General Rugby Discussion II

kuang1

Dog Botherer wrote: »

New Zealand are going to absolutely hump them.

And that might suit us just fine given we play them a week later.

Yeah_Right

Dog Botherer wrote: »

New Zealand are going to absolutely hump them.

I really hope so. I think England being humiliated at Twickenham is something every rugby fan likes to see. We will be able to empty our bench early which means our front line team will be well rested to beat up the Irish

Clegg

You'd wonder just how strong a side England will be able to field for the New Zealand game. Their two best carriers, the Vunipola brothers, will miss the game with injury and last seasons 6 Nations showed us how poorly they fare without big ball carriers. Every side would miss men that can get over the gain line, but England's tactics are built entirely around winning the collisions. They're also down to their 5th choice loose head due to injury and retirement.

Unless Jones alters England's tactics entirely I can't see them getting much from New Zealand. Especially if they revert to Lawes playing at blindside. Expect them to get murdered at the breakdown.

nc6000

So Quilter are sponsoring England's autumn internationals and Gallagher are sponsoring the premiership this season. They aren't exactly attracting stellar sponsors, are they?

Buer

nc6000 wrote: »

So Quilter are sponsoring England's autumn internationals and Gallagher are sponsoring the premiership this season. They aren't exactly attracting stellar sponsors, are they?

Not household names here but massive companies. Gallagher in particular are a huge name in insurance and could afford a big sponsorship package comfortably.

Burkie1203

https://twitter.com/andNickMullins/status/1053045720318656512?s=19

Dog Botherer

Burkie1203 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/andNickMullins/status/1053045720318656512?s=19

Meh, Wade was world class in attack but schoolboy level in defense. If he’d worked on it he could have won a lot more caps but no Tier 1 international coach is going to select a liability like Wade anymore.

Good luck to him in the NFL, he’ll need it.

Kevski

Dog Botherer wrote: »

Meh, Wade was world class in attack but schoolboy level in defense. If he’d worked on it he could have won a lot more caps but no Tier 1 international coach is going to select a liability like Wade anymore.

Good luck to him in the NFL, he’ll need it.

I was wondering why he didn’t play against Leinster last Friday. Guess this explains it.

He was on five live’s Rugby Union Weekly podcast recently and they chatted with him about him possibly breaking the Premiership try scoring record. He seemed hopeful that he could do it this season so I wonder if this is just a recent decision or if he was bluffing on the podcast.

Mookie Blaylock

Kevski wrote: »

I was wondering why he didn’t play against Leinster last Friday. Guess this explains it.

He's gone off the boil too, hasn't scored this season at all... this decision has probably been brewing for quite a few months

thomond2006

Leaving now makes little sense. It's currently the middle of the NFL season. He's not going to get near a roster until next summer in preseason. By then he'll be 28.

Former Former

I really hope Wade isn't actually pinning his hopes on the NFL. He's 27, I presume he's never played before and he's a midget by NFL standards, it would be a miracle if he gets a contract.

Something else going on here I'd say.

troyzer

Former Former wrote: »

I really hope Wade isn't actually pinning his hopes on the NFL. He's 27, I presume he's never played before and he's a midget by NFL standards, it would be a miracle if he gets a contract.

Something else going on here I'd say.

He's not crazy short. He's a little underweight, but he can easily pack on.

Rugby players in general are lighter because fitness and conditioning is far, far more important. But Wade can now trade his conditioning for more weight. He'll still be a bit small, but there are running backs just as small as him in the NFL now like Kenjon Barner, Marcus Murphy and Phillip Lindsay.

I don't think he'll ever be a starter but the NFL minimum salary is $450k a season which is far more then he'd make in rugby. He'll be picked up somewhere, even as a project. It's been done before.

thomond2006

At best I think he would make a practice squad where the minimum salary per annum is USD 130k and you can be cut at any stage.

Making an active roster is a very big ask. I'm laughing at some of the headlines: Big money move on the Telegraph.

Like FF I think there's more to this. If this is true, financially it is likely to cost Wade quite a bit.

troyzer

thomond2006 wrote: »

At best I think he would make a practice squad where the minimum salary per annum is USD 130k and you can be cut at any stage.

Making an active roster is a very big ask. I'm laughing at some of the headlines: Big money move on the Telegraph.

His best shot is at special teams, a few rugby players have done this already like Nate Ebner who also plays free safety.

That would seem to be a really good position for someone like Wade.

Former Former

troyzer wrote: »

He's not crazy short. He's a little underweight, but he can easily pack on.

Rugby players in general are lighter because fitness and conditioning is far, far more important. But Wade can now trade his conditioning for more weight. He'll still be a bit small, but there are running backs just as small as him in the NFL now like Kenjon Barner, Marcus Murphy and Phillip Lindsay.

I don't think he'll ever be a starter but the NFL minimum salary is $450k a season which is far more then he'd make in rugby. He'll be picked up somewhere, even as a project. It's been done before.

Those guys would be playing football all their lives. Wade will be a 28 year old novice.

As noted above, if he gets picked up anywhere, it will be in a practice squad which isn't well paid at all.

Best of luck to him but...

Neil3030

It'll be interesting to see him return kicks and punts. Can't see him making any other contribution.

irishbucsfan

He has no hope whatsoever of being a success

But if you don’t want to play rugby any more and you’re not happy, want a new challenge, can afford to forego your salary and can get into a high performance institute who will coach and develop you, then absolutely go for it.

troyzer

Former Former wrote: »

Those guys would be playing football all their lives. Wade will be a 28 year old novice.

As noted above, if he gets picked up anywhere, it will be in a practice squad which isn't well paid at all.

Best of luck to him but...

A few rugby players have already broken in having never played football until they were adults.

I'm not saying it's a smart decision, but it's not crazy. I could potentially see him as a specialist kick chasing on special teams.

The NFL are likely to change rules on special teams making those massive impact hits illegal meaning that proper tackle technique leading to wraps will be more valuable. He'll have that in spades.

irishbucsfan

troyzer wrote: »

He's not crazy short. He's a little underweight, but he can easily pack on.

Rugby players in general are lighter because fitness and conditioning is far, far more important. But Wade can now trade his conditioning for more weight. He'll still be a bit small, but there are running backs just as small as him in the NFL now like Kenjon Barner, Marcus Murphy and Phillip Lindsay.

I don't think he'll ever be a starter but the NFL minimum salary is $450k a season which is far more then he'd make in rugby. He'll be picked up somewhere, even as a project. It's been done before.

No, he would not qualify for that salary.


He’d probably immediately be one of the better tacklers in the league if he plays as a defensive back, despite being one of the worst in the premiership!

irishbucsfan

troyzer wrote: »

A few rugby players have already broken in having never played football until they were adults.

Who?

troyzer

irishbucsfan wrote: »

No, he would not qualify for that salary.


He’d probably immediately be one of the better tacklers in the league if he plays as a defensive back, despite being one of the worst in the premiership!

That's the minimum rookie salary for making the 53 which I think he can after a full offseason.

As you say, he could quickly establish himself as one of the safest tacklers on the field. I think he's too old to properly coach the techniques required of a safety or cornerback. But realistically, there's nothing to special teams other than raw aggression and tackling ability. It's the easiest part of the game to pick up and has the most in common with a scramble defence in rugby.

The only thing he'd really need to learn is how to shed/make a block.

troyzer

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Who?

Nate Ebner didn't play football until he was 22 I think. There are others.

Former Former

troyzer wrote: »

Nate Ebner didn't play football until he was 22 I think. There are others.

Per Wikipedia, Ebner played three years at Ohio State which is basically professional level without the salary. He's not really relevant to Wade.

Go Buckeyes!

troyzer

Former Former wrote: »

Per Wikipedia, Ebner played three years at Ohio State which is basically professional level without the salary. He's not really relevant to Wade.

Go Buckeyes!

He started playing for Ohio in his junior year, when he was 22.

irishbucsfan

troyzer wrote: »

Nate Ebner didn't play football until he was 22 I think. There are others.

And then he took it up in college while playing for a division I school and got drafted to the NFL. He never played professional rugby.

There aren’t others if you’re talking about players trying to do what Christian Wade is trying to do. It hasn’t happened successfully. Players have gone to the States to try but it hasn’t happened yet for them.

The main reason this is now possible for guys to try is because of new NFL rules around practice squad numbers, effectively meaning someone like Wade can be signed as an extra player. But being on a practice squad is very different to being on an active roster and you do not qualify for the rookie or veteran minimum. He can go over and sign for a practice squad and that will start the clock giving him 3 years to develop (unless international players get an extra year perhaps)

The closest we’ve ever seen to being successful was Jarryd Hayne from rugby league. He’s back in Australia again now. He started one game in the NFL. He was signed specifically and his minimum was $115k, Wade will be lucky to get a similar offer because he doesn’t have nearly the same profile.

troyzer

irishbucsfan wrote: »

And then he took it up in college while playing for a division I school and got drafted to the NFL. He never played professional rugby.

There aren’t others if you’re talking about players trying to do what Christian Wade is trying to do. It hasn’t happened successfully. Players have gone to the States to try but it hasn’t happened yet for them.

The main reason this is now possible for guys to try is because of new NFL rules around practice squad numbers, effectively meaning someone like Wade can be signed as an extra player. But being on a practice squad is very different to being on an active roster and you do not qualify for the rookie or veteran minimum. He can go over and sign for a practice squad and that will start the clock giving him 3 years to develop (unless international players get an extra year perhaps)

The closest we’ve ever seen to being successful was Jarryd Hayne from rugby league. He’s back in Australia again now. He started one game in the NFL. He was signed specifically and his minimum was $115k, Wade will be lucky to get a similar offer because he doesn’t have nearly the same profile.

From Google there are guys who went over with no experience and ended up with long careers in the full squad like Gary Anderson and David Dixon. These are indisputable.

Jordan Mailata went over last year and he's on the full squad for the Eagles.

It IS possible, it's just really really hard.

Buer

It is completely crazy. He doesn't have a hope of making it whatsoever. The closest comparison to my mind would be Jarryd Hane who made the roster by the skin of his teeth and was cut 6 weeks later before retiring ahead of the next season. Jarryd Hane was a much, much better athlete than Wade who is completely dependent on speed. Guys with Wade's attributes are ten a penny in the NFL draft.

Nate Ebner isn't a realistic comparison. He's American, for a start. He'll have grown up in a culture of gridiron and would have been extremely familiar with the sport even before he started playing in college. Wade is starting so far behind the curve, it's pointless. I'll eat my hat if he makes any squad.

Buer

troyzer wrote: »

From Google there are guys who went over with no experience and ended up with long careers in the full squad like Gary Anderson and David Dixon. These are indisputable.

Jordan Mailata went over last year and he's on the full squad for the Eagles.

It IS possible, it's just really really hard.

A kicker and two lads who were 150kg+ and 6'5" and 6'8" respectively. They're not really relevant to Wade at all.

troyzer

I guess we'll just have to wait and see!

I reckon he has an outside chance as a tackling specialist on punt and kick returns.

razorblunt

molloyjh wrote: »

Billy V was involved in that too, although that seems to have flown under the radar. As has Farrells constant laughing at Glasgow players when they gave away penalties or turnovers. Of course then there was Rhodes and his hair pulling.

It's not like the club doesn't have form for this sort of thing either. There's no need for it at all and they should be getting pulled up over it.

After the hair pulling incident Rhodes was sarcastically clapping DTH, which is borderline fine ... maybe. But in cases like this I'd give them all a pass, they were playing Glasgow; DTH, Wilson, Cummings, Ashe, Swinson, Hogg are all well versed in the head taps and general shíthousing.