Dublin City Marathon and getting to Mass

Thinkingaboutit

St Kevin's is within the Marathon 'ring of steel.' Anyone worshiping in Dublin City who lives outside is out of luck with the Sunday Marathon. The SSPX Priory in Mounttown Dun Laoghaire is the obvious alternative, but an hour journey as against 15 mins, and I'd much rather go to where I've heard Mass for a good many years.

I suppose if I use a bicycle, I can get there, that I can cross the closed roads. The Dublin City Marathon is something I've never had an interest in, and it has spoiled that Sunday for me. Why not Saturday?

Anyhow how to get in and out of Dublin city that Sunday during the day, morning to afternoon?

Thanks

Mancomb Seepgood

Pedestrian access won't be a problem.It very much depends where you are but Harrington Street is only a short walk from Grand Canal Dock station so Dart might be an option (park at the station closest to you).

Birdie Num Num

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

St Kevin's is within the Marathon 'ring of steel.' Anyone worshiping in Dublin City who lives outside is out of luck with the Sunday Marathon. The SSPX Priory in Mounttown Dun Laoghaire is the obvious alternative, but an hour journey as against 15 mins, and I'd much rather go to where I've heard Mass for a good many years.

I suppose if I use a bicycle, I can get there, that I can cross the closed roads. The Dublin City Marathon is something I've never had an interest in, and it has spoiled that Sunday for me. Why not Saturday?

Anyhow how to get in and out of Dublin city that Sunday during the day, morning to afternoon?

Thanks

Why not? As there is mass at 6pm. Also still mass there on Sunday too and I don't believe St. Kevin's has closed for the occasion. Hardly a 'ring of steel' for a once a year event over a few hours on one day. It's even possible to do both, take part in the race and go to mass. Twice as good for the soul.

Peregrinus

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

I suppose if I use a bicycle, I can get there, that I can cross the closed roads. The Dublin City Marathon is something I've never had an interest in, and it has spoiled that Sunday for me. Why not Saturday?

That might spoil the Saturday for somebody else, mightn't it?

It's impossible to hold a major event like a city marathon without some degree of disruption and inconvenience to citizens. Generally holding them on a Sunday or public holiday tends to minimise the disruption, and the numbers who suffer from it. Which, I agree, is not much consolation if you happen to be one of those who is only inconvenienced if the event is held on a Sunday. But that's probably a fairly small group.

In addition to the options mentioned - walk, bike, train - if there's a number of people who for whatever reason can't use those transport modes, there's always the option for the community that organises this mass to arrange to have a mass celebrated outside the cordon on that particular Sunday. It shouldn't be beyond the bounds of possibility to find a church that can be made available, even if not at the standard time.

Probably too late for that this year, but it's something that could be looked at in future years.

eviltwin

It's only mass. Plenty of other churches you can go to and mass times that are not affected by the run. Is there a Saturday one you can go to? And if you can't just have a lie in.

c_man

eviltwin wrote: »

It's only mass.

Pretty stupid statement to be fair.

Delirium

eviltwin wrote: »

It's only mass. Plenty of other churches you can go to and mass times that are not affected by the run. Is there a Saturday one you can go to? And if you can't just have a lie in.

You do realise you're posting in the Christianity forum?

Mass is an important part of many Christians life so maybe consider that before posting such statements in response to someone trying to get information on how to get to mass during the marathon.

eviltwin

Delirium wrote: »

You do realise you're posting in the Christianity forum?

Mass is an important part of many Christians life so maybe consider that before posting such statements in response to someone trying to get information on how to get to mass during the marathon.

There are going to be a lot of people put out for far more important things than mass. Implying one of the biggest events in the city should be moved because it alters the path to a church, when the city is full of churches, is a bit precious. It matters to the OP but lets not pretend it's an important point race organisers should consider.

c_man

eviltwin wrote: »

There are going to be a lot of people put out

I'm curious, if someone in another forum was asking about arrangements on how to get into town on Sunday would be barging down their door telling them that their plans don't matter, the main part of the <forum_subject> is stupid and is worth missing out on, argue the point and basically do everything bar help them out? What drives our resident A&A subscribers? Why the need to go into every single topic, no matter what, and throw their two pence in on why Christianity is stupid? What's the point?

pconn062

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

St Kevin's is within the Marathon 'ring of steel.' Anyone worshiping in Dublin City who lives outside is out of luck with the Sunday Marathon. The SSPX Priory in Mounttown Dun Laoghaire is the obvious alternative, but an hour journey as against 15 mins, and I'd much rather go to where I've heard Mass for a good many years.

I suppose if I use a bicycle, I can get there, that I can cross the closed roads. The Dublin City Marathon is something I've never had an interest in, and it has spoiled that Sunday for me. Why not Saturday?

Anyhow how to get in and out of Dublin city that Sunday during the day, morning to afternoon?

Thanks

In fairness, it can't have spoiled that many Sundays as it was only moved to Sunday last year. In the previous 35+ years it's been on the Bank holiday Monday.

As for why not Saturday, it's because every single business in Dublin city would protest a move to Saturday due to it's effect on shopping/profits!

I can see how it would be mildly inconvenient but it's only once a year and creates massive amounts of money in terms of tourism (it's now one of the biggest marathons in Europe!).

For the record, I'm not involved with the marathon nor will I will running it.

eviltwin

c_man wrote: »

I'm curious, if someone in another forum was asking about arrangements on how to get into town on Sunday would be barging down their door telling them that their plans don't matter, the main part of the <forum_subject> is stupid and is worth missing out on, argue the point and basically do everything bar help them out? What drives our resident A&A subscribers? Why the need to go into every single topic, no matter what, and throw their two pence in on why Christianity is stupid? What's the point?

I never said Christianity is stupid

I appreciate the OP feels put out but there are other options which I and others suggested.

I think it's ridiculous to suggest moving it to Saturday, the busiest day in the city, because someone might be impacted going to a specific mass in a specific church by his or her usual route.

As far as race organisations goes it is only mass. If they aren't accommodating business needs or the emergency services or public transport then why on earth would they consider people's religious commitments ( that's what I meant by that comment, I wasn't slagging the OP or disrespecting his or her belief, I know it's an integral part of the day )

smacl

pconn062 wrote: »

I can see how it would be mildly inconvenient but it's only once a year and creates massive amounts of money in terms of tourism (it's now one of the biggest marathons in Europe!).

Worth remembering those taking part also raise a lot of money for charities on the day as well.

Hitman3000

Sure watch mass on the telly on Sunday. Have a cup of tea during the hymns. Very relaxing.

c_man

eviltwin wrote: »

I wasn't slagging the OP or disrespecting his or her belief, I know it's an integral part of the day

Don't try and play cute, anyone can read the thread.

Delirium

MOD NOTE

If anyone has any helpful tips to the OP on how to get to their desired church, feel free to offer advice.

Any further posts with comments such as "it's only mass" or "watch it on TV" will be deleted and carded if they persist.

Thanks for your attention.

Mancomb Seepgood

Mancomb Seepgood wrote: »

Pedestrian access won't be a problem.It very much depends where you are but Harrington Street is only a short walk from Grand Canal Dock station so Dart might be an option (park at the station closest to you).

I just realised that I mixed up Harrington Street with Haddington Road.Disregard previous advice!Parking somewhere convenient and walking in is probably the best option.

brian_t

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Sure watch mass on the telly on Sunday.

There is no mass on RTE on Sunday.

It's an Ecumenical Service from Saint Fin Barre's Cathedral, Cork to commemorate the 500th Anniversary of the Beginning of the Reformation.

Thinkingaboutit

Thanks for the answers. The simple solution will be to cycle, and walk the bike when I cannot cycle. You see there are no shortage of churches, but a limited number, as in one offering the traditional Latin Mass, St Kevin's church, Dublin. At the edges of the city, there's St John the Evangelist SSPX priory (originally Anglican, later closed, SSPX chapel since 1985, has the high altar of Eccles St Dominican convent and college, the school is now on Griffith Ave). in Dun Laoghaire (10 miles cycle), Silverstream Priory in Meath (probably one of those longer distance cycles:pac:). There are quite a few broadcast options, even via phone app (say iMass or another) but I'll leave that to days with chest infections:(.

Spanish Eyes

Can you go to a vigil Mass the night before somewhere convenient?

smacl

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

Thanks for the answers. The simple solution will be to cycle, and walk the bike when I cannot cycle. You see there are no shortage of churches, but a limited number, as in one offering the traditional Latin Mass, St Kevin's church, Dublin. At the edges of the city, there's St John the Evangelist SSPX priory (originally Anglican, later closed, SSPX chapel since 1985, has the high altar of Eccles St Dominican convent and college, the school is now on Griffith Ave). in Dun Laoghaire (10 miles cycle), Silverstream Priory in Meath (probably one of those longer distance cycles:pac:). There are quite a few broadcast options, even via phone app (say iMass or another) but I'll leave that to days with chest infections:(.

Sunday morning cycle out to Dun Laoghaire on the coast road could be very pleasant and the long term forecast looks good. Teddy's ice cream and walk along the pier after mass, what's not to like?

J C

There seems to be an increasing trend towards organising all kinds of things to co-incide with Sunday mornings. The move of the DC Marathon from Monday to Sunday is but one example of this trend.

I guess its all part of the increasing secularisation of Sundays in Ireland ... if some of the postings on this thread are anything to go by, some Secularists simply don't care / maybe even deliberately organise these events to clash with Sunday services (including Mass).

Roman Catholics have the choice to attend their Sabbath Mass on either Saturday night or Sunday morning.
Other Churches don't do this ... and therefore are potentially even more inconvenienced by these secular Sunday activities.
A little consideration and respect for Christians who wish to take part in and/or not be inconvenienced by these activities would go a long way IMO.

Birdie Num Num

J C wrote: »

There seems to be an increasing trend towards organising all kinds of things to co-incide with Sunday mornings. The move of the DC Marathon from Monday to Sunday is but one example of this trend.

I guess its all part of the increasing secularisation of Sundays in Ireland ... if some of the postings on this thread are anything to go by, some Secularists simply don't care / maybe even deliberately organise these events to clash with Sunday services (including Mass).

Roman Catholics have the choice to attend their Sabbath Mass on either Saturday night or Sunday morning.
Other Churches don't do this ... and therefore are potentially even more inconvenienced by these secular Sunday activities.
A little consideration and respect for Christians who wish to take part in and/or not be inconvenienced by these activities would go a long way IMO.

There's no deliberate organisation of the marathon by secularists to clash with Sunday services. Most other big city marathons bar Boston are on Sundays. As I understand it, Dublin moved to Sunday so as facilitate the huge numbers of overseas entrants that don't have the benefit of an October bank holiday Monday in their own countries. I have never raced the marathon but have ran in many races on a Sunday and have attended mass too.

Also, as I understand it, no church closed it's doors because of the staging of the marathon today. Sure there was restrictions on access for vehicles but vehicles are not entirely necessary for attending a church service. Church services have been taking place long before the invention of the car. It's many a time too that vehicles or processions associated with church services have inconvenienced many people in their movements. Take cemetery Sunday services for example and the volume of traffic and irresponsible parking of cars that takes place up and down the country throughout the summer.

It's a big world, it's big enough for us all and it's about give and take.

splinter65

c_man wrote: »

I'm curious, if someone in another forum was asking about arrangements on how to get into town on Sunday would be barging down their door telling them that their plans don't matter, the main part of the <forum_subject> is stupid and is worth missing out on, argue the point and basically do everything bar help them out? What drives our resident A&A subscribers? Why the need to go into every single topic, no matter what, and throw their two pence in on why Christianity is stupid? What's the point?

Is it not best to just ignore ignore ignore?
It’s kinda sad that people seem to hover around waiting to goad and insult, but I do think that if there were no response then the goaders would give up and go elsewhere.

J C

Birdie Num Num wrote: »

There's no deliberate organisation of the marathon by secularists to clash with Sunday services. Most other big city marathons bar Boston are on Sundays. As I understand it, Dublin moved to Sunday so as facilitate the huge numbers of overseas entrants that don't have the benefit of an October bank holiday Monday in their own countries. I have never raced the marathon but have ran in many races on a Sunday and have attended mass too.

Also, as I understand it, no church closed it's doors because of the staging of the marathon today. Sure there was restrictions on access for vehicles but vehicles are not entirely necessary for attending a church service. Church services have been taking place long before the invention of the car. It's many a time too that vehicles or processions associated with church services have inconvenienced many people in their movements. Take cemetery Sunday services for example and the volume of traffic and irresponsible parking of cars that takes place up and down the country throughout the summer.

It's a big world, it's big enough for us all and it's about give and take.

I take all your points in relation to the marathon ... but my overall point remains ... Sundays aren't largely observed as 'days of rest' any more in Ireland ... in many ways they have become the busiest day of the week ... with a full schedule of sports / sports training / shopping from dawn 'til dusk on Sundays.

ABG (Anything But God) seems to be the new Sunday motto in Ireland!!!

How this has come about over the past thirty or so years is open to debate ... but it seems to be directly linked to a combination of declining Christianity
... and ascendent secularism ... that doesn't seem too concerned about including Christian concerns in its plans.

Birdie Num Num

J C wrote: »

I take all your points in relation to the marathon ... but my overall point remains ... Sundays aren't largely observed as 'days of rest' any more in Ireland ... in many ways they have become the busiest day of the week ... with a full schedule of sports / sports training / shopping from dawn 'til dusk on Sundays.

ABG (Anything But God) seems to be the new Sunday motto in Ireland!!!

How this has come about over the past thirty or so years is open to debate ... but it seems to be directly linked to a combination of declining Christianity
... and ascendent secularism ... that doesn't seem too concerned about including Christian concerns in its plans.

Personally I have no issue with sporting events and recreation on Sundays but it is not just about me. I get your point and I really would favour closure of many big retailers on Sundays or restricted hours at least.

I was away somewhere recently where Sundays are a much quieter affair but I found it quite depressing how quiet it was on the streets and in parks. I like my Sunday run, as many do and here in Dublin and you would normally see quite a few fellow runners about and cyclists too but not in this place.

I do also find the busy out of town shopping centres and high streets shops equally depressing on Sundays along with soccer jerseys spilling out of pubs. I'm all in favour of a day of rest from business matters but not necessarily in a religious way. I think the evolution of retail in recent decades will probably make that difficult to reverse unless customers fall away.

Not sure there is any concerted ABG effort but yes plenty dismissive of Sunday as a day of rest or worship by others.

Thinkingaboutit

J C wrote: »

There seems to be an increasing trend towards organising all kinds of things to co-incide with Sunday mornings. The move of the DC Marathon from Monday to Sunday is but one example of this trend.

I guess its all part of the increasing secularisation of Sundays in Ireland ... if some of the postings on this thread are anything to go by, some Secularists simply don't care / maybe even deliberately organise these events to clash with Sunday services (including Mass).

Roman Catholics have the choice to attend their Sabbath Mass on either Saturday night or Sunday morning.
Other Churches don't do this ... and therefore are potentially even more inconvenienced by these secular Sunday activities.
A little consideration and respect for Christians who wish to take part in and/or not be inconvenienced by these activities would go a long way IMO.

A traditional Catholic, like I try somehow to be, has only the Sunday. The anticipated Mass since V2 can, perhaps, encourage a degree of laxity. Sunday should be Sunday, as far as possible. Can be clamour of commerce be kept away from one day?

J C

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

A traditional Catholic, like I try somehow to be, has only the Sunday. The anticipated Mass since V2 can, perhaps, encourage a degree of laxity. Sunday should be Sunday, as far as possible. Can be clamour of commerce be kept away from one day?

I agree.

It's not even a Secular thing per se ... just our Irish version of it ... where we have gone from one extreme to the other!!!

In highly secular France, for example, large retail stores must stay closed on Sundays by law ... and small supermarkets may only open until 1.00pm.

This provides a relaxing family-focussed ambience on Sundays throughout France, that everybody benefits from ... whether Christian ... or not.

Our Creator told us we need to take one day of rest in every seven ... and in so far as we ignore the 'manufacturers instructions' on this, we suffer from all kinds of prroblems ... including health issues and being 'stessed out'.

smacl

Birdie Num Num wrote: »

Personally I have no issue with sporting events and recreation on Sundays but it is not just about me. I get your point and I really would favour closure of many big retailers on Sundays or restricted hours at least.

I was away somewhere recently where Sundays are a much quieter affair but I found it quite depressing how quiet it was on the streets and in parks. I like my Sunday run, as many do and here in Dublin and you would normally see quite a few fellow runners about and cyclists too but not in this place.

I do also find the busy out of town shopping centres and high streets shops equally depressing on Sundays along with soccer jerseys spilling out of pubs. I'm all in favour of a day of rest from business matters but not necessarily in a religious way. I think the evolution of retail in recent decades will probably make that difficult to reverse unless customers fall away.

Not sure there is any concerted ABG effort but yes plenty dismissive of Sunday as a day of rest or worship by others.

I tend to agree with this in sentiment, in that I really enjoy an extended cycling or walking outing on a Sunday and appreciate the break from work. That said, just back from a walk up to and around Marlay park with the youngest where we got a bite to eat at the farmers market, and we appreciated that they were there selling hot food. Similarly, while I'd rather have lit matches stuck under my toe nails than traipse around Ikea on a Sunday, there does seem to be a substantial cohort of people who enjoy that kind of thing much as you or I might like a cycle or run. Each to their own.

As for the ABG thing, I'm not sure how any of this interfere's with those who do prefer to worship on a Sunday. Seems to be making unreasonable demands of others who don't share that preference.

J C

Birdie Num Num wrote: »

Not sure there is any concerted ABG effort but yes plenty dismissive of Sunday as a day of rest or worship by others.

The Irish people seem to be like children of very strict parents ... who go wild, when they come out from under their parents authority.
We have moved from God-fearing to God-hating in one generation.
... and this isn't a change for the better ... but its worst fruits have yet to be fully realised, as we 'coast along' on a heritage of the vestiges of Christianity ... which haven't been totally destroyed yet.

J C

smacl wrote: »

I tend to agree with this in sentiment, in that I really enjoy an extended cycling or walking outing on a Sunday and appreciate the break from work. That said, just back from a walk up to and around Marlay park with the youngest where we got a bite to eat at the farmers market, and we appreciated that they were there selling hot food. Similarly, while I'd rather have lit matches stuck under my toe nails than traipse around Ikea on a Sunday, there does seem to be a substantial cohort of people who enjoy that kind of thing much as you or I might like a cycle or run. Each to their own.

Fair enough.

smacl wrote: »

As for the ABG thing, I'm not sure how any of this interfere's with those who do prefer to worship on a Sunday. Seems to be making unreasonable demands of others who don't share that preference.

Nobody expects unreasonable demands to be met ... but consideration should be given, to people who wish to attend Sunday church services, when planning Sunday events.
Sometimes circumstances will dictate that nothing can be done ... but many times, a little thought and consideration will allow Christians to be facilitated, even to be involved ... when otherwise they could not.
Its often easy to 'go the extra mile' to include 'a minority of one' ... whilst not taking account of the needs of much more significant minorities ... or even the needs/beliefs of the majority !!

Its a kind of perversion of 'inclusion' ... to facilitate tiny minorities ... whilst ignoring, even disrespecting, the mainstream.

smacl

J C wrote: »

The Irish people seem to be like children of very strict parents ... who go wild, when they come out from under their parents authority.
We have moved from God-fearing to God-hating in one generation.
... and this isn't a change for the better ... but its worst fruits have yet to be fully realised, as we 'coast along' on a heritage of the vestiges of Christianity ... which haven't been totally destroyed yet.

I think the previous generation might be better termed God fearing Christians. Those who were indifferent to religion kept their feelings to themselves. Today they are are more openly indifferent but maybe not that different as such. Current hostility seems reasonably directed at specific atrocities and cover ups within the church as opposed to God or even Christianity.

uck51js9zml2yt

smacl wrote: »

I think the previous generation might be better termed God fearing Christians. Those who were indifferent to religion kept their feelings to themselves. Today they are are more openly indifferent but maybe not that different as such. Current hostility seems reasonably directed at specific atrocities and cover ups within the church as opposed to God or even Christianity.

I don't know where you got that idea from. We're obviously reading different versions of boards(assuming it's a general cross section of society)

smacl

Holly Fancy Bankroll wrote: »

I don't know where you got that idea from. We're obviously reading different versions of boards(assuming it's a general cross section of society)

Not really basing my rationale on boards, though if you wanted to get a feel for this community you could post a poll. You'd probably need to post across more than one forum, as each has its own biases and audience. FWIW, my rationale is that for all the scandal the RCC has become embroiled in to visible outrage in the media and larger population, as of the last census, most people still identify as Catholic. This leads me to believe that the hostility is directed at specific events (e.g. Tuam babies), discrimination (school enrolment) and moral stances taken (same sex marriage, pro life). I certainly wouldn't draw too many conclusions on the larger population based solely on the opinions of a small subset of more regular posters on this site (and I include myself and yourself in that subset).

J C

smacl wrote: »

I think the previous generation might be better termed God fearing Christians. Those who were indifferent to religion kept their feelings to themselves. Today they are are more openly indifferent but maybe not that different as such. Current hostility seems reasonably directed at specific atrocities and cover ups within the church as opposed to God or even Christianity.

I think you have some good points there ... but it still adds up to a move from God fearing to God defying ... which are actually two sides of the one coin ... becoming God loving is the solution.:)

uck51js9zml2yt

smacl wrote: »

Not really basing my rationale on boards, though if you wanted to get a feel for this community you could post a poll. You'd probably need to post across more than one forum, as each has its own biases and audience. FWIW, my rationale is that for all the scandal the RCC has become embroiled in to visible outrage in the media and larger population, as of the last census, most people still identify as Catholic. This leads me to believe that the hostility is directed at specific events (e.g. Tuam babies), discrimination (school enrolment) and moral stances taken (same sex marriage, pro life). I certainly wouldn't draw too many conclusions on the larger population based solely on the opinions of a small subset of more regular posters on this site (and I include myself and yourself in that subset).

My boldening of your post could have been clearer.
I'd be more inclined to say the disdain for the RCC has moved very quickly to a disdain for God Himself.
A very easy jump when a church says He's their god and everything they do is in His Name.
In turn anyone, Non RC included gets tarred with the same disdain.

smacl

Holly Fancy Bankroll wrote: »

My boldening of your post could have been clearer.
I'd be more inclined to say the disdain for the RCC has moved very quickly to a disdain for God Himself.
A very easy jump when a church says He's their god and everything they do is in His Name.
In turn anyone, Non RC included gets tarred with the same disdain.

Perhaps, but my limited experience is that we've come through a period of religion being compulsory to religion being optional in about two generations. I think a lot of the disdain is generational, where those who were educated by nuns and brothers often got an unreasonably hard time time of it. For example, my father had no time for the clergy as he was beaten for being left handed at school. These seeds of discord, along with the many more serious atrocities that have come to light since, are such that once public criticism of the church became acceptable there were many voices clamouring to be heard. I think it was always there, but simply forbidden in the past. (Edit, just saw an article on John McGahern's memoir that illustrates this rather well).

I think different groups do get treated differently. Those who push their religion on others, such as the Mormons, have always had a hard time of it. Those who don't, such as the Quakers, tend to get far more respect.

smacl

J C wrote: »

I think you have some good points there ... but it still adds up to a move from God fearing to God defying ... which are actually two sides of the one coin ... becoming God loving is the solution.:)

I don't think it is God defying so much as church defying, as can be seen by various minority Christian groups increasing their numbers as mainstream church attendances collapse.

Nick Park

smacl wrote: »

I think different groups do get treated differently. Those who push their religion on others, such as the Mormons, have always had a hard time of it. Those who don't, such as the Quakers, tend to get far more respect.

I guess that depends on how you define having 'a hard time of it' or getting 'far more respect'.

For a religious group, there is limited benefit to be had from having a bunch of people who don't like religion anyway saying, "Sure, they're a nice group of people."

What is for sure is that faiths which enthusiastically share their beliefs with others attract many more adherents than those which don't.

(Btw, I much prefer the beliefs of the Quakers to those of the Mormons, even though I am personally friendly with leading figures in both movements).

smacl

Nick Park wrote: »

What is for sure is that faiths which enthusiastically share their beliefs with others attract many more adherents than those which don't.

I've no problem with that once that enthusiasm works within acceptably social boundaries. So for example, if, as happened a couple of weeks ago, a religious group comes knocking on my door and asks me have I time to talk, I've no problem with that. If, however one of my kids were to answer the door and they were to engage them without my consent, I would have a real problem with that. Basically, I take issue with any religious group pushing their belief system on minors or vulnerable people. Adults who are not in a vulnerable position are fair game.

Thinkingaboutit

The thread has moved a bit from transport issues and Mass, but the attacks on the Church have a certain orchestration to them.

Genuine abuses, albeit somewhat exaggerated in respect of the Laundries, are put to a wider purpose of attacking and undermining Christian belief. The church shooting in Texas was the work of a man who had drunk deeply on this hatred of Christianity. Related to this, it is frankly bemusing to see the Irish Times writing a weekend article with a focus on child sexual abuse, at least the headline and subhead gives it that angle, given how they approached his crimes against children, once even allowing him to write articles which essential made up additional claims against the Christian Brothers (before his interests became public knowledge). After he was convicted, they wrote a paean to the pervert (my oldest sister read it and found it disgusting), which only mentioned his paedophilia late in the article. Now, as the day went to the online version was edited. Hopefully less and less people are fooled by those who attack Christianity, those same people who are first to defend Islam after the latest atrocity by a devout follower.

Hitman3000

Thinkingaboutit wrote:

Genuine abuses, albeit somewhat exaggerated in respect of the Laundries, are put to a wider purpose of attacking and undermining Christian belief. The church shooting in Texas was the work of a man who had drunk deeply on this hatred of Christianity. Related to this, it is frankly bemusing to see the Irish Times writing a weekend article with a focus on child sexual abuse, at least the headline and subhead gives it that angle, given how they approached his crimes against children, once even allowing him to write articles which essential made up additional claims against the Christian Brothers (before his interests became public knowledge). After he was convicted, they wrote a paean to the pervert (my oldest sister read it and found it disgusting), which only mentioned his paedophilia late in the article. Now, as the day went to the online version was edited. Hopefully less and less people are fooled by those who attack Christianity, those same people who are first to defend Islam after the latest atrocity by a devout follower.

I love a quote I heard attributed to Ghandi "I like your Christ just not your Christianity ". The concept of Christ was benign what followed was malevolent.

c_man

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

The thread has moved a bit from transport issues and Mass, but the attacks on the Church have a certain orchestration to them.

It's rare for a thread around here to last a handful of posts before that starts up.

J C

Hitman3000 wrote: »

I love a quote I heard attributed to Ghandi "I like your Christ just not your Christianity ". The concept of Christ was benign what followed was malevolent.

Jesus is God ... and Christianity ranges across the spectrum from good to evil ... go figure !!!:)

Hint ...it may have something to do with the wide spectrum of Humans who claim to make up Christianity.

smacl

J C wrote: »

Jesus is God ... and Christianity ranges across the spectrum from good to evil ... go figure !!!:)

Hint ...it may have something to do with the wide spectrum of Humans who claim to make up Christianity.

In the case of Ghandi I'd suspect it had more to do with maltreatment of Indians by the invading British empire than religion per se, and close enough to the Irish experience of Britain in a similar era. The spread of Christianity going hand in hand with the expansions of aggresive empires as it for most of its history.