone can have kids without considering the costs involved. Raising children is expensive.. and secondly, we need to be able to provide people from every area the ability to upskill to be employable. Not teaching Hamlet, Religious studies, or other rubbish. Actual employable skills from primary school right through to Leaving certificate. Shift away from this idea that University/college is necessary since degrees are generally a waste of time for actual practical knowledge.

Give options. Because right now, there are very few options for most people. Our schools train people for jobs that are either already saturated with people or for jobs that are gradually being phased out by technology/automation.

And lastly, bring back reasonable & manageable corporal punishment. Full freedom to batter children was wrong. We all know that. But completely banning physical punishment is also wrong. Surely, we can find something in the middle.

Wanderer78

Deleted User wrote:

Re-educate them. Give them practical employable skills, and introduce to them the very valid reasons for not behaving this way, and gradually reintroduce them into society, far away from their previous friends/family. Put them on a trial/probationary period, and if they behave well, the past is wiped clean. If not, hit them with a work camp prison sentence for 10-15 years.

Wow, that's pretty scary stuff! I 'll try respond later

brevity

If the parents cannot control them, mandatory curfews or send them into the army for a year.

That sort of behaviour is unacceptable and there needs to be accountability.

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Wow, that's pretty scary stuff! I 'll try respond later

I don't mean it to sound like indoctrination or mental reprogramming.

brevity wrote: »

If the parents cannot control them, mandatory curfews or send them into the army for a year.

That sort of behaviour is unacceptable and there needs to be accountability.

A military school type place with that strict organisational and role-driven attitude sure. But not the army... I wouldn't be interested in giving people arrested for violence, better training in, well, violence.

MadYaker

Yet more evidence as to why I'm better off not living in Dublin. Imagine paying €600 a month for a single room and having this going on outside your gaf. Everytime I visit Dublin I dislike it more. Id rather emigrate than live there.

cbreeze

direstraits wrote: »

****ers probably only crawled out of bed at 4in the afternoon, no wonder they have energy to smash cars up. Stop their benefits and ban them from JD sports. That will teach them

Make them collect their benefits between 9 and 10 in the morning - no show no dough!

CucaFace

Deleted User wrote: »

Re-educate them. Give them practical employable skills, and introduce to them the very valid reasons for not behaving this way, and gradually reintroduce them into society, far away from their previous friends/family. Put them on a trial/probationary period, and if they behave well, the past is wiped clean. If not, hit them with a work camp prison sentence for 10-15 years.

Education is key here. Providing proper skills/knowledge for them to get out of the slum mentality. And the chance for their past crimes to be forgiven. If they choose not to accept that chance, then they've made that choice and can be treated as pure scum.

.

Unless they are got very early in life, I think the damage is not repairable. The only solution in my opinion is to not allow another generation after this to start in the same way. How you do this is well.... very hard to achieve.

pxdf9i5cmoavkz

These are not feral children, they're a 'young person in conflict with the law'.

I'm in full support for severe punishment of anti-social behaviour. It has to be done properly or it'll get the leftist hippies bleating about how it's not their fault but society's fault for letting them slip through the cracks or some such nonsense.

One of the problems is the cost us Taxpayers have to endure while they are being "repatriated" into society.

My solution is then as follows:

1. Fine the parents a percentage of their yearly income. Dole or otherwise.
2. A month of jail time to cool off. It's important that they have nothing to do and are bored.
3. Follow this up with a couple of months worth of manual labour to clean up the area and surrounding areas they vandalized.
4. Back to prison where they can watch their cleanup work slowly be defiled by others.
5. Release.

This way we get a cleaner city and don't have to pay labour costs for a private contractor.

Peatys

MadYaker wrote: »

Yet more evidence as to why I'm better off not living in Dublin. Imagine paying €600 a month for a single room and having this going on outside your gaf. Everytime I visit Dublin I dislike it more. Id rather emigrate than live there.

Ah, don't be afraid. My kids and grannies have lived here no bother. This makes the news because its unusual.

CucaFace

Deleted User wrote: »

And prevent the parents of those children from having more kids. Obviously, they're not suitable parents and shouldn't be creating such messes. No need to fine them money. Just remove their rights to have children until 1) they're financially capable of providing the needs without government support, and 2) that they pass an educational examination on child/teen psychology, biology, etc.

We need to get past this idea that everyone can have kids without considering the costs involved.

I think this is correct and the only way to solve this issue. You need a license to own a dog, but to have a kid.......

osarusan

CucaFace wrote: »

I think this is correct and the only way to solve this issue. You need a license to own a dog, but to have a kid.......

How do you envisage stopping them from having kids? Are you talking about making a pregnancy impossible? or removing the infant from them? Or something else?

s15r330

osarusan wrote: »

How do you envisage stopping them from having kids? Are you talking about making a pregnancy impossible? or removing the infant from them? Or something else?

Forced sterilisation might be a good call.
Eradicate the next generation of scum and also do the world a favour by helping to solve over population. Win win!

CucaFace

osarusan wrote: »

How do you envisage stopping them from having kids? Are you talking about making a pregnancy impossible? or removing the infant from them? Or something else?

Chastity belts.. but then again the people from that neck of the woods have no problems removing locks without keys so that wouldn't work.

Seriously though its a hard fix....

For sure, not removing infants from them.

It would have to be some form of sterilisation, that could be reversed in the future when permission was granted to have kids when certain criteria were met. Honestly I know how bad that sounds ha ha, but I can't honestly think of another way.

osarusan

The ease with which people throw out the option of forced sterilisation never ceases to amaze me.

realdanbreen

cbreeze wrote: »

Make them collect their benefits between 9 and 10 in the morning - no show no dough!

Collect their benefit:D, you're kidding, it gets transferred straight into the bank account .

s15r330

osarusan wrote: »

The ease with which people throw out the option of forced sterilisation never ceases to amaze me.

In my town for example, we have the local scumbags.
They are nothing but a complete drain on society.
They collect the dole on a Thursday and it is drank or smoked or gambled by Friday night.

They rob houses, destroy property and injure people to name but a few.

They serve no purpose whatsoever and if they disappeared off the face of the earth the only person who would miss them would be the person in the post office when their dole wasn't picked up.

They breed like rabbits thus ensuring another generation of good for nothing leeches

They aren't worth the dirt on my shoe, at least dirt can be productive when used to grow something.

There is nothing any bleeding heart can say to me that would change my mind.

I would vote for forced sterilisation in the morning.

realdanbreen

s15r330 wrote: »

In my town for example, we have the local scumbags.
They are nothing but a complete drain on society.
They collect the dole on a Thursday and it is drank or smoked or gambled by Friday night.

They rob houses, destroy property and injure people to name but a few.

They serve no purpose whatsoever and if they disappeared off the face of the earth the only person who would miss them would be the person in the post office when their dole wasn't picked up.

They breed like rabbits thus ensuring another generation of good for nothing leeches

They aren't worth the dirt on my shoe, at least dirt can be productive when used to grow something.

There is nothing any bleeding heart can say to me that would change my mind.

I would vote for forced sterilisation in the morning.

I hate the way you sit on the fence on these issues!:D

s15r330

realdanbreen wrote: »

I hate the way you sit on the fence on these issues!:D

I could never be accused of that

pilly

s15r330 wrote: »

In my town for example, we have the local scumbags.
They are nothing but a complete drain on society.
They collect the dole on a Thursday and it is drank or smoked or gambled by Friday night.

They rob houses, destroy property and injure people to name but a few.

They serve no purpose whatsoever and if they disappeared off the face of the earth the only person who would miss them would be the person in the post office when their dole wasn't picked up.

They breed like rabbits thus ensuring another generation of good for nothing leeches

They aren't worth the dirt on my shoe, at least dirt can be productive when used to grow something.

There is nothing any bleeding heart can say to me that would change my mind.

I would vote for forced sterilisation in the morning.

Good job the rest of world is sane so there'll never be a referendum on such a thing.

s15r330

pilly wrote: »

Good job the rest of world is sane so there'll never be a referendum on such a thing.

Sane you keep on living in your little bubble while the world goes down the toilet around you

begbysback

s15r330 wrote: »

In my town for example, we have the local scumbags.
They are nothing but a complete drain on society.
They collect the dole on a Thursday and it is drank or smoked or gambled by Friday night.

They rob houses, destroy property and injure people to name but a few.

They serve no purpose whatsoever and if they disappeared off the face of the earth the only person who would miss them would be the person in the post office when their dole wasn't picked up.

They breed like rabbits thus ensuring another generation of good for nothing leeches

They aren't worth the dirt on my shoe, at least dirt can be productive when used to grow something.

There is nothing any bleeding heart can say to me that would change my mind.

I would vote for forced sterilisation in the morning.

If I were you I'd worry about getting my own issues sorted first, then tackle society's problems

s15r330

I think you'll find you're the one who will have the issues when these dirtbags become even more rampant. Wake up.

begbysback

s15r330 wrote: »

I think you'll find you're the one who will have the issues when these dirtbags become even more rampant. Wake up.

Even more rampant? What do you believe this is, some sort of progression until rampant teenagers take over the city? lol

it's an intermittent problem, which is usually sensationalised by the media, and those who believe it - like the guy earlier comparing this to the vegas massacre.

jmayo

pilly wrote: »

Good job the rest of world is sane so there'll never be a referendum on such a thing.

Actually at some point in the future mankind is going to have to seriously halt reproduction.
That is of course if mankind hasn't slaughtered itself into lower numbers or had major outbreaks of incurable epidemics.

As it is there are already major problems coming down the road economically for the western world and we have recently seen the beginning of massive population migrations from some of the world's poorer nations who happen to be the ones overbreeding.

Countries like Ethiopia or Bangladesh have huge environmental issues and yet are doubling their populations over a few decades.
It will not end well.

The planet simply will not be able to cope and once sea levels rise, water shortages kick in, all bets are going to be off.

But back to the topic a hand.
Posters are right, these scrots and most likely their parents before them will never have contributed anything to society.

s15r330

begbysback wrote: »

Even more rampant? What do you believe this is, some sort of progression until rampant teenagers take over the city? lol

it's an intermittent problem, which is usually sensationalised by the media, and those who believe it - like the guy earlier comparing this to the vegas massacre.

There is more to Ireland than "the city".
I'm only in my early 30's and even I can see that in my lifetime things are getting worse and I won't be told otherwise by someone who hasn't a clue.

10 years ago you might have gotten a few slaps on a night out, now you get stabbed or beaten to death and they'd laugh at you dying on the ground while probably recording it.

There is a certain section of society who would rob your house and kill uou if you disturbed them and they would't lose a wink of sleep over it all because they know there is no punishment.

But you enjoy living in dreamland

Sofiztikated

s15r330 wrote: »

There is more to Ireland than "the city".
I'm only in my early 30's and even I can see that in my lifetime things are getting worse and I won't be told otherwise by someone who hasn't a clue.

10 years ago you might have gotten a few slaps on a night out, now you get stabbed or beaten to death and they'd laugh at you dying on the ground while probably recording it.

There is a certain section of society who would rob your house and kill uou if you disturbed them and they would't lose a wink of sleep over it all because they know there is no punishment.

But you enjoy living in dreamland

Well that's just bolix.

Slightly more than 15 years ago, I remember a lad getting a a screwdriver in the head outside the local club.

I remember (outside the same club) someone getting his head danced on.

I remember getting threatened with a kneecapping.

I remember Frog Ward getting shot by Nally 13 years ago.

**** it, nostalgia isn't what it used to be.

s15r330

Hardly bollix, I never said that stuff never happened back then, but it is most definitely worse now.
As for that shooting, your man was hardly innocent, got what he deserved imo

end of the road

Carolyn Howling Permit wrote: »

These are not feral children, they're a 'young person in conflict with the law'.

I'm in full support for severe punishment of anti-social behaviour. It has to be done properly or it'll get the leftist hippies bleating about how it's not their fault but society's fault for letting them slip through the cracks or some such nonsense.

One of the problems is the cost us Taxpayers have to endure while they are being "repatriated" into society.

My solution is then as follows:

Fine the parents a percentage of their yearly income. Dole or otherwise.
A month of jail time to cool off. It's important that they have nothing to do and are bored.
Follow this up with a couple of months worth of manual labour to clean up the area and surrounding areas they vandalized.
Back to prison where they can watch their cleanup work slowly be defiled by others.
Release.


This way we get a cleaner city and don't have to pay labour costs for a private contractor.

fining the parents is unworkable. not only is it a waste of time, not cost effective and has no effect on the crimes commited but there could be other children in that family. manual labour isn't cost effective either, + there is staff all ready for cleaning up. realistically prison and re-education while in prison are the only option.

CucaFace wrote: »

I think this is correct and the only way to solve this issue. You need a license to own a dog, but to have a kid.......

likely breaks international and human rights law, so not an option realistically. children will always be born to people who will need some government support, you will just have to get used to that fact.

osarusan wrote: »

The ease with which people throw out the option of forced sterilisation never ceases to amaze me.

indeed. they are delusianel quite frankly. forced sterilisation makes a nice, quick, snappy little soundbite though. sounds good to them so they latch on to it.

s15r330 wrote: »

In my town for example, we have the local scumbags.
They are nothing but a complete drain on society.
They collect the dole on a Thursday and it is drank or smoked or gambled by Friday night.

They rob houses, destroy property and injure people to name but a few.

They serve no purpose whatsoever and if they disappeared off the face of the earth the only person who would miss them would be the person in the post office when their dole wasn't picked up.

They breed like rabbits thus ensuring another generation of good for nothing leeches

They aren't worth the dirt on my shoe, at least dirt can be productive when used to grow something.

There is nothing any bleeding heart can say to me that would change my mind.

I would vote for forced sterilisation in the morning.

bleeding hearts don't exist. just realists.

s15r330 wrote: »

Hardly bollix, I never said that stuff never happened back then, but it is most definitely worse now.
As for that shooting, your man was hardly innocent, got what he deserved imo

wrong on all counts.

Sofiztikated

s15r330 wrote: »

Hardly bollix, I never said that stuff never happened back then, but it is most definitely worse now.
As for that shooting, your man was hardly innocent, got what he deserved imo

You said "10 years ago ,you might get a few slaps on a night out."

I was pointing out that worse DID happen 10 years ago.

Hell, my own mother admitted (recently) to carrying a pair of scissors in her bag for protection when she was walking around Crumlin, when I was in hospital 20 years ago.

You just hear about **** quicker due to social media. Before the rise of Facebook and 24 news, this gang of teens wouldn't have made it further than the Evening Herald, if it even made it that far

CucaFace

CucaFace wrote: »

Unless they are got very early in life, I think the damage is not repairable. The only solution in my opinion is to not allow another generation after this to start in the same way. How you do this is well.... very hard to achieve.

I disagree with that. All it requires is finding the right buttons to press and also finding out what their ambitions/desires truly are.

Sure, some people are out to burn the world, but honestly, very few are that messed up. Most people want a comfortable lifestyle and a happy existence.

Psychology and behavioural sciences have progressed a lot in the last twenty years... why can't we use that knowledge to our advantage?

osarusan wrote: »

How do you envisage stopping them from having kids? Are you talking about making a pregnancy impossible? or removing the infant from them? Or something else?

People need a license to have children based on their income and whether they've passed various parenting exams. If people have children without permission, then the children are taken away for adoption, and the parents receive a legal record and a heavy fine. If they do it again without permission, they're sterilized.

osarusan wrote: »

The ease with which people throw out the option of forced sterilisation never ceases to amaze me.

TBH it wouldn't be my first choice of an answer. I'm more inclined towards adoption... but I also recognize that many of the families that involve these kinds of people are often quite large. Resorting to adoption and a slap on the wrist isn't likely to stop them from producing children that they're incapable (financially, or morally) in raising.

Having children (for most of us) is a big decision. I know couples and married people who are waiting/saving money because they can't afford to have a kid yet. They're not expecting the government to pick up the tab. They're preparing themselves to be in a position to be able to provide for their own children. That's admirable, and the way things should be. And the government should be helping these kinds of families to have and raise children...

We live in a world where contraception is easily available. It's not as if they don't have the options not to have kids...

s15r330

end of the road wrote: »

wrong on all counts.

Realists more like eejits who are happy to sit back and let the scum of the world have the run of the place.

Oh a stranger on the internet says i'm wrong...a dirtbag was breaking into someones house, pity the fukkers that were with him didn't get the same. Excuse me if I totally ignore you.

Sofiztikated

Deleted User wrote: »

People need a license to have children based on their income and whether they've passed various parenting exams. If people have children without permission, then the children are taken away for adoption, and the parents receive a legal record and a heavy fine. If they do it again without permission, they're sterilized.

Well that's not open to any kind of abuse at all.

It's not like we haven't had any kind of scandal with children being taken away from mothers, adopted without concent, from people that were deemed a disgrace, in recent history.

Oh. Wait.

osarusan

Deleted User wrote: »

People need a license to have children based on their income and whether they've passed various parenting exams. If people have children without permission, then the children are taken away for adoption, and the parents receive a legal record and a heavy fine. If they do it again without permission, they're sterilized.

Forced sterilisation for the crime of having children without a licence is nothing other than fantastical dystopian nonsense.

Look.. TBH I don't have much interest in this targeting of families, and births. It's never going to work.

What we can do is target those who commit crimes and provide a different system of bringing them back into normal living. Provide workable alternatives to the environment that pushed them towards crime. Break up the gangs. Put real police presence in every community. Separate dodgy communities and spread them out across the country. And give them the skills to find work that pays well. Cut out the entitlement culture, and continue the movement to improve the welfare system.

Sofiztikated

s15r330 wrote: »

Realists more like eejits who are happy to sit back and let the scum of the world have the run of the place.

Oh a stranger on the internet says i'm wrong...a dirtbag was breaking into someones house, pity the fukkers that were with him didn't get the same. Excuse me if I totally ignore you.

It's a sad day that I find me and eotr on the same side, but here we are.

I'd consider myself a realist. I know that your "solutions" are unworkable.

I'm not happy to "sit back and let the scum of the world have the run of the place."

I'm more interested in finding workable solutions, rather than ****ing nonsense.

FYI, I agree with Nally's first shot. The second, not so much.

osarusan

osarusan wrote: »

Forced sterilisation for the crime of having children without a licence is nothing other than fantastical dystopian nonsense.

Agreed. It's not going to happen.