EA messed up - the huge backlash about SW : BF2

wes

I doubt anyone trusts them at this point.

SeantheMan

I know noone really expected anything to happen, I at least hoped.
But it's funny going back to the comments on the 1st 2 pages of people who said there was no chance anything of the sort would happen.

gizmo

According to this piece on Venturebeat it looks like Disney did indeed get involved...

Earlier today, Electronic Arts chief executive officer Andrew Wilson had a phone call with The Walt Disney Company chief executive Bob Iger about Star Wars: Battlefront II, according to sources familiar with the situation. A few hours after that call, and players are finding that the option to purchase the premium crystals currency is no longer working. EA has now confirmed that it is taking this feature down to address fan concerns just as the game is about to launch worldwide tomorrow. All of this comes after multiple days of outrage from fans who are upset that EA and developer DICE have implemented an online multiplayer system that gives an advantage to people who pay money.

Oh, to be a fly on the wall for that conversation.

SeantheMan

SeantheMan wrote: »

I know noone really expected anything to happen, I at least hoped.
But it's funny going back to the comments on the 1st 2 pages of people who said there was no chance anything of the sort would happen.

Hate to toot own horn but yea, I was right
This is massive news for going in general IMO

Stone Deaf 4evr

gizmo wrote: »

According to this piece on Venturebeat it looks like Disney did indeed get involved...



Oh, to be a fly on the wall for that conversation.

If you think the house of mouse is a benevolent entity, not focused solely on generating money, well I'd say you're off the mark. It's a PR exercise now.

Stone Deaf 4evr

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

If you think the house of mouse is a benevolent entity, not focused solely on generating money, well I'd say you're off the mark. It's a PR exercise now.

I agree, but it made the difference all the same.
I'd say it was brown pants day at that meeting EA, Disney & the Shareholders.

quad_red

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

If you think the house of mouse is a benevolent entity, not focused solely on generating money, well I'd say you're off the mark. It's a PR exercise now.

But they’re pretty obsessive about protecting the brand as well. Battlefront is nothing if not massively high quality fan service - it’s what generates the best return. Having the brand become intimately associated with blatant ****ty money grabbing and potentially the centre of introducing gambling (gasp!) components into a wholesome game about space war is not something Disney Corps wants probably.

Me waiting for Jim Sterlings video like.....

Once it hit CNN then the **** hit the fan IMO

http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/16/technology/battlefront-ii-star-wars-game-gambling/index.html?sr=twCNN111617battlefront-ii-star-wars-game-gambling0129PMStory

Vicxas

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Me waiting for Jim Sterlings video like.....

Jim Sterling is gonna have a field day with this, seeing how much he despises Loot boxes and Microtransactions.

Jelle1880

Seems a lot of people are lapping this up as proof that EA have caved.

They'll just introduce it back after Christmas or so.

Jelle1880

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Seems a lot of people are lapping this up as proof that EA have caved.

They'll just introduce it back after Christmas or so.

Yes they will, it's confirmed it will return. But I'd suspect not in the manner of which it was in the game during implementation.

It's still a win IMO

Andrew76

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Me waiting for Jim Sterlings video like.....

Here you go.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiwRIkRTvms

Jelle1880

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Yes they will, it's confirmed it will return. But I'd suspect not in the manner of which it was in the game during implementation.

It's still a win IMO

You don't know that though. As for calling it a win: They deliberately kept it vague. None of this is by accident, they know what they are doing and no doubt Disney told them to try and get rid of the bad PR. So they make it sound like they've listened to the community, and will simply implement the same system later. I'd be more than happy to come back in here and apologise if I'm wrong.

And this might seem spiteful, but I actually hope they bring it back in the exact same way or even worse. I've had a read on /r/battlefrontTWO and those guys are lapping this **** up and calling out people who still complain, as if somehow EA have turned around and done the right thing.
Some people simply deserve to be ****ed over.

edit: https://twitter.com/The_Katbot/status/931367497831366657

So they're not changing it, it still links to progression in the game.

Kiith

Good to see that they have removed them, but it'll be interesting to see what happens when they bring them back. I actually don't think they'll bring them back in their current form, and I suspect we'll see mostly cosmetic microtransactions, along with some XP/credit booster type ones after Christmas.

Glad that there has been something positive (so far) from this whole ****show anyway.

Still probably won't buy it (though i was on the fence before this anyway)

Penn

Kiith wrote: »

Good to see that they have removed them, but it'll be interesting to see what happens when they bring them back. I actually don't think they'll bring them back in their current form, and I suspect we'll see mostly cosmetic microtransactions, along with some XP/credit booster type ones after Christmas.

Glad that there has been something positive (so far) from this whole ****show anyway.

Still probably won't buy it (though i was on the fence before this anyway)

EA have said in an interview that when they return they'll still be tied to progression, for people who want an "accelerated experience"

http://www.usgamer.net/articles/ea-star-wars-battlefront-2-changes-will-balance-those-who-want-gameplay-progression-and-those-who-want-an-accelerated-experience?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

In a telephone conversation, an EA representative confirmed that the developers are going "back to the drawing board" in attempting to balance out Battlefront 2's microtransactions. Their ultimate goal is to find a way to balance the needs of their large playerbase, they said.

In saying that they will try and strike a balance for those seeking an "accelerated experience," EA appears to be suggesting that Battlefront 2 will eventually return to offering the opportunity for players to spend money on accelerators—industry jargon for gameplay boosts that can be purchased with real money. Aside from Battlefront 2, Need for Speed Payback is a recent example of EA's attempt to introduce balanced "accelerators" through loot boxes.

Overall I'm glad that the line in the sand has now been drawn and EA and hopefully other companies will see that there is only so far they can push things before consumers push back. Maybe it needed to happen with a game the brand recognition that Star Wars has to help break it into mainstream news, but I think most games implementing lootboxes and microtransactions going forward will hopefully see that they will be called out on it if they push it too far.

Lone Stone

hmm i have a sneaking suspicion the talk of being investigated in regards to it being a gambling gotcha style system has them in panic mode, turn it offff quick before they see it, then turn it back on when the heat cools down.

Billy86

gizmo wrote: »

According to this piece on Venturebeat it looks like Disney did indeed get involved...



Oh, to be a fly on the wall for that conversation.

Can't remember who, but someone called this exactly.

I'd imagine they'll try and creep them in at some point, but if it's more than a few weeks after Christmas I'd also reckon many people will be done with needing to. I could be completely wrong here but figure it's the type of game that's going to have big sales for the next 6 weeks and then drop off quite dramatically and quickly.

Jelle1880

Jelle1880 wrote: »

You don't know that though. As for calling it a win: They deliberately kept it vague. None of this is by accident, they know what they are doing and no doubt Disney told them to try and get rid of the bad PR. So they make it sound like they've listened to the community, and will simply implement the same system later. I'd be more than happy to come back in here and apologise if I'm wrong.

And this might seem spiteful, but I actually hope they bring it back in the exact same way or even worse. I've had a read on /r/battlefrontTWO and those guys are lapping this **** up and calling out people who still complain, as if somehow EA have turned around and done the right thing.
Some people simply deserve to be ****ed over.

edit: https://twitter.com/The_Katbot/status/931367497831366657

So they're not changing it, it still links to progression in the game.

Again I haven't disagreed with any of that. I'm classing this a win due the fact it forced their hand.
I really don't expect it to return in the manner of which it was originally planned but we will wait and see.

Billy86

quad_red wrote: »

But they’re pretty obsessive about protecting the brand as well. Battlefront is nothing if not massively high quality fan service - it’s what generates the best return. Having the brand become intimately associated with blatant ****ty money grabbing and potentially the centre of introducing gambling (gasp!) components into a wholesome game about space war is not something Disney Corps wants probably.

And while less direct in terms of impact, as profitably as the BF game may be for them the last two Star Wars movies made a combined $3bn for Disney with another out just four Fridays from now (and the Hans Solo movie in the summer). Star Wars is surprisingly not all that popular in China either which is almost neck and neck with the US as the biggest market (and has weird rules that only allow 34 non-Chinese movies to be shown each year, e.g. you need to work hard to get on that list) so it's really important for them to maximise the Western market from top to bottom. Clearly this incident something most people who have been watching from early on or even many over 30 won't have heard of, but I really doubt Disney would want to take any chances.

The lift might stick and it might not, but at least this shows making enough noise can indeed get some sh** done and won't necessarily go entirely ignored, which is a bit encouraging at least between the sh**show that was EA this week, as week as WB about a month back with Shadow of War (though that one doesn't seem to be as was feared if the odd comment I've read here or there is anything to go by).

Jayop

That's mad about the few movies allowed in China.

Relikk

So now with unlocking content purely through gameplay for the time being, did they rework any credit prices (excluding the initial backlash) or timeframes? Or does it still take 4500 hours to unlock everything?

Billy86

Jayop wrote: »

That's mad about the few movies allowed in China.

Yeah, and it used to be 20! I'll try to not derail (much ) but before the Fugitive they had not shown any Hollywood (or I think even Japanese or Korean which are big producers obviously) movie in China for decades. Nobody cared because it wasn't much of a market - in 2002 the national box office for China was barely bigger than New Zealand's and smaller than the Dutch. It's actually an unexpected good barometer for how far along China has come, now having more cinema screens than any other country in the world and as of 2016 making up about 20% of the entire global box office (the US being 30%) which it was expected to overtake around 2020 but might even do so this year.

That's why you get the likes of Transformers and Fast & Furious making such obscene amounts of money (it even saved that stupid looking Warcraft movie last year), they absolutely clean up in China... and to be fair I remember how much Jurassic Park was a 'must see' movie back in 1993, imagine going from maybe not even being in a cinema in your whole life to these big, flashy showpiece type movies. Also dramas and rom-coms (if you've noticed they've fallen off altogether over the last decade) don't translate well to a Chinese audience which is a big reason of why they're not as prominent as before.

China even get to dictate points and themes of movies to certain companies because of this (the US government even wrote a report on this) and Chinese government linked companies are even buying pretty big chunks of Hollywood, like Legendary (300, Interstellar, Straight Outta Compton, Inception, Dark Knight trilogy, Jurassic World, many more) which the Chinese Wanda Group bought for $3.5bn last year while the Chinese government is incentivising the sh** out of US companies for co-productions to build their own industry (basically cutting tax on box office earnings in half (which should explain that weird Great Wall movie Matt Damon was in about a year back, as well as several others like Kung Fu Panda 3 being largely made in China).

Aaaanyway to get back on topic... probably because the first six were not released or seen by many, Star Wars never got the Chinese following it has elsewhere, which is still a bit odd considering all those boxes it ticks about flashy showpieces, CGI fests, being bright, colourful and easy on the eyes etc while keeping a fairly straightforward good-vs-evil plot. Because of this, the stagnant/declining western markets are where Star Wars makes its money and Disney would have probably been quite concerned once this went properly viral and showing up all over people's FB feeds, national news, etc.

Penn

Relikk wrote: »

So now with unlocking content purely through gameplay for the time being, did they rework any credit prices (excluding the initial backlash) or timeframes? Or does it still take 4500 hours to unlock everything?

No word of them reworking rewards/credits that I've heard. Only that they've removed the ability to spend actual money on the game to unlock things.

Don't worry they said they'll bring back crystals at a later date for those who want "accelerated progression". Which the cynic in me sees it as translating to, we'll continue to screw people once the spotlight is off us and the dust has settled.

jcd5971

You can't imagine Disney are very happy with ea right now.

Since they got the license, BF1 was panned, another title is cancelled and BF2 has had more bad publicity in the last week than any game I can ever remember.

Hardly an impressive use of the license.

jcd5971

jcd5971 wrote: »

You can't imagine Disney are very happy with ea right now.

Since they got the license, BF1 was panned, another title is cancelled and BF2 has had more bad publicity in the last week than any game I can ever remember.

Hardly an impressive use of the license.

That's the real reason this happened.
Fact the outrage managed to hit mainstream media.
With movie coming out and everything else associated with merchandise, You would expect Disney don't want their pride and joy associated with a gambling mechanic.
Especially when ****ty EA knows the Star Wars influence can easily target vulnerable children.

gizmo

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

If you think the house of mouse is a benevolent entity, not focused solely on generating money, well I'd say you're off the mark. It's a PR exercise now.

On the contrary, Disney were the ones that could truly force their hand on this. In terms of the contract between the two, not only will there most likely be a clause in there that says they won't bring the franchise into disrepute, it's also quite likely that there'll be a revenue sharing agreement in place which would directly affect Disney. On top of this, they'll have a fairly significant interest in the F2P markets on various platforms through both their own Disney Interactive arm and extensive licencees so the recent regulatory push could potentially hurt them in further multiple ways.

On EA's side, it was only a few days ago that their CFO spoke more about their shift to an increasing live model with their titles. With the Battlefront II issue hitting mainstream news as well as prominent financial sites, widespread negative public opinion aside, I'd strongly wager they were seeing larger than expected pre-order cancellations which would force them to make adjustments to Day 1 and initial launch period sales estimations causing further concern. This would be seen as doubly detrimental because low initial sales would make growing and maintaining a healthy userbase considerably more difficult in the longer run. Why is this important? Because ultimately, you can't rely on and encourage "recurrent consumer spending" in a dead game.

gizmo

gizmo wrote: »

On the contrary, Disney were the ones that could truly force their hand on this. In terms of the contract between the two, not only will there most likely be a clause in there that says they won't bring the franchise into disrepute, it's also quite likely that there'll be a revenue sharing agreement in place which would directly affect Disney. On top of this, they'll have a fairly significant interest in the F2P markets on various platforms through both their own Disney Interactive arm and extensive licencees so the recent regulatory push could potentially hurt them in further multiple ways.

On EA's side, it was only a few days ago that their CFO spoke more about their shift to an increasing live model with their titles. With the Battlefront II issue hitting mainstream news as well as prominent financial sites, widespread negative public opinion aside, I'd strongly wager they were seeing larger than expected pre-order cancellations which would force them to make adjustments to Day 1 and initial launch period sales estimations causing further concern. This would be seen as doubly detrimental because low initial sales would make growing and maintaining a healthy userbase considerably more difficult in the longer run. Why is this important? Because ultimately, you can't rely on and encourage "recurrent consumer spending" in a dead game.

Great post

Dave_The_Sheep

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'm classing this a win due the fact it forced their hand.

It's a positive note, I'd agree with you there.

I can't see it stopping things long term though. Gamers are just people, and people can't fight the good fight indefinitely, particularly not online where there are infinite distractions and it's a fickle place.

EA will return the option in future, and then things will go on as before. Slippery slope, we've been on it a long time and it'll continue.

Cynical and depressing view, I know.