Republic of Ireland Team Talk/News/Rumours 2018/19

Dots1982

It was some big nothing of a career Stephen Ireland ended up having. Constantly injured and not up to the level at the rare times he was fit. Seems to have just retired now. Some waste of space.

Sin City

Complete waste of talent Stephen Ireland was

Francie Barrett

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

She's not his mother.




Who says the FAI have even talked with him or even knew that Ireland's kid played football seeing as the FAI only first heard of Armstrong Okoflex after he was called up and played with England first.

I thought Ireland had custody of all his children though?

Sin City

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

She's not his mother.

Probably has 3 mothers like his 3 grannies

Mr.Nice Guy

Dots1982 wrote: »

It was some big nothing of a career Stephen Ireland ended up having. Constantly injured and not up to the level at the rare times he was fit. Seems to have just retired now. Some waste of space.

Sin City wrote:

Complete waste of talent Stephen Ireland was

9 goals and 9 assists in the Premier League in 2008-09, where he was voted Man City's Player of the Season. (13 goals, 13 assists in total that season)

Voted Villa's Player of the Season in 2012.

6 senior caps, 4 goals for Ireland. Also scored the first ever international goal in Croke Park against Wales.

Millionaire, never has to work a day again in his life.

I agree he didn't live up to the promise of his early years but that's hardly the record of a waste of talent. That's a better career CV than 90% of senior Ireland pros will ever get.

mada82

It’s a pity the issues with Ireland could not be resolved back them. Was looking like he was going to be a top player and a very important one for us.

Corholio

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

9 goals and 9 assists in the Premier League in 2008-09, where he was voted Man City's Player of the Season. (13 goals, 13 assists in total that season)

Voted Villa's Player of the Season in 2012.

6 senior caps, 4 goals for Ireland. Also scored the first ever international goal in Croke Park against Wales.

Millionaire, never has to work a day again in his life.

I agree he didn't live up to the promise of his early years but that's hardly the record of a waste of talent. That's a better career CV than 90% of senior Ireland pros will ever get.

He was a waste of talent. Almost everything he did was before he came to Villa. His player of the year award is infamous for being hilarious because everyone was pretty crap that year. All short term stats. An 'average' player playing multiple seasons steadily is a better career imo.

Mr.Nice Guy

Corholio wrote: »

He was a waste of talent. Almost everything he did was before he came to Villa. His player of the year award is infamous for being hilarious because everyone was pretty crap that year. All short term stats. An 'average' player playing multiple seasons steadily is a better career imo.

When was the last time an Irish player returned a season comparable to 9 goals and 9 assists in the Premier League? Duff? Robbie Keane?

If we're rubbishing his stats then we're rubbishing 90% of our players who can't get close to that kind of an impact. Duffy is the top scoring Irish player from our squad in the Premier League from the last few years for example.

His decline can't be denied but to also deny that he hit a ridiculously good peak by Irish standards is just being blinded by dislike of him tbh.

Corholio

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

When was the last time an Irish player returned a season comparable to 9 goals and 9 assists in the Premier League? Duff? Robbie Keane?

If we're rubbishing his stats then we're rubbishing 90% of our players who can't get close to that kind of an impact. Duffy is the top scoring Irish player from our squad in the Premier League from the last few years for example.

His decline can't be denied but to also deny that he hit a ridiculously good peak by Irish standards is just being blinded by dislike of him tbh.

Who mentioned Irish standards? The original point was a waste of talent, in relation to the trajectory of his career, like most players output of talent is judged. The 'waste' of talent expression shows he had 'talent', just wasted it in terms of his overall career. He left City 9 years ago when he was around 24, he's 32 now and has done absolutely in that time except mediocre or worse loan spells. He has only scored 3 goals in that entire time too. Career wise his peak was quite short as well.

Oh and I also don't 'dislike' him.

Mr.Nice Guy

Corholio wrote: »

Who mentioned Irish standards? The original point was a waste of talent, in relation to the trajectory of his career, like most players output of talent is judged. The 'waste' of talent expression shows he had 'talent', just wasted it in terms of his overall career. He left City 9 years ago when he was around 24, he's 32 now and has done absolutely in that time except mediocre or worse loan spells. He has only scored 3 goals in that entire time too. Career wise his peak was quite short as well.

Oh and I also don't 'dislike' him.

Irish standards are understandably mentioned given we're in the Ireland thread (no pun intended). You say most players output is judged on career trajectory - indeed so, but the problem is you wish to overlook the trajectory where a scrawny kid from Cork goes across the water to become one of the standout players in perhaps the toughest league in the world. Presumably because it doesn't fit your narrative.

You conveniently wish to focus on his post-City career when judging his overall output which is not a fair appraisal, and again dismiss him being voted Villa's best player in 2012 because in your words "everyone was pretty crap that year". Consider the kind of teams most Irish players play for these days and reflect on that last statement in relation to an Irishman being a standout for a Premier League side - struggling or not. You seem to be cherry-picking aspects of his career. You sure you don't dislike him?

Let's frame it this way...

True of false? Stephen Ireland in 08-09 had a season for Manchester City that was comparable in quality to ones we've seen from the very best Irish internationals in the Premier League era.

True or false? Scoring 4 goals in 6 international appearances, including an historic first ever goal at Croke Park, is a commendable career return for an Irish international player.

True or false? Having standout seasons for two different Premier League clubs is a respectable record for an Irish professional in England.

If your answer to the above statements is 'false', can you name me a dozen or so Irish players that can equal or better the above, just so we know the company he's in keeping with.

If your answer to the above statements is 'true', how can he be said to have been a waste of talent?

There's been talk in this thread about this guy's kids and who they might play for etc. Here's a thought for anyone who's a father, or perhaps one day might be a father: if your own son had the career outlined above that Ireland did, would you in all honesty say your son had been 'a waste of talent'? I highly doubt it.

Fr Tod Umptious

For all the giving out people do here about the Irish setup and the way it's run and the FAI etc it's ironic that people are giving out about a guy who experienced that setup, left it, and now is not pushing his English born and raised son towards it.

Zico !

Ireland best performance was that man of the match performance at Old Trafford for City match of the day pundits were all over him he had Scholes in his pocket
Ya if Robbie Keane didn't mock his hair he could of had a long career with us

LuckyLloyd

He managed over 300 top level senior appearances. Hung around Premier League Squads making at least occasional appearances for 14 years. You can't argue that he didn't make it.

I do agree that he is a massive 'what might have been' player though. He was electric in 2008 / 9. I remember in particular a magnificent goal he scored away in Germany in a UEFA Cup Quarter final (I can't find it on youtube) where he started a move by aggressively winning the ball in midfield, played an ambitious 1 - 2 with Robinho and finished calmly. He just never pushed on from that season the way you might have hoped.

So I see both sides to this one. We necessarily analyse the careers of pro footballers to various levels. Ireland is a 'failure' because he might have had the talent to be a top player in his position in the Premier League. But he's a 'success' relative to the young lads who get shipped over from youth football in Ireland to the UK Academy conveyor belts - easily in the very highest percentiles.

That his career is over makes me feel a little older though, I'll say that much!

Ferris_Bueller

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

He managed over 300 top level senior appearances. Hung around Premier League Squads making at least occasional appearances for 14 years. You can't argue that he didn't make it.

I do agree that he is a massive 'what might have been' player though. He was electric in 2008 / 9. I remember in particular a magnificent goal he scored away in Germany in a UEFA Cup Quarter final (I can't find it on youtube) where he started a move by aggressively winning the ball in midfield, played an ambitious 1 - 2 with Robinho and finished calmly. He just never pushed on from that season the way you might have hoped.

So I see both sides to this one. We necessarily analyse the careers of pro footballers to various levels. Ireland is a 'failure' because he might have had the talent to be a top player in his position in the Premier League. But he's a 'success' relative to the young lads who get shipped over from youth football in Ireland to the UK Academy conveyor belts - easily in the very highest percentiles.

That his career is over makes me feel a little older though, I'll say that much!

Spot on, I think it is fair to say he is a wasted talent but I guess it depends on your definition. 99% of young footballers would probably settle for the career he has had but he should have achieved more. Even a poster or two up above saying we haven't seen a player as talented since Robbie or Duffer, and that is exactly the point - he should have gone on to have careers like them two lads but he never kicked on from Man City. Guys like Richard Dunne, Glenn Whelan, Seamus Coleman all got the max out of their careers despite having much less talent, whereas Ireland at his peak was brilliant and he was much more talented, yet he won't be remembered fondly by many at all.

Eod100

Hopefully Maguire stays injury free. https://www.rte.ie/amp/1032988/?__twitter_impression=true

Adamocovic

Ireland was definitely a talented player no doubt, and had such a bright start to his career. I think he definitley could have achieved more if he made smarter decisions but still, you have to acknowledge the success he's had.

Mad to think looking back he was only with us during 2006-2007, let us very early on in his career and the questions on whether he returned lilngered for what felt like forever. Was good when he was with us no doubt and we did miss his ability if we're being truthful.

Seems like he was a bit odd though, him against the world attitude from interviews, fell out with Kerr, the Granny-Gate was a complete shambles, and then accusations of bullying. He says the bullying isn't true as far as I'm aware.

Remember him saying he still supported Ireland but it was amateurish and bias. Complained about the difference in treatment between the Dublin based lads and the rest of the lads. Also said they weren't looked after and he grew sick of it. It's an odd one though and always will be a what if player.

No doubt it's not the last we'll hear of him or his family, just wait for the media attention around his son. No doubt he'll be playing for England but I'd say we'll hear a bit about it. Wonder will the FAI try to approach him.

wadacrack

Zico ! wrote: »

Ireland best performance was that man of the match performance at Old Trafford for City match of the day pundits were all over him he had Scholes in his pocket
Ya if Robbie Keane didn't mock his hair he could of had a long career with us

With hindsight I think the Stephen Ireland situation was handled disgraceful tbh. His mental state was clearly not good , struggling with his image and his girlfriend miscarried a child.

wadacrack

wadacrack wrote: »

With hindsight I think the Stephen Ireland situation was handled disgraceful tbh. His mental state was clearly not good , struggling with his image and his girlfriend miscarried a child.

Afair that's what he claimed at the time. He had lied about a family member dying by then so I think many were sceptical about the new claim.

As for being concerned about his hair, what a first world problem.

He seemed like a complete and utter skanger, which is no crime - what one does on the pitch is the main issue - but the whole sensitivity about his hair was hilarious.

The Talking Bread

He was actually very much on the verge of giving it another go (if needed) once Trap went but between injuries, his over thinking everything and notably more terrible man management and communication skills by Keane and MON it never materialised.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/stephen-ireland-reveals-breakdown-in-communication-with-martin-oneill-and-roy-keane-over-ireland-return-36049867.html

OldMrBrennan83

Eod100 wrote: »

Hopefully Maguire stays injury free. https://www.rte.ie/amp/1032988/?__twitter_impression=true

More chance of us all winning the Euromillions.

The Talking Bread

sugarman wrote: »

Whatever the case, he was no great loss as it turned out anyway. He had a decent club career, not may players get close to 250 PL appearances.

We were crying out for a player like him at the time and through the Trap era. It is all shouda woulda but he was definitely a loss.

dr.kenneth noisewater

Another goal for Ronan Curtis for Pompey Tonight. Be interested to see how he goes in Championship if they go up

Adamocovic

sugarman wrote: »

So youre telling me at 19/20 you never any mistakes nor told a white lie to get out of a bad situation?

He lied about his grandmother dying to protect his equally young girlfriend who had indeed suffered a miscarriage. Its even on record of Man City sending him to counseling to help cope during this period.

As for the hair thing? If reports are to be believed, which have been from more than one source, he was being badly bullied. Including being pinned to the ground by grown men in the locker rooms trying to pull off his hairpiece. Dont tell me you'd just brush it off as "banter". It was a joke that went too far.

I genuinely believe he had/has mental health issues, and maybe if the incident happened a few year later in the more modern football world he might have been more open about it.

Whatever the case, he was no great loss as it turned out anyway. He had a decent club career, not may players get close to 250 PL appearances.

Wasn't just the one gran, every time they found out they were alive he changed until he couldn't any more. Went through 3 of them, some attempting to sue news papers reporting their death.

He said the whole reason he told them it was his gran was because he thought it would get him home quicker. Sven Goran Erikson at the time at City described it as it was, stupid by him.

As for the bullying, maybe it occured but he has always denied this, sounds more like he just didn't feel valued by the FAI, argued the Dublin lads got better treatment and that it wasn't professional enough for him at the time, then said if he was to come back he wouldn't feel right taking someones spot.

Maybe he had mental issues, but nothing has been confirmed so can't treat his actions like he did. For all the talent and potential he had he just continued to make terrible decisions on and off the pitch. Maybe it all happened too quickly for him and he didn't know how to handle it, but he also had issues at underage level, remember Kerr had a huge falling out with him even going as far as saying he wouldn't wear an Irish jersey for as long as Kerr had any say. Can't say the warning signs weren't there.

Definitely had a good career, better than most, but can't say he lived up to his potential.

pgj2015

Adamocovic wrote: »

Wasn't just the one gran, every time they found out they were alive he changed until he couldn't any more. Went through 3 of them, some attempting to sue news papers reporting their death.

He said the whole reason he told them it was his gran was because he thought it would get him home quicker. Sven Goran Erikson at the time at City described it as it was, stupid by him.

As for the bullying, maybe it occured but he has always denied this, sounds more like he just didn't feel valued by the FAI, argued the Dublin lads got better treatment and that it wasn't professional enough for him at the time, then said if he was to come back he wouldn't feel right taking someones spot.

Maybe he had mental issues, but nothing has been confirmed so can't treat his actions like he did. For all the talent and potential he had he just continued to make terrible decisions on and off the pitch. Maybe it all happened too quickly for him and he didn't know how to handle it, but he also had issues at underage level, remember Kerr had a huge falling out with him even going as far as saying he wouldn't wear an Irish jersey for as long as Kerr had any say. Can't say the warning signs weren't there.

Definitely had a good career, better than most, but can't say he lived up to his potential.

I remember joey barton talking about how modern day footballers were living in cloud cuckoo land and mentioned a footballer buying a fish for his aquarium that looked like a pineapple, it cost £15,000. it was stephen he was talking about apparently.

Adamocovic

pgj2015 wrote: »

I remember joey barton talking about how modern day footballers were living in cloud cuckoo land and mentioned a footballer buying a fish for his aquarium that looked like a pineapple, it cost £15,000. it was stephen he was talking about apparently.

I'm not surprised. Maybe I'm wrong and I'll put my hand up if it's proven he has suffered from mental issues but it just strikes me as someone who rose too fast too young and couldn't handle it.

You could argue the support isn't in place for the young lads who start making loads and thrown into the spotlight perhaps. Some decisions were just immature and most of the controveries seemed to have came in the earlier parts of his career when he was younger and the world at his feet.

I know one of his quotes about not wanting to play for Ireland was the following:

“Going away for three days to play in Andorra – I’ve got better things to do. Also, when you’re Irish you know you’ll never win the World Cup."

For me I believe that was his attitude. Better than this. His falling out with Kerr was over him requesting to return to City after every game he didn't feature in.

So maybe I'm wrong and it was bullying but he himself says that's a daft rumour and argues he's still friends with most of the lads, from what he's ever said it seems more like he felt it wasn't up to his level.

pgj2015

Adamocovic wrote: »

I'm not surprised. Maybe I'm wrong and I'll put my hand up if it's proven he has suffered from mental issues but it just strikes me as someone who rose too fast too young and couldn't handle it.

You could argue the support isn't in place for the young lads who start making loads and thrown into the spotlight perhaps. Some decisions were just immature and most of the controveries seemed to have came in the earlier parts of his career when he was younger and the world at his feet.

I know one of his quotes about not wanting to play for Ireland was the following:



For me I believe that was his attitude. Better than this. His falling out with Kerr was over him requesting to return to City after every game he didn't feature in.

So maybe I'm wrong and it was bullying but he himself says that's a daft rumour and argues he's still friends with most of the lads, from what he's ever said it seems more like he felt it wasn't up to his level.

apparently he has that attitude about cork as well, there was a rumour of cork city making him an offer a few months back but he apparently said in the past that he would rather die than go back to cork.

Adamocovic

pgj2015 wrote: »

apparently he has that attitude about cork as well, there was a rumour of cork city making him an offer a few months back but he apparently said in the past that he would rather die than go back to cork.

The quote was something like he preferred to go to Los Angeles!

Argued it was made to sound harsher than it really was or something. Just another example of him making poor decisions with media.

Redo91

Brock Turnpike wrote: »

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

Mental health. The excuse for anything.

Disgraceful comment.

Just goes to show dinosaurs aren’t extinct after all!

pgj2015

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/158367/Footballer-who-spent-100-000-on-a-fish-tank

johnnyryan89

pgj2015 wrote: »

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/158367/Footballer-who-spent-100-000-on-a-fish-tank

Big shocker.. lad who didn't have a lot of money suddenly spends it on things you couldn't buy unless you had a lot of money.

The Talking Bread

Adamocovic wrote: »

Wasn't just the one granny........... some attempting to sue news papers reporting their death.

l.

I'm putting this on my big list of things that never happened.

Where did you pull that nonsense from!!

Adamocovic

Adamocovic wrote: »

Ireland was definitely a talented player no doubt, and had such a bright start to his career. I think he definitley could have achieved more if he made smarter decisions but still, you have to acknowledge the success he's had.

Mad to think looking back he was only with us during 2006-2007, let us very early on in his career and the questions on whether he returned lilngered for what felt like forever. Was good when he was with us no doubt and we did miss his ability if we're being truthful.

Seems like he was a bit odd though, him against the world attitude from interviews, fell out with Kerr, the Granny-Gate was a complete shambles, and then accusations of bullying. He says the bullying isn't true as far as I'm aware.

Remember him saying he still supported Ireland but it was amateurish and bias. Complained about the difference in treatment between the Dublin based lads and the rest of the lads. Also said they weren't looked after and he grew sick of it. It's an odd one though and always will be a what if player.

No doubt it's not the last we'll hear of him or his family, just wait for the media attention around his son. No doubt he'll be playing for England but I'd say we'll hear a bit about it. Wonder will the FAI try to approach him.

Family are known around Cork are a bit strange, difficult to deal with.....no chance his child will be repping Ireland in anything

Adamocovic

The Talking Bread wrote: »

I'm putting this on my big list of things that never happened.

Where did you pull that nonsense from!!

Nonsense? Which? It's known he changed the story multiple times before admitting the truth and it was stated that family members threatened legal action against papers.

"Ireland changed his story to say his paternal grandmother, Brenda Kitchener, had died. She, in turn, read about her own death and at least one newspaper was reportedly threatened with legal action by relatives on Thursday. "

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2007/sep/15/newsstory.sport4

Dots1982

Adamocovic wrote: »

Nonsense? Which? It's known he changed the story multiple times before admitting the truth and it was stated that family members threatened legal action against papers.

"Ireland changed his story to say his paternal grandmother, Brenda Kitchener, had died. She, in turn, read about her own death and at least one newspaper was reportedly threatened with legal action by relatives on Thursday. "

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2007/sep/15/newsstory.sport4

There’s a few footballers that you think you know will run into financial trouble and marriage difficulties when they retire. Ireland would be one for me.

Anyway moving on l; going by mccarthys interview with Stephen Doyle in OTB it doesn’t sound like McCarthy will be putting Coleman and Doherty in the same team. Doherty will be the one to lose out if that’s where mccarthys head is at.

Banjaxed82

Dots1982 wrote: »

There’s a few footballers that you think you know will run into financial trouble and marriage difficulties when they retire. Ireland would be one for me.

Anyway moving on l; going by mccarthys interview with Stephen Doyle in OTB it doesn’t sound like McCarthy will be putting Coleman and Doherty in the same team. Doherty will be the one to lose out if that’s where mccarthys head is at.

I thought it sounded more like Coleman was the one. There was no waffle like "he's my captain, we'll always find a place for him", etc.

Anyway, whatever way it works out, not starting Doherty will be a sin.

Ultimate Seduction

Banjaxed82 wrote: »

I thought it sounded more like Coleman was the one. There was no waffle like "he's my captain, we'll always find a place for him", etc.

Anyway, whatever way it works out, not starting Doherty will be a sin.

He said Coleman will be the captain didn't he?

Adamocovic

Did enjoy the honesty from Mick regarding the Declan Rice situation too. It was a bit of a gas interview.

On Coleman and Doherty

“How am I going to solve that conundrum was the question? Well I’m going to pick one of them and then I’m going to come in here and talk to all you guys [reporters] about the one I haven’t picked.

“How wonderful he is, how gifted he is, how he should have been playing….but he’s not because I’ve picked the other one.

“And you won’t talk about the other one that’s in the team, you’ll only want to know about the one that’s not so I’m ready for that.”

Adamocovic

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

He said Coleman will be the captain didn't he?

Said he hadn't a captain yet but there wouldn't be any reason why he wouldn't pick Coleman.

“I haven’t had a team yet so I haven’t got a captain as of yet. I think he’s a good captain [Coleman], I think he’s a really good role model as a footballer, how he’s gotten to where he is and stayed where he is, how he conducts himself, how he trains, his professionalism.

“If I am picking one [a captain], which I haven’t yet, there wouldn’t be any reason why I wouldn’t pick him as a captain.

weldoninhio

sugarman wrote: »

So youre telling me at 19/20 you never any mistakes nor told a white lie to get out of a bad situation?

He lied about his grandmother dying to protect his equally young girlfriend who had indeed suffered a miscarriage. Its even on record of Man City sending him to counseling to help cope during this period.

As for the hair thing? If reports are to be believed, which have been from more than one source, he was being badly bullied. Including being pinned to the ground by grown men in the locker rooms trying to pull off his hairpiece. Dont tell me you'd just brush it off as "banter". It was a joke that went too far.

I genuinely believe he had/has mental health issues, and maybe if the incident happened a few year later in the more modern football world he might have been more open about it.

Whatever the case, he was no great loss as it turned out anyway. He had a decent club career, not may players get close to 250 PL appearances.

Jaysus, you would never make it as a professional sportsman. That is on the very mild end of the scale of what went/goes on at training grounds/dressing rooms.

johnnyryan89

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjgir2x5t7gAhW_VRUIHTQ1AXMQzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.the42.ie%2Fmcdermott-released-by-dinamo-bucharest-4517508-Feb2019%2F&psig=AOvVaw0IBKT0cCuqUYYX3A7kETYq&ust=1551456071501850

Sean McDermott released by Dinamo Bucharest after only joining them last month.

Adamocovic

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjgir2x5t7gAhW_VRUIHTQ1AXMQzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.the42.ie%2Fmcdermott-released-by-dinamo-bucharest-4517508-Feb2019%2F&psig=AOvVaw0IBKT0cCuqUYYX3A7kETYq&ust=1551456071501850

Sean McDermott released by Dinamo Bucharest after only joining them last month.

Seems very odd. Manager stated:

I asked for a goalkeeper, not a libero, that is life. I told you, I am very demanding.

I don't want the next season to catch us and not be sure what we did during this period. We can not forgive anybody next season if we miss the play-off.

McDermott played 3 times for them. First two were wins with clean sheets, then dropped after a 2-1 defeat.

Seems completely bonkers to be honest! Is there any more to it?

johnnyryan89

Adamocovic wrote: »

Seems very odd. Manager stated:



McDermott played 3 times for them. First two were wins with clean sheets, then dropped after a 2-1 defeat.

Seems completely bonkers to be honest! Is there any more to it?

Haven't the foggiest and agree it's mad. Interesting to see if he heads back to Norway as the league starts end of March or goes somewhere else.

Mr.Nice Guy

Dan Crowley's Willem II are into the Dutch Cup final where they'll play Ajax after beating AZ Alkmaar 2-1 in a penalty shootout.

I didn't see the game but I caught the penalties. Crowley missed from the spot early on, but most of the players did. It was an awful shootout.

Pleased for him.

Banjaxed82

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Dan Crowley's Willem II are into the Dutch Cup final where they'll play Ajax after beating AZ Alkmaar 2-1 in a penalty shootout.

I didn't see the game but I caught the penalties. Crowley missed from the spot early on, but most of the players did. It was an awful shootout.

Pleased for him.

Crowley was very impressive throughout. I must say, he works his bollocks off more than you'd expect considering he's known more for what he does on the ball. Will be a big plus when he comes on board.

Corholio

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Irish standards are understandably mentioned given we're in the Ireland thread (no pun intended). You say most players output is judged on career trajectory - indeed so, but the problem is you wish to overlook the trajectory where a scrawny kid from Cork goes across the water to become one of the standout players in perhaps the toughest league in the world. Presumably because it doesn't fit your narrative.

You conveniently wish to focus on his post-City career when judging his overall output which is not a fair appraisal, and again dismiss him being voted Villa's best player in 2012 because in your words "everyone was pretty crap that year". Consider the kind of teams most Irish players play for these days and reflect on that last statement in relation to an Irishman being a standout for a Premier League side - struggling or not. You seem to be cherry-picking aspects of his career. You sure you don't dislike him?

Let's frame it this way...

True of false? Stephen Ireland in 08-09 had a season for Manchester City that was comparable in quality to ones we've seen from the very best Irish internationals in the Premier League era.

True or false? Scoring 4 goals in 6 international appearances, including an historic first ever goal at Croke Park, is a commendable career return for an Irish international player.

True or false? Having standout seasons for two different Premier League clubs is a respectable record for an Irish professional in England.

If your answer to the above statements is 'false', can you name me a dozen or so Irish players that can equal or better the above, just so we know the company he's in keeping with.

If your answer to the above statements is 'true', how can he be said to have been a waste of talent?

There's been talk in this thread about this guy's kids and who they might play for etc. Here's a thought for anyone who's a father, or perhaps one day might be a father: if your own son had the career outlined above that Ireland did, would you in all honesty say your son had been 'a waste of talent'? I highly doubt it.

Look we seem to have two different definitions of what a waste of talent means. I don't know why you mentioned about me focusing on his post-City career, which is multiple years, when you just focused on his 1 really good City season. I don't dislike him at all, I was delighted when he joined Villa but it didn't work out at all. As a Villa supporter I wasn't 'dismissing' him winning Villa's player of the year, I just know what that year was like and how him even winning that award has gone down in sort of infamy. He only played 90 minutes 11 times for Villa that year. He played ok and had a few good performances but even he himself admitted he didn't deserve to win it.

I just feel more of his talent was wasted than was shown across his career, which was multiple years doing very little and fading out.

sugarman

sugarman wrote: »

I genuinely believe he had/has mental health issues, and maybe if the incident happened a few year later in the more modern football world he might have been more open about it.

On the other hand, had it happened a few years earlier the implants would have been awful.

And he'd have been told to drop the mirror, stop worrying about his looks to the point of falling out with teammates over their reaction, and get a grip.

He may have had mental health issues. Or maybe he's just an asshole and it's a character issue rather than a mental health one. Or maybe a mix of both.

Rhys Essien

Stevens and Browne make Championship team of the month.

https://twitter.com/whoscored/status/1101150030382030848?s=21

The Talking Bread

Rhys Essien wrote: »

Stevens and Browne make Championship team of the month.

https://twitter.com/whoscored/status/1101150030382030848?s=21

And Westwood.

OldMrBrennan83

Does Ward get a game anywhere these days?

Loafing Oaf

The Talking Bread wrote: »

And Westwood.

Surely we can claim P. Gallagher as one of ours too.:p