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Refugee Family Reunification

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    #482
    Will I Am Not
    Registered Users Posts: 3,496 ✭✭✭Will I Am Not


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    What are the effects though? I hear a lot of people supporting multiculturalism in broad strokes but there's very little acknowledgment that multiculturalism can only work if all parties are inclined to work together. In the "west", there is a tradition of cultural diversity, and for the most part, it has worked although there are definite problems too. Even before the rise in immigration/asylum seekers, there were loud conversations about the melting pot of cultures.

    The issue is that we are no longer talking about people who have come to Europe because they want to live in a western culture. They're not coming here to escape Sharia law or embrace the freedoms that the "west" provides. There is a strong trend of immigrants who want to bring their own cultural perception of law here as well. You can easily see that in the UK with the establishment of Sharia courts. You can see it in the rise in assault and abuse of western women in European countries by Islamic immigrants. They have brought their belief that their culture is best, and the desire to use their own cultural "norms" while in Europe.

    For the people who come to Europe to integrate whilst keeping their own culture in the privacy of their own homes... I fully welcome them. Those who seek to import Sharia law or other such nonsense, they can go to another Muslim country. There are quite a few to choose from.



    Expand on this?

    Western governments have bent over backwards to encourage multiculturalism with Islamic immigrants to work... so why is it failing so badly>?

    Why is it failing so badly? When has it ever really worked?
    Despite what some would like to believe, people are very different and don’t want to change. They tend to stick to their own too.

    The problems where I am are basically down to gangs. They are intimidating, violent and just don’t belong on the streets of a previously quiet, Irish fishing town.


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    #483
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    The Fake Sheikh wrote: »
    Why is it failing so badly? When has it ever really worked?
    Despite what some would like to believe, people are very different and don’t want to change. They tend to stick to their own too.

    The problems where I am are basically down to gangs. They are intimidating, violent and just don’t belong on the streets of a previously quiet, Irish fishing town.

    At a guess I'm going to suggest that the "problems" in your small town are being worked around,parked up or lessened in impact due to a requirement to be "receptive and understanding" of the differing backgrounds of these Gangs.

    Is there no community figure standing up for the "Ordinaries" in this situation ?,one which sadly is becoming more prevalent across Ireland as a whole .. :(


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



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    #484
    Really Interested
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,554 ✭✭✭Really Interested


    JenovaProject wrote: »
    Are all the refugees bringing Christian American relations over for reunification?
    If so,then that's a conversation we could have,if not,It's just simple whataboutery.

    No but there are thousands of Americans coming here on students permissions, working permission and even some residing here illegally. Fact is most ME people in Ireland did not come in via international protection but through student permission and working permissions. So let’s talk about the murdering kiddy marrying Americans


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    #485
    Will I Am Not
    Registered Users Posts: 3,496 ✭✭✭Will I Am Not


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    At a guess I'm going to suggest that the "problems" in your small town are being worked around,parked up or lessened in impact due to a requirement to be "receptive and understanding" of the differing backgrounds of these Gangs.

    Is there no community figure standing up for the "Ordinaries" in this situation ?,one which sadly is becoming more prevalent across Ireland as a whole .. :(

    No representatives would touch it with a barge pole.
    The only candidate to ever even bring it up was a black man, you might remember him from Father Ted :pac:

    https://m.independent.ie/regionals/fingalindependent/news/balbriggan-pushed-to-the-edge-claims-candidate-sharkey-35526609.html

    I’ve only ever seen mention of it once in any publication.

    https://m.independent.ie/regionals/fingalindependent/news/antisocial-behaviour-is-key-balbriggan-issue-35842371.html
    Issues around the ethnic diversity of Balbriggan and the integration of its migrant community were also raised at the public meeting with local gardaí commenting that there are a number of Garda programmes to promote and support integration.
    A resident of the town referred to a specific 'racial attack' in the town which local gardaí said they had been made aware of and were investigating.

    There was an incident last week (not the one mentioned above) where 2 young lads were beaten really badly and it was reported that a gang of black and white youths carried out the attack. Which was strange because it would usually be just a gang of youths but this particular incident drew a lot of anger in the way it was organised and carried out. From what I’ve heard it was a couple of white girls with the gang of black guys and the 2 guys beaten were there to meet girls.

    If you lived here you would be aware of it all from social media groups. Not so much the actual media.


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    #486
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    The Fake Sheikh wrote: »
    Why is it failing so badly? When has it ever really worked?
    Despite what some would like to believe, people are very different and don’t want to change. They tend to stick to their own too.

    When has it worked? Hmm.. Quite a few times actually. We have English people living in Ireland, and French people living in Spain, without causing any problems. But then there is an element of common cultural/moral commonality to ease the transition. We also have the Asian elements who, for the most part, integrate or keep separate but don't cause problems (apart from the crime brought to the US and Oz).

    The clear division is when it comes to Religion and how that religion is treated in the host country. Posters here are commenting on the US with child brides, but then, the US has constitutional laws to protect all religions. That made sense at the time of the "founding fathers", but not in the modern world. Alas we all know that once you give a right or protection to a group of people, you can't remove that right. It's undemocratic, dehumanizing, immoral, whatever.

    We don't have that system in Europe. Yet. Although it's likely to come into being because of the short-sighted 'left'.

    I really don't have an issue with Islam. From travel, I've come to appreciate that you can't really condemn the beliefs of other nations, and their own systems while keeping your own systems that they might find offensive. I've traveled through Muslim countries, and I definitely don't want that kind of culture in Europe. If Muslims want that kind of culture, they can have it in their countries.

    We (Europeans) need to recognize that Islam (in it's current form) is not suitable for Europe, and will continue to cause problems here. Why? Because Islam as a religion is entwined with their culture. The Catholic church has been pushed out of most European society into a very background position, but we seem to have forgotten what it was like, when it did have real influence to shape society. Islam still has that influence over its followers.

    Multiculturalism does not mean we have to accept every aspect of another culture. It means that we provide a platform for integration with the admiration for cultural differences, but not for cultural differences that cause social unrest. Integration is necessary. Integration worked for centuries when other cultures came to Europe because they wanted a different system to their home country, and while they retained their home culture, they didn't expect their own culture to gain prominent powers.

    Europe needs to set serious restrictions on the immigration of Muslims, with a clear instruction given to Muslims so that they know that the host country's culture will remain dominant. They would still gain the same rights and protections that other citizens receive but nothing more than that. IF they can't accept that, then they should be expelled, and sent to a Muslim controlled country... If they can accept it, then they can continue to follow their faith in Europe, although Sharia law would have no power, and the host country's law would be first and foremost. No exceptions.

    This attitude of welcoming in Muslims without restrictions is a copy of the US Founding fathers attitude. It was fine for two hundred years ago, but times have changed. It's naive and dangerous to continue this way of thinking in the modern world.


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    #487
    Ronaldinho
    Registered Users Posts: 829 ✭✭✭Ronaldinho


    If I may say so... if anyone finds Government policy on this matter objectionable, your time would be better spend writing an e-mail to you local councillors or TDs than writing loads of posts here imho.

    There were lots of threads like this one in the Politics Cafe '1.0'. Lots of common sense talked but some people just couldn't be reasoned with.


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    #488
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Really Interested wrote: »
    You know that such marriages are promoted in a large number of Christian churches.

    https://www.google.ie/amp/s/m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5a05f4f8e4b0e37d2f37573d/amp

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/sheriff-covered-up-mormon-child-marriage

    https://www.google.ie/amp/s/mobile.nytimes.com/2017/05/26/opinion/sunday/it-was-forced-on-me-child-marriage-in-the-us.amp.html

    https://www.google.ie/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/child-marriage-chart-reveals-girls-can-still-get-married-at-12-in-some-parts-of-the-us-as-lawmakers-a6921246.html%3famp

    I say keep them American child marrying Christians out of Ireland they also kill people.

    “Johnson, the former 11-year-old unwitting bride who is now fighting for Florida to set a minimum marriage age (there is none now), says that her family attended a conservative Pentecostal church and that other girls of a similar age periodically also married. Often, she says, this was to hide rapes by church elders.

    She says she was raped by both a minister and a parishioner and gave birth to a daughter when she was just 10 (the birth certificate confirms that). A judge approved the marriage to end the rape investigation, she says, telling her, “What we want is for you to get married.”

    Well we dont need or want them coming here in mass either


  • Options
    #489
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    RustyNut wrote: »
    Do Christians not base their lives by a book written even longer ago? If not then I have been misinformed.

    Do Christians still believe in killing gays?
    How about beheadings?
    Stoning people to death?


  • Options
    #490
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Deleted User wrote: »
    What are the effects though? I hear a lot of people supporting multiculturalism in broad strokes but there's very little acknowledgment that multiculturalism can only work if all parties are inclined to work together. In the "west", there is a tradition of cultural diversity, and for the most part, it has worked although there are definite problems too. Even before the rise in immigration/asylum seekers, there were loud conversations about the melting pot of cultures.

    The issue is that we are no longer talking about people who have come to Europe because they want to live in a western culture. They're not coming here to escape Sharia law or embrace the freedoms that the "west" provides. There is a strong trend of immigrants who want to bring their own cultural perception of law here as well. You can easily see that in the UK with the establishment of Sharia courts. You can see it in the rise in assault and abuse of western women in European countries by Islamic immigrants. They have brought their belief that their culture is best, and the desire to use their own cultural "norms" while in Europe.

    For the people who come to Europe to integrate whilst keeping their own culture in the privacy of their own homes... I fully welcome them. Those who seek to import Sharia law or other such nonsense, they can go to another Muslim country. There are quite a few to choose from.



    Expand on this?

    Western governments have bent over backwards to encourage multiculturalism with Islamic immigrants to work... so why is it failing so badly>?

    It fails because you get the liberals & politicians calling to let the migrants in. They get the applause & slaps on the back, they then proceed to stick the migrants into areas where they can afford usually poorer parts (of course non of the Muslims will get the live down the road from Politicians or the wealthy as it will bring down house prices ) These areas then become little Bagdad or wherever where the migrants dont need to speak the native language. Sooner or later all the families who originally lived there will move somewhere else because of intimidation or for fear of going out at night. More move in. Sharia gets set up. Sooner or later police no longer go to these areas. Radicalisation of youth begins....We know what happens after that


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    #491
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    end of the road wrote: »
    yes, i do. and it's outrageous. no question about it.
    but guess what, child marriage is happening in parts of america as well. and that is just as sickening to me.



    catholic priests who took part in paedophilia believe they were doing it for their god. why were they not doing it for their god yet paedophiles who are muslim are? because none of them were doing it for their god, they were doing it because they have a sexual attraction to children. a sexual attraction that thankfully the vast majority of people believe to be wrong and unacceptable.

    Yes & we would not allow Americans to do it here either, although Americans dont kidnap the kids & marry them before the parents find out so as to change their religion but I'm willing to be proved wrong

    How were priests doing it for God? You do realise it is in the Islamic scriptures to take child brides. There are Imams telling their followers its Gods will for them to do it
    I guess when you're a liberal its hard to see the difference


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    #492
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    end of the road wrote: »
    you will have to ask help! . he seems to know what people think

    No just what I've read from their holy book & seen news reports on
    Maybe stop watching MSM & look for different news sources


  • Options
    #493
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    The Fake Sheikh wrote: »
    Why is it failing so badly? When has it ever really worked?
    Despite what some would like to believe, people are very different and don’t want to change. They tend to stick to their own too.

    The problems where I am are basically down to gangs. They are intimidating, violent and just don’t belong on the streets of a previously quiet, Irish fishing town.

    Who commits the most crime in the USA or UK but with less % of the population?


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    #494
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Ok so can one of the people wanting to bring in these migrants explain to me the positives? Real positives though


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    #495
    Really Interested
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,554 ✭✭✭Really Interested


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    Well we dont need or want them coming here in mass either


    There are over 10,000 from the USA.


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    #496
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    Do Christians still believe in killing gays?
    How about beheadings?
    Stoning people to death?

    The westboro baptist church probably do??


    It's like any vague book,open to interpretations to suit anyones agenda....the fact yous think a billion plus Muslims genuinely believe 100% in this blindly and none have any critical thinking to question it,is worrying


    Do you think all Christians take the bible literally??and believe God knocked out the world in 6 days chilled on the 7th and evolution is a lie?

    Of course not,noone sane deos,

    But yous seem happy to believe all practicing Muslims are eyeing up primary school kids to marry them??
    (There are alot more things regarding sins etc in the Koran that could critise Muslims on...instead of this, headline grabbing nonsense )


    I don't even support this recommendation btw


  • Options
    #497
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    Well we dont need or want them coming here in mass either
    It is very hard to get the semen stains out of the carpet alright. Any priest will tell you.


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    #498
    Really Interested
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,554 ✭✭✭Really Interested


    seamus wrote: »
    It is very hard to get the semen stains out of the carpet alright. Any priest will tell you.


    That is the first time in a long time I actually laughed out loud, good thing i was not drinking something it would have gone everywhere, Bravo good sir Bravo.


  • Options
    #499
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Really Interested wrote: »
    There are over 10,000 from the USA.

    & there on their way here as refugees? Get on the buzzer to RTE
    Seriously what they do & what others do in their own country is no concern of mine. Its when they bring their cultures with them here thats the problem


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    #500
    Really Interested
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,554 ✭✭✭Really Interested


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    & there on their way here as refugees? Get on the buzzer to RTE
    Seriously what they do & what others do in their own country is no concern of mine. Its when they bring their cultures with them here thats the problem


    The Majority of non nationals in Ireland are not here under international protection. Of the some 8-900,000 non Irish in Ireland at most 30-50,000 here by way of International protection.

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2010/jan/25/americans-claim-asylum-britain

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/01/20/can-an-american-become-a-refugee-yes-and-some-already-have/?utm_term=.a15d9ceeca7e

    The other way around.

    http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/political-asylum-for-homeschoolers-evangelical-christians-celebrate-victory-over-embarrassed-germany-a-674492.html


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    #501
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 8,103 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    Yes but Christians live in the here & now, Muslims live their lives by a book written 1400 years ago

    As this thread goes on, I suspect more and more you're taking the piss.


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    #502
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Really Interested wrote: »
    The Majority of non nationals in Ireland are not here under international protection. Of the some 8-900,000 non Irish in Ireland at most 30-50,000 here by way of International protection.

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2010/jan/25/americans-claim-asylum-britain

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/01/20/can-an-american-become-a-refugee-yes-and-some-already-have/?utm_term=.a15d9ceeca7e

    The other way around.

    http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/political-asylum-for-homeschoolers-evangelical-christians-celebrate-victory-over-embarrassed-germany-a-674492.html

    OK so how many Americans have been caught grooming kids in Europe?


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    #503
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Odhinn wrote: »
    As this thread goes on, I suspect more and more you're taking the piss.

    How so? Most Christians realise that the bible is just a book
    Muslims believe that stoning people, killing gays etc are ok because it says so in the Koran


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    #504
    Really Interested
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,554 ✭✭✭Really Interested


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    How so? Most Christians realise that the bible is just a book
    Muslims believe that stoning people, killing gays etc are ok because it says so in the Koran


    In the USA 38% http://news.gallup.com/poll/210956/belief-creationist-view-humans-new-low.aspx

    http://news.gallup.com/poll/210704/record-few-americans-believe-bible-literal-word-god.aspx

    1 in 4 Americans believe in the literal bible interpretation.


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    #505
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    The westboro baptist church probably do??


    It's like any vague book,open to interpretations to suit anyones agenda....the fact yous think a billion plus Muslims genuinely believe 100% in this blindly and none have any critical thinking to question it,is worrying


    Do you think all Christians take the bible literally??and believe God knocked out the world in 6 days chilled on the 7th and evolution is a lie?

    Of course not,noone sane deos,

    But yous seem happy to believe all practicing Muslims are eyeing up primary school kids to marry them??
    (There are alot more things regarding sins etc in the Koran that could critise Muslims on...instead of this, headline grabbing nonsense )


    I don't even support this recommendation btw

    Well no obviously female Muslims cant marry children;) I'm not saying that all Muslims want to marry children nor am I saying they all want to blow us up but the way the politicians will bring in the migrants & dump them somewhere & forget about them. Then there is a huge chance of radicalisation
    Do you know many Muslims?
    I have friends that are Muslim, ex Muslim & non practising Muslim


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    #506
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    Well no obviously female Muslims cant marry children;) I'm not saying that all Muslims want to marry children nor am I saying they all want to blow us up but the way the politicians will bring in the migrants & dump them somewhere & forget about them. Then there is a huge chance of radicalisation
    Do you know many Muslims?
    I have friends that are Muslim, ex Muslim & non practising Muslim

    I do know a few Muslims....mostly my own age though?

    Do.you lecture your Muslim friends on all yous spout off here??


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    #507
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 8,103 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    How so? Most Christians realise that the bible is just a book
    Muslims believe that stoning people, killing gays etc are ok because it says so in the Koran

    How many countries does stoning, as an offical sentence, go on in?

    The legal age limit for marriage in Jordan is 18
    Also, for when you spout your child marriage crap
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_age_at_first_marriage


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    #508
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    I do know a few Muslims....mostly my own age though?

    Do.you lecture your Muslim friends on all yous spout off here??

    No lectures but they know my views and I know theirs


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    #509
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Really Interested wrote: »
    In the USA 38% http://news.gallup.com/poll/210956/belief-creationist-view-humans-new-low.aspx

    http://news.gallup.com/poll/210704/record-few-americans-believe-bible-literal-word-god.aspx

    1 in 4 Americans believe in the literal bible interpretation.

    When did Ireland become America? As I said I wouldn't want them here either with their views


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    #510
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 8,103 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    Help!!!! wrote: »
    When did Ireland become America? As I said I wouldn't want them here either with their views

    But you've joined a grouping that states it wants a catholic ireland.


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    #511
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Odhinn wrote: »
    How many countries does stoning, as an offical sentence, go on in?

    The legal age limit for marriage in Jordan is 18
    Also, for when you spout your child marriage crap
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_age_at_first_marriage

    11 countries
    Wow 1 country out of all the Muslims countries my mistake:rolleyes:
    So what your saying is because of that list there are no child marriages?

    OK you have convinced me there is nothing wrong with Islam, no sex grooming gangs, no rape so we will welcome them in
    So when we have cases like they do in Rochdale, Rotherham, Sunderland etc I will be expecting people like yourself to go to the victims & apologise for trying to shut people up who were concerned for the safety of our people rather than migrants


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