Who should Irelands next manager be?

PhiloCypher

The problem is the same no matter who we got. A manager like a politician is always playing for his next contract (or to keep the one he's on) and with there being very little down time between qualification campaigns they have to get wins on the board early, so any long term development is sacrificed for short term gain .

To make the most of our limited resources we'd need to be willing to lose a few games while we find a system that works, we'd miss out on qualification sure , but we miss out on those as things stand anyway. And I dont buy that hoofball or hoping for a set piece goal is the only "system" that would work with the players we have . We've played teams with similarly few playing resources whose managers still managed to drill into something approximating a football team. It can be done. Unfortunately with the FAI in charge and with fans unlikely to accept effectively throwing a qualification campaign , it's unlikely it ever will.

Billy86

PhiloCypher wrote: »

The problem is the same no matter who we got. A manager like a politician is always playing for his next contract (or to keep the one he's on) and with there being very little down time between qualification campaigns they have to get wins on the board early, so any long term development is sacrificed for short term gain .

To make the most of our limited resources we'd need to be willing to lose a few games while we find a system that works, we'd miss out on qualification sure , but we miss out on those as things stand anyway. And I dont buy that hoofball or hoping for a set piece goal is the only "system" that would work with the players we have . We've played teams with similarly few playing resources whose managers still managed to drill into something approximating a football team. It can be done. Unfortunately with the FAI in charge and with fans unlikely to accept effectively throwing a qualification campaign , it's unlikely it ever will.

You're thinking of the old Jose, the one that could get the best out of Michael Ballack and have him flying at 200kmph+. What we've got is the new Jose, the busted flush that can't even get guys to parallel park.

s3rtvdbwfj81ch

Paul Jewel or Philippe Troussier

razorblunt

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Michael O'Neill.



So we can all still us MON.

No longer an issue with the increased characters on Twitter!!

Paully D

Sam Allardyce, without question.

GavRedKing

I'd give Kerr another shot TBH.

Pighead

I'd give it to the soccer forum. All of us. Collectively we know all there is to know about the beautiful game and I think we have earned respect from players and supporters a like thanks to (in some cases) fifteen years of watching, studying and offering constructive criticism on a countless number of matches over the years. Squads and first elevens would be picked via poll and post match interviews with Tony O'Donoghue would be done via boards in written form. The lads over in the Fantasy Football forum could come on board as assistant manager. If John Delaney is reading this PM me.

Ulysses Gaze

I would give someone like Stephen Kenny or Pat Fenlon a go at it. Give them 2 years until the Euros and let them have at it.

As long as it not Roy Keane. He'll spend most of his time scowling and pulling shapes for the media.

beer enigma

Wenger.....please take him PLEASE:D

Ulysses Gaze

Pighead wrote: »

I'd give it to the soccer forum. All of us. Collectively we know all there is to know about the beautiful game and I think we have earned respect from players and supporters a like thanks to (in some cases) fifteen years of watching, studying and offering constructive criticism on a countless number of matches over the years. Squads and first elevens would be picked via poll and post match interviews with Tony O'Donoghue would be done via boards in written form. The lads over in the Fantasy Football forum could come on board as assistant manager. If John Delaney is reading this PM me.

Only as long as Pighead becomes Director of Football at the FAI as well.

We'll need someone to implement this vision.

No better man.

John, if you are reading.....

ballsymchugh

GavRedKing wrote: »

I'd give Kerr another shot TBH.

I'd love if Kerr was involved higher up in the FAI. as i said earlier, there's already an accountant doing a football man's job.

PGE1970

Paully D wrote: »

Sam Allardyce, without question.

It would be like deja vu when another big gruff North of England man walked in sometime in late 1985!!

Only this time, Sam wouldn't have Whelan, McGrath, Stapleton, Brady, Lawrenson, Sheedy, Galvin, O'Leary etc at his disposal. What a platform to start from.

At the risk of repeating myself, this Irish panel is one of the most limited in our recent history in terms of talent. MON was brought in to get us to Euro16 and WC18. He got us to Euros16 and to the playoff for WC18 with an English Championship standard side.

What a disaster he has been.

briany

Get a more 'progressive' manager in, that's fine. But don't say I didn't tell you so if because of that, the team gets ripped open, defensively, many times more, and he's hounded out of the job double-quick. Nobody's going to 'understand' what he's trying to build, not the public, not the papers and not the FAI.

I'm afraid that any manager coming into the Ireland job is going to make the same assessment as Trap and MON have. If they want to get consistently decent results, that is.

Idbatterim

I cant see them willing to possibly foresake qualifying for the euros which should be quite doable v the millions it will bring in. If they were going to do that, maybe do it after the euros...

MON if he stays on, probably wouldnt stay on for another tournie anyway... Also qualifying for the w.c is a hell of a lot harder. If we could get back into second seeds, we would be doing well...

jmayo

pjohnson wrote: »

He was offered it by the FAI definitely but it was never announced he HAD signed it to the best of my knowledge so he could walk. The FAI nor O'Neill have ever said the deal was signed.

I reckoned he signed last night at about 9.35.

Rumpy Pumpy wrote: »

O’Neill is a good manager. The problem is that Ireland have really poor players. Soccer is in trouble in Ireland, and has been for quite some time. The talent simply isn’t coming through.

A good managed, no make that an average manager, doesn't leave his dogdy defence with no midfield cover, doesn't allow the best opposition player have acres of space in front of goal, shove a winger up front, shove on a busted flush to rescue the game taking off a holding midfield in the process, take off one of his centre halfs replacing him with a fulback that is having a mare of a match.

Northern ireland don't have the talent, neither does Iceland but funnily enough they actually look like an actual football team.

Billy86 wrote: »

I don't think it's as much to do with the parents, and possibly not even the coaches so much, but the overall structure - what the f*** are little kids doing playing 11 vs 11 on a full sized pitch for anyway? Teaches them sweet FA except for how to run faster than the other kid, and for longer.

Sometimes billy you should check out your facts before you post.

Ehh that has changed the last few years under the influence of Ruud Dokter.

For instance taking u10 and u11, they play 7 a side and it is non competitive.
They are all on smaller pitches with retreat zones for kickouts.
The goalies can't launch kicks out of their hands.
The idea is they play out of the back.

The numbers are even lower for lower age groups although I have seen coaches agree to play more because there are a lot of subs.

At u12 then it is 9 a side and competitive.
Offside only comes in at u12.

They only go to fullsize pitches and 11 a side at u13.

Now saying that there is no proper coaching and training of coaches ala the Iceland model which is brilliant from what I have heard.

Also the rules have been tweaked so one week people were kicking the ball back into play and the next week it is throwins.
Also the rules on opposing player sin retreat zones was changed AFAIK.

As for changes I think Brian Kerr should be involved in underage development.
It is a joke he ws ever brought back into the fold.

MON has to go and take that crank Keane with him.
Stephen Kenny would be one option.

And for those who claim he has only LOI, then what about Michael O'Neill or indeed Eoin Hand ?

callaway92

Patrick Narrow Tribe wrote: »

Paul Jewel or Philippe Troussier

Is it 2008 again?

callaway92

beer enigma wrote: »

Wenger.....please take him PLEASE:D

I'd love to have Wenger in charge

GavRedKing

ballsymchugh wrote: »

I'd love if Kerr was involved higher up in the FAI. as i said earlier, there's already an accountant doing a football man's job.

Ya, hes a good footballing man and would do good things in the setup IMO.

Whether that was with the FAI or the senior team it would remain to be seen but I'd like to see him involved somewhere along the line.

TheDoc

I would suggest that the FAI refrain from, whoever the next manager is, from getting a 3rd party to subsidise a massive contract to get a name into the mix.

We should live within our means, and should that mean promoting or looking at candidates from the LOI or coaching networks then so be it. I don't see why we believe ourselves justified in having " a name" recognition for our manager, considering our squads are typically bereft of any quality and there is fundamental issues with our youth setups.

As time has gone on with O'Nell, I think its actually such a ludcrious situation whereby they are sweating to sign him up. IF motiviation is all he does, with no tactical or prep work, I'm sorry, that's not good enough in 2017. Regardless of the perceived talent of the players or squads.

Redo91

PGE1970 wrote: »

I agree with 99% of what you say Redo. But Hendrick & Arter are playing with better players at their clubs. Leaving aside that they play a different system with their clubs, they are not playing with David Meyler, Cyrus Christie etc who, with all due respect, are not international nor PL class. Throw in the likes of McGeady, Murphy etc, we have a Championship standard squad at best.

And yet we beat Germany, Wales, Italy etc and some people are howling at the manager and his tactics

Are they really though. On paper Burnley and Bournemouth are two of the weaker PL teams out there. Ok Bournemouth have decent attackers in King and Defoe but I wouldn't say the rest of the side is much better than what we have. Burnley are weaker still on paper. It's not like they are surrounded by top players at club level.

Bounty Hunter

As far as the FAI are concerned this probably isn't even a point of discussion. TBH you can't fully blame them, MON has had 2 campaigns - 1 where we qualified and did well enough at the tournament and another where we made the playoffs despite being 4th seeds in our group.

You can talk about his style of play all you like but the above is what I would think they would consider far more than that.

johnnyryan89

Redo91 wrote: »

Off the top of my head Michael O'Neill is the only realistic candidate that I'd be interested in but would he be brave enough to leave NI for us with all the stick he'd get? I've seen some suggesting Stephen Kenny but it would be a massive risk to put someone in charge of the National team who's only experience has been managing in the LoI.

Where do you think Michael O'Neill came from, he'd only five years experience behind him with 3 of those coming at Shamrock Rovers in the LOI with the others coming at the mighty Brechin City in the third tier of Scottish football.

Ulysses Gaze

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

Where do you think Michael O'Neill came from, he'd only five years experience behind him with 3 of those coming at Shamrock Rovers in the LOI with the others coming at the mighty Brechin City in the third tier of Scottish football.

Sure Pat Fenlon has greater experience than that.

Idbatterim

I would suggest that the FAI refrain from, whoever the next manager is, from getting a 3rd party to subsidise a massive contract to get a name into the mix.

We should live within our means, and should that mean promoting or looking at candidates from the LOI or coaching networks then so be it. I don't see why we believe ourselves justified in having " a name" recognition for our manager, considering our squads are typically bereft of any quality and there is fundamental issues with our youth setups.

if the "name" would actually be better than the alternatives, I dont agree. This living within our means, I hear associations say it, I think the FAI said it before Trap and Oneill came along "cant afford that salary" the salary of a manger who will have you qualifying or get you very close to it versus one who wont, is a pittance compared to the financial gain of being there or thereabouts at the end of the qualifying campaign, mostly selling out the stadium, jerseys, tv audience etc.

I might buy that argument if they had to pay out 10,000,000 or so a year, its a million or so for oneill right? what would the cheapest reasonable alternative costs? 200,000k a year or so?

As time has gone on with O'Nell, I think its actually such a ludcrious situation whereby they are sweating to sign him up. IF motiviation is all he does, with no tactical or prep work, I'm sorry, that's not good enough in 2017. Regardless of the perceived talent of the players or squads.

i have heard about this, not much though. Where is this coming from? If true it is an absolute joke and Id prefer to see him gone...

Stephen15

Slightly off topic but what do you think will be next for MON if he leaves the Ireland I could a possible Villa return as I could see them sacking Steve Bruce if they fail to get promotion this season.

Agent Coulson

John Delaney needs to go first and foremost and have nothing to do with picking the next manager!

Zaph

Giampiero Ventura is available...

Berserker

Stephen15 wrote: »

Slightly off topic but what do you think will be next for MON if he leaves the Ireland I could a possible Villa return as I could see them sacking Steve Bruce if they fail to get promotion this season.

Nope, he won't return to Villa. On managers, Big Sam would probably be a very good acquisition for you but I think MON will sign a new contract when the dust settles. You won't ship goals like you did last night under Sam. On a personal note, Harry Redknapp would be a bit of fun from a neutrals perspective.

Harry Palmr

O'Neill - Michael!

Agent Coulson

Would Simon Grayson be worth a shot I wonder he have a lot of Irish lads with him at Preston who he did a decent job with.


I wouldn't judge him on his few months at Sunderland.

weldoninhio

Stephen15 wrote: »

Slightly off topic but what do you think will be next for MON if he leaves the Ireland I could a possible Villa return as I could see them sacking Steve Bruce if they fail to get promotion this season.

Retirement. No club will touch him with a barge pole. Especially Villa.

Mr.Nice Guy

GLaDOS wrote: »

Replacing MON is only placing a band aid on the bigger issues. If we continue to produce technically poor players, we're always going to struggle.

There are fundamental problems with the way we run football in this country and until they are addressed, there's only so much a manager can do.

Unfortunately it's hard to see anyone in a position to make a difference actually doing anything.

RTE should have skipped the post-game analysis and just said this in a public service announcement.

It's a bit like if someone owns an orchard that is producing poor quality apples. Getting in a smooth-talking salesman to front the place may improve business ever so slightly, but you're still left with the problem of poor apples. To properly build for the future would involve ensuring a healthy crop in the first place.

We need to produce better players that can compete with the continent, and that's only going to happen by tackling the FAI; but Delaney has the whole system locked down. Nothing will change any time soon.

Richard Hillman

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Sam Alardyce, Tony Pulis, Alan Pardew or Martin O'Neill

O big Sam for the meltdown please it'd be brilliant

ballsymchugh

what's Sven Goran Erikssen doing these days? Richard Dunne spoke very highly of him on OTB recently. Delaney wouldn't touch him though, cos the bould Sven would have his eyes on Delaney's burd.

loyatemu

weldoninhio wrote: »

Retirement. No club will touch him with a barge pole. Especially Villa.

MON would walk into another international job if he wanted it. I'm sure they'd happily have him back at Celtic too if Rodgers moved on.

TheCitizen

loyatemu wrote: »

MON would walk into another international job if he wanted it. I'm sure they'd happily have him back at Celtic too if Rodgers moved on.

He's a legend at Celtic but his days as a full time day in day out manager are over I would say. He could get offered another International job though, if he was interested. As I said if he was to leave the Ireland job now; he has been a success overall as Ireland manager in terms of results. Anyway he's not gone yet, there's the Euros in 2020 to come, if he stays I'd back him to get us qualified.

MD1990

I would seriously consider Stephen Kenny.

He wouldn't have a huge wage & some of the extra money should be invested in the LOI(won't happen).

But I would have concerns over how he would handle the media pressure.

weldoninhio

loyatemu wrote: »

MON would walk into another international job if he wanted it. I'm sure they'd happily have him back at Celtic too if Rodgers moved on.

One of the most ridiculous things I've ever read on the soccer forum. There would be a fans revolt if Celtic tried to get O'Neill back.

TheCitizen

weldoninhio wrote: »

One of the most ridiculous things I've ever read on the soccer forum. There would be a fans revolt if Celtic tried to get O'Neill back.

While I agree that MON won't be returning to manage Celtic, there's no way you speak about him at Celtic matches or in pubs with Celtic fans as you claim to be like you do on here. No chance.

loyatemu

TheCitizen wrote: »

Anyway he's not gone yet, there's the Euros in 2020 to come, if he stays I'd back him to get us qualified.

will we be seeded any higher for those? There's 24 qualifying spaces available at Euro2020 (with no host country) compared to only 13 at the WC - should be much easier.

There's also the Euro Nations League thingy which will see us playing teams around our level (though arguably the last qualifying group was a similar situation with no top teams in it).

TBH I don't hang out in Celtic discussion groups so I don't know what they currently say about MON, but I was under the impression he was still held in high regard (certainly moreso than Strachan). It's simple not true that no-one would employ him, managers with much worse records are managing internationally, Roy Hodgson and David Moyes are managing in the Premier League despite recent failures (and MON's tenure with Ireland has not been a failure).

GavRedKing

Agent Coulson wrote: »

John Delaney needs to go first and foremost and have nothing to do with picking the next manager!

This ^

As long as Delaney is heading up the FAI, nothing will change.

The league is treated with disdain and only used as a tool to be allowed to field an international side but as long as Delaney is surronded by yes men in the FAI, the larger, domestic issues wont change.

GavRedKing

TheCitizen wrote: »

While I agree that MON won't be returning to manage Celtic, there's no way you speak about him at Celtic matches or in pubs with Celtic fans as you claim to be like you do on here. No chance.

The watering down of the Euros to include 8 extra teams with the top 2 going straight through and 3rd getting a playoff should see us get through to any future Euros no matter who is in charge.

I also wouldnt hold limping out of a group as the 3rd best team as any major achievement.

Stephen15

ballsymchugh wrote: »

what's Sven Goran Erikssen doing these days? Richard Dunne spoke very highly of him on OTB recently. Delaney wouldn't touch him though, cos the bould Sven would have his eyes on Delaney's burd.

He was managing in China up until recently I believe

weldoninhio

loyatemu wrote: »

will we be seeded any higher for those? There's 24 qualifying spaces available at Euro2020 (with no host country) compared to only 13 at the WC - should be much easier.

There's also the Euro Nations League thingy which will see us playing teams around our level (though arguably the last qualifying group was a similar situation with no top teams in it).

TBH I don't hang out in Celtic discussion groups so I don't know what they currently say about MON, but I was under the impression he was still held in high regard (certainly moreso than Strachan). It's simple not true that no-one would employ him, managers with much worse records are managing internationally, Roy Hodgson and David Moyes are managing in the Premier League despite recent failures (and MON's tenure with Ireland has not been a failure).

O'Neill spent a fortune at Celtic and Villa and left them both with bloated, old squads on huge wages. Strachan gets stick because he wasn't a "Celtic" man, but when you look at the squad he was left by O'Neill he done very well.

He left Villa in the lurch, walking out 5 days before the season started, because Lerner had tried to reign in his crazy spending.

He then went on to stink the place out at Sunderland.

Redo91

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

Where do you think Michael O'Neill came from, he'd only five years experience behind him with 3 of those coming at Shamrock Rovers in the LOI with the others coming at the mighty Brechin City in the third tier of Scottish football.

As I already said I never ruled out Kenny. I just said he would be a risk due to his lack of top level performance. It's a bit simplistic to think that just because Michael O'Neill worked out for NI that Kenny would for us. It doesn't work that way.

loyatemu

weldoninhio wrote: »

O'Neill spent a fortune at Celtic and Villa and left them both with bloated, old squads on huge wages. Strachan gets stick because he wasn't a "Celtic" man, but when you look at the squad he was left by O'Neill he done very well.

He left Villa in the lurch, walking out 5 days before the season started, because Lerner had tried to reign in his crazy spending.

He then went on to stink the place out at Sunderland.

alternative take - he took Villa to the top 6 3 years in a row - since he left they've sunk like a stone. Lerner reigned in his spending because he was no longer interested in trying to compete with the bigger clubs.

Sunderland are a basket-case as every subsequent manager has discovered.

I'm not some MON fanboy but he has done reasonably well wherever he has gone (except Sunderland). The worst you can say about his stints at Celtic and Villa is that he achieved par based on the money spent (I think Villa had the 6th highest wage bill at the time, and they finished 6th), which is not a given when you see what others have done at similar clubs. He has definitely overachieved with Ireland.

artanevilla

He did okay at Villa, you wouldn't say they were punching about their weight as the time. Some players in that team went on to win Premier and Champions Leagues.

One thing he did do was opt to sign Emile Heskey over Falcao...

loyatemu

artanevilla wrote: »

He did okay at Villa, you wouldn't say they were punching about their weight as the time. Some players in that team went on to win Premier and Champions Leagues.

One thing he did do was opt to sign Emile Heskey over Falcao...

true - he could never resist the lure of the Heskey. Shane Long has taken a similar role in the Irish team of the striker who never scores but just makes a nuisance of himself.

TheCitizen

GavRedKing wrote: »

The watering down of the Euros to include 8 extra teams with the top 2 going straight through and 3rd getting a playoff should see us get through to any future Euros no matter who is in charge.

I also wouldnt hold limping out of a group as the 3rd best team as any major achievement.

Are you talking about the Euro qualifying group? What about the play off win over Bosnia and the good performances at the Euros in France? Do you rate those achievements?

TheCitizen

loyatemu wrote: »

will we be seeded any higher for those? There's 24 qualifying spaces available at Euro2020 (with no host country) compared to only 13 at the WC - should be much easier.

There's also the Euro Nations League thingy which will see us playing teams around our level (though arguably the last qualifying group was a similar situation with no top teams in it).

TBH I don't hang out in Celtic discussion groups so I don't know what they currently say about MON, but I was under the impression he was still held in high regard (certainly moreso than Strachan). It's simple not true that no-one would employ him, managers with much worse records are managing internationally, Roy Hodgson and David Moyes are managing in the Premier League despite recent failures (and MON's tenure with Ireland has not been a failure).

O’Neill is still held in high regard at Celtic that doesn’t mean he’ll be returning as manager at the age of 65.

The poster weldoninho says he’s a Celtic fan but he wouldn’t be representative of Celtic fans vies on MON at all. Some fans would have their criticisms of him from time to time, as I do especially the chaotic nature of the performance v Denmark, but none of them would come out with the one sided blanket ott criticism that that poster does there, and neither would he talk about that way in real life amongst other Celtic supporters. Not a chance of it.