E-Bike Etiquette

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Etc wrote: »

So to my question, if you look at the people who shoal you, is there a pattern, are they seasoned commuters ? Dublin bike commuters, deliveroo cyclists, couriers, because I think it has a bearing on how people will ride.

I can't tell who's a seasoned commuter or not without speaking to them and finding out how much they do/have done.
I do know that seasoned commuters come in all shapes and sizes, and bike types, so you can't judge one from that alone.

I get shoaled by every type of cyclist, all of the above. The only one I haven't been shoaled by are women.

There are dicks who shoal and decent people who don't. There's no need for it.

I've never had a bother getting by a slower person after lights no matter what bike I'm on. It's a bit annoying in some places, like the canal where you're stuck behind for ages.

Shoaling is a dick move, end of.

Grassey

nee wrote:

I get shoaled by every type of cyclist, all of the above. The only one I haven't been shoaled by are women.

Not missing out on much. Just like guys.

Zen0

With the exception of mrcheez, the general trend in the replies seems to be don't shoal. You don't seem to want to hear that.

Etc

nee wrote: »

You actually can't always tell who's an experienced commuter or not though. And why only those you perceive to be experienced cyclists deserve not to be pissed off? Why are the only ones who matter? We're all cyclists, surely everyone is worth your consideration?

I think you can usually tell an experienced cyclist by their roadcraft and instinct for survival.

Statistically if I decide to commute I'm going to encounter people I see daily i.e. regular commuters.

I'll also have many random encounters. I treat everybody with the same respect and I believe in live and let live but there is a a percentage of cyclists in Dublin who have no awareness, regarding themselves or anyone else. So other than practicing self survival, why would I show them respect

Canis Lupus

I thought when commuting you must always assume you're the fastest badass on the road. Eyeball the other f*ckers in lycra into submission.

Plastik

I commute 23km each way into Dublin city centre daily, all year round. As an "experienced" cyclist I queue. I invariably pass everyone at ease when the lights to green and we're on the move. With ePower you will be able to do the same.

It is absolutely not discernibly less dangerous to have to do that than it is to jump to the front of the queue because you "assume" that you're going to be faster than everyone else.

nee wrote: »

Shoaling is a dick move, end of.

I could type a further long reply, but that's the crux of it. You can justify any other action any way you want, but for most people that see you doing it that's how it is.

Etc

Plastik wrote: »

I commute 23km each way into Dublin city centre daily, all year round. As an "experienced" cyclist I queue. I invariably pass everyone at ease when the lights to green and we're on the move. With ePower you will be able to do the same.

It is absolutely not discernibly less dangerous to have to do that than it is to jump to the front of the queue because you "assume" that you're going to be faster than everyone else.



I could type a further long reply, but that's the crux of it. You can justify any other action any way you want, but for most people that see you doing it that's how it is.

Is that a general post or directed at someone ?

eeeee

Grassey wrote: »

Not missing out on much. Just like guys.

I fully expect it to happen tomorrow :pac:

Etc wrote: »

I think you can usually tell an experienced cyclist by their roadcraft and instinct for survival.

Statistically if I decide to commute I'm going to encounter people I see daily i.e. regular commuters.

I'll also have many random encounters. I treat everybody with the same respect and I believe in live and let live but there is a a percentage of cyclists in Dublin who have no awareness, regarding themselves or anyone else. So other than practicing self survival, why would I show them respect

Nope, again not always obvious. I race with people who've been at it for years yet are all over the place and a danger/do stupid things. I also do stupid things, all the time!
You also have people who do it immediately 'right', but they aren't seasoned, so where do they sit in your value system?!

You say above you treat everyone the same yet contradict yourself in the same sentence? And further up stated you only care about pissing off 'seasoned' commuters.
This does not make logical sense!

There are a percentage of people on the road across all forms of transport we perceive (and indeed objectively do) to engage in dangerous behaviour. They can also be doing it like that for a long time - 'seasoned' and 'experienced' cyclists.

Shoaling is dick behaviour. The etiquette of it has been answered, repeatedly.

eeeee

Canis Lupus wrote: »

I thought when commuting you must always assume you're the fastest badass on the road. Eyeball the other f*ckers in lycra into submission.

*eyeballs Canis Lupus back*

dinneenp

After reading this thread all I can say is WOOF!

Etc

nee wrote: »

I fully expect it to happen tomorrow :pac:




Nope, again not always obvious. I race with people who've been at it for years yet are all over the place and a danger/do stupid things. I also do stupid things, all the time!
You also have people who do it immediately 'right', but they aren't seasoned, so where do they sit in your value system?!

You say above you treat everyone the same yet contradict yourself in the same sentence? And further up stated you only care about pissing off 'seasoned' commuters.
This does not make logical sense!

There are a percentage of people on the road across all forms of transport we perceive (and indeed objectively do) to engage in dangerous behaviour. They can also be doing it like that for a long time - 'seasoned' and 'experienced' cyclists.

Shoaling is dick behaviour. The etiquette of it has been answered, repeatedly.

It does make sense because what I'm saying is I treat everyone I encounter with a positive regard, but I assess my situation and make determinations off the back of that.

I can tell when I see an experienced cyclist. I have no radar that detects arseholes. And sometimes there is no differentiation between experienced cyclists and arseholes.

What I am saying is after 35 years of cycling I can tell if someone can ride a bike, ride in traffic or ride in a group or just ride a bike.

You seem very black and white in terms of your views of racing or shoaling, I respect your opinion and when some day if we meet on the road I'll respect you too.

I don't have anything else to add.

eeeee

Etc wrote: »

It does make sense because what I'm saying is I treat everyone I encounter with a positive regard, but I assess my situation and make determinations off the back of that.

I can tell when I see an experienced cyclist. I have no radar that detects arseholes. And sometimes there is no differetion between experienced cyclists and arseholes.

What I am saying is after 35 years of cycling I can tell if someone can ride a bike, ride in traffic or ride in a group or just ride a bike.

You seem very black and white in terms of your views of racing or shoaling, I respect your opinion and when some day if we meet on the road I'll respect you too.

I don't have anything else to add.

I haven't unleashed any of my racing opinions?! No one wants to hear them :pac:

I'm advocating the opposite to the black and white approach, and saying that you actually can't always judge what a seasoned commuter, to use your own words, is. The very positive opposite of a black and white approach!
Yes you can see some people can pedal, hassle handle a bike etc, but there's nothing to say they are seasoned commuters. And there are seasoned commuters, just like they're are experienced riders who have terrible style on a bike.

What I was originally responding to was your statement that you don't want to its piss off seasoned commuters with your shoaling. I'm pointing out that there is actually no way of knowing how seasoned a commuter someone is, and that surely rider, not just who you perceive to be a seasoned commuter deserves the same consideration.

Whether people can ride in a bunch is a different kind of riding and not one mentioned on this thread. That's immediately obvious when you put them in a group.

On shoaling I am black and white. Shoaling on a bike is skipping a queue essentially - the same as skipping the queue at an atm - 'I'm faster than that old man at the machine I'm cutting in front of him'. In a shop- 'I'll be quicker through the tills than these people, I have my stuff, money and bags ready I'm going in front'. I know it's not exactly the same as the two examples above, but it's not a million miles off.

And FYI the most experienced bike riders I ride with don't shoal. There is never a need. When Is it ever necessary?

It's a dick move no matter what way you look at it and its just not necessary.

Kaisr Sose

This all got quite contentious as to different classes of cyclist. Treat others how you would like them to treat you. We are all equal.

No shoaling, to any anyone, at anytime. When he lights turn green, pass them safely, if you want to and Can. Importantly, look to see if it’s safe and give a proper hand signal in plenty of time ( for those coming behind you who may be faster than you and for the benefit other road users).
I don’t have anything else to add. Enjoy the new lifestyle choice!

beauf

The problem is when someone slow skips at the light then holds everyone up till the next set of lights. As often there is no room to pass.

If there's room to pass then its not much of an issue, we'll just pass them out.

If someone skips then disappears rapidly into the distance, I don't have a problem with that.

Etc

nee wrote: »

I haven't unleashed any of my racing opinions?! No one wants to hear them :pac:

I'm advocating the opposite to the black and white approach, and saying that you actually can't always judge what a seasoned commuter, to use your own words, is. The very positive opposite of a black and white approach!
Yes you can see some people can pedal, hassle handle a bike etc, but there's nothing to say they are seasoned commuters. And there are seasoned commuters, just like they're are experienced riders who have terrible style on a bike.

What I was originally responding to was your statement that you don't want to its piss off seasoned commuters with your shoaling. I'm pointing out that there is actually no way of knowing how seasoned a commuter someone is, and that surely rider, not just who you perceive to be a seasoned commuter deserves the same consideration.

Whether people can ride in a bunch is a different kind of riding and not one mentioned on this thread. That's immediately obvious when you put them in a group.

On shoaling I am black and white. Shoaling on a bike is skipping a queue essentially - the same as skipping the queue at an atm - 'I'm faster than that old man at the machine I'm cutting in front of him'. In a shop- 'I'll be quicker through the tills than these people, I have my stuff, money and bags ready I'm going in front'. I know it's not exactly the same as the two examples above, but it's not a million miles off.

And FYI the most experienced bike riders I ride with don't shoal. There is never a need. When Is it ever necessary?

It's a dick move no matter what way you look at it and its just not necessary.

Thanks all for the input. I think I know how to approach my commute from Monday on my SPedelec.


Mods: Can you close this.