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Bar Levy Expiry - Legal?

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  • 07-10-2017 5:31pm
    #1
    Pints?
    Registered Users Posts: 98 ✭✭


    Sorry if this is in wrong area.

    Every year at my club we pay a bar levy at start of year to encourage the use of the bar. This is something I'm in favour of. This year I haven't been in the bar at all and had money left over on my card from the levy.

    However this was taken back my the club as I hadn't used it within calender year. They do say they it must be used within the the year however I'm pretty sure this is illegal. It's like the gift card situation few years ago. Technically it's legal tender as I've already paid for it so can't have an expiry.

    Just looking for confirmation on this or where I'd find out!

    Thanks


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    #2
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Pints? wrote: »
    Sorry if this is in wrong area.

    Every year at my club we pay a bar levy at start of year to encourage the use of the bar. This is something I'm in favour of. This year I haven't been in the bar at all and had money left over on my card from the levy.

    However this was taken back my the club as I hadn't used it within calender year. They do say they it must be used within the the year however I'm pretty sure this is illegal. It's like the gift card situation few years ago. Technically it's legal tender as I've already paid for it so can't have an expiry.

    Just looking for confirmation on this or where I'd find out!

    Thanks

    I know the government published a framework to make expiry periods illegal, but I don't think it was ever enacted into law, maybe it was. The ccpc website just says to note expiry dates before you buy gift cards so they seem to be still legal. If they are, and you were told about it, then you are out of luck.


    https://www.ccpc.ie/consumers/shopping/gift-vouchers/gift-voucher-card-expiry-date/


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    #3
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    If it is designated as a levy then it is not a gift card but a charge that entitles a degree of use of the bar.


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    #4
    CeilingFly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭CeilingFly


    Pints? wrote: »
    They do say they it must be used within the the year however I'm pretty sure this is illegal. It's like the gift card situation few years ago. Technically it's legal tender as I've already paid for it so can't have an expiry.

    I'll guess you are not studying law or in a job that requires understanding of the word "legal"

    1. It is NOT legal tender in any way shape orvform.

    2. If there are terms and conditions attached, then those terms and conditions apply.

    3. Quite standard that a club bar levy whether a gaa club, golf club or any other club is for uae in the year of the pertaining membership.

    4. Illegal? What law have they broken?


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    #5
    Pints?
    Registered Users Posts: 98 ✭✭Pints?


    CeilingFly wrote: »
    I'll guess you are not studying law or in a job that requires understanding of the word "legal"

    1. It is NOT legal tender in any way shape orvform.

    2. If there are terms and conditions attached, then those terms and conditions apply.

    3. Quite standard that a club bar levy whether a gaa club, golf club or any other club is for uae in the year of the pertaining membership.

    4. Illegal? What law have they broken?

    Terms and conditions mean nothing if not legal.
    Judging by your condescending tone I'm assuming you have a law degree. Enjoy being a prick...unfortunately that's not illegal.


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    #6
    CeilingFly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭CeilingFly


    Pints? wrote: »
    Terms and conditions mean nothing if not legal.
    Judging by your condescending tone I'm assuming you have a law degree. Enjoy being a prick...unfortunately that's not illegal.

    No, i have common sense.

    Something you are lacking if you think your situation is illegal.

    Again, what law have they broken?


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    #7
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 69,023 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Pints? wrote: »
    Terms and conditions mean nothing if not legal.
    Judging by your condescending tone I'm assuming you have a law degree. Enjoy being a prick...unfortunately that's not illegal.

    If you don't like a response, challenge it rather than replying like this.


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    #8
    Snotty
    Registered Users Posts: 1,298 ✭✭✭Snotty


    The levy is there to encourage use of the facilities, the club benifit from those facilties and may rely on them to continue to keep the club going.
    As a member of that club, do you not understand this and want to support the club?

    Also, let me guess, golf club?


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    #9
    Pints?
    Registered Users Posts: 98 ✭✭Pints?


    Snotty wrote: »
    The levy is there to encourage use of the facilities, the club benifit from those facilties and may rely on them to continue to keep the club going.
    As a member of that club, do you not understand this and want to support the club?

    Also, let me guess, golf club?

    Tennis club.
    But what's to stop them saying it has to be used in a week? Unrealistic I know but there has to be some law or regulation around it and that's what I'm looking for.
    As I said I'm all in favour of it and every year I would always spend at least double it. This year was just a freak year due to accident.


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    #10
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Pints? wrote: »
    Tennis club.
    But what's to stop them saying it has to be used in a week? Unrealistic I know but there has to be some law or regulation around it and that's what I'm looking for.
    As I said I'm all in favour of it and every year I would always spend at least double it. This year was just a freak year due to accident.

    A year is the usual term as this coincides with a yearly subscription. The law you are looking for relates to expiry dates, it doesn't exist at the moment. You knew the expiry date when paying, a year is a long time to use it up. As a previous poster said, they are not legal tender.


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    #11
    Snotty
    Registered Users Posts: 1,298 ✭✭✭Snotty


    Pints? wrote: »
    Tennis club.
    But what's to stop them saying it has to be used in a week? Unrealistic I know but there has to be some law or regulation around it and that's what I'm looking for.
    As I said I'm all in favour of it and every year I would always spend at least double it. This year was just a freak year due to accident.


    Do you understand how a club works at all? You don't have to pay the levy, it's completely your decisions to join the club.
    Also, I'm sure there is a committee and AGM where these things are discussed, club members are normally involved, but yes they can make you spend it in one week, they could also require you to ware a rabbit costume and hop around when at the club.


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    #12
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Pints? wrote: »
    Tennis club.
    But what's to stop them saying it has to be used in a week? Unrealistic I know but there has to be some law or regulation around it and that's what I'm looking for.
    As I said I'm all in favour of it and every year I would always spend at least double it. This year was just a freak year due to accident.

    It's called Club Rules. Members set them.


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    #13
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,971 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Pints? wrote: »
    Tennis club.
    But what's to stop them saying it has to be used in a week? Unrealistic I know but there has to be some law or regulation around it and that's what I'm looking for.
    As I said I'm all in favour of it and every year I would always spend at least double it. This year was just a freak year due to accident.

    Why has there to be some law or regulation around it?

    There isn't a law for everything.

    As far as I know there is nothing to stop them saying it has to be used in a week, so long as that is a club rule enacted in accordance with the general rules of the club.


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    #14
    CeilingFly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭CeilingFly


    Pints? wrote: »
    Terms and conditions mean nothing if not legal.
    Judging by your condescending tone I'm assuming you have a law degree. Enjoy being a prick...unfortunately that's not illegal.

    I might have been a little harsh in the reply - but probably saving you from embarrassment in the club and isn't it better to get a nasty reply annomonously than from some committee member you will see every weekend.

    Legal tender is bank notes and coin that must be accepted where a debt has already created. It means nothing in the normal course of retail or service industry unless you have an account in debit with someone. So, don't even mention it.

    As for illegal - there is no law on the staute books to cover this or even gift cards (that legislation is still to be enacted) and any card can have any expiry date it wishes.

    As I say regularly, its always better to ask politely when you want something done that is outside what someone must do - if you were ill or had an injury or were away for a few months and couldn't attend the club you could appeal, but aside from that you could say you didn't understand and ask if they'd return 50% of the balance to your card.

    But telling them its illegal or saying its legal tender will get the type of reply you won't like.


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    #15
    stronglikebull
    Registered Users Posts: 477 ✭✭stronglikebull


    Pints? wrote: »
    Tennis club.
    But what's to stop them saying it has to be used in a week?

    Nothing is stopping them. They could just as easily say it has to be used within 5 minutes, but doing so would mean no one would ever pay it in the first place. As a member of the club you can go to the AGM and challenge this rule, and ask for it to be changed. You'll need support from other members to do this though. Also, a year is a perfectly reasonable timeframe, and if it were to be longer then it could effect the long term running of the club, so it's unlikely that you'd ever get support to change it.

    Long and short, you didn't pay attention to the rules and you lost out. Move on, and don't worry about it.


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    #16
    clint_silver
    Registered Users Posts: 2,900 ✭✭✭clint_silver


    Pints? wrote: »
    Sorry if this is in wrong area.

    Every year at my club we pay a bar levy at start of year to encourage the use of the bar. This is something I'm in favour of. This year I haven't been in the bar at all and had money left over on my card from the levy.

    However this was taken back my the club as I hadn't used it within calender year. They do say they it must be used within the the year however I'm pretty sure this is illegal. It's like the gift card situation few years ago. Technically it's legal tender as I've already paid for it so can't have an expiry.

    Just looking for confirmation on this or where I'd find out!

    Thanks

    From my dealings with committees and sitting on them them and listening to appeals of all sorts, I would suggest to write a very nice letter to them, explaining very clearly and very nicely could they look on the situation favorably to extending your levy to next year as you had extenuating circumstances that prevented you from using the bar at all in previous year.

    It will be brought up at a meeting, discussed and a decision arrived at.

    Thank them for their time in considering it whether or not the decision is favorable towards you.


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