Al Porter Scandal

Mossy Monk

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Don't split hairs.
The connection is two comedians who were faced with scandals and both handled it the same way. That being acknowledging it and making a joke out of it.

Personally I don't find porter funny and couldn't give a toss about watching him but hey, it's what's he is attempting to do.

It takes something special to liken tax avoidance to sexual assault. Well done you.

razorblunt wrote: »

Does The George have a rugby team? They might let Jackson and Olding line out for them?

How edgy. Are you implying that gay men are rapists, even though the two rugby players you mention were cleared of the charge?

wakka12

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Imagine the outrage from certain sections of society, twitter and the mainstream media if Porter had attacked women in the same way?

One rule for straight men it seems...........

Its because the victims are male more so than the perpetrator being gay, and I think you know that. Im sure being gay has helped him get off lighter for sure though, as well.

kunst nugget

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Imagine the outrage from certain sections of society, twitter and the mainstream media if Porter had attacked women in the same way?

One rule for straight men it seems...........

Porter's probably the most visible casualty of the #metoo movement in Ireland, he lost all work almost straight away and I suspect any chance of getting mainstream work again is slim to none. He's also not been charged with or found guilty of anything so far.

I'm not sure what else you need at the moment to stop you feeling that straight men are the real victims. Do you want us to all indulge in the sort of media-fed hysteria that's surrounded the Belfast trial to make you feel better?

razorblunt

Mossy Monk wrote: »

It takes something special to liken tax avoidance to sexual assault. Well done you.



How edgy. Are you implying that gay men are rapists, even though the two rugby players you mention were cleared of the charge?

Wow, that's a lot to take away from my question.

razorblunt

kunst nugget wrote: »

What are you trying to imply there?

The George appear to provide a platform to people trying to rebuild their careers.

Mr.H

Mossy Monk wrote:

How edgy. Are you implying that gay men are rapists, even though the two rugby players you mention were cleared of the charge?

Gay men can be rapists too 😉

But I am in no way implying anyone on particular is a rapist because unless there is proof they did something, they should never be called that.

kunst nugget

razorblunt wrote: »

The George appear to provide a platform to people trying to rebuild their careers.

I probably would have led with that line to avoid confusion…

facehugger99

ButtersSuki wrote: »

One rule for straight men it seems...........

It's amazing how oppressed straight men are in society. I never realized until I visited Boards.

ButtersSuki

kunst nugget wrote: »

Porter's probably the most visible casualty of the #metoo movement in Ireland, he lost all work almost straight away and I suspect any chance of getting mainstream work again is slim to none. He's also not been charged with or found guilty of anything so far.

I'm not sure what else you need at the moment to stop you feeling that straight men are the real victims. Do you want us to all indulge in the sort of media-fed hysteria that's surrounded the Belfast trial to make you feel better?

Except that's not what I said. At all.

Captain Flaps

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Completely agree, it would rightly be viewed far more seriously if he had done it to a woman. Thankfully it was grown men.

I can't tell if you're being serious, but I really hope not.

kunst nugget

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Except that's not what I said. At all.

Sooo, what's your problem?

kunst nugget

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Completely agree, it would rightly be viewed far more seriously if he had done it to a woman. Thankfully it was grown men.

Wait… what?

ButtersSuki

kunst nugget wrote: »

Sooo, what's your problem?

Nice tone.

I simply stated that in my opinion the way this appearance has been received would likely be different if Porter was straight and had committed his alleged crimes against women.

I didn't make any claims or statement about straight men being the victims.

kunst nugget

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Nice tone.

I simply stated that in my opinion the way this appearance has been received would likely be different if Porter was straight and had committed his alleged crimes against women.

I didn't make any claims or statement about straight men being the victims.

The 'one rule for straight men…' line always comes across as playing the victim card imo.

I also can't see anyone on here supporting him in the relation to his appearance at the George apart from a misguided attempt at trying to equate what he did with Jimmy Carr's indiscretions with the taxman. Tbh, most people have moved on and forgotten about him so the reality is that when he's not in the public eye, no one really gives a shít about him.

WHIP IT!

Captain Flaps wrote: »

I can't tell if you're being serious, but I really hope not.

We've been over this. If you can't see that grown men are better equipped to deal with a clumsy "attack" from a jumped up eejit like Al Porter than a woman might be I don't know what to tell ye.

Again, there is an inherent physical threat when a man accosts a woman like this that is just not there when it's a short, weakling bloke doing it to a grown man.... the "menace" is just not there.

WHIP IT!

kunst nugget wrote: »

Tbh, most people have moved on and forgotten about him so the reality is that when he's not in the public eye, no one really gives a shít about him.

Can't really argue with that...

kunst nugget

WHIP IT! wrote: »

We've been over this. If you can't see that grown men are better equipped to deal with a clumsy "attack" from a jumped up eejit like Al Porter than a woman might be I don't know what to tell ye.

Again, there is an inherent physical threat when a man accosts a woman like this that is just not there when it's a short, weakling bloke doing it to a grown man.... the "menace" is just not there.

So that makes it okay then? Riiiight…

Buford T. Justice XIX

kunst nugget wrote: »

Sooo, what's your problem?

Mod note: Debate the point and not the poster please!

Buford T. Justice

WHIP IT!

kunst nugget wrote: »

So that makes it okay then? Riiiight…

Makes what okay?

kumate_champ07

WHIP IT! wrote: »

We've been over this. If you can't see that grown men are better equipped to deal with a clumsy "attack" from a jumped up eejit like Al Porter than a woman might be I don't know what to tell ye.

Again, there is an inherent physical threat when a man accosts a woman like this that is just not there when it's a short, weakling bloke doing it to a grown man.... the "menace" is just not there.

are you aware of the sexual assaults against Terry Crews and Brendan Fraiser?

being powerless/vulnerable is not about someone being physically stronger than you

kunst nugget

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Makes what okay?

It's alright for Al Porter to sexual assault people because he was doing it to men and not women is essentially what you're saying.

WHIP IT!

kunst nugget wrote: »

It's alright for Al Porter to sexual assault people because he was doing it to men and not women is essentially what you're saying.

Who said that? I'm not 100% sure you have quoted the correct person.

ButtersSuki

kunst nugget wrote: »

The 'one rule for straight men…' line always comes across as playing the victim card imo.

I also can't see anyone on here supporting him in the relation to his appearance at the George apart from a misguided attempt at trying to equate what he did with Jimmy Carr's indiscretions with the taxman. Tbh, most people have moved on and forgotten about him so the reality is that when he's not in the public eye, no one really gives a shít about him.

I'm sorry - is your opinion considered fact now? Genuine question.

Others are entitled to their opinion too you know, even it it's different to yours (who'd have thought?). I explained the context in what I said in my post and it was not as you have alluded, yet you're continuing to bang this drum.

Can you answer me honestly and state you believe that if a straight man had committed the alleged sexual crimes against a number of women in Ireland and was a few months later making jokes about it on stage in a public venue it would be received as this has been?

kunst nugget

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Who said that? I'm not 100% sure you have quoted the correct person.

You said this?

Completely agree, it would rightly be viewed far more seriously if he had done it to a woman. Thankfully it was grown men.

Red_Wake

ButtersSuki wrote: »

kunst nugget wrote: »

The 'one rule for straight men…' line always comes across as playing the victim card imo.

I also can't see anyone on here supporting him in the relation to his appearance at the George apart from a misguided attempt at trying to equate what he did with Jimmy Carr's indiscretions with the taxman. Tbh, most people have moved on and forgotten about him so the reality is that when he's not in the public eye, no one really gives a shít about him.

I'm sorry - is your opinion considered fact now? Genuine question.

Others are entitled to their opinion too you know, even it it's different to yours (who'd have thought?). I explained the context in what I said in my post and it was not as you have alluded, yet you're continuing to bang this drum.

Can you answer me honestly and state you believe that if a straight man had committed the alleged sexual crimes against a number of women in Ireland and was a few months later making jokes about it on stage in a public venue it would be received as this has been?

Maybe if he'd reformed himself by cutting down on cigarettes and booze.:angel:

WHIP IT!

kunst nugget wrote: »

You said this?

I know what I said. You said someone claimed that what Porter did was "alright". Were you accusing me of saying it?? I apologise if I've go that wrong - I haven't read every single post here.

kunst nugget

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I'm sorry - is your opinion considered fact now? Genuine question.

No, it's my opinion. That's why I said in my opinion at the end.

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Others are entitled to their opinion too you know, even it it's different to yours (who'd have thought?).

I never said they weren't?

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I explained the context in what I said in my post and it was not as you have alluded, yet you're continuing to bang this drum.

The 'one rule for straight men…' line is a tired cliche at this stage that always comes across as self pitying imo (remember this is just my opinion).

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Can you answer me honestly and state you believe that if a straight man had committed the alleged sexual crimes against a number of women in Ireland and was a few months later making jokes about it on stage in a public venue it would be received as this has been?

I don't see any positive reception of it on here, do you. I must be missing something in the posting that's going on here.

If we are to use the Belfast trial as a guide to how it would be different if it was women being assaulted, there'd be a couple of posters on here calling the people that said they were assaulted liars who were probably desperate to get in Porter's pants and then regretted it.

Lux23

If Porter was up on the stage in the George yesterday making jokes about putting his hands down the pants of his victims, then that is disgusting. Appalled that the George would do that. I've only been there a few times, so they wouldn't exactly be losing much money but I doubt I will be giving them my custom again.

kumate_champ07

WHIP IT! wrote: »

I know what I said. You said someone claimed that what Porter did was "alright". Were you accusing me of saying it?? I apologise if I've go that wrong - I haven't read every single post here.

are you saying that a man will always be less of a victim than a woman in the same scenario?

what about the psychological aspect of a man being made feel like 'less of a man' because he's being socially dominated by another man , as well as being sexually assaulted.

kunst nugget

Was anyone in the George last night? What was the reaction from the crowd?

Effects

Mossy Monk wrote: »

even though the two rugby players you mention were cleared of the charge?

Cleared of rape. Still used misogynistic language when talking about women and treated them very badly.

WHIP IT!

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

are you saying that a man will always be less of a victim than a woman in the same scenario?

what about the psychological aspect of a man being made feel like 'less of a man' because he's being socially dominated by another man , as well as being sexually assaulted.

Do you think the "victims" of the moron Porter went home and cried themselves to sleep? They continued socialising with him that very night and further nights in question.

I have a friend who was victim of an actual sexual assault. A very high profile attack. It destroyed her for a long time. She once texted me, almost six months to the day after it had happened, and said words to the effect of "Progress: I slept without the full lights on last night for the first time!"

She was a long time rebuilding her life. It effected her whole family and still does. Her father and brothers refused to let her out of their sight in the weeks and months afterward, this led to conflict and stress within the family home as you can imagine. In fact, she confided in me not because I'm some kind of Dr Phil type, but because it turned out I was her only male friend or family member who could stand to talk to her without turning into a blubbering mess (although I came close!).

Thankfully she is fine now and has since married a lovely bloke.

Genuine question: What effect (lasting or otherwise) do you think the lads who had their c*cks grabbed - and their families - have experienced?

I object to these guys seeking - and being offered - similar sympathies to the victims of real sexual assaults. Their motives for announcing their "ordeal" on social media were questionable to say the least.

I've said it earlier in this thread and I'll repeat it: If you're the victim of a crime, or feel you have been the victim of a crime - go to the Gardai, not Twitter.

ButtersSuki

kunst nugget wrote: »

No, it's my opinion. That's why I said in my opinion at the end.



I never said they weren't?



The 'one rule for straight men…' line is a tired cliche at this stage that always comes across as self pitying imo (remember this is just my opinion).



I don't see any positive reception of it on here, do you. I must be missing something in the posting that's going on here.

If we are to use the Belfast trial as a guide to how it would be different if it was women being assaulted, there'd be a couple of posters on here calling the people that said they were assaulted liars who were probably desperate to get in Porter's pants and then regretted it.

Where to start.....?

One by one:

• You said "always". Even when I explained that's not what I was saying or implying
• No, you never said it, but your tone implies that you're right and anyone with a different opinion is wrong - even if they state that's not what they said (see my posts and the previous bullet point for further evidence of same)
• I didn't say there was any positive reception of it on here. What I was referring to was the likely outrage there would be if the hypothetical situation I outlined and it was a straight man making jokes about alleged sexual assaults whilst investigations were still ongoing in those cases had come to pass
• I actually have no idea what your last comment is about

Btw, you still haven't answered my question re. the hypothetical question I posed.

kunst nugget

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Btw, you still haven't answered my question re. the hypothetical question I posed.

I tried to use the Belfast thread as a way of answering what would happen in the hypothetical situation.

There most likely be hysterical reaction on both sides - considering he's not been charged of anything, there be a lot of people supporting both sides of the argument most likely. People would be looking for him to be hung from the rafters while others would be saying the victims were most likely liars and that he was just being a lad.

Is that what you want for this thread?

Mossy Monk

Effects wrote: »

Cleared of rape.

I'm sure you will get over it at some stage.

gmisk

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Do you think the "victims" of the moron Porter went home and cried themselves to sleep? They continued socialising with him that very night and further nights in question.

I have a friend who was victim of an actual sexual assault. A very high profile attack. It destroyed her for a long time. She once texted me, almost six months to the day after it had happened, and said words to the effect of "Progress: I slept without the full lights on last night for the first time!"

She was a long time rebuilding her life. It effected her whole family and still does. Her father and brothers refused to let her out of their sight in the weeks and months afterward, this led to conflict and stress within the family home as you can imagine. In fact, she confided in me not because I'm some kind of Dr Phil type, but because it turned out I was her only male friend or family member who could stand to talk to her without turning into a blubbering mess (although I came close!).

Thankfully she is fine now and has since married a lovely bloke.

Genuine question: What effect (lasting or otherwise) do you think the lads who had their c*cks grabbed - and their families - have experienced?

I object to these guys seeking - and being offered - similar sympathies to the victims of real sexual assaults. Their motives for announcing their "ordeal" on social media were questionable to say the least.

I've said it earlier in this thread and I'll repeat it: If you're the victim of a crime, or feel you have been the victim of a crime - go to the Gardai, not Twitter.

I agree there are degrees of severity when it comes to things like this but I dont think there is any need to put victims in quotation marks, its not as if Al Porter has denied most of the allegations, they were down to his flamboyant attitude or some such sh#te!

How would you feel if a someone went up to you and stuck their hands down your trousers?

People deal with things in very different ways, men in general I think are a lot less likely to open up and talk to someone or go to the gardai.

I can remember an incident myself at a concert with a random much larger man than me sticking his hands down my trousers, just because I dont go to the Gardai or tweet about it, does that mean it hasnt effected me? Of course it f#cking has!

kumate_champ07

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Do you think the "victims" of the moron Porter went home and cried themselves to sleep? They continued socialising with him that very night and further nights in question.

I have a friend who was victim of an actual sexual assault. A very high profile attack. It destroyed her for a long time. She once texted me, almost six months to the day after it had happened, and said words to the effect of "Progress: I slept without the full lights on last night for the first time!"

She was a long time rebuilding her life. It effected her whole family and still does. Her father and brothers refused to let her out of their sight in the weeks and months afterward, this led to conflict and stress within the family home as you can imagine. In fact, she confided in me not because I'm some kind of Dr Phil type, but because it turned out I was her only male friend or family member who could stand to talk to her without turning into a blubbering mess (although I came close!).

Thankfully she is fine now and has since married a lovely bloke.

Genuine question: What effect (lasting or otherwise) do you think the lads who had their c*cks grabbed - and their families - have experienced?

I object to these guys seeking - and being offered - similar sympathies to the victims of real sexual assaults. Their motives for announcing their "ordeal" on social media were questionable to say the least.

I've said it earlier in this thread and I'll repeat it: If you're the victim of a crime, or feel you have been the victim of a crime - go to the Gardai, not Twitter.

You didnt really answer my question tho, its a yes or no answer.

what happened to your friend is horrible. I dont know how Al's victims felt, but that doesnt excuse his behaviour. What about the guys who stayed silent, we dont know how they felt afterwards

Ive seen women make accusations on twitter too, and they didnt go to the gardai.

Theres a high profile comedy promoter in the west of Ireland that has accusations against him for a while now, no mention of any investigations into the allegations. No comedians are speaking up about it. I saw him mentioned in a post recently on a feminist page on Facebook, I was checking for updates on the 'story'.

WHIP IT!

gmisk wrote: »

I agree there are degrees of severity when it comes to things like this but I dont think there is any need to put victims in quotation marks, its not as if Al Porter has denied most of the allegations, they were down to his flamboyant attitude or some such sh#te!

How would you feel if a someone went up to you and stuck their hands down your trousers?

People deal with things in very different ways, men in general I think are a lot less likely to open up and talk to someone or go to the gardai.

I honestly think we should close this thread now. We have finally seen the light.

WHIP IT!

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

You didnt really answer my question tho, its a yes or no answer.

Sorry, can you ask it again? I genuinely missed it.

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

Ive seen women make accusations on twitter too, and they didnt go to the gardai.

Equally wrong. I view any such "accusations" with, I wouldn't say disdain, but something slightly milder to disdain! (someone gimme a word)

EDIT: Suspicion! That's the word I wanted...

ButtersSuki

kunst nugget wrote: »

I tried to use the Belfast thread as a way of answering what would happen in the hypothetical situation.

There most likely be hysterical reaction on both sides - considering he's not been charged of anything, there be a lot of people supporting both sides of the argument most likely. People would be looking for him to be hung from the rafters while others would be saying the victims were most likely liars and that he was just being a lad.

Is that what you want for this thread?

And you still haven't answered it.

kumate_champ07

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Sorry, can you ask it again? I genuinely missed it.

"a man will always be less of a victim than a woman in the same scenario?"

Effects

Mossy Monk wrote: »

I'm sure you will get over it at some stage.

Thanks for your concern, but there's nothing for me to get over.

terryduff12

Sure why would a Man report it, its not the same as if it happened to a Woman, Man are strong and tough we don't cry over such things. To report such a thing you probably get some sniggering much the same as reporting your Wife or girlfriend for beating you up. You object to men stealing the limelight, hope no Male comes to you looking for help sure your only stealing the limelight you'd tell them right.

kunst nugget

ButtersSuki wrote: »

And you still haven't answered it.

Sigh… Okay, in a hypothetical situation where a comedian was job presenting on television and radio several months beforehand for groping women and allegedly did an unannounced gig (that I can't find anything about online) in a small venue while there was a whole other media shítstorm going on in relation to a high profile court case that had everybody's attention, I would imagine that the reaction, or lack thereof, would most likely be the same.

Does that help?

WHIP IT!

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

"a man will always be less of a victim than a woman in the same scenario?"

Assuming that the question is do I believe the above to be true?

It's an impossible question to answer. Every situation is different. In the case we're talking about, would it have been more serious if the victims were women? Yes, to me, it would have been more serious.

ButtersSuki

kunst nugget wrote: »

Sigh… Okay, in a hypothetical situation where a comedian was job presenting on television and radio several months beforehand for groping women and allegedly did an unannounced gig (that I can't find anything about online) in a small venue while there was a whole other media shítstorm going on in relation to a high profile court case that had everybody's attention, I would imagine that the reaction, or lack thereof, would most likely be the same.

Does that help?

What's with the sighing? Honestly, can you have a debate without resorting to sighing and your earlier "sooo, what's your problem?" comment?

Re. your answer, fair enough, if that's your opinion. My own opinion would be that there would be significantly more "noise" and outrage around a straight male....but that's just my opinion.

Thanks for finally answering though.

kunst nugget

ButtersSuki wrote: »

What's with the sighing? Honestly, can you have a debate without resorting to sighing and your earlier "sooo, what's your problem?" comment?

Re. your answer, fair enough, if that's your opinion. My own opinion would be that there would be significantly more "noise" and outrage around a straight male....but that's just my opinion.

Thanks for finally answering though.

You know what, I am coming across as a snarky prick so I apologise.

I think there'd might be more noise about the Al Porter thing if the fall out from the Belfast trial wasn't ongoing although I think most people are happy enough to ignore him at this stage - if he was a straight man groping women would there be more noise about it? I honestly don't know but if there was, I think there would also be a corresponding rise in the debate in the validity of the victims if other threads in boards are anything to go by.

Omackeral

WHIP IT! wrote: »

In the case we're talking about, would it have been more serious if the victims were women? Yes, to me, it would have been more serious.

I don't like that attitude or opinion to be honest but at least you've bottle to say it out.

smurgen

Omackeral wrote: »

WHIP IT! wrote: »

In the case we're talking about, would it have been more serious if the victims were women? Yes, to me, it would have been more serious.

I don't like that attitude or opinion to be honest but at least you've bottle to say it out.

It's a scumbag's opinion.

WHIP IT!

smurgen wrote: »

It's a scumbag's opinion.

Assuming that was aimed at me and not Omackerel... as someone who hasn't interacted with me once on this thread, would you like to explain that statement... or shall we just leave the irony hanging in the air?