Harvey Weinstein scandal (Mod warning in op.)

Ash.J.Williams

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

I was a great fan of his and it came as a shock.

I don't want to speculate upon motive as that is for him but I was just wondering if he had bought the victim spiel from her and then discovered that she was actually a predator.

No offence meant, just curious. May he continue to rest in peace.

People don't usually kill themselves because of something..

Happy4all

I see she says she didn’t have sex with him but that he was threatening to blackmail her.
And that her boyfriend Anthony Bourdain who arranged paying him off.
Conveniently Anthony died recently & can’t contradict her statement.

sexmag

Happy4all wrote: »

I see she says she didn’t have sex with him but that he was threatening to blackmail her.
And that her boyfriend Anthony Bourdain who arranged paying him off.
Conveniently Anthony died recently & can’t contradict her statement.

Dragging her deceased ex through the mud, sickening really.

They all went mad at Casey Affleck for paying off those 2 woman basically "confirming his guilt" and now she's saying it was for another reason such as black mail yet people have confirmed they have texts between her and Anthony saying "she didn't rape Bennett" and there is a photo of them post coitus

RabbleRouser2k

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

To clarify, I'm struggling to understand the outrage at metoo. If they knew she was an abuser and still used her because she was also a victim, then they would be culpable. But we have no evidence that it was widely known until now.

So how is it 'their fault'? And how is the hypocrisy on anyone except Asia?

Well, if you watch 'Author...' it does show she's very manipulative. That she does ply people with substances to get what she wants. Hollywood is a tight, close knit area-they knew. Similar to Brian Singer, or Harvey...or Polanski. They knew, they just turned the other cheek.

As for the hypocrisy of 'metoo'. Metoo has taken a mere accusation as evidence, no trial, no judge, no jury-it's 'FACT'...but only as long as you're not one of their own.
Asia is one of their own, and Rose and her team are now saying 'be gentle, stop trying to under mine metoo'...but ignoring the victim here. We'll even have people saying 'it's different for a boy'...no, grooming and so on is still the same, no matter the gender. Asia's now dragging her dead boyfriend into this-that's just demented.

The hypocrisy is all over this, it's staring em point blank in the face.

NOVA MCMXCIV

Hollywood is such a cesspit.

El_Duderino 09

sexmag wrote: »

They all went mad at Casey Affleck for paying off those 2 woman basically "confirming his guilt" and now she's saying it was for another reason such as black mail yet people have confirmed they have texts between her and Anthony saying "she didn't rape Bennett" and there is a photo of them post coitus

So is paying off the alleged victim a sign of guilt or not? You seem critical of the people who deemed Casey Afleck guilty because he made a payment. But I don’t see many here calling for people to wait until all the facts are known and a jury passes a verdict.

Talk about double standards. Dreadful business.

sexmag

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

So is paying off the alleged victim a sign of guilt or not?

Neither, only a judge and jury can decide but it never gets to that stage.

I'm pointing out the hypocrisy and how when casey did it in their eyes hes guilty but when asia did it we should believe her.

I feel bad as this is all blowing up in their face now and the movement was a good thing to an extent,it's exposed the evil but the gun toating of shoot first ask questions later of what it became has really undermind it

Resverathrole

The poor fella was just trying to get laid. I think the first wan he abused was the hottest! It wasn't like he raped some1

We're all caring too much about what goes on in these Hollywood weirdos lives. They get paid to lie and entertain, they're living in a parallel universe, they aren't us.

RabbleRouser2k

Deleted User wrote: »

We're all caring too much about what goes on in these Hollywood weirdos lives. They get paid to lie and entertain, they're living in a parallel universe, they aren't us.

There's 'a different world' and then there's hurting someone else and breaking the law.
Many creative people live in a different world-it's how they get ideas. They're sort of exploring places people ignore in order to gain ideas.

I see Rosanna Arquette is trying to pull the same craziness as Rose McGowan-'that Harvey leaked this story'.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6083203/Asia-Argento-DENIES-having-sex-teen-says-extorted-Anthony-Bourdains-money.html

Except there's a photo Rosanna, this happened-it broke the law. You were all going after Woody Allen despite a court case finding him not guilty.
Here there's a ton of evidence. Hell, Argento was even possibly still married at the time too-it was 2013 after all.

El_Duderino 09

sexmag wrote: »

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

So is paying off the alleged victim a sign of guilt or not?

Neither, only a judge and jury can decide but it never gets to that stage.

I'm pointing out the hypocrisy and how when casey did it in their eyes hes guilty but when asia did it we should believe her.

I feel bad as this is all blowing up in their face now and the movement was a good thing to an extent,it's exposed the evil but the gun toating of shoot first ask questions later of what it became has really undermind it

Ah so the posters in this thread haven’t made up their mind on whether she’s guilty or not. They’re just honestly Collecting data and waiting for the court case? You must be joking!

Yours is the first post that hasn’t assumed her guilt. And that was only because it would have been glaringly obvious that anyone who assumes her guilt is committing the very same crime that metoo supposedly commits.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

NOVA MCMXCIV wrote: »

Hollywood is such a cesspit.

A friend of mine didn’t want to watch a certain film recently because she didn’t like one of the lead actors. He’s one of the accused in the last year.

I said to her that the film and TV industries are rotten to their core. I’d say literally every production has an asshole/assholette somewhere in the production ranks. You’d never watch anything if you were avoiding things that have questionable people involved.

It stumped her a bit!

JJJJNR

She has blood on her hands bigtime.

RabbleRouser2k

JJJJNR wrote: »

She has blood on her hands bigtime.

When Bourdain killed himself, a lot of people noted how 'he was supporting her, but she completely abandoned him'.

Depression is a horrible disease, and it needs a support network to help one get through the rougher times.
Bourdain didn't seem to have this support, instead he was left out in the cold.

Venom

TMZ has gotten their hands on at least one photo out of four alleged to have been taken and a text message chain where she admits to having sex with the kid.



http://www.tmz.com/2018/08/22/asia-argento-17-year-old-boy-in-bed-photo-sex-texts/


How can she claim she didn't know his age when she's known him for years?

tritium

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

To clarify, I'm struggling to understand the outrage at metoo. If they knew she was an abuser and still used her because she was also a victim, then they would be culpable. But we have no evidence that it was widely known until now.

So how is it 'their fault'? And how is the hypocrisy on anyone except Asia?

Well, it would be less hypocritical if this was maybe the first #metoo leader who was caught out and basically given a pass by the movements main players. Unfortunately Cristina Garcia has previous form here. At the moment the top tier of #metoo aren’t doing well when it comes to being the change they want to see in the world...

RabbleRouser2k

The Daily Mail has two pretty good articles on the subject (though their stating 'Bourdain paid him' has to be libellous, hasn't it? She claims he paid the guy, it doesn't mean he genuinely did. She might be...wait for this...lying.)

Asia's accused victim has stated he kept his secret out of shame. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6088245/Asia-Argentos-accuser-breaks-silence-says-ashamed-afraid-come-forward.html

And now texts and other details have emerged where it shows she did have sex with him, but is now playing the victim. There are claims like 'she didn't know he was 17'...but she knew he was 7 when she made a film with him. So is she that bad at math? Doubt it.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6086009/Asia-Argento-admits-DID-sex-17-year-old-Jimmy-Bennett-texts.html

She's also going to be in X Factor Italy... or not. She's already dropped out of a festival over the allegations.

RabbleRouser2k

Man, Asia's sounding more and more like a creep.

Tagging people in Instagram videos. Sending unsolicited nude's to people, and then badmouthing them or blaming them when they get angry.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6095413/Asia-Argento-sent-unwanted-nude-video-comedian-freaked-got-upset.html

El_Duderino 09

Fair play to the metoo movement for making this kind of thing more likely to come out.

sexmag

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/24/metoo-victim-asia-argento-jimmy-bennett

Great article,unbiased and written by a woman about the whole me too movement and not just the Asia argento story

The Crowman

This ad wouldn't go down well in the Metoo age

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P05mF5JzvBA

El_Duderino 09

The Crowman wrote: »

This ad wouldn't go down well in the Metoo age

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P05mF5JzvBA

I don't suppose it would.

It shows how that kind of workplace harassment was baked into the culture. It's amazing how far culture has come in just 30 years.

the purple tin

The Crowman wrote: »

This ad wouldn't go down well in the Metoo age

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P05mF5JzvBA

That's a well worn trope in english tv. The randy old git who can't keep his hands to himself, for some reason it's usually always a retired military officer.

tritium

sexmag wrote: »

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/24/metoo-victim-asia-argento-jimmy-bennett

Great article,unbiased and written by a woman about the whole me too movement and not just the Asia argento story

I have to admit, the aspect that disturbs me about that piece is how it essentially downplays the Argento and Ronell stories as though they weren’t sexual assault at all. I do wonder would this piece have been accepted by the guardian were the gender roles reversed

Lines like

A 17-year-old and a 37-year-old together in bed now appals; a few generations ago, the play ​Tea and Sympathy​ – which concludes with the sexual propositioning of a prep school student by his headmaster’s wife – was a sentimental Broadway hit.

Ignore the fundamental point that this a kid who was below the age of consent - this isn’t an age gap romance, if they had sex it’s legally and morally child abuse

That said, as el duderino pointed out, and several commentators have noted, it is positive that male victims finally feel they can step forward. Early metoo had been quite toxic at times to that. It’s also good that finally were seeing that no one is Teflon on this stuff given cases like Cristina Garcia very much were in danger of giving that view. Hollywood is a cesspit and I’m not actually surprised to see this as the next stage of metoo given how power and influence can corrupt, something that’s not gender specific

RabbleRouser2k

tritium wrote: »

I have to admit, the aspect that disturbs me about that piece is how it essentially downplays the Argento and Ronell stories as though they weren’t sexual assault at all. I do wonder would this piece have been accepted by the guardian were the gender roles reversed

Lines like

Ignore the fundamental point that this a kid who was below the age of consent - this isn’t an age gap romance, if they had sex it’s legally and morally child abuse

That said, as el duderino pointed out, and several commentators have noted, it is positive that male victims finally feel they can step forward. Early metoo had been quite toxic at times to that. It’s also good that finally were seeing that no one is Teflon on this stuff given cases like Cristina Garcia very much were in danger of giving that view. Hollywood is a cesspit and I’m not actually surprised to see this as the next stage of metoo given how power and influence can corrupt, something that’s not gender specific

We've seen a lot of 'underage male seduced by older man/ woman' movies in the past, and they're treated as dramas or romantic.
Summer of 42, or the Oscar nominated 'Call me by your name', to name a few.
In actuality, friends of mine that were 15 and male who were being hounded by much older women found it much creepier.

The Crowman

The Crowman wrote: »

This ad wouldn't go down well in the Metoo age

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P05mF5JzvBA

The good old days

Outlaw Pete

tritium wrote: »

I have to admit, the aspect that disturbs me about that piece is how it essentially downplays the Argento and Ronell stories as though they weren’t sexual assault at all. I do wonder would this piece have been accepted by the guardian were the gender roles reversed..

I think overall it's always downplayed when it's a woman rather than a man. Had it been say Tom Cruise that had statutorily raped Dakota Fanning a few days after she turned 17, after him having played her Dad in a film when she was nine or ten (War of the Worlds) and (similarly to Asia and Johnny) been quite close to one another over the subsequent years, then I think the reaction would be far different to what we are seeing.

El_Duderino 09

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

I think overall it's always downplayed when it's a woman rather than a man. Had it been say Tom Cruise that had statutorily raped Dakota Fanning a few days after she turned 17, after him having played her Dad in a film when she was nine or ten (War of the Worlds) and (similarly to Asia and Johnny) been quite close to one another over the subsequent years, then I think the reaction would be far different to what we are seeing.

Yes but... I had never heard of Asia before this story and Tom Cruise is massive news when he does anything. He jumped on Opera’s sofa and it was front page news.

So an analogous story would be an actor I’ve never heard of who might have statutory raped a 17 year old actor.

RabbleRouser2k

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yes but... I had never heard of Asia before this story and Tom Cruise is massive news when he does anything. He jumped on Opera’s sofa and it was front page news.

So an analogous story would be an actor I’ve never heard of who might have statutory raped a 17 year old actor.

Really? Never heard of Asia, prior to the Weinstein thing, I mean? That's pretty strange. (No offence).

Her dad is Dario Argento, famous Italian horror director. She starred alongside Vin Diesel in XXX, as well as in Sofia Coppola's Marie Antoinette, as well as George Romero's Land of the Dead.

I think the only other example(s) that springs to mind is Stephen Collins from 7th Heaven admitting to molesting his niece.
Or R Kelly and his 'house full of young girls'. Or James Woods allegedly hitting on 16 year old girls.

El_Duderino 09

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

Really? Never heard of Asia, prior to the Weinstein thing, I mean? That's pretty strange. (No offence).

Her dad is Dario Argento, famous Italian horror director. She starred alongside Vin Diesel in XXX, as well as in Sofia Coppola's Marie Antoinette, as well as George Romero's Land of the Dead.

I think the only other example(s) that springs to mind is Stephen Collins from 7th Heaven admitting to molesting his niece.
Or R Kelly and his 'house full of young girls'. Or James Woods allegedly hitting on 16 year old girls.

Her name didn’t stand out even after Weinstein. I googled her and saw the same info you posted. I hadn’t seen any of those movies or hadn’t seen her before as far as I know.

But I know those Male actors you mentioned and R Kelly from before any accusations. But I hadn’t heard of the accusations until you mentioned them right now (except R Kelly)

To be fair ‘obscure Male actor you’ve never heard of, might have had sex with 17 year old actor you’ve never heard of’ doesn’t make an amazing headline. But Tom cruise, or James woods are instantly recognisable.

This story shows that it’s moving in the right direction thanks in large part to metoo

Candyshell

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Her name didn’t stand out even after Weinstein. I googled her and saw the same info you posted. I hadn’t seen any of those movies or hadn’t seen her before as far as I know.

But I know those Male actors you mentioned and R Kelly from before any accusations. But I hadn’t heard of the accusations until you mentioned them right now (except R Kelly)

To be fair ‘obscure Male actor you’ve never heard of, might have had sex with 17 year old actor you’ve never heard of’ doesn’t make an amazing headline. But Tom cruise, or James woods are instantly recognisable.

This story shows that it’s moving in the right direction thanks in large part to metoo

Spoken like a true zealot. When you look at mettoo movement objectively you can see that there are both positive and negative consequences of it. Zealots on both sides focus on what they want to see.

El_Duderino 09

Candyshell wrote: »

Spoken like a true zealot. When you look at mettoo movement objectively you can see that there are both positive and negative consequences of it. Zealots on both sides focus on what they want to see.

What exactly about my post suggested zealotry?

tritium

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Her name didn’t stand out even after Weinstein. I googled her and saw the same info you posted. I hadn’t seen any of those movies or hadn’t seen her before as far as I know.

But I know those Male actors you mentioned and R Kelly from before any accusations. But I hadn’t heard of the accusations until you mentioned them right now (except R Kelly)

To be fair ‘obscure Male actor you’ve never heard of, might have had sex with 17 year old actor you’ve never heard of’ doesn’t make an amazing headline. But Tom cruise, or James woods are instantly recognisable.

This story shows that it’s moving in the right direction thanks in large part to metoo

Whether it’s “heading in the right direction” will very much depend on how this story evolves tbh. Metoo already had a pretty poor record of sidelining and marginalizing male victims. Argento isn’t the first prominent female metoo advocate to be accused of impropriety either. At least this time the wider movement seems to be saying hell no to people like Rose McGowan, whose lost a lot of credibility.

The real test will be do advocates afford the same standard in all cases. Already we’re seeing a mix of poorly thought out attempts to differentiate cases like this and, surprisingly, op-Ed’s that maybe we need to slow down and wait for due process because the rush to judgement to now was so unfair. It’s not that I disagree with waiting for due process but the hypocrisy of folks like McGowan changing her tune on this once a female friend is accused makes for horrible optics.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

Really? Never heard of Asia, prior to the Weinstein thing, I mean? That's pretty strange. (No offence).

Her dad is Dario Argento, famous Italian horror director. She starred alongside Vin Diesel in XXX, as well as in Sofia Coppola's Marie Antoinette, as well as George Romero's Land of the Dead.

I think the only other example(s) that springs to mind is Stephen Collins from 7th Heaven admitting to molesting his niece.
Or R Kelly and his 'house full of young girls'. Or James Woods allegedly hitting on 16 year old girls.

Not really. All those films are pretty niche. Except maybe the Vin Diesel one and many people avoid his films with good reason. And her father is well-known in Italy and maybe with horror film fans internationally. I can easily see why many people wouldn’t have heard of her. I knew her name but I had certainly never heard of her father before this scandal.

El_Duderino 09

tritium wrote: »

Whether it’s “heading in the right direction” will very much depend on how this story evolves tbh. Metoo already had a pretty poor record of sidelining and marginalizing male victims. Argento isn’t the first prominent female metoo advocate to be accused of impropriety either. At least this time the wider movement seems to be saying hell no to people like Rose McGowan, whose lost a lot of credibility.

The real test will be do advocates afford the same standard in all cases. Already we’re seeing a mix of poorly thought out attempts to differentiate cases like this and, surprisingly, op-Ed’s that maybe we need to slow down and wait for due process because the rush to judgement to now was so unfair. It’s not that I disagree with waiting for due process but not he hypocrisy of folks like McGowan changing her tune on this once a female friend is accused makes for horrible optics.

I'd say it's clear that it's moving in the right direction as these cases are so much more likely to come to light.

I don't know who McGowan is either tbh. But I gather she has been vocal in there Cass but less critical in this case and Asia is her friend. There's a great reason we don't allow friends of the accused/alleged victim to be on a jury in court. Because we don't expect them tonnage clear judgement about a close friend as we do about a stranger.

I think holding her as the standard for metoo is just looking to stack the deck so you can be outraged.

tritium

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I'd say it's clear that it's moving in the right direction as these cases are so much more likely to come to light.

I don't know who McGowan is either tbh. But I gather she has been vocal in there Cass but less critical in this case and Asia is her friend. There's a great reason we don't allow friends of the accused/alleged victim to be on a jury in court. Because we don't expect them tonnage clear judgement about a close friend as we do about a stranger.

I think holding her as the standard for metoo is just looking to stack the deck so you can be outraged.

You don’t know who McGowan is? I don’t get how you can comment on metoo without knowing the actual story of it. There’s just too many gaps there without that knowledge and Rose McGowan is a pretty fundamental piece of the story.

Or are you just playing your previous games to misrepresent people?

Outlaw Pete

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yes but... I had never heard of Asia before this story and Tom Cruise is massive news when he does anything. He jumped on Opera’s sofa and it was front page news.

So an analogous story would be an actor I’ve never heard of who might have statutory raped a 17 year old actor.

Fair enough, their level of fame would make it more newsworthy, but I wasn't really referring to that aspect of things, I meant with regards to gender and as has been said, even an anecdote about James Woods apparently inviting a 16 year old to Vegas garnered far more vitriol and so I can only imagine what it would be like if he'd actually had sex with her in a hotel and posted online about how he was her 'daddy' and she his 'little girl' as he paced around his hotel room feeling 'alive!'

I'm not saying that there should be the same reaction to Asia doing what she did, than if a male actor did, I'm saying they should be similar. Personally I think there tends to be an overreaction when male actors or producers are said to have engaged in questionable behaviour, immediately labeling them evil monsters and an under reaction when it's a woman, as we've seen recently with the female professor at NYU, where excuses were made for her.

As for #metoo heading in the right direction, nonsense. With respect, you seem to have blinders on to just how destructive this #metoo movement has been. In my view (and that of others) three suicides have directly or indirectly resulted from this public naming and shaming of alleged abusers (Anthony Bourdain, Benny Fredriksson and Jill Messick) and it could easily have been more.

All #metoo did was make skipping due process fashionable for awhile and hopefully that will soon peter out. Cliff Richard recently won a case for how the BBC reported his arrest, so that can of nonsense should change and I think it's only a matter of time also before reporting one of these metoo anecdotes lands a network, publication or even an individual in court too and quite frankly, the sooner it does, the better. If people want to hashtag metoo without naming people, fine, but let's be honest, this has largely been about trial by social media of named individuals and that aspect of it all has been very destructive.

Which of course is in large part why it has been that Asia has not been given the benefit of doubt which she and Rose feels she should be, as people feel why should she be afforded something which she didn't afford others. Wait for due process and be gentle with her? When they showed no such mercy for any of the men who have been accused of much less crimes than what she has, and with a hell of lot less evidence of their guilt too.

batgoat

In general, I've seen similar levels of disgust directed at Argento but her profile is far lower than Weinstein so not going to get anywhere the same level of coverage. To claim this somehow discredits the me too movement is ridiculous and it has been reported by all major publications. It doesn't somehow change anything else that's happened.

Outlaw Pete

You're naive if you think that.

Asia was pretty much the face of the metoo movement along with Rose and these allegations discredit her, and bring into question her motives and her credibility, which in turn absolutely tarnishes the metoo movement.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

batgoat wrote: »

In general, I've seen similar levels of disgust directed at Argento but her profile is far lower than Weinstein so not going to get anywhere the same level of coverage. To claim this somehow discredits the me too movement is ridiculous and it has been reported by all major publications. It doesn't somehow change anything else that's happened.

Yeah, I gotta say outside of a few apologists, Argento seems to be getting the derision she deserves. Even the Guardian has written a few articles that don’t hold back.

The fame levels would play a part in these revelations making a smaller splash. She’s not very well known in this part of the world.

El_Duderino 09

batgoat wrote: »

In general, I've seen similar levels of disgust directed at Argento but her profile is far lower than Weinstein so not going to get anywhere the same level of coverage. To claim this somehow discredits the me too movement is ridiculous and it has been reported by all major publications. It doesn't somehow change anything else that's happened.

That’s the way I’ve seen this whole thing. I’m glad this guy had the platform to come forward and I don’t care which guilty parties are thrown under the bus to lubricator the wheels - as soon as they’re proved guilty of course.

I don’t think I’ve ever heard of Asia or McGowan before this incident. And I don’t care how any of them behave in any single incident. The movement is trundling forward and there’s nothing they can do to stop it in the single instance even if they want to.

That demonstrates the good the movement is doing overall, however it works out in individual cases. That’s for the courts to figure out.

El_Duderino 09

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

As for #metoo heading in the right direction, nonsense. With respect, you seem to have blinders on to just how destructive this #metoo movement has been. In my view (and that of others) three suicides have directly or indirectly resulted from this public naming and shaming of alleged abusers (Anthony Bourdain, Benny Fredriksson and Jill Messick) and it could easily have been more.

All #metoo did was make skipping due process fashionable for awhile and hopefully that will soon peter out. Cliff Richard recently won a case for how the BBC reported his arrest, so that can of nonsense should change and I think it's only a matter of time also before reporting one of these metoo anecdotes lands a network, publication or even an individual in court too and quite frankly, the sooner it does, the better. If people want to hashtag metoo without naming people, fine, but let's be honest, this has largely been about trial by social media of named individuals and that aspect of it all has been very destructive.

Which of course is in large part why it has been that Asia has not been given the benefit of doubt which she and Rose feels she should be, as people feel why should she be afforded something which she didn't afford others. Wait for due process and be gentle with her? When they showed no such mercy for any of the men who have been accused of much less crimes than what she has, and with a hell of lot less evidence of their guilt too.

I don’t think I’ve seen many people in this thread sayings should wait for all the info to come through before passing judgement. You’re criticising the ‘other side’ for doing the exact same thing that everyone else is doing.

I feel I’m in the minority for not pretending to have all the info. Since when is it so unfashionable to want to leave it to the court to decide?

Oh, that’s just the metoo crowd who go in for that kind of carry on, right?

RabbleRouser2k

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Her name didn’t stand out even after Weinstein. I googled her and saw the same info you posted. I hadn’t seen any of those movies or hadn’t seen her before as far as I know.

To be fair ‘obscure Male actor you’ve never heard of, might have had sex with 17 year old actor you’ve never heard of’ doesn’t make an amazing headline. But Tom cruise, or James woods are instantly recognisable.

This story shows that it’s moving in the right direction thanks in large part to metoo

I don't think it's moving in the right direction-in fight I think it's veered in all the wrong directions. McGowan was tainted long before she spoke of Weinstein's assault. She had no problem working with Victor Salva, but then again goes after James Franco or Woody Allen.
She claimed she 'got out of acting' because its all comic book movies. Yet she was attached, at one point, to a Red Sonja movie to be directed by her boyfriend Robert Rodriguez. (He left his wife because of her). Because she was box office poison, that movie didn't happen.

Ditto Uma Thurman complaining about Tarantino and Weinstein. Now her daughter just got a major acting role in QT's new movie.

It all feels self serving.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Not really. All those films are pretty niche. Except maybe the Vin Diesel one and many people avoid his films with good reason. And her father is well-known in Italy and maybe with horror film fans internationally. I can easily see why many people wouldn’t have heard of her. I knew her name but I had certainly never heard of her father before this scandal.

I love movies, so I find that strange. Dario was an Italian horror legend (his movies now...are rather bad. As in he's still making movies). But I can understand how people don't know who he is.

Yeah-I'm no fan of Vinnie D. I think Iron Giant and GotG are his only two good movies. (Never cared for Saving Private Ryan-he's not bad in it, I'm just not a fan of the movie).
Vin Diesel himself seems an okay kind of guy. It's just his movies I've never dug.

El_Duderino 09

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Her name didn’t stand out even after Weinstein. I googled her and saw the same info you posted. I hadn’t seen any of those movies or hadn’t seen her before as far as I know.

To be fair ‘obscure Male actor you’ve never heard of, might have had sex with 17 year old actor you’ve never heard of’ doesn’t make an amazing headline. But Tom cruise, or James woods are instantly recognisable.

This story shows that it’s moving in the right direction thanks in large part to metoo

I don't think it's moving in the right direction-in fight I think it's veered in all the wrong directions. McGowan was tainted long before she spoke of Weinstein's assault. She had no problem working with Victor Salva, but then again goes after James Franco or Woody Allen.
She claimed she 'got out of acting' because its all comic book movies. Yet she was attached, at one point, to a Red Sonja movie to be directed by her boyfriend Robert Rodriguez. (He left his wife because of her). Because she was box office poison, that movie didn't happen.

Ditto Uma Thurman complaining about Tarantino and Weinstein. Now her daughter just got a major acting role in QT's new movie.

It all feels self serving.

You're focusing on individuals as if they are the movement. The movement is happening even if some individuals involved behave duplicitously.

The fact that the 17 year old actor could come forward IS part of the metoo legacy. The same with the PHD student who was subject of a recent thread. Metoo has given a platform to those people and McGowan can object all she likes.

Isn't the consensus that McGowan is not getting any traction in the Asia case? Doesn't that demonstrate that no matter how influential an individual is within the movement, they can't stop the movement from supporting the alleged victim?

PlaneSpeeking

Nauseating to see the defence from Lysette Anthony yesterday.

https://perezhilton.com/2018-08-26-asia-argento-lysette-anthony-defense-quote-comment-me-too-movement/

Anthony remains the only actress that I'm aware of to sleep her way to the bottom.

tritium

Tbh it feels like metoo is at a fulcrum point. Whether these allegations are good or bad for it very much depends on how the wider movement and it’s support base reacts to it. It’s not clear yet what that outcome will be, so for most of us, certainly those who support accountability, all we can do is watch and wait.

#metoo started out with a lot of pace. It’s profile grew quickly and it acted to confirm stories that had sat around Hollywood and elsewhere for decades. One of the criticisms of the speed of that growth was that there was a rush to bypass any due process, and many individuals found themselves ostracized on the back of rumour or vague allegation. In some cases there was a mere whisper campaign that upended individuals.

Equally many of the most vocal advocates were slow to have their own backgrounds scrutinized, and it gained a tribalism at times. When Cristina Garcia was accused of sexual harassment the silence from most quarters of metoo was startling.Rose McGowan raised against hypocrisy while cozying up to a child molester. like many revolutionaries, they found that, once they had taken control, they became just as corrupted by the power. It was notable too on many of the twitter exchanges, where several male victims, including some who were at the forefront of metoo from early on, were marginalized and excluded. Key figures like Argento and McGowan definitely helped fuel this, their statements turning metoo into “us vs them” rather than a force for change against all forms of corruption of power.

Now it’s hit it’s second speed bump, and it’s notable how a somewhat more mature movement is reacting to it. There appears to be two camps forming - one that is willing to be inclusive in its criticism and one that remains deeply polarizing. Many outlets like the Guardian actually seem caught between these two poles, with commentary that shifts between the two extremes. In there somewhere is a call from more moderate voices to respect due process, however there’s a real danger that that call will be seen as self serving given many of the figures caught up in this were themselves keen to dispense with due process.

Its obvious certainly that this turn of events has caught the movement by surprise on many levels. What seems most likely now is something of a power struggle. Argento and McGowan (and a number of others) are coming out of the current revelations as quite toxic. Whether the movement ditches both them and their mindset will be key to what happens next.

Outlaw Pete

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I don’t think I’ve seen many people in this thread sayings should wait for all the info to come through before passing judgement.

Then you haven't been paying attention. From the start the cornerstone of the metoo movement has been 'believe women' and those objecting to that have always maintained that that is a ridiculous position to take in that it circumvents due process (initially at least) in favour of public naming and shaming.

You’re criticising the ‘other side’ for doing the exact same thing that everyone else is doing.

Again you're not paying attention. No matter what 'side' someone is on I feel it should be illegal to name them publicly before they have even been charged with anything, be they John Leslie, Weinstein or Asia Argento.

PlaneSpeeking

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Then you haven't been paying attention. From the start the cornerstone of the metoo movement has been 'believe women' and those objecting to that have always maintained that that is a ridiculous position to take in that it circumvents due process (initially at least) in favour of public naming and shaming.



Again you're not paying attention. No matter what 'side' someone is on I feel it should be illegal to name them publicly before they have even been charged with anything, be they John Leslie, Weinstein or Asia Argento.

Ed Westwick was the one that got me - fired from a play called Ordeal by Innocence by accusation alone.

Fair drips with irony that, and not in a good way.

Outlaw Pete

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

Nauseating to see the defence from Lysette Anthony yesterday.

Ah yes, Lysette Anthony, yet another of these metoo women that claim Harvey raped them, but yet went onto to have a sexual relationship with him over many years.

When will people wake up that this movement is rotten to it's core.

PlaneSpeeking

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Ah yes, Lysette Anthony, yet another of these metoo women that claim Harvey raped them, but yet went onto to have a sexual relationship with him over many years.

When will people wake up that this movement is rotten to it's core.

I would love to say soon but it's far too self serving in nature and I fear we are stuck with it.