We’ve had abortions!/We haven't had abortions!

Hitman3000

blarrah wrote:

It is, in its own way. It imparts wisdom, enabling you to see the reality of your mistakes, to see things beyond the immediate present and immediate self.

Sadly most of what you have said cannot be attributed to a young person. Also time is linear, No going back. No offense but 'what ifs' will only torture you. Accept what you have now and look to the future.

Toastytoes

blarrah wrote: »

Signed up just to comment on this thread, it touches home.

Girlfriend and I were quite young, fell pregnant, disastrous set of circumstances at the time (in hindsight, not so much, but that's hindsight for you). Exams, start of careers, completely unstable financially etc.

Its still a haze looking back at it, time dragged on and on, unsure what to do, stress coming from everywhere else as well. Before we knew it the baby was quite late in pregnancy (I honestly cant remember how many weeks, it was something "in the middle")

Snap decision made, went to UK. Wasn't actually present in person in the room, but girlfriend told me everything, and let me tell you, its horrific. I clearly remember her saying that "bits of her (her, as in the baby) were cut up and sucked out. No need for the other details.

That was many years ago, and although we still somewhat know each other (relationship ended), we have never once talked about it since. I can say hand on heart that at least 3 or 4 days a week I think about it, regret it in many ways. If we had continued and allowed our girl to be born it would have completely changed our lives, I have no doubt about that.

Careers probably would have gone in absolutely different directions, would have been poorer in the immediate term, would have been very stressful at the immediate time etc. But being older now, I know that you get over problems, and I'm very sure we would have gotten over those problems too.

I'm not in a relationship at the moment, neither is she. But having read this thread it just makes me think for the millionth time that I could, in an alternate reality, hear a laugh in the hall outside now and the girl would come skipping in, she'd be there and be my daughter. It really is dreadful to have that hang on you. I have no doubt whatsoever that my ex feels the same, if not much worse. I daren't ask, because what can be said now?

That's my experience, and I wouldn't wish it on anyone, either the stress of not knowing what to do, or the reality of having done it. I just cant imagine, nor have I ever heard, anyone ever regretting having a child as much as NOT having a child.

I'm dreading the referendum next year, because its bad enough having these things live with you as well as having the whole thing shoved in your face every second through media, people knocking on doors and all that.

Anyone who says that having an abortion doesn't bother them, it just comes across as a seriously suspect personality to me. Anyone who can do such a thing and just treat it like nothing is unhinged or something, in my opinion. But there are plenty of strange people out there.

Anyone who says this is solely a womans choice is out of their mind. I cant think of a more selfish position to take. Its as plain as this, it involves the man, the woman, and the child. If all are present, then its a joint decision and there should be equal regard for all 3. Anything else is out of this world.

Its very easy to see the women who hate men (or lets say have a serious "problem" with men) hijacking the debate and turning it into womens rights, or me, me, me. Equally so, its easy to see the men who operate on the other side of it, trying to dictate entirely what should happen from their perspective.

Its a pity these "social warriors" will take control of the debate and be the loudest mouths. But what else was going to happen?!

The whole abortion issue is a bandaid for a far more serious problem in society. Instead of preventing all of these preventable pregnancies from happening, we've just accepted the problem and moved onto the short-sighted "solution" of abortion.

That's my two cents anyway. I wouldn't do it again if I could go back.

Don’t assume your experience allows you to speak for others. Your circumstances, your decision, your regrets. You must have known or had some idea what a mid term abortion would entail and gone in to it with your eyes open. Not every abortion is a mid or late term one.

blarrah

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Sadly most of what you have said cannot be attributed to a young person. Also time is linear, No going back. No offense but 'what ifs' will only torture you. Accept what you have now and look to the future.

You're right, but equally unfortunately abortion is faced mostly by young people. And seeing as this seems to be the "me" generation you might as well be talking to a wall as trying to talk sense into anyone.

I think the campaign will be run on the basis of "me" versus "others". "me" will win because selfishness always comes first (definition of it?)

But I don't agree about disregarding the past, its a little too close to ignorance for me. I think a person should recognise and absorb the mistakes they make, be responsible for what you have and haven't done, that's what makes up your character. Its not a good thing to forget your past or to degrade/minimise it. A trade-off for that personal growth is the odd regret.

blarrah

Toastytoes wrote: »

Don’t assume your experience allows you to speak for others. Your circumstances, your decision, your regrets. You must have known or had some idea what a mid term abortion would entail and gone in to it with your eyes open. Not every abortion is a mid or late term one.

Can you speak for others? Are you allowed to have an opinion?

If so, whats the difference with what I said?

Toastytoes

blarrah wrote: »

Can you speak for others? Are you allowed to have an opinion?

If so, whats the difference with what I said?

“Anyone who says that having an abortion doesn't bother them, it just comes across as a seriously suspect personality to me. Anyone who can do such a thing and just treat it like nothing is unhinged or something, in my opinion. But there are plenty of strange people out there.”

Wtf?! Who are you to judge them or their reactions?!! People deal with their decisions however they deal with them. You’ve clearly struggled with your decision in the aftermath. There are many people who say they made the decision that was best for them and don’t necessarily live a life plagued by constant thoughts and regrets about it.

blarrah

Toastytoes wrote: »

“Anyone who says that having an abortion doesn't bother them, it just comes across as a seriously suspect personality to me. Anyone who can do such a thing and just treat it like nothing is unhinged or something, in my opinion. But there are plenty of strange people out there.”

Wtf?! Who are you to judge them or their reactions?!! People deal with their decisions however they deal with them. You’ve clearly struggled with your decision in the aftermath. There are many people who say they made the decision that was best for them and don’t necessarily live a life plagued by constant thoughts and regrets about it.

Who am I to judge people? I'm a human being. You may have noticed for the entirety of your life that everyone judges everything. Just like you're judging me for judging others.

You say that there are many people that don't have regrets, I say there are. Unless you're god and know everything.....its a moot point. The one difference is that I at least have provided something to talk about, you haven't.

You could apply your "point" to absolutely everything. *insert absolutely anything as a topic here*......your response, "but not necessarily so!"

Ave Sodalis

blarrah wrote: »

I've never heard anyone say anything similar. And I would imagine that everyone has bouts of fancy, "what if I did this, what if I did that"......but its probably just fanciful.

I'd imagine that if those women had their children in front of them and they were given the choice to get rid of them and have a different (unknown) life, I cant imagine a mother REALLY going for the trade. Its a nice soundbite and something to muse over, but I think reality would be different.

Another thing I'd say is a major factor (even for myself) is having other children. I don't have other children, and my tune might be different if I did. Its a really debase form of humanity, but sure maybe one is as good as another if you have them

And fathers? Could you say the same thing about fathers?

Just because you haven't heard anyone say it, doesn't really mean that nobody says it. The woman I worked with "bout of fancy" has lasted a great many years at this stage, and I doubt she's changed her mind.

blarrah

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

And fathers? Could you say the same thing about fathers?

Just because you haven't heard anyone say it, doesn't really mean that nobody says it. The woman I worked with "bout of fancy" has lasted a great many years at this stage, and I doubt she's changed her mind.

Of course I realise that I just because I haven't heard it doesn't mean it isn't said.

I still stand by what I said though, stick that womans kids in front of her and present her with the REALITY of the choice, and I don't think she'd change. I don't know who she is, she could be a horrible person, her children could be horrible, who knows?

I'm judging it based on my experience of average normal people in average, normal circumstances. I cant judge it by extraordinary circumstances if I don't KNOW those circumstances, surely.

Toastytoes

blarrah wrote: »

Who am I to judge people? I'm a human being. You may have noticed for the entirety of your life that everyone judges everything. Just like you're judging me for judging others.

You say that there are many people that don't have regrets, I say there are. Unless you're god and know everything.....its a moot point. The one difference is that I at least have provided something to talk about, you haven't.

You could apply your "point" to absolutely everything. *insert absolutely anything as a topic here*......your response, "but not necessarily so!"

You clearly regret your decision. Don’t assume it’s the same for everyone.

It’s a personal decision for every person faced with it and not everyone will have the same experience as you did.

blarrah

Toastytoes wrote: »

You clearly regret your decision. Don’t assume it’s the same for everyone.

It’s a personal decision for every person faced with it and not everyone will have the same experience as you did.

I don't think you understood the point I made in my last comment. WHat youre saying is without merit. Or perhaps another way to say it; its so glaringly obvious it doesn't need to be said.

"I think, based on my experiences, that a lot of people don't like drinking milk"......your response is "But it might not be that way for some other people"

"I think, based on my experiences, that the GDP of Saudi Arabia will grow this year".......your response is, "But it might not".

Youre not saying anything, its like you just want to be contrary for the purpose of being contrary.

Graham

blarrah wrote: »

I'm judging it based on my experience of average normal people in average, normal circumstances. I cant judge it by extraordinary circumstances if I don't KNOW those circumstances, surely.

I think it's probably more accurate to say your basing it on your individual experience.

That doesn't automatically extrapolate across the entire population.

Toastytoes

blarrah wrote: »

I don't think you understood the point I made in my last comment. WHat youre saying is without merit. Or perhaps another way to say it; its so glaringly obvious it doesn't need to be said.

"I think, based on my experiences, that a lot of people don't like drinking milk"......your response is "But it might not be that way for some other people"

"I think, based on my experiences, that the GDP of Saudi Arabia will grow this year".......your response is, "But it might not".

Youre not saying anything, its like you just want to be contrary for the purpose of being contrary.

You regret your decision and would change it if you could and you seem to want to assume it’s the same for everyone.

Ave Sodalis

blarrah wrote: »

Of course I realise that I just because I haven't heard it doesn't mean it isn't said.

I still stand by what I said though, stick that womans kids in front of her and present her with the REALITY of the choice, and I don't think she'd change. I don't know who she is, she could be a horrible person, her children could be horrible, who knows?

I'm judging it based on my experience of average normal people in average, normal circumstances. I cant judge it by extraordinary circumstances if I don't KNOW those circumstances, surely.

Actually, she's a lovely person and one I have a lot of time for. I still think she would have chosen to not have children if she could go back.

blarrah wrote: »

I don't think you understood the point I made in my last comment. WHat youre saying is without merit. Or perhaps another way to say it; its so glaringly obvious it doesn't need to be said.

"I think, based on my experiences, that a lot of people don't like drinking milk"......your response is "But it might not be that way for some other people"

"I think, based on my experiences, that the GDP of Saudi Arabia will grow this year".......your response is, "But it might not".

Youre not saying anything, its like you just want to be contrary for the purpose of being contrary.

To be fair, it's not that you've said that you think a lot of people do something based on your experience, because that's only just cropped up. It's that you originally made wildly sweeping generalisations and harsh, unfair comments about those not under your generalisations. Instead of just saying about how you went through an abortion with your girlfriend and regret it (which is perfectly reasonable), you had to try and demonize those who don't feel the same.

blarrah

Graham wrote: »

I think it's probably more accurate to say your basing it on your individual experience.

That doesn't automatically extrapolate across the entire population.

What is it with the contrary attitude here? I mean, what do you base your opinions and thoughts on, your own life, or Pat Kenny's life?

No it doesn't extrapolate across the entire population. Does your opinion do that, or are you just being contrary for the sake of it too?

Graham

blarrah wrote: »

What is it with the contrary attitude here? I mean, what do you base your opinions and thoughts on, your own life, or Pat Kenny's life?

No it doesn't extrapolate across the entire population. Does your opinion do that, or are you just being contrary for the sake of it too?

I get that you have regrets, as others have said that's understandable. What's being pointed out is you can't assume that means anyone else in similar circumstances feels as you do.

Toastytoes

blarrah wrote: »

What is it with the contrary attitude here? I mean, what do you base your opinions and thoughts on, your own life, or Pat Kenny's life?

No it doesn't extrapolate across the entire population. Does your opinion do that, or are you just being contrary for the sake of it too?

Are you just going to call everyone contrary?!

Just because not everyone shares your views? Can you come up with a better argument or point than that.

blarrah

Toastytoes wrote: »

You regret your decision and would change it if you could and you seem to want to assume it’s the same for everyone.

When you use the word "seem" it means that youre extrapolating the bit of information I have provided, applied your own interpretation to it, and voila, you've made a judgement on me. Do you feel bad about it, the way you'd like me to feel bad about it?

Here it is in a nutshell. Having gone through the entire process as much as I could have, I am left with the very real conclusion that people should be extremely careful about the choices they make, because it is definite and final.....and I am living proof (and I am confident it is the same for my ex) that it can be a very regretful thing.

You don't need to state for the third time that it might be different for everyone else. Of course it might be. But that's not my experience and this is my opinion and I believe it could well apply to many people.

I cant provide statistics on the regret-level of the population of Ireland for those who have gone through abortion.

But neither can you.

blarrah

Graham wrote: »

I get that you have regrets, as others have said that's understandable. What's being pointed out is you can't assume that means anyone else in similar circumstances feels as you do.

But I most certainly CAN assume it. I cant assume it for everyone, but I definitely can for SOME people.

Why can I not assume it? Are we all supposed to be unthinking goons that cant form an opinion? Not the least of which based on our own lives?

Why not just lock yourself in a box the rest of your life, you might get an idea one day? Just think about the logical conclusion of what youre saying.

blarrah

Toastytoes wrote: »

Are you just going to call everyone contrary?!

Just because not everyone shares your views? Can you come up with a better argument or point than that.

Go back to one of the previous posts I made to you. Quote it, try to contradict it if you can.

You have basically said the exact same thing 3 or 4 times in a row, haven't replied to what I said, and now somehow youre trying to miraculously turn this into ME not having a point.

Graham

blarrah wrote: »

But I most certainly CAN assume it. I cant assume it for everyone, but I definitely can for SOME people.

Why can I not assume it? Are we all supposed to be unthinking goons that cant form an opinion? Not the least of which based on our own lives?

Why not just lock yourself in a box the rest of your life, you might get an idea one day? Just think about the logical conclusion of what youre saying.

You appear to have come around to agree with the last few posters so I don't think there's any need for the snarkiness.

Toastytoes

blarrah wrote: »

Go back to one of the previous posts I made to you. Quote it, try to contradict it if you can.

You have basically said the exact same thing 3 or 4 times in a row, haven't replied to what I said, and now somehow youre trying to miraculously turn this into ME not having a point.

Because you are ignoring all opinions except your own and resorting to calling people contrary.

blarrah

Graham wrote: »

You appear to have come around to agree with the last few posters so I don't think there's any need for the snarkiness.

If that's what you call agreeing, so be it.

I'll have to remember that the next time I'm in a debate about absolutely anything under the sun......"but it might not be!"

My problem with all those posts is that they say nothing, its vapid, thin-air. Can you imagine trying to have a conversation with someone and all they did was state a negative of what you just said, with nothing else added? Yeah its irritable.

blarrah

Toastytoes wrote: »

Because you are ignoring all opinions except your own and resorting to calling people contrary.

You are either a master troll, or something....else.

Seeing as you refuse to comment on my actual words, maybe you could state your opinion?

Let me guess.......it might be a different experience for someone else? Is that it, did I pick it up correctly from the first 5 times you said it?

How on earth you seem to think you're on the up-side of this "argument" is baffling. Goodnight everyone.

Permabear

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Toastytoes

blarrah wrote: »

You are either a master troll, or something....else.

Seeing as you refuse to comment on my actual words, maybe you could state your opinion?

Let me guess.......it might be a different experience for someone else? Is that it, did I pick it up correctly from the first 5 times you said it?

How on earth you seem to think you're on the up-side of this "argument" is baffling. Goodnight everyone.

You come across as very immature and I’m not surprised you have struggled to deal with such a hugely important decision as the one you made. Genuinely, I’d recommend you look into getting some kind of support to help you come to terms with it.

Hitman3000

blarrah wrote:

But I don't agree about disregarding the past, its a little too close to ignorance for me. I think a person should recognise and absorb the mistakes they make, be responsible for what you have and haven't done, that's what makes up your character. Its not a good thing to forget your past or to degrade/minimise it. A trade-off for that personal growth is the odd regret.

My past is not that not far back that I can't remember the terror of the choices made. At the time they seemed the best course of action. It's pointless questioning them.

Rumpy Pumpy

Permabear, your posts have become very creepy recently. Creepy isn’t cool. You try too hard.

Grayson

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

So you made a choice that worked for you. Don't make that choice for everyone.

Grayson

Rumpy Pumpy wrote: »

Your posts have become very creepy recently. Creepy isn’t cool. You try too hard.

It's not like there aren't umpteen threads about this that he could have posted in.
Edit: Thread merge

blarrah

Toastytoes wrote: »

You come across as very immature and I’m not surprised you have struggled to deal with such a hugely important decision as the one you made. Genuinely, I’d recommend you look into getting some kind of support to help you come to terms with it.

I was just about to go to bed, saw that you made your best comment yet, and just had to reply! Sometimes you have to give into these little urges.

So heres what I have to say; Take a mirror, look yourself in the eyes, and then repeat your own words back to yourself.

You're a joke, you have avoided every single one of my comments, and have somehow come to the conclusion that it is I that am immature and cant deal with serious problems. Notwithstanding the admittedly childish (you need those moments!) return comment from me.....just read the last few pages of the exchange between us. You look ridiculous.

And now I better get my 8 year old arse into bed

(Try to get a good last word in now, something along the lines of "youre a poo poo head!" should be about your level, and that ones on the house)

blarrah

Grayson wrote: »

So you made a choice that worked for you. Don't make that choice for everyone.

I keep seeing this sentiment, just as I'm about to leave the thread too.

You and a bunch of others are posting inane comments, let me explain, i'm not trying to be rude.

"Don't make that choice for everyone" fine. So what are you going to do? Are you going to vote? Are you going to recommend such and such to people in certain situations? You are obviously not going to say nothing, because youre pretty clear about telling other people what not to do already.

How do you figure into anything, should people be allowed do whatever they want? WHere do you draw the line (on any issue)?

Do you mind your own business on absolutely everything? You obviously don't because of your comments here.

Consider it rhetorical.

Toastytoes

blarrah wrote: »

I was just about to go to bed, saw that you made your best comment yet, and just had to reply! Sometimes you have to give into these little urges.

So heres what I have to say; Take a mirror, look yourself in the eyes, and then repeat your own words back to yourself.

You're a joke, you have avoided every single one of my comments, and have somehow come to the conclusion that it is I that am immature and cant deal with serious problems. Notwithstanding the admittedly childish (you need those moments!) return comment from me.....just read the last few pages of the exchange between us. You look ridiculous.

And now I better get my 8 year old arse into bed

(Try to get a good last word in now, something along the lines of "youre a poo poo head!" should be about your level, and that ones on the house)

Sure thing.... clearly I was completely mistaken as you’re obviously very mature.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Graham

blarrah wrote: »

"Don't make that choice for everyone" fine. So what are you going to do?

Give everyone the choice.

spookwoman

blarrah wrote: »

Who am I to judge people? I'm a human being. You may have noticed for the entirety of your life that everyone judges everything. Just like you're judging me for judging others.

You say that there are many people that don't have regrets, I say there are. Unless you're god and know everything.....its a moot point. The one difference is that I at least have provided something to talk about, you haven't.

You could apply your "point" to absolutely everything. *insert absolutely anything as a topic here*......your response, "but not necessarily so!"

You have the right to judge others but that doesn't mean you are right, just like because you have regrets doesn't mean everyone else shouldn't be given that choice.
You can assume there are others that will regret their choices be it having an abortion and not having one, it works both ways. People do regret going through with a pregnancy as well.
But the main point is it is their lives that are being affected not yours, how would you like it if someone butted into your life telling you what you could and couldn't do.

Permabear

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spookwoman

Permabear wrote: »

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difference between the state and some busy body

Permabear

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spookwoman

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

I haven't seen the state push pictures of photoshopped fake pictures of aborted fetus into childrens faces on the street or harass women entering family planning clinics

Graham

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

You realise this isn't another pro/anti thread right?

Are you planning to drop into the non-drinkers forum to tell them why you still like a pint at the weekend, just for the sake of balance.

One eyed Jack

Carry wrote: »

They not only had to fear prosecution (which didn’t happen) but also being shunned by all the people who quickly climbed up their moral high horse.

...

I’m not nosy, I still think that the more women say it out loud the more their predicament will be heard. And every abortion is a predicament that all those moralistic foetus-savers will never understand.

...

I’m interested in experiences of women who went through this ordeal.

May I ask - has it occurred to you at any point in your experiences and listening to the experiences of other women of their experience of abortion, that many of those women were themselves also feminists and foetus-savers?

Could it be possible for you then to understand why some women would prefer to keep their experiences of abortion to themselves, given that they may fear the wrath of opening themselves up to being humiliated and shunned by a person looking to get up on their own moral high horse?

My own experiences of women who have had abortions have been that they have been a mixed bag, with all sorts of individual perspectives, and yes, even women who have had abortions themselves who condemn other women for having abortions!

This idea that peoples morals regarding abortion delineates or aligns neatly along a particular set of preconceived ideas or ideological beliefs is no different than the hundreds of other threads that have already appeared on Boards regarding the issue of abortion, and your opening post is really no different. It's just saying the same thing in a different way - "I only want to hear from people who will validate my perspective of my experience".

That's at least one of the reasons why people may be reluctant to discuss their perspective of their experiences with others, whose perspective of their experiences may differ, thereby making them feel like their perspective of their experience is invalid, as it doesn't meet the criteria you've set out that they perceive are the only kinds of experiences you want to hear about.

RabbleRouser2k

I often wonder about my reasons for being here.

I don't know if I could actually fully defend my being alive-in that I don't believe I was actually wanted. My mother wanted two children, my dad only wanted one. And with good reason. He grew up in a large family, I'm talking double digits, and he did not the same for himself. Well, a number of miscarriages later, two doctors opinions (one telling them they would never have children, the other saying they would) and my brother was born.
And that is all my dad wanted-it was my mother who wanted two kids.

Well, cue my birth-and a lot of problems. Bronchitis at 6 months, Depression and anxiety for as far back as I can remember, and an emotionally immature individual who realized from an early age that parenting was not for him. (Animals I am terrible for, however, they boss me around and I let them.)
And never being close to my dad. Not like my brother anyway.

I often think did my parents make the right choice? And if they had chance to do it all over again, would they? I dunno, I often think they would have been better off without me, tbh. Especially if they had better access to information.

So a termination would have been better in the long run-times were tough financially, and I can't say I would have been any the wiser if I wasn't here.

JupiterKid

Good idea for a thread. Women in France in 1972 also publicly declared that they had abortions and saw resulting huge controversy and debate but the law was changed.

I know at least two women who have had abortions. And they are not at all like the type of women that the moralising "pro-lifers" would have us imagine.

One eyed Jack

JupiterKid wrote: »

I know at least two women who have had abortions. And they are not at all like the type of women that the moralising "pro-lifers" would have us imagine.

Well I suppose the fact that I imagine they are women is probably a good start, and not this "pregnant persons" nonsense I've seen doing the rounds lately, but apart from that, are they any different to moralising "pro-choicers"?

I don't imagine they are.

HandsomeBob

lazybones32 wrote: »

My dad had to bribe her to not kill me by taking her shopping in Dublin for a weekend.

Jesus.

shesty

Interesting thread.....

I have not had an abortion.I don't actually know anybody who has (or if they did, they certainly haven't told me).

I have been pregnant though.And I have seen the heartbeat on scans at 6/7 weeks in each.Could I have ended it?Nope.

If I was told at 12/20 weeks that it had a condition that meant it couldn't survive, could I end it? I don't think so myself - again I have seen the little wriggles, the fingers and toes, the baby that they are at that time.

BUT-that said, I fully believe there is a place for abortion for people who are given such news, and for people who are victims of rape and also for various other medical circumstances.I don't envy them that decision by the way.I personally think it's a hideous decision to have to make.

I am very grey on the topic of getting pregnant and not wanting it or it being a bad time to have a baby and it's a choice you have to make, so you should have access to abortion.I don't actually know how I feel about that. I appreciate every person's circumstances are different but at the same time......consequences and taking responsibility.....I don't know.

Two other things.Firstly many women who are now in their 50/60/70 telling their abortion stories....the problem was far wider than 'you can't have an abortion here'.It was societal condemnation of single mothers, families being 'shamed' by having an unwed mother, no support of income for these women as they couldn't work.....it was a much bigger picture than simply 'I got pregnant and it wasn't a good time to have a baby'.Their stories are extremely valid because not least because they show Irish society for what it was at the time, but they are not quite in the same context as someone who can't finish their degree if they have the baby. (As some stories are presented).

The second thing is that there's a lot of shouting in this debate but I rarely if ever hear anything of the after effects on women.who have an abortion.I hear about the physical after effects in the context of not being in yourhome country but the mental?Very little.And I know everyone reacts differently but I can't imagine there are so few living with the mental scars afterwards.It must have a profoundly deep effect on most women who do this, that they have to live with forever and that's rarely mentioned.

Toastytoes

shesty wrote: »

Interesting thread.....
The second thing is that there's a lot of shouting in this debate but I rarely if ever hear anything of the after effects on women.who have an abortion.I hear about the physical after effects in the context of not being in yourhome country but the mental?Very little.And I know everyone reacts differently but I can't imagine there are so few living with the mental scars afterwards.It must have a profoundly deep effect on most women who do this, that they have to live with forever and that's rarely mentioned.

Maybe it’s not always a negative effect though? Maybe there are women who made the decision that was right for them for whatever their reasons and are dealing with it ok. Are not deeply traumatized. Know that they made the best choice in the situation. Why do we want to assume the other is most likely?

Maybe we don’t hear it in this debate because it’s not relevant to the issue of all women having the right to make the choice that is best for them regardless of others having regretted it or struggled with it. And the right to access abortion services safely, timely and in their own country.

eviltwin

Only speaking for myself here. I have no regrets about my abortion nor does my husband. Not because we are cruel or unemotional but because we know we made the right choice. We'd already had one child so we knew the reality of parenting and the impact it has, we were both older so we didn't have the worry of our parents finding out or a pregnancy being a stigma, it was a decision we had space to make. I think the fact we are surrounded by good people who are supportive and non judgemental is a huge help too. It can't be easy to move on if you are constantly told you did a terrible thing.

am i bovvered

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

I often wonder about my reasons for being here.

I don't know if I could actually fully defend my being alive-in that I don't believe I was actually wanted. My mother wanted two children, my dad only wanted one. And with good reason. He grew up in a large family, I'm talking double digits, and he did not the same for himself. Well, a number of miscarriages later, two doctors opinions (one telling them they would never have children, the other saying they would) and my brother was born.
And that is all my dad wanted-it was my mother who wanted two kids.

Well, cue my birth-and a lot of problems. Bronchitis at 6 months, Depression and anxiety for as far back as I can remember, and an emotionally immature individual who realized from an early age that parenting was not for him. (Animals I am terrible for, however, they boss me around and I let them.)
And never being close to my dad. Not like my brother anyway.

I often think did my parents make the right choice? And if they had chance to do it all over again, would they? I dunno, I often think they would have been better off without me, tbh. Especially if they had better access to information.

So a termination would have been better in the long run-times were tough financially, and I can't say I would have been any the wiser if I wasn't here.

Hi Rabble
Lots of children come into the world unplanned and initially unwanted, do not allow this to stop you living your life !!
Please stop reinforcing the image you have determined for yourself into the future. No more 'I am' regarding past behaviour. You sound young and your life is in your own hands, no excuses.
To help you with this make sure you are getting help with your issues as well as exercising and working.
You are worthy of life, you have life, live life

Conor Bourke

shesty wrote: »

I am very grey on the topic of getting pregnant and not wanting it or it being a bad time to have a baby and it's a choice you have to make, so you should have access to abortion.I don't actually know how I feel about that. I appreciate every person's circumstances are different but at the same time......consequences and taking responsibility.....I don't know.

One poster here told her story of having an abortion when she found herself pregnant with a fifth child that her and her husband simply couldn’t support. They were using contraceptives. In 2015, 54% of women who terminated their pregnancies in the UK were already mothers. 70% were married or had partners. Your post reads as though you believe the only people who seek abortions are wild and flighty young wans and something needs to put a halt to their gallop.

If you agree with abortion “in certain circumstances”, it is not abortion you have an issue with, it’s the type of sex women are having.