Newstalk bans Irish Times Journalists

elperello

Wheels coming off the Newstalk wagon.
Expect a change of ownership.

Venom

Sunny Dirty Track-and-field wrote: »

Least she has her ‘comedy’ career to fall back on ....

Is that the new term for busking :pac:

Richard Hillman

Donoghue next

This is very important for Communicorp to send a message to the upstarts about trying to get people sacked again.

The less than 20 signatures will be very worried too

VinLieger

The Legend Of Kira wrote: »

The op fails to take into account that there no mob that sought to pressure Newstalk to ban people from the Irish times, unlike what we seen from the other side in recent weeks, I disagree with Newstalks move to ban others from the Irish times based on what one of their writers said saying " he d refuse to appear on newstalk " .

He dis more than that, he made some pretty outrageous claims about sexism in NT, a station where 10 out of 11 producers are women and so is the director of the station, the on air talent is not indicative of the makeup of the station behind the scenes but Fintans never let the facts get in the way of hisnown indignation.

The whole dill thing is hilarious

Rumpy Pumpy

Like two blind mice on the Titanic arguing about which way to get to the lifeboats.

RobertKK

Newstalk is upping it's quality.

Surprised people still pay for the Irish Times, it is too PC and preaches on certain topics.

HandsomeBob

Donutz wrote: »

It's all a bit childish really. If communicorp are in the habbit of banning anybody that gives them criticism, they're gonna run out of decent contributors fairly quickly.

Fintan O Toole on the other hand though....
How come he didn't raise his sexism concerns any of the previous times he appeared on the station.

Oul Fintan has already banned himself from Newstalk. He finally made a "stand" on the issue a couple of weeks ago......but I've no doubt he'll milk this for another article now.

I'm sure some of the IT journos will be delighted anyway.....now they don't have to come up with some sort of excuse for refusing to take part in live debates (well on Newstalk at least).

Teyla Emmagan

I don't think I have ever heard Una Mulally on radio. Bit of a pathetic move by DOB anyway.

Do you get paid to go on air an contribute to radio shows or are all these people just doing it for their profile?

_Dara_

pilly wrote: »

So why were a large proportion of posters saying George Hook was denied free speech?

That's my point. He wasn't denied free speech he was denied a platform.

Great point actually!

Newstalk can do this if they want, as I said in the George Hook thread, he wasn’t silenced. He could still get his POV across via other platforms. This is the same.

Now whether this makes anyone look hypocritical depends on whether they thought Hook was silenced and simultaneously agree with this move by Newstalk. If anyone simultaneously holds these two viewpoints then, yes, that makes them hypocritical.

VinLieger

_Dara_ wrote: »

Great point actually!

Newstalk can do this if they want, as I said in the George Hook thread, he wasn’t silenced. He could still get his POV across via other platforms. This is the same.

Now whether this makes anyone look hypocritical depends on whether they thought Hook was silenced and simultaneously agree with this move by Newstalk. If anyone simultaneously holds these two viewpoints then, yes, that makes them hypocritical.

George hook was removed from his job for something he said that was hurtful, fintan said something moronic, ridiculously hyperbolic and factually untrue and he as well as his employer refuse to apologise for or retract that, however George did apologise..... several times. The two situations as much people would like to believe are entirely different.

_Dara_

VinLieger wrote: »

George hook was removed from his job for something he said that was hurtful, fintan said something moronic, ridiculously hyperbolic and factually untrue and he as well as his employer refuse to apologise for or retract that, however George did apologise..... several times. The two situations as much people would like to believe are entirely different.

They were both being denied a platform - from that POV, if you think one is fine and the other isn’t, you are being hypocritical.

Oh and the Newstalk platform is still available to Hook. He still works for the station.

I’d also disagree that the IT needs to apologise but that’s a matter of opinion.

Rumpy Pumpy

I love how seemingly semi-intelligent folk around here seem to lose all sense of rationality when it comes to Denis O’Brien. He gets portrayed as this almost Bond-like villain - sitting at his desk in an extinct volcano, stroking a cat, and laughing maniacally.

Can’t imagine the man has any great input or interest in decisions like this. Newstalk took the decision to ban Irish Times hacks because notorious pontificator and pain in the hoop, Fintan ‘The Voice of Modern Ireland’ O’Toole jumped on the anti-Hook bandwagon and wrote one of his laziest and most indulgent articles ever. Insulted management, staff and presenters on the station.

Very strong move by Newstalk, even if it will only be a temporary thing. I’m sure that Fintan and his buddies can start a podcast or something.

_Dara_

No arguments that Newstalk are well within their rights to do this but it’s not a strong move. It’s a petty move which is pretty much the diametric opposite of strong. I’m sure they were going for powerful but it just makes them seem rattled.

O’Toole has a national platform. No need for a podcast just yet.

VinLieger

_Dara_ wrote: »

They were both being denied a platform - from that POV, if you think one is fine and the other isn’t, you are being hypocritical.

Oh and the Newstalk platform is still available to Hook. He still works for the station.

I’d also disagree that the IT needs to apologise but that’s a matter of opinion.

TBH I don't care about platforms and i think that whole argument is a joke with people on both sides of the discussion just desperate to find a reasonable sounding excuse for their positions. I have a problem with people relentlessly ganging up on someone who really didn't deserve that kind of vitriolic hate.

TBH i honestly think Fintan's delighted and probably still banging one out over this cus he loves being indignant on others behalf but he never actually gets to play the victim so this must be his dream come true.

meeeeh

_Dara_ wrote: »

They were both being denied a platform - from that POV, if you think one is fine and the other isn’t, you are being hypocritical.

Oh and the Newstalk platform is still available to Hook. He still works for the station.

I’d also disagree that the IT needs to apologise but that’s a matter of opinion.

Irish Times journalists are employed by IT. The situation would be comparable if Fintan O'Toole was in danger of being let go from IT because of his opinions. There is a difference between not inviting someone on a program and threatening to take away their paid employment. Journalists won't be afraid to voice their opinion or work on contentious stories because they can't go on NT, they would be if their employment was threatened.

RobertKK

RobertKK wrote: »

Newstalk is upping it's quality.

Surprised people still pay for the Irish Times, it is too PC and preaches on certain topics.

saw on another forum its readership is down to 50k, I wonder why

Teyla Emmagan

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

I don't think I have ever heard Una Mulally on radio. Bit of a pathetic move by DOB anyway.

Do you get paid to go on air an contribute to radio shows or are all these people just doing it for their profile?

Mullalley has been on Last word a number of times and I think Alison Curtis's show....Ray D'arcys as well

silverharp

Sunny Dirty Track-and-field wrote: »

saw on another forum its readership is down to 50k, I wonder why

says 77K though give it a couple of years and it will get to 50K , it will close down at some stage , I doubt anyone in school today will ever buy one

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/media-and-marketing/the-irish-times-had-daily-circulation-of-77-657-in-first-half-of-this-year-1.3190023

conorhal

spookwoman wrote: »

More like cancelled
http://www.thejournal.ie/dil-wickremasinghe-newstalk-show-cancelled-3632151-Oct2017/?utm_source=shortlink

I'm sure she'll be fine, and welcomed with open arms by a multitude of quangos.

She should have been outright fired though, with the station fighting a fire you can't tollerate a backroom rebellion that's fanning the flames.

conorhal

silverharp wrote: »

says 77K though give it a couple of years and it will get to 50K , it will close down at some stage , I doubt anyone in school today will ever buy one

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/media-and-marketing/the-irish-times-had-daily-circulation-of-77-657-in-first-half-of-this-year-1.3190023

Do they still give the IT out for free to freshers in college? They were like SJW drug dealers outside the school gate, "wanna try some political correctness? All the cool kids are doing it!"

mzungu

Rumpy Pumpy wrote: »

I love how seemingly semi-intelligent folk around here seem to lose all sense of rationality when it comes to Denis O’Brien. He gets portrayed as this almost Bond-like villain - sitting at his desk in an extinct volcano, stroking a cat, and laughing maniacally.

Can’t imagine the man has any great input or interest in decisions like this. Newstalk took the decision to ban Irish Times hacks because notorious pontificator and pain in the hoop, Fintan ‘The Voice of Modern Ireland’ O’Toole jumped on the anti-Hook bandwagon and wrote one of his laziest and most indulgent articles ever. Insulted management, staff and presenters on the station.

Very strong move by Newstalk, even if it will only be a temporary thing. I’m sure that Fintan and his buddies can start a podcast or something.

I don't agree, I think it's a weak move by Newstalk. Comes across as a playground grudge. If their skin is that weak, then they really shouldn't be in the media game. What they should have done was challenged the IT/O'Toole through open debate. That would have been the proper response.

AustinLostin

Loving all the drama in this, loved the hysterical backlash against George by the 'eternally offended' originally, loved the histrionic backlash against the original backlash by 'the eternally offended by the eternally offended.'
Hope there will be a backlash backlash backlash, can someone write a think piece asap
And now this. Its the gift that keeps on giving.

I hope everyone ends up banned from everywhere frankly.

conorhal

conorhal wrote: »

She should have been outright fired though, with the station fighting a fire you can't tollerate a backroom rebellion that's fanning the flames.

Station accused of misogyny sacks lesbian feminist.

Hmmmm. I think if anything might have fanned flames...

Biggest lickspittle on boardz

Deleted User wrote: »

Station accused of misogyny sacks lesbian feminist.

Hmmmm. I think if anything might have fanned flames...

Yeah, we should just turn a blind eye to misconduct based on the employees sexuality, race, or political views.

What could POSSIBLY go wrong?

The tantrum blew up in her face, and I'm delighted. Well done Denis O Brien and Co.

Biggest lickspittle on boardz

Biggest lickspittle on boardz wrote: »

Yeah, we should just turn a blind eye to misconduct...

I haven't read her contract so not sure what is defined as misconduct on it.

Not sure why we might be concerned as to what constitutes misconduct in a workplace anyway. The arrangement between her and her employers is kinda none of our business really.

conorhal

Biggest lickspittle on boardz wrote: »

Yeah, we should just turn a blind eye to misconduct based on the employees sexuality, race, or political views.

What could POSSIBLY go wrong?

The tantrum blew up in her face, and I'm delighted. Well done Denis O Brien and Co.

You only have to look at the Evergreen College insanity to see what happens when you hand out PC armor to cry-bullies and refuse to call them on their behaviour.

VinLieger

Deleted User wrote: »

I haven't read her contract so not sure what is defined as misconduct on it.

Not sure why we might be concerned as to what constitutes misconduct in a workplace anyway. The arrangement between her and her employers is kinda none of our business really.

Im gonna go out on a limb and say demanding another employee be fired or else you wont do your own job is probably not specifically listed in most peoples contracts but definitely not something you can just expect to get away with scott free either.

Unless George had specifically done something against her that violates some kind of workplace agreement then shes definitely in the wrong from a legal standpoint.

Opinionated Onion

pilly wrote: »

I asked a question, didn't just post the link.

I agree it was never a free speech issue but the amount of people on the original case saying this was free speech being stifled was huge. I'm just wondering will they object as much to this action.

It's possible for both things to be wrong.... I assume you mean that George Hook by 'the original case'. Both were/are about free speech, and neither is good. Arbitrary witch hunts are bad, curtailing the freedom of one arm of the press by one of the largest media holders in Ireland is bad.

Hooks Golf Handicap

Well done NT on what could have been a debacle.

Give Georgie a few months gardening leave for optics, keep the sponsors & the reactionaries happy.
Go Alex Fergusson on the Irish Times, whip up a new storm.
In ensuing good day to bury bad news take Dil the dissenter out the back & put her down.
Allow the froth of the feminist Twitterati to settle & George will be back for Christmas.

Well played NT, well played.

If I were Chris O'Donoghue I'd be planking it.

meeeeh

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I haven't read her contract so not sure what is defined as misconduct on it.

Not sure why we might be concerned as to what constitutes misconduct in a workplace anyway. The arrangement between her and her employers is kinda none of our business really.

She refused to present the show if Hook is not fired. Hook was not fired so I can't see any other resolution as her leaving.

She didn't offend me in the same way she seems to offend some. I just didn't find there that good, I'm also not Hook fan although I think some of his slots with regulars were good (stats, essential song, movies...). But there could be only one winner between her and Hook when you look at listenership numbers they can attract. Newstalk is a commercial station.

VinLieger

Its actually gotten to the stage where the drama going on about the station is more interesting than anything they have on the air

pilly

Opinionated Onion wrote: »

It's possible for both things to be wrong.... I assume you mean that George Hook by 'the original case'. Both were/are about free speech, and neither is good. Arbitrary witch hunts are bad, curtailing the freedom of one arm of the press by one of the largest media holders in Ireland is bad.

I totally agree it's possible both things are wrong. In fact my point is that if you feel one is wrong and the other is right that you're a hypocrite.

I've more respect for someone who on either side says both are wrong or both are right.

This is not what's happening though, people are blatantly saying out straight yeah fcuk the IT because I don't like them. Fcuk FOT, he's an asshole. Fcuk Dill because I don't like her. Blah blah blah.

So it's only okay to silence the voices you don't like? Height of hypocrisy.

Personally I think both are wrong and bad for what we call a "free" press. I don't agree for a second with what Hook said but I never thought he should be sacked for it. Final warning maybe.

By you I'm talking about people in general, not yourself OO.

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

Biggest lickspittle on boardz wrote: »

Yeah, we should just turn a blind eye to misconduct based on the employees sexuality, race, or political views.

What could POSSIBLY go wrong?

The tantrum blew up in her face, and I'm delighted. Well done Denis O Brien and Co.

But what about free speech?

ChikiChiki

Great move by NT. DOB is still an absolute arse though. He would have had input into this decisioning for sure.

JMNolan

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

But what about free speech?

Do you understand what free speech is and/or how it is applied in this country?

pilly

ChikiChiki wrote:

Great move by NT. DOB is still an absolute arse though. He would have had input into this decisioning for sure.

Why a great move?

JMNolan

pilly wrote: »

Why a great move?

I guess its a great move because most of NT listeners agree with Hook. This will entice like minded people to listen to NT

pilly

JMNolan wrote: »

I guess its a great move because most of NT listeners agree with Hook. This will entice like minded people to listen to NT

Oh right, so they only want right wing listeners? Hmm, limiting their audience somewhat wouldn't you say?

JMNolan

pilly wrote: »

Oh right, so they only want right wing listeners? Hmm, limiting their audience somewhat wouldn't you say?

What's wrong with that approach? From a commercial perspective that is.

Hooks Golf Handicap

pilly wrote: »

Oh right, so they only want right wing listeners? Hmm, limiting their audience somewhat wouldn't you say?

Think of the age demo that listen to talk radio.
Think of the political views of the majority of that demo.

Rule No.1, know your audience.
Rule No.2, give your audience what they want.

Someone like Dil just stank that place up.

pilly

JMNolan wrote: »

What's wrong with that approach? From a commercial perspective that is.

Because your audience will eventually die off. These fogeys will pop their clogs, trends change and they're left with no audience.

That's what wrong with it from a commercial perspective.

JMNolan

pilly wrote: »

Because your audience will eventually die off. These fogeys will pop their clogs, trends change and they're left with no audience.

That's what wrong with it from a commercial perspective.

Says you. Do you own many radios or newspapers? When you have your own radio station you can cater to whoever you want.

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

JMNolan wrote: »

Do you understand what free speech is and/or how it is applied in this country?

I am being a little ironic but my point is this: free speech doesn't actually exist - nobody can publish or broadcast absolutely anything they like. And they never could.

Freedom of speech is the more accurate term (as this applies limits) and I support it. I believe people should be able to express any view whatsoever, so long as they can back it up and make their point civilly.

Freedom of speech isn't a concern for commercial enterprises though, only state bodies, although it's not great when a media outlet exploits this - they should still be striving for balance.

I don't think George Hook picked the right case for making his point but I think the backlash was appalling and I'm glad he's staying on air. However, some of those who condemned his free speech being infringed have no problem with NewsTalk "no platforming" any Irish Times journalist at all (fair enough re O'Toole alone though).

And that double standard stinks. It also proves somewhat that people who cry "What about free speech?" really only mean the free speech they agree with (whatever political persuasion they are). I cannot stand the hyper politically correct crowd but there still needs to be consistency.

meeeeh

pilly wrote: »

Because your audience will eventually die off. These fogeys will pop their clogs, trends change and they're left with no audience.

That's what wrong with it from a commercial perspective.

FF an FG have 60% according to last IT poll, 10 more than they got in last election. If anything the target audience is getting bigger.

JMNolan

People get more right wing as they get older. I think there will always be an audience for Hook and others. As for print media.... I fear Fintans medium is on the way out...

JMNolan

JMNolan wrote: »

Says you. Do you own many radios or newspapers? When you have your own radio station you can cater to whoever you want.

And judging from comment sections/here and other forums, people are getting irritated by the left/pc stance taken by a lot of the media in this country

osarusan

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

However, some of those who condemned his free speech being infringed have no problem with NewsTalk "no platforming" any Irish Times journalist at all (fair enough re O'Toole alone though).

And that double standard stinks. It also proves somewhat that people who cry "What about free speech?" really only mean the free speech they agree with (whatever political persuasion they are). I cannot stand the hyper politically correct crowd but there still needs to be consistency.

Such lofty principles are to be applied whenever it suits, and simply disregarded whenever it suits also.

pilly

JMNolan wrote: »

Says you. Do you own many radios or newspapers? When you have your own radio station you can cater to whoever you want.

What's with the aggressive approach?

Do you own many radio stations or newspapers yourself?

You have your opinion, I have mine, sorry if I hit a nerve by suggesting that old fogeys eventually die off and times change.

JMNolan

pilly wrote: »

What's with the aggressive approach?

Do you own many radio stations or newspapers yourself?

You have your opinion, I have mine, sorry if I hit a nerve by suggesting that old fogeys eventually die off and times change.

No its not that you've hit a nerve or anything but I find this idea that Newstalk are wrong to cater to a particular demographic bizarre. It seems completely natural to me that they would so I can't understand someone saying "nah, they're dead wrong, I know this for a fact".

conorhal

pilly wrote: »

Because your audience will eventually die off. These fogeys will pop their clogs, trends change and they're left with no audience.

That's what wrong with it from a commercial perspective.

I saw some interesting articles a while back refering to attitudinal surveys (This would apply to the US and UK so I can't say how relevent they might be to Ireland) that suggested that generation Z are far more conservative then their parents or grandparents generation. If anybody's audience is dying off, it's the right on Irish Times audience.


http://nypost.com/2017/07/01/why-the-next-generation-after-millennials-will-vote-republican/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/thatchers-children-blairs-babies-british-social-attitudes-more-authoritarian-right-wing-a7557351.html