Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018

greendom

Arne_Saknussem wrote: »

I have to say i'm not too confident that they will, it's not like they have a track record of making excellent football decisions.

The reason they were forced to give Arsene a new 2 year deal last year was because they were absolutely in no position not to as they had nobody lined up.

And if it's true that there is only £50m to spend in the summer if they give it to the wrong guy we might not see Champions League football for a few years at least.

The club realised it wasn't in a position to properly replace Wenger so they gave him another contract. They weren't prepared to put a new guy in charge until they had the club structured as they wanted it. Sounds like good management to me

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

The club realised it wasn't in a position to properly replace Wenger so they gave him another contract. They weren't prepared to put a new guy in charge until they had the club structured as they wanted it. Sounds like good management to me

So why end his contract after only one year then? Nothing has changed, in fact we have gone down another notch. All that has changes is the two new boys in the background but the football has not changed.

Quazzie

tayto lover wrote: »

So why end his contract after only one year then? Nothing has changed, in fact we have gone down another notch. All that has changes is the two new boys in the background but the football has not changed.

That's the point tho. They gave him a new contract in the belief he'd get back in the top 4 this year, and that gave them two years to make the transition possible. Fans absence in the stands, and a much lower uptake on season ticket sales has forced their hand tho and they've decided to bring forward the change by a year. In the background the big changes are already made, so now it's time for changes on the field. Wenger couldn't achieve the success he had promised this year, so he's out the door.

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

So why end his contract after only one year then? Nothing has changed, in fact we have gone down another notch. All that has changes is the two new boys in the background but the football has not changed.

Way more than 2 appointments. The whole back office has been completely restructured...


https://shewore.com/2017/11/29/whos-who-in-arsenals-back-room-shake-up/

BenK

greendom wrote: »

Gazidis has stated that the new appointment won't be a replacement for Wenger, the club will have to find a new path. They have already been working towards this with a plethora of new appointments behind the scenes. Experienced, successful guys carrying out functions that used to be Wenger's domain.

The club is putting a lot of thought into this, it is doing all it can to avoid what happened to United post Ferguson (and post Busby come to that).

No guarantees but I'm confident the club will end up appointing the right guy even if it's not my first choice or ends up being completely left field.

You could very well be right, I suppose nobody really knows at the moment how it's going to work out as it's a pretty unique situation. United post Fergie is the best recent example I can think of (though of course not exactly the same). Things have gone stale under Wenger and I can certainly understand the demand for a new manager and a change.

No matter who is employed in the other roles within the club though, if the first team manager/coach (whatever you want to call him) isn't experienced, successful, strong-willed etc. I feel ye could struggle for a while until the club properly adapts to the huge change of Wenger leaving.

No guarantee with whoever ye appoint but people like Arteta, Vieira etc. would be huge unnecessary risks I feel.

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

Way more than 2 appointments. The whole back office has been completely restructured...


https://shewore.com/2017/11/29/whos-who-in-arsenals-back-room-shake-up/

That's good but it doesn't explain why Wenger's contract was broken (thankfully) with a year to go. Something must have happened. I thought they must have had someone to bring in straight away to announce his leaving at this point but if they have they're not saying.

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

That's good but it doesn't explain why Wenger's contract was broken (thankfully) with a year to go. Something must have happened. I thought they must have had someone to bring in straight away to announce his leaving at this point but if they have they're not saying.

The club wasn't ready or in a position to replace him a year ago. They are now. I think its as simple as that

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

The club wasn't ready or in a position to replace him a year ago. They are now. I think its as simple as that

They probably have someone to announce when Wenger's last four games and the Europa are finished if that's the case. I doubt there's a search on then.

al87987

greendom wrote: »

The club wasn't ready or in a position to replace him a year ago. They are now. I think its as simple as that

Yes I thought this was all pretty obvious. The constant questions last year on his contract situation were unsettling for all. They didn't want a repeat of that uncertainty so gave him a two year deal with the intention of only serving one and it gives you a year to get the backroom sorted which they have done.

tayto lover

al87987 wrote: »

Yes I thought this was all pretty obvious. The constant questions last year on his contract situation were unsettling for all. They didn't want a repeat of that uncertainty so gave him a two year deal with the intention of only serving one and it gives you a year to get the backroom sorted which they have done.

It didn't seem to be obvious to Wenger who was talking recently about next season. He seemed to think he had another season.

Quazzie

tayto lover wrote: »

That's good but it doesn't explain why Wenger's contract was broken (thankfully) with a year to go. Something must have happened. I thought they must have had someone to bring in straight away to announce his leaving at this point but if they have they're not saying.

Season ticket sales are down apparently and that's the main reason. It always boils down to finances

Roaster

Less bums on seats (even if they're season ticket holders) means less money being spent on food, drink, merchandise - everything that goes hand in hand with the match day experience. Thousands of empty seats doesn't sit well with sponsors either, especially when you are in negotiations to try and get larger sums for new upcoming deals.

For the record, I don't think Arsenal would have released last week's statement without having somebody already in the bag.

For all the speculation about Wenger's future, the majority on here (and in media) thought he'd get another year whether we agreed with it or not. None of us saw last week's statement coming.

Arne_Saknussem

Quazzie wrote: »

Season ticket sales are down apparently and that's the main reason. It always boils down to finances

Exactly, and it's reactionary.

The people they've brought in seem to have decent reputations but this board still has it all to prove when it comes to a football strategy as far as i'm concerned.

I'd be hopeful rather than confident.

Wheeliebin30

I think it was one last chance for wenger but we look worst than last season so he had to go.

They probably thought he could get top 4 and mount some challenge, hence the 2 year contract.

tayto lover

Arne_Saknussem wrote: »

Exactly, and it's reactionary.

The people they've brought in seem to have decent reputations but this board still has it all to prove when it comes to a football strategy as far as i'm concerned.

I'd be hopeful rather than confident.

It's actually amazing that Wenger doesn't seem to have got wind of what was happening.

Arne_Saknussem

tayto lover wrote: »

It's actually amazing that Wenger doesn't seem to have got wind of what was happening.

I was convinced he'd be gone this summer, said as much in here. Couldn't see him staying with all the positioning going on behind the scenes.

You'd think that if it was Enrique or Tuchel they'd have named him already like Bayern did with Pep when Jupp Heynckes announced he was leaving.

So the new man is either already in a job or they're just making it up as they go along.

Be interesting to see who'd be the favourite for the job with people on here.

FixitFelix

al87987 wrote: »

Yes I thought this was all pretty obvious. The constant questions last year on his contract situation were unsettling for all. They didn't want a repeat of that uncertainty so gave him a two year deal with the intention of only serving one and it gives you a year to get the backroom sorted which they have done.

This times 100, it's common knowledge he wanted to go before Kroenke begged him to stay. Don't think ideas here in the plans to see out the 2 years

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

It's actually amazing that Wenger doesn't seem to have got wind of what was happening.

Do you really believe that?

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

Do you really believe that?

I do. There were articles on the BBC pages about his plans for next season the day before the news broke. I think they shafted him.

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

I do. There were articles on the BBC pages about his plans for next season the day before the news broke. I think they shafted him.

possibly but I think it's more likely that he was negotiating with the club about his future at that point and it would have been inappropriate to talk about his departure before it was announced so he had to talk about next season as if he was still going to be around.

As Ferguson said about Wenger "He could run a poker school in Govan"

Ol' Donie

Intetesting question on the Arsecast there.

What one thing over the 22 years of Arsene's reign would you like the actual real inside story of what happened?

Just listening to Second Captains earlier. Firminho has a release clause of 80 million, that applies to every club except Arsenal, because we p*ssed them off so much with the 40 mil + 1 pound nonsense for Suarez.

I would love to know what actually happened there. For a club that prioritises finances above everything, that was bizzarrely childish and out of character offer. If we had done just that one deal properly, everything could be different.

I assumed the offer was in someway misrepresented in the press, but if it annoyed Liverpool so much, it must have actually been acting the b*llocks.

al87987

Ol' Donie wrote: »

Intetesting question on the Arsecast there.

What one thing over the 22 years of Arsene's reign would you like the actual real inside story of what happened?

Just listening to Second Captains earlier. Firminho has a release clause of 80 million, that applies to every club except Arsenal, because we p*ssed them off so much with the 40 mil + 1 pound nonsense for Suarez.

I would love to know what actually happened there. For a club that prioritises finances above everything, that was bizzarrely childish and out of character offer. If we had done just that one deal properly, everything could be different.

I assumed the offer was in someway misrepresented in the press, but if it annoyed Liverpool so much, it must have actually been acting the b*llocks.

Willing to be proven wrong here but I thought Arsenal and Suarez reps had just misinterpreted the clause.

We though anything over 40 mill and he can leave but I think it was actually anything over 40 mill and they have to let the player know of the offer.

Again I could be wrong but I think this was it.

AdamD

al87987 wrote: »

Willing to be proven wrong here but I thought Arsenal and Suarez reps had just misinterpreted the clause.

We though anything over 40 mill and he can leave but I think it was actually anything over 40 mill and they have to let the player know of the offer.

Again I could be wrong but I think this was it.

Nah pretty sure Arsenal had it correct but the Liverpool owner decided he wasn't going to honor the contract as it would take too long for Suarez to fight it in court for it to be worth Suarez's while.

Their owner enjoyed the PR a little too much too, hope they get battered tonight.

Ol' Donie

al87987 wrote: »

Willing to be proven wrong here but I thought Arsenal and Suarez reps had just misinterpreted the clause.

We though anything over 40 mill and he can leave but I think it was actually anything over 40 mill and they have to let the player know of the offer.

Again I could be wrong but I think this was it.

That's hardly reason enough to single us out for exclusion on future players?

Plus, that's the sort of mistake a trainee receptionist might make. Not someone about to hand over 40 million quid.

That's not to say you're wrong, it's just all very...amateurish.

Quazzie

Ol' Donie wrote: »

That's hardly reason enough to single us out for exclusion on future players?

Plus, that's the sort of mistake a trainee receptionist might make. Not someone about to hand over 40 million quid.

That's not to say you're wrong, it's just all very...amateurish.

I'd say the 40M+1 price is used for nearly all release clauses. If Neymar's release clause was €245M I can guarantee ya, that PSG didn't throw an extra few million to Barca on top to secure the deal. Liverpools owners just decided to be a dick and make a point about it

Ol' Donie

Quazzie wrote: »

I'd say the 40M+1 price is used for nearly all release clauses. If Neymar's release clause was €245M I can guarantee ya, that PSG didn't throw an extra few million to Barca on top to secure the deal. Liverpools owners just decided to be a dick and make a point about it

Make what point, though?

Had they a ttack record of this? Could we have offered more?

What's the point if a release clause if it can be overruled by the selling team?

keano_afc

From what I remember, Arsenal were perfectly within their rights to make the offer. Their owner just acted the dick.

Found this:

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/mar/02/liverpool-john-henry-luis-suarez-clause

Quazzie

Ol' Donie wrote: »

Make what point, though?

Had they a ttack record of this? Could we have offered more?

What's the point if a release clause if it can be overruled by the selling team?

Legally it can't, but they knew that the legal objection to it would take time, and effort by Suarez so they gambled that he wouldn't follow through with it.

And as it turns out, they were right, because he didn't and he left the following year to Barca for more money, which suited everyone down to the ground, except Arsenal.

Ol' Donie

keano_afc wrote: »

From what I remember, Arsenal were perfectly within their rights to make the offer. Their owner just acted the dick.

Found this:

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/mar/02/liverpool-john-henry-luis-suarez-clause

So what's with ruling us out of Firminho's clause (not that I especially care about Firminho).

Seems remarkably unusual, especially since we've dealt with then over the Ox since the Suarez fiasco.

Skylinehead

Ol' Donie wrote: »

Make what point, though?

Had they a ttack record of this? Could we have offered more?

What's the point if a release clause if it can be overruled by the selling team?

It's up to the player to fight them if they won't honour the release clause. They correctly guessed that Suarez wasn't going to do that.

tayto lover

Nixonbot wrote: »

It's up to the player to fight them if they won't honour the release clause. They correctly guessed that Suarez wasn't going to do that.

The whole Suarez thing was a complete shambles.
Had we offered 41 million i'd be of the opinion we'd have got him.
The 1 euro shyte was annoying to everyone even Arsenal fans.

Deise Vu

keano_afc wrote: »

From what I remember, Arsenal were perfectly within their rights to make the offer. Their owner just acted the dick.

Found this:

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/mar/02/liverpool-john-henry-luis-suarez-clause

The last line of that article is interesting quoting John Henry:

"It's been great for Luis, it's been great for us. We have three gentlemen up front Suárez, [Raheem] Sterling, and [Daniel]Sturridge, [they] are young, I think those three could be together for a long time."

Quazzie

tayto lover wrote: »

The whole Suarez thing was a complete shambles.
Had we offered 41 million i'd be of the opinion we'd have got him.
The 1 euro shyte was annoying to everyone even Arsenal fans.

Why would they pay nearly a million pound more than they have to?

Do you go into shops and buy stuff and pay more than they asking price?

tayto lover

Quazzie wrote: »

Why would they pay nearly a million pound more than they have to?

Do you go into shops and buy stuff and pay more than they asking price?

Well the 1 euro clearly didn't work. It only angered them.

keano_afc

tayto lover wrote: »

Well the 1 euro clearly didn't work. It only angered them.

They were never gonna play ball regardless of what we offered. They didnt want to sell to a rival and convinced the press that we were taking the piss. Good days work as far as they were concerned

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

Well the 1 euro clearly didn't work. It only angered them.

They were angry as we found out there was a release clause and that it was 40 million

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

They were angry as we found out there was a release clause and that it was 40 million

I know that BUT we were the only club to put in a bid. I have never seen another club put in the exact amount plus 1 euro.

Royale with Cheese

Suarez might be back on the market this summer. Another £40,000,001 bid to Barcelona this time?

tayto lover

Quazzie wrote: »

Why would they pay nearly a million pound more than they have to?

Do you go into shops and buy stuff and pay more than they asking price?

Could you point out any other club who bid the amount plus 1 euro though?

Quazzie

tayto lover wrote: »

I know that BUT we were the only club to put in a bid. I have never seen another club put in the exact amount plus 1 euro.

How do you know tho? It usually doesn't become public knowledge. Liverpool acted like a petulant child releasing that story to the press, and yet we were the ones called amateurish.

tayto lover

Quazzie wrote: »

How do you know tho? It usually doesn't become public knowledge. Liverpool acted like a petulant child releasing that story to the press, and yet we were the ones called amateurish.

We only know what we were told on this one.
I'd have acted the same way had some other club offered the release amount plus 1 euro too for one of our best players.

Quazzie

tayto lover wrote: »

We only know what we were told on this one.
I'd have acted the same way had some other club offered the release amount plus 1 euro too for one of our best players.

Well then you'd be technically breaking the law. It doesn't matter if it's a pound or a million pound. They broke the law by refusing the offer.

tayto lover

Quazzie wrote: »

Well then you'd be technically breaking the law. It doesn't matter if it's a pound or a million pound. They broke the law by refusing the offer.

And they got away with it with us looking like the bad guys.

Arne_Saknussem

tayto lover wrote: »

We only know what we were told on this one.
I'd have acted the same way had some other club offered the release amount plus 1 euro too for one of our best players.

It does happen, Bayern i remember bit €1 more than Mario Gotze's release fee at Dortmund when he made his move.

Ol' Donie

tayto lover wrote: »

And they got away with it with us looking like the bad guys.

So then why did no one at Arsenal say "What the f*ck are yis on about? This always happens?"

CatInABox

Poor Ox, always getting injured. Klopp might be training him better, but he's still all Arsenal on the Injuries front anyway.

emmetlego

Salah really is the best player in the premiership right now. A real world class act.

Ol' Donie

emmetlego wrote: »

Salah really is the best player in the premiership right now. A real world class act.

He's something else. Jesus.

Ardennes1944

4 now.

All I can say is...fair play Liverpool. Everyone giving their all.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Ugh, I remember getting roasted in here last year when i suggested we should have gone for Klopp when he was available.