Al Porter Scandal

LadyMacBeth_

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

It shall haunt my dreams forever

Aww, no one has sent me a picture of Al's schlong on whatsapp, I feel left out :pac:

pilly

Malayalam wrote: »

It should probably be career destroying. One would surely tell a child that if a teacher puts their hands inside their pants that this is wrong, and that teacher should lose their job. One would surely tell a teenager that if the coach put their hand inside their underwear that this is sexual assault and that coach should lose their job. Surely you would say to your friend home from work in the office whose boss or colleague has put their hand inside their underpants that this is assault and that the one who did it should lose their job. If it happened on the bus or the luas or in the queue for the grocery checkout then the person who did it should be prosecuted for sexual assault. Cheesus, it's not that hard. People should not insert their hands into other people's knickers uninvited.

Comparing what Al Porter has been accused of to someone doing it to a child is just a step too far. He has not been accused of doing it to a child.

If we've now gone past the point where we can differentiate between the two I despair.

VinLieger

pilly wrote: »

Unforgivable is taking it too far.

We have turned into a nation of witch burners.

Ffs, he hasn't murdered someone.

Witch Burners ehh? *checks posters history for references to george hook*

Interesting.......

LollipopJimmy

Pics of his doodah doing the rounds, an admission of being 'on the bag' and accusations of inappropriate behavior?

Probably no returning from this for him.

LadyMacBeth_

pilly wrote: »

Comparing what Al Porter has been accused of to someone doing it to a child is just a step too far. He has not been accused of doing it to a child.

If we've now gone past the point where we can differentiate between the two I despair.

Completely agree, I think the whole thing has been blown out of proportion. He basically is a bit of a knob who gets too handsy with people. He doesn't need to be burned at the stake.

I was surprised to hear the men involved describe themselves as victims (and I would feel the same if they were women), like I said previously, I have had far worse incidents of groping happen to me and one attempted rape and I wouldn't ever describe myself as a victim, it's an insult to actual victims of sexual assault.

Having said that though, I do think that his behaviour towards a severely depressed man was really inappropriate and shameful (if true).

Dr Crayfish

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Pics of his doodah doing the rounds, an admission of being 'on the bag' and accusations of inappropriate behavior?

Probably no returning from this for him.

Well drugs are rife in the gay community, you'd need to be pretty clueless to think it unusual of a gay man in the entertainment industry to be fond of a few lines

Red_Wake

He'll be back.

Vojera

The Pheasant2 wrote: »

Worse than that, one of the screenshots is a Facebook status from the gf of one of the lads he was messaging, but from the guy's account posting grabs of their conversations I.e. His gf was snooping on his account, found the messages and then shared them, outing him from his own account publicly complete with very sexual messages.

I mean it's not on cheating on her with Al but Jesus what a cúnt move - could she not just have broken up with him ffs

If the conversation was consensual, i.e. yer man was up for it and wasn't being bombarded with messages he didn't want, then that's not on. It has nothing to do with the allegations.

cloudatlas

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Well drugs are rife in the gay community, you'd need to be pretty clueless to think it unusual of a gay man in the entertainment industry to be fond of a few lines

They are rife on any club scene, straight as well.

cloudatlas

Vojera wrote: »

If the conversation was consensual, i.e. yer man was up for it and wasn't being bombarded with messages he didn't want, then that's not on. It has nothing to do with the allegations.

And if he didn't ask for a dick pic to be sent?

statto25

The Last Word will have a segment on Porter during todays show for anyone interested

pilly

Trond wrote: »

Do you not believe the accusers then?

I don't know, have no idea who they are or whether they're telling the truth or not.

My point was in response to someone saying that the motivation for someone now coming out with these allegations was to protect others. If that was the motivation then they would have came out about it years ago.

AnneFrank

Big Gay Al

Mr.H

LadyMacBeth_ wrote:

I was surprised to hear the men involved describe themselves as victims (and I would feel the same if they were women), like I said previously, I have had far worse incidents of groping happen to me and one attempted rape and I wouldn't ever describe myself as a victim, it's an insult to actual victims of sexual assault.

Saying they are not victims is an insult to these victims.

If this was women being touched like this there would be calls for him to be in prison. But because it's men it's OK?

Absolutely disgusting attitude

Cazale

AnneFrank wrote:

yes i hear you but it just seems a bit odd, if not punch then push off in a strong manner, but i take the points you could then be in trouble too. I guess you don't know how you'd react till it happens

I was at a staff night out a few years ago in a well known bar in Dublin and there was a fella drinking with a few girls at a table just outside the men's toilets. Every time I walked by he tried to grope me or pinch my arse. It was embarrassing enough so I tried to laugh it off and told him to stop. The next time I walked by he did it again and when I confronted him he smacked me on the arse hard enough it hurt. I'm 6ft2 and 17.5 stone so didn't want to hit him as I would have seriously hurt him so I pushed him away with my forearm. Long story short I ended up getting pulled out of the place by three bouncers and your man was let stay. My only other options apart from pushing him were to leave the bar or go out to the bouncers. My thinking is the fact that I was bigger than all of them that they wouldn't have took my complaints about a five foot nothing groper too seriously.

In the grand scheme of things it wasn't a huge sexual assault but it was an invasion of my person and it could have had consequences for me work wise as luckily my boss witnessed what happened and knew I was in the right.

Mr.H

pilly wrote:

My point was in response to someone saying that the motivation for someone now coming out with these allegations was to protect others. If that was the motivation then they would have came out about it years ago.

Did you think the same about Weinstein's victims?

LadyMacBeth_

Mr.H wrote: »

Saying they are not victims is an insult to these victims.

If this was women being touched like this there would be calls for him to be in prison. But because it's men it's OK?

Absolutely disgusting attitude

You quoted me as saying I'd think the same if they were women. Try reading my post.

Don Kiddick

Mickey slaps and fanny grabs for all I say!!!

pilly

cloudatlas wrote: »

What punishment do you think is suitable for multiple cases of sexual assault?
If you had an employee or worked with someone who did that would you be happy for them to represent your company at meetings knowing that they might get 'handsy', would you like to work with them beside you in the office? I know I wouldn't. Sure tis only a bit of craic like!

Okay, let's hang on one second.

1. Nothing has been proven yet
2. None of the allegations took place in Today FM, TV3 or at the Gaiety as far as I know. Those were his place of work.
3. It is not up to me to decide on anyone's level of punishment
4. I'd have no problem working next to a pervert if he had realised the wrong of his ways and apologised.

The latest thing now is screenshots of his private conversations on whatsapp.

God help us all if we were judged by every conversation we've ever had in our lives.

My point and I'll say it again in case it's not clear enough for people is that this alleged behaviour is not UNFORGIVABLE.

If you all genuinely feel that it is then I feel sorry for your family and friends.

LollipopJimmy

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Well drugs are rife in the gay community, you'd need to be pretty clueless to think it unusual of a gay man in the entertainment industry to be fond of a few lines

Ah so it's ok then. Must remember that if I'm ever stopped with a few grams

Mr.H

LadyMacBeth_ wrote:

You quoted me as saying I'd think the same if they were women. Try reading my post.

My point is that there is no way you would feel the same.......

These men were assaulted. They did not want to be touched or gropped yet they where.

If it was women I would feel the exact same.

If anyone is forcefully touched inappropriatly then they are a victim of assault. While they were not raped, it's hot the point. It wasn't violent but definitely illegal.

No difference between what he did and what Harvey Weinstein did. Maybe Harvey took it another step but this creep definitely deserves what's coming to him

Venom

Red_Wake wrote: »

He'll be back.

Only in a re-run of his god awful show.

Grayditch

There is some awful attitudes to men who have been felt up against their will.

https://youtu.be/pi0ePRY7TSc?t=4m1s

I wonder would they all laugh if he was there in the studio...

pilly

Mr.H wrote: »

Did you think the same about Weinstein's victims?

There is no comparison between the two. Weinstein did and does wield a huge amount of power, Al Porter has no power and certainly didn't 4 or 5 years ago.

LadyMacBeth_

Mr.H wrote: »

My point is that there is no way you would feel the same.......

These men were assaulted. They did not want to be touched or gropped yet they where.

If it was women I would feel the exact same.

If anyone is forcefully touched inappropriatly then they are a victim of assault. While they were not raped, it's hot the point. It wasn't violent but definitely illegal.

No difference between what he did and what Harvey Weinstein did. Maybe Harvey took it another step but this creep definitely deserves what's coming to him

No, I wouldn't consider it to be sexual assault if it were women instead of men. I previously posted in this thread that I have been groped and I never considered it to be sexual assault nor did I consider myself to be a victim.

Mr.H

pilly wrote:

There is no comparison between the two. Weinstein did and does wield a huge amount of power, Al Porter has no power and certainly didn't 4 or 5 years ago.

He paid one of those men to appear at a show. That is power as he was the employer.

Scale is the only difference

Ulysses Gaze

pilly wrote: »

There is no comparison between the two. Weinstein did and does wield a huge amount of power, Al Porter has no power and certainly didn't 4 or 5 years ago.

An abuser is an abuser.

And a serial abuser is a serial abuser.

Cazale

Mr.H wrote:

No difference between what he did and what Harvey Weinstein did. Maybe Harvey took it another step but this creep definitely deserves what's coming to him

I'm sure Harvey started out with a few gropes here or there and a few unsolicited messages. The longer you get away with it the more emboldened you get I'd imagine. What would people have said about Saville or Harvey had they been stopped in their tracks forty years previously?

Mr.H

LadyMacBeth_ wrote:

No, I wouldn't consider it to be sexual assault if it were women instead of men. I previously posted in this thread that I have been groped and I never considered it to be sexual assault nor did I consider myself to be a victim.

OK that's fair enough. I do get where your coming from and would agree to an extent. But I could never go as far as to tell people they should feel like victims when they never asked for that to happen.

Just reading way too much hypocrisy on this issue.

pilly

VinLieger wrote: »

Witch Burners ehh? *checks posters history for references to george hook*

Interesting.......

What's more interesting is that someone has time to go back over 6 months of posting? Hmm......

I don't have time for that crack but I'm pretty sure I never said Hook should be burned at the stake or that he was unforgivable because I believe most people can be forgiven.

AnneFrank

it's not nice and he will pay for it, but he hasn't killed anyone, and let's be honest, he's only 24, we all make mistakes when we're young, He just didn't help himself with that statement, he should have been more contrite.

Mr.H

Cazale wrote:

I'm sure Harvey started out with a few gropes here or there and a few unsolicited messages. The longer you get away with it the more emboldened you get I'd imagine. What would people have said about Saville or Harvey had they been stopped in their tracks forty years previously?

Exactly. I wonder how this would look if it wasn't stopped now. He was obviously on the rise in the Irish entertainment circles so who is to say he couldn't have made it big. As an openly gay entertainer he was an ideal front an for any TV show that wanted to appeal to the current audience

pilly

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

An abuser is an abuser.

And a serial abuser is a serial abuser.

I wish I lived in a Black and White world. Really makes things simple.

Kill all the bad people - problem solved. :rolleyes:

Penn

LadyMacBeth_ wrote: »

No, I wouldn't consider it to be sexual assault if it were women instead of men. I previously posted in this thread that I have been groped and I never considered it to be sexual assault nor did I consider myself to be a victim.

But just because you don't, doesn't mean the same applies for everybody. And someone considering themselves to be a victim of such acts doesn't diminish those who have suffered worse acts or what they went through.

I think if someone considers the type of thing Porter did to them to be sexual assault and that they're a victim, and that that's a reasonable claim based on the general usage of the terms, then that's fair enough. If you don't based on similar or worse happening to you, that's fair enough for you also.

cloudatlas

LadyMacBeth_ wrote: »

No, I wouldn't consider it to be sexual assault if it were women instead of men. I previously posted in this thread that I have been groped and I never considered it to be sexual assault nor did I consider myself to be a victim.

Well what would you call it then?

LadyMacBeth_

Mr.H wrote: »

OK that's fair enough. I do get where your coming from and would agree to an extent. But I could never go as far as to tell people they should feel like victims when they never asked for that to happen.

Just reading way too much hypocrisy on this issue.

I just feel like victim is too strong a word in this instance, when he was just groping, I do think that he went too far with the man who was depressed and also when he put his hand down the other man's pants, definitely uncalled for behaviour, just ''assault'' and ''victim'' are too strong, especially when he just seemed to grab some crotches through jeans with the other men. I've had it happen to me, and I felt annoyed and shoved them away but I mean that was the end of it for me, definitely nothing that scarred me for life.

LadyMacBeth_

cloudatlas wrote: »

Well what would you call it then?

Unwanted attention? Groping? Being a general arsehole?

Cienciano

I think it's seriously bad form sending screenshots of a private conversation. I think a lot of people could be in trouble if their employer saw screenshots of a private conversation. (Obviously don't condone the groping before someone gets on a high horse).

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

An abuser is an abuser.

And a serial abuser is a serial abuser.

I wouldn't agree with that. Giving your mate a joint means you're a dealer, same as a guy pushing heroin. Different levels of everything.

cloudatlas

AnneFrank wrote: »

it's not nice and he will pay for it, but he hasn't killed anyone, and let's be honest, he's only 24, we all make mistakes when we're young, He just didn't help himself with that statement, he should have been more contrite.

My four year old niece is being taught in school that what's in your pants belongs to you. How difficult a concept is that, he is old enough to know better. No he hasn't killed anyone and he's not hitler.

pilly

Penn wrote: »

But just because you don't, doesn't mean the same applies for everybody. And someone considering themselves to be a victim of such acts doesn't diminish those who have suffered worse acts or what they went through.

I think if someone considers the type of thing Porter did to them to be sexual assault and that they're a victim, and that that's a reasonable claim based on the general usage of the terms, then that's fair enough. If you don't based on similar or worse happening to you, that's fair enough for you also.

I agree with you Penn, it's precisely how the person feels themselves.

It is not however up to us to call someone a victim in fact some people really object to being called a victim because it demeans them.

There was one recent horrific case of two girls abused by their father and neither of them wanted to be called victims.

We can't bestow the victim title on people just so we feel comfortable about bashing the abuser.

AnneFrank

Listen, i'm not defending the chap, but i do think a bit of perspective is needed here, that's all i'm saying

Will I Am Not

AnneFrank wrote: »

all the girls in my office are more interested in how big his schlong is

I have this in my head since reading your post. Sunday, Bloody Sunday tune.

How long, how long is Al Porter’s schlong
How long, how looooooooooooong...

LadyMacBeth_

Penn wrote: »

But just because you don't, doesn't mean the same applies for everybody. And someone considering themselves to be a victim of such acts doesn't diminish those who have suffered worse acts or what they went through.

I think if someone considers the type of thing Porter did to them to be sexual assault and that they're a victim, and that that's a reasonable claim based on the general usage of the terms, then that's fair enough. If you don't based on similar or worse happening to you, that's fair enough for you also.

Fair enough, if they want to consider themselves to be victims then that's up to them, I just don't think that's a healthy mindset in this instance.

VinLieger

pilly wrote: »

What's more interesting is that someone has time to go back over 6 months of posting? Hmm......

I don't have time for that crack but I'm pretty sure I never said Hook should be burned at the stake or that he was unforgivable because I believe most people can be forgiven.

Firstly the search function isn't that hard to use, it took all of 20 seconds.

Secondly I more just find it funny you found it ridiculous that people called what happened to hook a witch hunt but in this situation you have a problem with whats happening.

Venom

Cienciano wrote: »

I think it's seriously bad form sending screenshots of a private conversation. I think a lot of people could be in trouble if their employer saw screenshots of a private conversation. (Obviously don't condone the groping before someone gets on a high horse).



I wouldn't agree with that. Giving your mate a joint means you're a dealer, same as a guy pushing heroin. Different levels of everything.

So if I offer a guest a glass of wine I'm a publican, a cake or biscuit and I'm a baker by that logic!

Penn

pilly wrote: »

I agree with you Penn, it's precisely how the person feels themselves.

It is not however up to us to call someone a victim in fact some people really object to being called a victim because it demeans them.

There was one recent horrific case of two girls abused by their father and neither of them wanted to be called victims.

We can't bestow the victim title on people just so we feel comfortable about bashing the abuser.

Agreed. At the same time though, I don't think it's unfair of people in this thread referring to the people who have made accusations as victims either, unless the person in questions have said they don't want to be called victims. It's not an unreasonable term to use given the circumstances.

AnneFrank

VinLieger wrote: »

Firstly the search function isn't that hard to use, it took all of 20 seconds.

Secondly I more just find it funny you found it ridiculous that people called what happened to hook a witch hunt but in this situation you have a problem with whats happening.

what happened to hook was a total witch hunt imo

castletownman

The aforementioned pics (well what looks like a facebook chat) popped up on a whatsapp group I am on, and it makes him across a lot worse than before.

I would be mortified talking the way he does to my GF in private, but to do so to someone who clearly isn't reciprocal to his advances, knowing that the "target" was straight and in a relationship, on a public behemoth knowing full well that his relative fame pushes into "risky" territory, borders on predatory.

Just heard Matt Copper's segment too. Basically reciting Al's apology and giving a time-line of the weekend events, without even a semblance of condemnation. Even he took the "alleged" part of the accusations into consideration, and qualified any criticism by citing same, he could have at least shown a bit of balance. Hardly surprising he didn't though.

Cienciano

castletownman wrote: »

The aforementioned pics (well what looks like a facebook chat) popped up on a whatsapp group I am on, and it makes him across a lot worse than before.

I think without knowing the context of the facebook chat and what his relationship was to the other guy you can forget about it.
Hefty lad on him all the same

omerin

omerin wrote: »

I cannot wait for the Last Word on Monday for Coppers reaction. Very quick to castigate Hook about the wording of his question on personal responsibility (incorrectly imo), Trump's grabbing by the meow comment and the latest scandals with Weinstein and others. Will we see more of the holier then thou attitude from him on Monday, I would very much doubt it, but let's hope for some consistency.
Dil probably wont respond, her 5 minutes are up and as for COD, don't get me started ....

What a joke, but as expected, Copper did not address the issue, simply reading out statements, complete whitewash. Has he any credibility left as a journalist? I used to enjoy this show but now he is (and I hate using the word) a snowflake, unless the discretion is from one of his friends. I look back at the hatchet job he did on Hook, I can recall at least two discussions on the topic where no one was defending Hook. Hook was hung, drawn and quartered.

As I write this he is responding to a text and he is reading from a pre-scripted reply. Jesus Christ