Che Guevara features on new €1 stamp issued by An Post

amtc

donegaLroad wrote: »

Does An Post have the final say as to what stamps are selected?

There's a annual stamp programme with representatives of An Post and others and then a proposal goes to the Board of An Post but the final decision is the Government. I think the President also has a part in approval.

amtc

If you look at www.irishstamps.ie you can suggest stamps for next year.

steddyeddy

timthumbni wrote: »

Che killed 6 British soldiers and 4 Protestants before he was killed himself don’t ya know....

Jesus man do all your posts have to be sectarian?

Tom Mann Centuria

donegaLroad wrote: »

I think that this could be a marketing strategy by An Post to raise revenue on the run up to Christmas.

I think you're probably right there. At the end of the day it's a commercial decision from an organisation trying to make money. It'll probably sell very well being such an instantly recognisable image.

jackboy

Tom Mann Centuria wrote: »

I think you're probably right there. At the end of the day it's a commercial decision from an organisation trying to make money. It'll probably sell very well being such an instantly recognisable image.

I still find it hard to believe this stamp is real. There are plenty of famous images that could be used instead. Also, I thought that some company had the rights to Che,s image.

amtc

Tom Mann Centuria wrote: »

I think you're probably right there. At the end of the day it's a commercial decision from an organisation trying to make money. It'll probably sell very well being such an instantly recognisable image.

Actually An Post make a loss on stamp sales! Anyway focus is always on selling Christmas stamp booklets.

Tom Mann Centuria

amtc wrote: »

Actually An Post make a loss on stamp sales!

Do they do as many limited edition stamps as the Royal Mail? I'm not really a stamp collector but I do buy sets or first day covers if I like the subjects matter. (and see them advertised, or here on boards!)

Berserker

donegaLroad wrote: »

I think that this could be a marketing strategy by An Post to raise revenue on the run up to Christmas.

Are people really going to buy stamps just because a certain person is on them? Putting collectors aside, of course.

Tom Mann Centuria

Berserker wrote: »

Are people really going to buy stamps just because a certain person is on them? Putting collectors aside, of course.

I bought the retro toy stamps royal mail had because I liked the images, and got some French stamps because they had Asterix on. I'll buy this too, purely for the image on it.

Full Marx

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Are you oblivious to the criminal blockade the US has imposed on Cuba?

At least all Cubans have free access to decent Healthcare and education... Something unheard of in your precious America.

Cuba has done OK. It's a better place to live than a lot of other similar and nearby developing countries.

As for the stamp, it's pretty cool. Aside from the man himself the image is iconic and deserving of a stamp imo.

amtc

Tom Mann Centuria wrote: »

Do they do as many limited edition stamps as the Royal Mail? I'm not really a stamp collector but I do buy sets or first day covers if I like the subjects matter. (and see them advertised, or here on boards!)

If you have a look at www.irishstamps.ie you can see the 2017 programme. I think it's 17 this year. There were all kind of ideas a few years ago about scented stamps and edible ones. I don't know if any of them got into production!

fryup

classic liveline fodder

Biggest lickspittle on boardz

seachto7 wrote: »

Yawn.

What's the yawn crap about? The poster made a perfectly valid point, whether you like it or not.

I might not agree with her politics but her post was perfectly acceptable in this case.

donegaLroad

Berserker wrote: »

Are people really going to buy stamps just because a certain person is on them? Putting collectors aside, of course.

I'd say if you put someone like Jimi Hendrix on a stamp they would sell like hotcakes..... wait, sorry.... I'm the wrong generation

Justin Beiber

blade1

Have we run out of Irish icons or something?

Amalgam

There's very grainy black and white footage of either Castro or Guevara torturing/taunting a man before shooting him point blank in the face.

Looking forward to the Father Brendan Smyth stamp..

Amalgam

Berserker wrote: »

Are people really going to buy stamps just because a certain person is on them? Putting collectors aside, of course.

Sending out the arcade classic stamps (http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=92538151) got so many mentions from people, got a lot of feedback on the cat stamps from a few years back too.

All types of people love receiving a fancy stamp!

Hotblack Desiato

Full Marx wrote: »

At least all Cubans have free access to decent Healthcare and education.

That really makes up for not having freedom of speech, free access to information, and freedom to travel, doesn't it!

As for the 'blockade', any country is free to choose to not do business with any other if it so desires. If communism was any use, they'd have no need or desire to trade with 'evil capitalists' anyway. The US is a handy scapegoat for the corrupt Cuban regime's impoverishment and oppression of its own people.

Synthol

Everything is racist!! Take it down immediately, I demand this as it offends me. This post stamp traumatised me and ruined my life as the racism of it is out of this world. I have never in my whole life have seen something so blatantly racist. Imagine if a child saw this! Please take it down before it's too late and cause catastrophic damage.

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

20Cent wrote: »

He married a black woman, insisted on integrated schools way before they had them in the US, even condemned discrimination against black people in the UN. But an out of context note from a diary when he was you makes him a racist. :rolleyes:

I don't know if you meant the rolleyes for them but I think they were making the same point as you.

maryishere wrote: »

lol. Reminds me of 1983 when Taoiseach Haughey thought it was great to get a dig at the British over the "Malvinas" war, and then he wondered why we got no tourists from the UK the following year.

Is ok with the "Falklands" war but not other kinds of wars.

In my opinion, some of ye - on both sides - should calm down a bit and take the blinkers clouded by your ideologies off.

Che Guevara had good intentions initially but, the usual, became corrupted by power. Comparisons with Stalin, Pol Pot, Cromwell, nazis though - cop on.

And those saying Cuba is great - also cop on. People are starving there, people have fled in droves. There is no such thing as free healthcare. Just because they don't pay health insurance premiums doesn't mean they don't pay unaffordable sums of money to the state.

The praising of that murderous dictator Castro (again, who did have good intentions initially but turned for the worse) was a disgrace, particularly by people who are usually on a mission against violence and oppression. Similar for Che Guevara (but at least not at the same level - yet). People who gloss over his violence are hypocrites. This stamp is populist nonsense and a bit baffling.

As for capitalism being so terrible, get rid of the laptop or phone so, and leave the west. Greed is objectionable - capitalism allows people to set up their own business though, it allows people not to have to suffer like people did in eastern Europe, it means the state doesn't control every enterprise, it drives prices down because companies have to compete. It can still coexist with state supports. It can exist without crazed greed - too many people seem to think that's all capitalism is.

timthumbni

steddyeddy wrote: »

Jesus man do all your posts have to be sectarian?

I think you will find that it was your chums in the Ira that were happy to be sectarian. Personally I’m an atheist.

Synthol

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

I don't know if you meant the rolleyes for them but I think they were making the same point as you.

Is ok with the "Falklands" war but not other kinds of wars.

In my opinion, some of ye - on both sides - should calm down a bit and take the blinkers clouded by your ideologies off.

Che Guevara had good intentions initially but, the usual, became corrupted by power. Comparisons with Stalin, Pol Pot, Cromwell, nazis though - cop on.

And those saying Cuba is great - also cop on. People are starving there, people have fled in droves. There is no such thing as free healthcare. Just because they don't pay health insurance premiums doesn't mean they don't pay unaffordable sums of money to the state.

The praising of that murderous dictator Castro (again, who did have good intentions initially but turned for the worse) was a disgrace, particularly by people who are usually on a mission against violence and oppression. Similar for Che Guevara (but at least not at the same level - yet). People who gloss over his violence are hypocrites. This stamp is populist nonsense and a bit baffling.

As for capitalism being so terrible, get rid of the laptop or phone so, and leave the west. Greed is objectionable - capitalism allows people to set up their own business though, it allows people not to have to suffer like people did in eastern Europe, it means the state doesn't control every enterprise, it drives prices down because companies have to compete. It can still coexist with state supports. It can exist without crazed greed - too many people seem to think that's all capitalism is.

Have you been there yourself and seen it happen? Or do you trust the fake news propaganda media which has been shown to be false on soooo many occasions. Look up Mark Dice on YouTube, he exposes all the fake news and propaganda. If you do not want to look it up then that tells me you are not interested in the truth and rather believe the mainstream media.

dirtyden

Amalgam wrote: »

There's very grainy black and white footage of either Castro or Guevara torturing/taunting a man before shooting him point blank in the face.

Looking forward to the Father Brendan Smyth stamp..

Ok, so what your saying is because their is grainy footage of someone who might look like Guevara maybe doing something wrong he is a paedo?

Interesting 'logic'.

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

timthumbni wrote: »

I think you will find that it was your chums in the Ira that were happy to be sectarian. Personally I’m an atheist.

Jeez, bit one-sided! The IRA were murdering bastards but when it comes to sectarianism, loyalists were/are worse - even Kevin Myers would concede that. Republicans didn't throw bags of urine and other missiles and scream obscenities at little kids walking to a protestant school like.

Synthol wrote: »

Have you been there yourself and seen it happen? Or do you trust the fake news propaganda media which has been shown to be false on soooo many occasions. Look up Mark Dice on YouTube, he exposes all the fake news and propaganda. If you do not want to look it up then that tells me you are not interested in the truth and rather believe the mainstream media.

The mainstream media isn't always untruthful you know - don't buy into the latest far right or far left fad of choosing to believe absolutely everything reported by the mainstream media is a lie. I'ma put more faith in a BBC report than e.g. an obscure website pushing a particular agenda.

So how come many many Cubans fled in their droves?

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

dirtyden wrote: »

Ok, so what your saying is because their is grainy footage of someone who might look like Guevara maybe doing something wrong he is a paedo?

Interesting 'logic'.

Think they mean he was "as bad as". They should compare like with like imo though.

Synthol

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

Jeez, bit one-sided! The IRA were murdering bastards but when it comes to sectarianism, loyalists were/are worse - even Kevin Myers would concede that. Republicans didn't throw bags of urine and other missiles and scream obscenities at little kids walking to a protestant school like.

The mainstream media isn't always untruthful you know - don't buy into the latest far right or far left fad of choosing to believe absolutely everything reported by the mainstream media is a lie. I'ma put more faith in a BBC report than in an obscure website pushing a particular agenda.

So how come many many Cubans fled in their droves?

Yep, close your eyes and ignore the truth. Bye bye. If if keeps you happy then good for you

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

Synthol wrote: »

Yep, close your eyes and ignore the truth. Bye bye. If if keeps you happy then good for you

You didn't answer my question - why did so many ordinary Cubans flee the Castro regime?

Synthol

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

You didn't answer my question - why did so many ordinary Cubans flee the Castro regime?

Why do so many Irish flee to us and Australia?

jackofalltrades

So any discussion of this mans legacy seems to be met with "cry baby","right winger","yawn","Donald Trump" and other such dross.
This thread really shows you how posters seem to be increasingly moving away from rational discussion and focusing more on thanks whoring and petty jibes.

timthumbni

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

Jeez, bit one-sided! The IRA were murdering bastards but when it comes to sectarianism, loyalists were/are worse - even Kevin Myers would concede that. Republicans didn't throw bags of urine and other missiles and scream obscenities at little kids walking to a protestant school like.

The mainstream media isn't always untruthful you know - don't buy into the latest far right or far left fad of choosing to believe absolutely everything reported by the mainstream media is a lie. I'ma put more faith in a BBC report than e.g. an obscure website pushing a particular agenda.

So how come many many Cubans fled in their droves?

Indeed. But I despise loyalist terrorists just as much as I do republican terrorists unlike some on here who are sf/Ira cheerleaders at every turn. Republicans blew up wee children so in a league table of being ***** the Ira would win every time.

Re the che stamp I find it funny as it reminds me of some clueless moron of a student wearing a che t-shirt at university.

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

Synthol wrote: »

Why do so many Irish flee to us and Australia?

To work/have a long holiday. Most come back too.

Come on, not an effective comparison.

Synthol

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

To work

Exactly

Uosdwis R. Dewoh

Synthol wrote: »

Exactly

I like the way you left the rest out!

They do come back though - and always plan to come back. They don't flee in desperation either. Surely the egalitarian utopia of Cuba (with its leader in a palace) would have work for them?

You're equating escaping a country with going on a long working holiday - come on, it's very dishonest.

Synthol

Uosdwis R. Dewoh wrote: »

I like the way you left the rest out!

They do come back though - and always plan to come back. They don't flee in desperation either. Surely the egalitarian utopia of Cuba (with its leader in a palace) would have work for them?

You're equating escaping a country with going on a long working holiday - come on, it's very dishonest.

If you say so

steddyeddy

timthumbni wrote: »

I think you will find that it was your chums in the Ira that were happy to be sectarian. Personally I’m an atheist.

Because I'm Irish I have chums in the IRA? I think you've been brainwashed dude.

Skylinehead

timthumbni wrote: »

I think you will find that it was your chums in the Ira that were happy to be sectarian. Personally I’m an atheist.

steddyeddy wrote: »

Because I'm Irish I have chums in the IRA? I think you've been brainwashed dude.

Mod: I don't know what the hell you're trying to achieve in this thread but it stops now. Both of you.

c_man

20Cent wrote: »

Statues of KKK members and those who fought for slavery fine.
Stamp of Che they lose their minds.
lol.

Who are you talking about? Specifically.

steddyeddy

I don't know enough about Che to decide whether it's a good or bad thing to have him on a stamp. Some of his comments seems racist, but then again some of his actions make it counter-intuitive to label him as such. It's also interesting how we label some people as racist yet defend some people's racism as being "a symptom of the time".

For instance Winston Churchill is widely regarded as a great man around some parts, but he came out with the following during his lifetime:

I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place.
-Churchill addressing the Peel Commission (1937) on why Britain is justified in deciding the fate of Palestine


I am strongly in favour of using poisonous gas against uncivilised tribes
-Churchill on how Britain should deal with the Iraqi revolution against British rule in 1920


Gandhi-ism and everything it stands for will have to be grappled with and crushed
-Churchill, on the independence movement in India, 1930


"It is alarming and also nauseating to see Mr. Gandhi, a seditious Middle Temple lawyer of the type well-known in the East, now posing as a fakir, striding half naked up the steps of the Viceregal palace to parley on equal terms with the representative of the King-Emperor."
-Comment on Gandhi's meeting with the British Viceroy of India, addressing the Council of the West Essex Unionist Association (23 February 1931); as quoted in "Mr Churchill on India" in The Times (24 February 1931)


I hate Indians. They are a beastly people with a beastly religion.
-Entry dated to September 1942 on a conversation held with Churchill in Leo Amery : Diaries.


I hope it would be bitter and bloody!
-Churchill, upon hearing news of conflict between the Muslim League and Indian Congress, July 1940


If food is scarce, why isn't Gandhi dead yet?
-Churchill's witty retort to British Secretary of State for India Leo Amery's telegram for food stock to relieve the famine of Bengal in 1943 (4 million peopled starved to death.)


Relief would do no good, Indians breed like rabbits and will outstrip any available food supply
-Leo Amery records Churchill's stance on why famine relief was refused to India, 1944

---

Was Churchill's thinking merely a 'product of his time'? Let's look at how others 'of his time' viewed him:


On the subject of India, Winston is not quite sane... I didn't see much difference between his outlook and Hitler's
-Leo Amery, British Secretary of State for India

c_man

Churchill being a racist has definitely moved me into the pro-Che camp.

steddyeddy

c_man wrote: »

Churchill being a racist has definitely moved me into the pro-Che camp.

I'm npt defending Che. I'm wondering how many figures that are idolised have skeletons in their closet.

c_man

steddyeddy wrote: »

I'm npt defending Che. I'm wondering how many figures that are idolised have skeletons in their closet.

Ah I'm just pulling the pi$$. We're all flawed in some way or another which is why "hero" worship is a bad thing when we elevate someone way beyond where we should.

Personally I don't think the stamp thing is such a hot idea. From this thread I've learned that makes me a Trump supporting, KKK loving, right-wing agitator. It's all come as news to me I tells ya.

steddyeddy

Maybe there should have been a vote on who to include of the stamps. If you're going to send someone a letter with an image of someone on it, make sure it's someone the majority can get behind.

Tom Mann Centuria

steddyeddy wrote: »

Maybe there should have been a vote on who to include of the stamps. If you're going to send someone a letter with an image of someone on it, make sure it's someone the majority can get behind.

Stampy mcstampface

Those poor Nationalist resident's of Northern Ireland don't get a choice, queenie is on all the stamps.

A Dub in Glasgo

I am in Dublin next week, I will pick one up at the PO

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

20Cent

Che would have been in Bolivia a year when that alleged incident happened.

c_man

20Cent wrote: »

Che would have been in Bolivia a year when that alleged incident happened.

Hey, *waves* who the hell were you talking about?

20Cent wrote: »

Statues of KKK members and those who fought for slavery fine.
Stamp of Che they lose their minds.
lol.

20Cent

c_man wrote: »

20Cent wrote: »

Che would have been in Bolivia a year when that alleged incident happened.

Hey, *waves* who the hell were you talking about?

20Cent wrote: »

Statues of KKK members and those who fought for slavery fine.
Stamp of Che they lose their minds.
lol.

The right.

c_man

20Cent wrote: »

The right.

So no-one in particular has said this, not here, not online, not anywhere? Just in your head. And you're just attempting to link that distasteful subject/argument (again, in your head) with the current topic in a hope to taint anyone who opposes you by association? Wow, that's powerful stuff man. Deffo onto a winner.

Carry

People who are getting a hissy fit about a stamp should relax a little.

Apart from that history is always a thing of perspective (the pick and mix variety, whatever suits the current trend or the wishful or political thinking of individuals), I get the impression that the posters here, which oppose strongly Che Guevara on a stamp and are frantically searching the internet to find out what he did wrong or attributing wrongdoings to him he didn't commit, are those who otherwise don't have a problem with pitchfork justice (approximate quotes: "Car crash? That was a Muslim!", "People on the dole? Should be confined to chain gangs!", "Women having an opinion that doesn't suit me? Feminazi!").

Guevara is a 20th century political pop-icon, he is of Irish descent, he was no mass murderer, nor a dictator - he refused to go into government with Castro after the Yanks were kicked out of Cuba.

Don't put too much into him being on a stamp. That picture, created after a famous photo by an Irish artist, is known around the world. So why not having his likeness on a stamp?

Besides, he was a fine looking specimen of a man ...