COYBIG

Hammer89

Truth is, we're a f*cking awful nation of footballers and guiding us to a World Cup finals would've been nothing short of miraculous. The fact we came so close is testament to O'Neill's talents as a manager and as a coach in my view.

DickSwiveller

I really fear for the future, though. Are there any good young players coming through?

Stacksofwacks

Hammer89 wrote: »

Truth is, we're a f*cking awful nation of footballers and guiding us to a World Cup finals would've been nothing short of miraculous. The fact we came so close is testament to O'Neill's talents as a manager and as a coach in my view.

This. Added to the fact we don't have a decent professional league, soccer is well behind GAA and probably rugby now its amazing we aren't in the minnows section

philstar

Arghus wrote: »

MON has got some great results as Ireland manager. But he gets the side to play an awful style of football in which we sometimes, quite fortunately, brutalize our way to results.

agree, sooner or later we were going to be found out...and tonight was the night

better that it happened tonight than be embarrassed in the blazing heat of a russian summer

tomwaterford

Specialun wrote: »

Its not though. To make it in the pl is difficult. A few of the irish team play week in week out. How many thousands dont make it...

It's terrible to watch....most games are boring

There's a reason sky sports audience figures for soccer in the PL are tanking

No premier league side has done well in the champions league in years

You could realistically drop the premiership to 12 to 15 sides and lose no games of quality

It us and has been for a long time failed to deliver on the hype generated around it

Any irish player playing in the SPL is as likely to win a english premiership medal this year as those playing in England. ..IE..their playing for the worst sides in the PL

No irish player has played regular champions league In 4+ years at least

KungPao

DickSwiveller wrote: »

I really fear for the future, though. Are there any good young players coming through?

You would have heard of them by now if there were.

vicwatson

philstar wrote: »

and temple bar

Temple Bar, Copenhagen, they'd have had a lot more fun if we won

Specialun

tomwaterford wrote: »

It's terrible to watch....most games are boring

There's a reason sky sports audience figures for soccer in the PL are tanking

No premier league side has done well in the champions league in years

You could realistically drop the premiership to 12 to 15 sides and lose no games of quality

It us and has been for a long time failed to deliver on the hype generated around it

Any irish player playing in the SPL is as likely to win a english premiership medal this year as those playing in England. ..IE..their playing for the worst sides in the PL

No irish player has played regular champions league In 4+ years at least

Yes i agree that the PL can be ****e to watch. However it is a very difficult league to make it in. Also i dont think that we have any superstar but as a collective we should be playing better and not be so bad to watch. When ireland scored first i bet have the coutry said oh ****e this will be a long 83 minutes, we knew we would sit

Arghus

philstar wrote: »

agree, sooner or later we were going to be found out...and tonight was the night

better that it happened tonight than be embarrassed in the blazing heat of a russian summer

Possibly, I'd still like to be part of a World Cup though, no matter how bad we might be. It is The World Cup and even if we stink the place out, the country goes absolutely ga-ga for a few weeks.

Tuco88

MON did a great job imo, I hope he sticks around.

About the lack of players its true to a point, but look at iceland and northen ireland. Look at England in the euros serious quality players available with woeful results.

What Ireland needs is a particular breed of player. Forwards! lack of strikers/wingers. Savy poachers not 6 footers who play off the bog ball tactics.

All our goals are sloppy scrappy ones... Again today..

philstar

Arghus wrote: »

Possibly, I'd still like to be part of a World Cup though, no matter how bad we might be. It is The World Cup and even if we stink the place out, the country goes absolutely ga-ga for a few weeks.

and thats what gets my goat..why celebrate mediocrity ?

even italia 90 did nothing for me, the football in the charlton era was truly primitive..its only in this soccer naive country he got away with it

Specialun

KungPao wrote: »

You would have heard of them by now if there were.

Excluding declan rice or conor masterson we are a bit bollocked at the younger group.few creeping about here and there

Specialun

Tuco88 wrote: »

MON did a great job imo, I hope he sticks around.

About the lack of players its true to a point, but look at iceland and northen ireland. Look at England in the euros serious quality players available with woeful results.

What Ireland needs is a particular breed of player. Forwards! lack of strikers/wingers. Savy poachers not 6 footers who play off the bog ball tactics.

All our goals are sloppy scrappy ones... Again today..

Boom. This.

Kermit.de.frog

philstar wrote: »

and thats what gets my goat..why celebrate mediocrity ?

even italia 90 did nothing for me, the football in the charlton era was truly primitive..its only in this soccer naive country he got away with it

2002 though. Ireland played some good football at times and it was entertaining.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BiJ3fmXZA4

Lucy8080

Specialun wrote: »

The problem with irish football is at grass roots

* coaches are not knowledgable enough or not able to adapt to the modern game
* we dont produce talented players anymore
* when kids are younger or any good its straight over to the uk. How many dont make it or go to clubs they wont progress in. Why not stay in irish league and strengthen physically and progress
* we have sold our own league down the swanny. No investment.
List goes on

Our schools have either a G.A.A. or Rugby favour over the years. Irish kids are talented and passionate for what-ever sports jersey you stick on them.

Football has always been most kids first love. The acquiring of skills early on in football gets divided time with schools (favoured) sports.

Arghus

philstar wrote: »

and thats what gets my goat..why celebrate mediocrity ?

even italia 90 did nothing for me, the football in the charlton era was truly primitive..its only in this soccer naive country he got away with it

I think in the context of tournaments like that we have to be a bit realistic. I think it's some achievement for a country like ourselves to get there in the first place. I think getting to the tournament becomes a bigger thing culturally than just about the football - it transcends sport, it can be a beautiful time.

Where I disagree with O' Neill is that he plays a brutal attritional version of the game and if he had even a smidgen more ambition we could have topped that group - we could have - but instead he doubled down on the ultra, ultra, comically, defensive attitude and we got dour game after dour game - and didn't even get the pleasure of going to the cup as a form of compensation!

PARlance

Hammer89 wrote: »

Truth is, we're a f*cking awful nation of footballers and guiding us to a World Cup finals would've been nothing short of miraculous. The fact we came so close is testament to O'Neill's talents as a manager and as a coach in my view.

I think the truth is somewhere in between. We're an awful football nation (and this won't change anytime soon as we're decades behind re youth coaching) but there are some many slots available for World Cups and Euros these days, that we can still expect to compete for the "best of the worst" positions in these Championships.

It wouldn't have been miraculous but it would have been a very good achievement.

Tuco88

So the list...

O'Shea.
Wes.
Walters.
Murphy?

Who is gona retire.

S.Long there is a clear reason clubs dont hold on to him... ffs get rid of him, his pace is already getting poor.

Specialun

Lucy8080 wrote: »

Our schools have either a G.A.A. or Rugby favour over the years. Irish kids are talented and passionate for what-ever sports jersey you stick on them.

Football has always been most kids first love. The acquiring of skills early on in football gets divided time with schools (favoured) sports.

Of course kids have others sports.as all countries do. GAA will always be the most popular but soccer is hardly a massive minority.

I do question sometimes the role gaa plays in the development. If a player at underage level is any bit good at GAA then he is forced to train all the the time and players a multi levels. Ie senior junior and minorI heard a story from a sports journalist pal of mine a few days ago about 5 kids who wernt let travel to a divison soccer game because the gaa coach said if you do travel to the soccer then dont come back to the gaa side. These were u16.

Chrongen

valoren wrote: »

Best fans in the world is not a self appointed moniker. It's based our reputation for good natured, non trouble making behaviour at tournaments unlike other countries fans (the English, the Russians etc) where the football actually interrupts the violence.

These are Tournaments we realistically have no chance of actually winning, let alone qualify for but the fans make it enjoyable and all the better when we make it. For the security and host country fans we're loved hence the moniker. Would have been great to qualify but we're not good enough.

Russia is going to be a miserable, yawn fest of a World Cup without us.

A yawn-fest?

How many world cups were so dreadful before the Irish came along?

Best supporters in the WORLD? What's so wrong with the Brazilians and their amazing football and their drums and their dancing?

What about the beauty of Cameroon and their skill and speed and ability?

Italy not there.....who gives a toss?

What about a crashing little underdog like Iceland?

The World Cup is going to be a bore because the Irish aren't there?

Yup, I won't watch a match because it will be such a yawn-fest.

scrawnyass

Specialun wrote: »

A stupid arguement..its international football..we have plenty of pl players..over 3/4 of the starting line up are or have played in the PL or are currently playing in. We dont have to be compared to spain or france all the time. We have enough to qualify

We have Darryl Murphy as our main striker Ffs . As a Celtic fan I can guarantee u he was 1 useless flop for us . I think this PL thing is so overhyped. A lot of EPL and Championship players are so overhyped. The Polish qualified no bother for example . How many of them play in ENGLAND? O Neill and Keane did as well as they could with an extremely limited bunch imo.

EICVD

Ah well, watching the Dubs win 4 in a row will be more enjoyable than making up the numbers in Russia anyway

Elmer Blooker

Its so frustrating the way some of our players who appeared to be good prospects for building a team around went into rapid decline. A few years ago Kevin Doyle looked to be the new Robbie Keane, so did Shane Long but both of them went into decline. Hendrick and Brady both had a good Euro '16 but Brady can't even pass a ball now and Hendrick is anonymous on the pitch.

Specialun

scrawnyass wrote: »

We have Darryl Murphy as our main striker Ffs . As a Celtic fan I can guarantee u he was 1 useless flop for us . I think this PL thing is so overhyped. A lot of EPL and Championship players are so overhyped. The Polish qualified no bother for example . How many of them play in ENGLAND? O Neill and Keane did as well as they could with an extremely limited bunch imo.

I agree murphy is poor and we do struggle up top. But then again when maguire was firing them in with CC or when he moved to preston why wasnt he given a proper chance..confidence is a big thing for strikers and he was playing well. If you were a LOI player looking in you would have to say how will i get a shot, or a young irish player abroad. Why didnt o neill or keane look to bring youth through..did theyactively travel to watch the fringe or outside fringe players. Probably not.

The polish have some good players imo. Iceland or sweden dont have any superstars and look how they get the best out of the squad

DEFTLEFTHAND

Chrongen wrote: »

A yawn-fest?

How many world cups were so dreadful before the Irish came along?

Best supporters in the WORLD? What's so wrong with the Brazilians and their amazing football and their drums and their dancing?

What about the beauty of Cameroon and their skill and speed and ability?

Italy not there.....who gives a toss?

What about a crashing little underdog like Iceland?

The World Cup is going to be a bore because the Irish aren't there?

Yup, I won't watch a match because it will be such a yawn-fest.

From a pure football standpoint the tournament will be all the better considering that we play route one anti football. Not the type of thing anyone wants to see tbh.

DEFTLEFTHAND

I mean Jesus Christ I watched Luxembourg of all places play a while back and I couldn't get over how they got the ball down and played around, stringing passes together and creating chances.

It made me weep for us and our caveman philosphy.

PARlance

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

Its so frustrating the way some of our players who appeared to be good prospects for building a team around went into rapid decline. A few years ago Kevin Doyle looked to be the new Robbie Keane, so did Shane Long but both of them went into decline. Hendrick and Brady both had a good Euro '16 but Brady can't even pass a ball now and Hendrick is anonymous on the pitch.

Kevin Doyle is 3 years younger than Keane, he was never a new Robbie Keane. Robbie got a move to Inter Milan when he was 20, Shane Long was at Reading at that age.

mattser

I thought the referee was great. Oh sorry....I can't say that.....Republic of Ireland were beaten.

scrawnyass

Specialun wrote: »

I agree murphy is poor and we do struggle up top. But then again when maguire was firing them in with CC or when he moved to preston why wasnt he given a proper chance..confidence is a big thing for strikers and he was playing well. If you were a LOI player looking in you would have to say how will i get a shot, or a young irish player abroad. Why didnt o neill or keane look to bring youth through..did theyactively travel to watch the fringe or outside fringe players. Probably not.

The polish have some good players imo. Iceland or sweden dont have any superstars and look how they get the best out of the squad

LOI players never get a shot under any Ireland manager. It's an unwritten rule. Anyway, I just think they did all they could with some very average players . They're not going to risk youth when their reputations are on the line . Some of those Irish players couldn't lace the likes of Giles boots, yet they earn fortunes playing in England. There's a huge misconception over here that anyone who plays for an English club is a quality player. That simply is not the case. Sky hype I call it.

Lucy8080

Specialun wrote: »

Of course kids have others sports.as all countries do. GAA will always be the most popular but soccer is hardly a massive minority.

I do question sometimes the role gaa plays in the development. If a player at underage level is any bit good at GAA then he is forced to train all the the time and players a multi levels. Ie senior junior and minorI heard a story from a sports journalist pal of mine a few days ago about 5 kids who wernt let travel to a divison soccer game because the gaa coach said if you do travel to the soccer then dont come back to the gaa side. These were u16.

Most kids in my time loved soccer first. The G.A.A. got first bite because of school support for the G.a.a. or the type of pressure you speak of above.

I'm not even knocking the G.A.A. here, I love my sport ,including G.A.A., but it always irked me a bit that they had first dibs in schools when most kids would rather have lined out in a game of soccer ,given the choice.

Tuco88

Looking back at that 2002 team lads... We didn't know how good it was.

I feel sorry for McClean it ment so much to the lad and Randolf.

McClean,Walthers,Randolf and maybe coleman gave it all imo during the stages.

The Jury is out on the likes of long,ward imo. McCarthys Irish performance can be questioned also.

Duckworth_Luas

Has anyone blamed GAA yet?

scrawnyass

Tuco88 wrote: »

Looking back at that 2002 team lads... We didn't know how good it was.

I feel sorry for McClean it ment so much to the lad and Randolf.

McClean,Walthers,Randolf and maybe coleman gave it all imo during the stages.

The Jury is out on the likes of long,ward imo. McCarthys Irish performance can be questioned also.

Your talking about the injured James McCarthy who went against his Everton managers wishes to report for international duty?

Lucy8080

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

Has anyone blamed GAA yet?

Nope, just knocking those who put pressure on kids choices.

scrawnyass

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

Has anyone blamed GAA yet?

Graeme Geraghty never took his Arsenal trials seriously coz Meath GAA would have him assassinated the boy if they picked him.Fact

Tuco88

scrawnyass wrote: »

Your talking about the injured James McCarthy who went against his Everton managers wishes to report for international duty?

Yes. Hes only average for ireland imo. Still given the chance i guess.

scrawnyass

Lucy8080 wrote: »

Most kids in my time loved soccer first. The G.A.A. got first bite because of school support for the G.a.a. or the type of pressure you speak of above.

I'm not even knocking the G.A.A. here, I love my sport ,including G.A.A., but it always irked me a bit that they had first dibs in schools when most kids would rather have lined out in a game of soccer ,given the choice.

Agree completely. GAA was always no 1 in school. My daughters in primary and it's still the same. I love hurling and soccer but the schools still have this "foreign sports" approach to soccer which is pretty sad

Citizenpain

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

2002 though. Ireland played some good football at times and it was entertaining.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BiJ3fmXZA4

Not one tattoo back then

_Dara_

_Dara_ wrote: »

That's a load of crap. There are lots of other peaceful, fun-loving football fans out there. The multitude of videos from the Euros on social media show that. The videos were primarily about the Irish fans but showed that lots of other countries are up for the craic too. You've named a handful of countries and even with them, the troublemakers are in the minority.

Icelandic fans, for example, seem pretty great.

I've enjoyed the last three World Cups just fine without Ireland being there.

To add to this point, here's a plane full of Dublin-bound Denmark fans having a singalong:

https://twitter.com/marcusschossow/status/930431431523827713

I don't get why some people think that nobody but Ireland fans are any craic.

Music Box

Just as well we're not going to Russia. An international team with players like jeff hendrick, ward, long, etc. Found out big time tonight.

Surreptitious

scrawnyass wrote: »

Graeme Geraghty never took his Arsenal trials seriously coz Meath GAA would have him assassinated the boy if they picked him.Fact

Your username is very funny! It's like what kids would insult each other with

A Little Pony

tomwaterford wrote: »

AnneFrank wrote: »

James Mcclean hates the queen

And the north...they're fùcking shít. ...nanana na na

James mclean

We are better than you, we went out on our shields, your side embarrassed your country.

lawred2

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

2002 though. Ireland played some good football at times and it was entertaining.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BiJ3fmXZA4

The stats for the Spain match are eye opening. Pretty much beat them on all counts (including 55 to 45 in terms of possession) just not on the scoreboard.

_Dara_

lawred2 wrote: »

The stats for the Spain match are eye opening. Pretty much beat them on all counts (including 55 to 45 in terms of possession) just not on the scoreboard.

That loss was heart-breaking. They weren't better than us. And we'd have met... South Korea, I think?

HandsomeBob

_Dara_ wrote: »

To add to this point, here's a plane full of Dublin-bound Denmark fans having a singalong:

https://twitter.com/marcusschossow/status/930431431523827713

I don't get why some people think that nobody but Ireland fans are any craic.

Because it's the typical Irish attitude: we have to find a way to feel morally superior in some manner even in defeat.

I await the inevitable JOE.ie type articles about the best fans in the world partying with their Danish counterparts last night, with Irish fans making sure to come across as the soundest people in the world in front of the camera.

Roy Keane was spot on about a lot of Irish fans a couple of years ago; knobends more concerned about how they come across to the world above all else.

FrancieBrady

My young fella has been playing soccer with his club since he was 8, he has actually played very little football in the way we played growing up because he has been in a team.
He is a forward and because it is all (and I mean all) about leagues and winning he spends most Saturday mornings standing waiting for a ball.
I think that is all wrong for a junior set-up. The emphasis should be on skills and ball control at that age. I see only one, maybe two players, who have enough ability at his age level, which I think would be abnormal.
Wanna be managers don't help either.

valoren

Chrongen wrote: »

A yawn-fest?

How many world cups were so dreadful before the Irish came along?

Best supporters in the WORLD? What's so wrong with the Brazilians and their amazing football and their drums and their dancing?

What about the beauty of Cameroon and their skill and speed and ability?

Italy not there.....who gives a toss?

What about a crashing little underdog like Iceland?

The World Cup is going to be a bore because the Irish aren't there?

Yup, I won't watch a match because it will be such a yawn-fest.

Most major tournaments are yawn fests. A few weeks sorting the wheat from the chaff until it actually matters and get's serious in the knockout phase. Even then you get only a good game or two thereafter. Mexico vs New Zealand? At 5pm on a Tuesday? Japan vs Australia at 2pm on a Thursday? No thanks. Brazil vs Russia in the Semi Final? Germany vs Argentina in the Quarter final? Shown at the weekend at 6pm? Will watch.

Ideally, whoever tops their groups in qualifying should play in the finals itself. Quality over quantity but that's no interest for FIFA who use all of the enormous amounts money generated at a World Cup for re-investment into the game at grass roots level (:rolleyes:). The format of the confederations cup is actually better. Champions playing champions. Like the old European cup where you could only play in the competition if you were domestic champs from the previous season. None of this 'Race for Fourth' bull**** in the Premier League then. So, I'm basically a fuddy duddy in terms of that, but money rules football and thus more games equals more revenue at the expense of 'liquid football'.

It would have been nice to have us there in some capacity, perhaps even advance from the group stage. Might be interested in the sorting the wheat from the chaff early weeks then i.e. seeing who we could potentially play in the second round etc but not to be. Russia 2018 then? Yawn (until sometime in July).

fryup

_Dara_ wrote: »

I don't get why some people think that nobody but Ireland fans are any craic.

cause irish fans think the whole world revolves around them

topper75

So, next summer, a gigantic pile of dough that was intended to be spent in Russia will now instead be pumped into the Irish economy?

Get in there!

andekwarhola

FrancieBrady wrote: »

My young fella has been playing soccer with his club since he was 8, he has actually played very little football in the way we played growing up because he has been in a team.
He is a forward and because it is all (and I mean all) about leagues and winning he spends most Saturday mornings standing waiting for a ball.
I think that is all wrong for a junior set-up. The emphasis should be on skills and ball control at that age. I see only one, maybe two players, who have enough ability at his age level, which I think would be abnormal.
Wanna be managers don't help either.

It is these days, at least in paper.

Both my kids (both under 10) play schoolboy football in Dublin and their club (and presumably everyone else) follow the FAI /Dokter guidelines. Small sided games on small pitches, no results/league tables until they're older; rotating positions and an emphasis on playing the ball to feet.

Part of it is also the new elite leagues for 15s , 17s and 19s which are trying to provide a pathway between schoolboy and league of Ireland.

Big LOI clubs like Cork City and Shamrock Rovers are heavily investing in academies. Rovers underage teams train 4 times a week now and a big emphasis is being put on underage development with qualified coaches.

The problem here has always been England. Most football 'supporters' here ignore the domestic league and the big schoolboy clubs were a separate power structure to the domestic league concerned only with shipping kids to England so basically we've had no linked academy structure between LOI and schoolboy clubs.

It's getting harder for Irish kids to break England because they've improved their academies and have the pick of imports elsewhere now.

It's going to take a while to bear fruit but it's still miles ahead of what our generation would have experienced as schoolboy footballers.