Guess what Mad_Lad got this time?

Interesting difference in charging between the 22 and 33 Kwh I3.

https://insideevs.com/informative-comparison-test-on-updated-2017-bmw-i3-94ah-33-kwh-performance-charging/


With both vehicles starting at roughly the same SOC (42.5%-%44%), in 30 minutes the 2014 i3 packed in 9.18 kWh. vs 17.14 kWh for the 2017. And significantly, even at 92% vs 82% SOC for the 2014, when I started an extra 10 minute session, I found the 2017 was still charging at a 70% faster rate. Above 98-99% the 2017 showed at least another 12 minutes left, but that is pretty close to being fully charged anyways and way faster than the 60Ah i3 98% SOC rate.

alanowx

Deleted User wrote: »

You can't even charge at 3 phase though because they don't give you the 3 phase cable !

So for average Joe they're not going to have a clue.......

But I agree super research should not be required it should be clearly stated the mode at which the vehicle will charge ann when charging should display some sort of information to indicate the charging power.

Here is more info is taken from Page 7 & 8 from BMW_i3_Quick_Start-Guide.pdf available from this link, doc at bottom of page.

https://www.bmw.ie/en/all-models/bmw-i/i3/2016/at-a-glance.html.

It gives some charge rates info.

Dardania

I wonder if that fancy wallbox pro is where you're meant to set when you want it to charge

MayoSalmon

draiochtanois wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Don't think those car seats take an isofix to be honest...

KCross

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm nearly sure the I3 charges at 32 amps on single phase, it certainly seemed to charge pretty fast at the 22 Kw AC point.

There are 3 modes of charging set in the head unit. Max , Reduced and Low.

Hard to tell from that.
The table in the first image only shows upto 15A and then the second image shows a 32A option "when supplied".


What Amps is written on your cable because that is going to limit you regardless anyway? If your cable says 16A I'd be surprised if the car can do 32A.

Its like the Leaf... if you bought a 6.6kW Leaf you got the higher rated cable. Everyone else got the 16A cable. Im sure BMW do the same.

ELM327

KCross wrote: »

Hard to tell from that.
The table in the first image only shows upto 15A and then the second image shows a 32A option "when supplied".


What Amps is written on your cable because that is going to limit you regardless anyway? If your cable says 16A I'd be surprised if the car can do 32A.

Its like the Leaf... if you bought a 6.6kW Leaf you got the higher rated cable. Everyone else got the 16A cable. Im sure BMW do the same.

+1

It doesn't have 32a support I am positive (badum tish) as 16a*3ph gives the 11kW.
For single phase I don't see how it could offer 32a if the charger is 16a for 3 phase.
The booklet seems to explain it pretty clear that the car charges between 15-17a if fitted with the 11kW charger and at 32a if fitted with the 7kW single phase option.

Yes I forgot to say the cable supplied is a 32 amp single phase . And based on the speed of charging at the AC public point I'm convinced it's charging at 32 amps on single phase.

KCross

ELM327 wrote: »

+1

It doesn't have 32a support I am positive (badum tish) as 16a*3ph gives the 11kW.
For single phase I don't see how it could offer 32a if the charger is 16a for 3 phase.
The booklet seems to explain it pretty clear that the car charges between 15-17a if fitted with the 11kW charger and at 32a if fitted with the 7kW single phase option.

Could some fancy electronics allow it to switch between 32A single and 16A 3-phase?

Maybe the car is 7kW but doesn't have 11kW 3-phase.... that would explain why it appears fast to Mad_lad on the public chargers and why the car came with a 32A single phase cable.

BMW seemingly only supply the single phase cable.

When I look up the VIN it says it's got the multi phase AC charger.

ELM327

KCross wrote: »

Could some fancy electronics allow it to switch between 32A single and 16A 3-phase?

Maybe the car is 7kW but doesn't have 11kW 3-phase.... that would explain why it appears fast to Mad_lad on the public chargers and why the car came with a 32A single phase cable.

You'd have to balance the current across two of the 3 16a phases.
I'm not electrically minded enough to know if that is possible or feasible to be included to be honest. I understand a little bit about electrical current but not enough!

If it's 7kW 1 phase that would explain the 32a 1 phase cable.

S4U6A Quick charg.altern.current multi-phase

I've another issue, it didn't precondition today.

I had it set to depart at 12:45 get in car cold, now this could have been an error last night when I set the timer via the app, perhaps , I did not wait for confirmation that the update was successful so perhaps it wasn't.

Battery temp was 10 degrees C .

I had the off peak time set from 11 PM - 8 AM.

So I'm curious now , will it preheat if out of the set off peak time ?

I would expect the battery to be higher than 10 deg C , but was expecting it to be less if not preheated, so does it warm up the battery before charging or before departure ?

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

You'd have to balance the current across two of the 3 16a phases.
I'm not electrically minded enough to know if that is possible or feasible to be included to be honest. I understand a little bit about electrical current but not enough!

If it's 7kW 1 phase that would explain the 32a 1 phase cable.

Apparently it does give 32a single phase and 16a three phase

https://speakev.com/threads/new-i3-ac-charging-rates.19818/


The 94Ah i3 has three 3.7kW AC/DC rectifiers. When connected to a single phase fast charger two of them are used in tandem for 7.4kW charging. When connected to a 3 phase supply there is a rectifier for each phase.

Cheers for that.

Yeah it makes sense because it did charge pretty fast on AC in Galway.

I must invest in a 3 phase cable for the AC points so.

I wonder how many poor sods are aware of this ?

I also just checked, the head unit in the i3 confirms a timer was set for 12:45 so why it didn't preheat is anyone's guess, maybe I didn't have Climatisation selected, Jaysus

One thing you can never fault Nissan for and that's making Charging and pre-heating timers simple, or maybe that's my problem now that the Leaf was too simple lol, I didn't have any issue before now anyway so I'll be more careful with setting timers in future.

One great thing though is being able to get home or to work and just plug in then set the timers when inside.

stesaurus

Confirmations from the app can take some time, you need to wait for confirmation.
Interesting to know about the 7.4kW single phase charging, great news. I'd be lost without that

draiochtanois

This post has been deleted.

spyderski

MayoSalmon wrote: »

Don't think those car seats take an isofix to be honest...

Every car manufactured since 2012/13 (think before that in the EU) has to have ISOFIX by law. Even 2 seater exotic stuff like Boxsters and the like have ISOFIX on the passenger seat...

Shefwedfan

Would anyone know, how far on electric do you get on the old model and new model before the REX kicks in?

Sherfin

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Would anyone know, how far on electric do you get on the old model and new model before the REX kicks in?

The REX will kick in automatically at 6.5% remaining.
In my (older) model, on these cold and dark evenings & mornings I'm seeing about 100-110 on the guessometer in the mornings compared to 130-140 in the summer. Of course, this also depends on your driving style.
Todays commute of 90km left me with 14% (13 km), so it would have kicked in if I had to go much further.

The REX can be engaged manually once below 75% and this is what I tend to do when I know that the journey is longer than the range, e.g. I have a brother in KK (about 160 km) which of course is on the FCP black-hole that is the M9
Then when I know that there's more than enough in the battery to get me there, I can switch off the rex

I3 battery did not warm up, this morning it was 10 Deg C, preconditioning enables, timer set well in advance last night. Any ideas ? I presume it was 10 Deg only from charging.

cros13

Deleted User wrote: »

I3 battery did not warm up, this morning it was 10 Deg C, preconditioning enables, timer set well in advance last night. Any ideas ? I presume it was 10 Deg only from charging.

Have a read of Tom Moloughney's FAQ on i3 preconditioning and see if anything jumps out:

http://bmwi3.blogspot.ie/2015/03/bmw-i3-understanding-how.html

He's covered any advice I could give in exhaustive detail. Only caveat is the three hours in advance for battery preconditioning is now four hours on any post-2015 firmware.

Yep I read that the other day but according to the I3 UK FB Group that 10 Deg C is perfectly fine and working as normal that it heats the battery enough to allow full regen.

20 Deg C that I read about was probably a hot climate and it cooled the battery to this temp.

BoatMad

nice car, too expensive for the value in my experience, but hey the flying propeller has to be worth something right

unkel

If you are into your spec, he got a decent deal. Basically €15k off the list price including extras for a 7 month old car, was it, Mad_Lad? and offloaded his '15 24kWh Leaf that still had the finance package on it. Not the easiest car to sell privately either and expect decent money for it.

BoatMad

unkel wrote: »

If you are into your spec, he got a decent deal. Basically €15k off the list price including extras for a 7 month old car, was it, Mad_Lad? and offloaded his '15 24kWh Leaf that still had the finance package on it. Not the easiest car to sell privately either and expect decent money for it.

oh I except he was in a bind with the expiration of his PCP, so he had to act. personally mine is up in early 2019 and I expect more choice

unkel

unkel wrote: »

If you are into your spec, he got a decent deal. Basically €15k off the list price including extras for a 7 month old car, was it, Mad_Lad? and offloaded his '15 24kWh Leaf that still had the finance package on it. Not the easiest car to sell privately either and expect decent money for it.

37,500 was about 55K with all the extras, yes a good deal indeed !

BoatMad wrote: »

oh I except he was in a bind with the expiration of his PCP, so he had to act. personally mine is up in early 2019 and I expect more choice

Correct, and mighty glad I did too, great car very happy with it !

ELM327

BoatMad wrote: »

oh I except he was in a bind with the expiration of his PCP, so he had to act. personally mine is up in early 2019 and I expect more choice

Early 2019 means you could have a choice of Leaf 2, and possibly the newer offerings of Ioniq with larger battery, even a model 3 if you have a reservation especially.

thecomedian

Did I see you heading towards Ken Blacks?

thecomedian

thecomedian wrote: »

Did I see you heading towards Ken Blacks?

You mean me ? today ? in carlow ? lol then yes that was me, where were you ?

I did a bit of i3 hacking today using bimmercode app on Iphone, really cool app.

Enables Am radio



And to my complete surprise I got Shortwave ! ok just the 49 meter band but still pretty cool and it receives a lot of stations on 49 meters which is crowded this time of the evening. Really happy with this. Shame on BMW for not activating all radio functions on the i3, however I've still to drive it with Am to see if the drivetrain really does interfere with reception.

thecomedian

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You mean me ? today ? in carlow ? lol then yes that was me, where were you ?

I was in Seamus Byrnes and saw a grayish i3 going by. Thought it may get be you.

I also discovered you can set the Rex to come in below 6 % also right down to 1 % which would allow you to use a bit more battery but might effect performance if you needed Rex mode you’d have to be aware of this.

unkel

Deleted User wrote: »

I also discovered you can set the Rex to come in below 6 % also right down to 1 % which would allow you to use a bit more battery but might effect performance if you needed Rex mode you’d have to be aware of this.

That's brilliant! You should do a write up in here.

unkel

unkel wrote: »

That's brilliant! You should do a write up in here.

On Bimmercode ?

Unfortunately, too good to be true, AM/SW is dreadful once the motor kicks in, BMW say the carbon Fibre body is the reason for this interference that a metal body provides much better shielding, who knows ? but I can see why they disabled it, now the question remains whether they didn't bother to try shield it in the first place because originally BMW had stated that no one listens to MW these days anyway and they couldn't be more wrong and they realise this now and are working on making AM work. But I can bet BMW thought that anyone who buys such a car would only stream from phones and hardly use the FM radio never mind AM !

Dardania

Not since Atlantic 252 anyway!

The carbon fibre body presents interesting challenges in aviation too, where they have to deal with manually putting in lightning dissipation routes - big difference from aluminium world.

Shame as I was really looking forward to having MW and 49 meters on the move !

ELM327

This thread has piqued my interest.
I'm starting to get sick of my 24kWh leaf's low range and the terrible fast charge network.
Hmm.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710140276344?model=I3&sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&fuel-type=Hybrid&radius=1500&make=BMW&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&postcode=ig61lu&page=1

thierry14

ELM327 wrote: »

This thread has piqued my interest.
I'm starting to get sick of my 24kWh leaf's low range and the terrible fast charge network.
Hmm.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710140276344?model=I3&sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&fuel-type=Hybrid&radius=1500&make=BMW&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&postcode=ig61lu&page=1

Good price

Out of warranty, state of the art BMW is dodgy though

BMW make bangers these days and if you google i3 problems, a **** load of posts on it across forums

Little annoying things too, typical BMW issues

Haven't read much on drivetrain and battery problems, thats good, those little things like charge failing, fuel leaks, generator switch motor failing though

Leaf seems to be incredibly reliable, almost bombproof in comparison

ELM327

You'll find problems on any EV/ICE you google for "carname problems".
Someone on here has done over 100k in an i3 if memory serves?

I think most of the issues with early i3’s Have been pretty much sorted now. Cros would be the man to ask about the I3.

Early leafs had issues charging also but it wasn’t too common , it is pretty bulletproof. Early leafs did have issues losing more capacity bars.

I’m really delighted I got the I3.

thierry14

ELM327 wrote: »

You'll find problems on any EV/ICE you google for "carname problems".
Someone on here has done over 100k in an i3 if memory serves?

He's had a lot of things go wrong with that car, not major and under warranty

Little things that would add up

Mechanics don't call BMW ( bring money withyou) for nothing

Early i3 are way down on consumer reports, while Leaf is near the top

Also that rex thing isnt going that be useful with the small battery i3, what will the range be with it just charging battery?

Will it even do 200km?

General feeling is Rex is too weak to drive the car on its own, anything above 40mph and it's struggling big time and hills etc are dodgy out

They should have made it more powerful, it's got like 30bhp that little engine

I like Mad_Lad posts, but everything he buys is the best

Was the same with electric bike when he got it, then Leaf, now i3 Rex is the best thing ever

When he changes it in 3 years for a 75kWh 250bhp EV, the i3 Rex will be over complicated

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

This thread has piqued my interest.
I'm starting to get sick of my 24kWh leaf's low range and the terrible fast charge network.
Hmm.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710140276344?model=I3&sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&fuel-type=Hybrid&radius=1500&make=BMW&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&postcode=ig61lu&page=1

The trick with the Rex is to know when you need it, rather than allow the battery % to fall to the point where it kicks in , for instance , you will have about the same range as a 24 kwh leaf in that 2015 i3 so if you know you got a 160 Km motorway stint then engage the Rex as soon as it allows at 75% and the battery % will drop much slower than if you used battery only.

Then at the next charge point fill her up with petrol, a 20 min charge and off you go again or if you don't want to you don't have to but Power can be limited if charge % goes below 6% , I never tried this so this could be a lower % where any power loss is noticeable.

On my motorway stint last week I lost 6% battery in 38 Kms at 120 Kph. However the Rex is a bit more powerful in the 33 Kwh. If you slow down then the charge % will actually climb again.

But at slower speeds as long as you have petrol there should be no issue with the Rex.

If you got say, 30% or more battery then you can use some of this when you get into town or slower traffic and then rex again when you get back out. Obviously it's better to find a charge point if you can.

Either way , the rex gives you a lot more options than having no backup at all.

What I'd do if I were you is take one for a test drive, some dealers should have the 22 Kwh in stock, get it for a day or two and see how you get on with it. But you won't want to give it back it's a lot of fun particularly off the motorway.

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

The trick with the Rex is to know when you need it, rather than allow the battery % to fall to the point where it kicks in , for instance , you will have about the same range as a 24 kwh leaf in that 2015 i3 so if you know you got a 160 Km motorway stint then engage the Rex as soon as it allows at 75% and the battery % will drop much slower than if you used battery only.

Then at the next charge point fill her up with petrol, a 20 min charge and off you go again or if you don't want to you don't have to but Power can be limited if charge % goes below 6% , I never tried this so this could be a lower % where any power loss is noticeable.

On my motorway stint last week I lost 6% battery in 38 Kms at 120 Kph. However the Rex is a bit more powerful in the 33 Kwh. If you slow down then the charge % will actually climb again.

But at slower speeds as long as you have petrol there should be no issue with the Rex.

If you got say, 30% or more battery then you can use some of this when you get into town or slower traffic and then rex again when you get back out. Obviously it's better to find a charge point if you can.

Either way , the rex gives you a lot more options than having no backup at all.

What I'd do if I were you is take one for a test drive, some dealers should have the 22 Kwh in stock, get it for a day or two and see how you get on with it. But you won't want to give it back it's a lot of fun particularly off the motorway.

I don't want to fill her up with petrol though! Not interested in using petrol day to day, or in supplementing my range with petrol. I'm a cheapskate and I have free EV charging at work, and nearly free at home. Don't want to pay for petrol unless absolutely necessary.

The idea of me buying a rex is that it has to comfortably do all my normal journeys on EV only (max trip about 160km) and then use the rex only irregularly.

I was looking at the range on the new rex 33kwh i3 and it seems to meet that but they are more expensive - not too far off repayments on a cheaper model S. The absolute cheapest Rex i3 94ah is below, approx 27k euro plus VRT (which is not free due to the BEVx)

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710039918777?advertising-location=at_cars&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&postcode=ig61lu&fuel-type=Hybrid&radius=1500&aggregatedTrim=94%20Ah&make=BMW&model=I3&sort=price-asc&page=1

thierry14

thierry14 wrote: »

I like Mad_Lad posts, but everything he buys is the best

Was the same with electric bike when he got it, then Leaf, now i3 Rex is the best thing ever

When he changes it in 3 years for a 75kWh 250bhp EV, the i3 Rex will be over complicated

This sums you up nicely !

thierry14

ELM327 wrote: »

I don't want to fill her up with petrol though! Not interested in using petrol day to day, or in supplementing my range with petrol. I'm a cheapskate and I have free EV charging at work, and nearly free at home. Don't want to pay for petrol unless absolutely necessary.

The idea of me buying a rex is that it has to comfortably do all my normal journeys on EV only (max trip about 160km) and then use the rex only irregularly.

I was looking at the range on the new rex 33kwh i3 and it seems to meet that but they are more expensive - not too far off repayments on a cheaper model S. The absolute cheapest Rex i3 94ah is below, approx 27k euro plus VRT (which is not free due to the BEVx)

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710039918777?advertising-location=at_cars&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&postcode=ig61lu&fuel-type=Hybrid&radius=1500&aggregatedTrim=94%20Ah&make=BMW&model=I3&sort=price-asc&page=1

That one is a good buy, great price

Under warranty, almost new car

Big battery too

They are like 45K new, damn thats some depreciation for a BMW

Crazy

Buy a 17 reg like that, paying almost 20k euro for a 15 with no warranty and small battery is mad

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

I don't want to fill her up with petrol though! Not interested in using petrol day to day, or in supplementing my range with petrol. I'm a cheapskate and I have free EV charging at work, and nearly free at home. Don't want to pay for petrol unless absolutely necessary.

The idea of me buying a rex is that it has to comfortably do all my normal journeys on EV only (max trip about 160km) and then use the rex only irregularly.

I was looking at the range on the new rex 33kwh i3 and it seems to meet that but they are more expensive - not too far off repayments on a cheaper model S. The absolute cheapest Rex i3 94ah is below, approx 27k euro plus VRT (which is not free due to the BEVx)

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710039918777?advertising-location=at_cars&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&postcode=ig61lu&fuel-type=Hybrid&radius=1500&aggregatedTrim=94%20Ah&make=BMW&model=I3&sort=price-asc&page=1

Not far off the cost of a Model S if you're talking new but a 2nd hand 33 Kwh like I got is quiet a lot cheaper than a 2nd hand model S unless you're talking 40-60 Kwh Model S then maybe it could be a close call. And are there superchargers near you on on your routes you take ? Charging it on 50 Kw DC will be slow.

ELM327

thierry14 wrote: »

That one is a good buy, great price

Under warranty, almost new car

Big battery too

They are like 45K new, damn thats some depreciation for a BMW

Crazy

Buy a 17 reg like that, paying almost 20k euro for a 15 with no warranty and small battery is mad

Agreed, the 33kWh is much more desirable.

Deleted User wrote: »

Not far off the cost of a Model S if you're talking new but a 2nd hand 33 Kwh like I got is quiet a lot cheaper than a 2nd hand model S unless you're talking 40-60 Kwh Model S then maybe it could be a close call. And are there superchargers near you on on your routes you take ? Charging it on 50 Kw DC will be slow.

Cheapest model S, albeit a 60, is £35k. https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201712182134605?postcode=ig61lu&sort=price-asc&make=TESLA&radius=1500&advertising-location=at_cars&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&page=1
I'd prefer a tesla if the repayments were even in the same ballpark.

There's a supercharger 50km north of my house (so if i were going to belfast it would be en route)
Same with ballacolla, its enroute to my parents house. It would cover most of my journeys, remember you dont need to charge until over 250km in even a MS60. I'd be aiming for an 85 though,there was one for £32k a couple of weeks ago.

Charging on 50kW DC isnt a problem in a model S, it's not mahoosively fast but still the same speed as charging an i3 at 50kW DC.

A lot of miles for the price no ?

Best is to take the two for a drive, the Model S is of course much larger. EPA range of 335 Kms, give or take as we know. Probably 220-250 winter at 120 Kph ?

I was swinging towards Model S also but not interested in importing + it was a lot more expensive than the i3 Rex that I got which has decent spec and 9,000 kms.

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

A lot of miles for the price no ?

Best is to take the two for a drive, the Model S is of course much larger. EPA range of 335 Kms, give or take as we know. Probably 220-250 winter at 120 Kph ?

I was swinging towards Model S also but not interested in importing + it was a lot more expensive than the i3 Rex that I got which has decent spec and 9,000 kms.

We need to get away from the attachment to the odometer when considering an EV.
Other than first gen (2011-2013) leafs it doesnt make much different at all.

It's not a bag of bolts from the 19th century clattering together with explosions of dino juice and spark plugs which will expire at 100k miles. It's an electric motor with very few moving parts.

I'd prefer a tesla with 400k miles than an equivalent ICE (s-klasse, 7 series etc) with 100k.


I would consider purchasing here but the prices are ludicrous (no pun intended) for second hand models, 20k over the cost of importing a similar spec from the UK. There was one at €52k from a private sale earlier, it was relatively cheap but as it was a pre-AP car it would have had to have been in the low-mid 40's for me to buy it really.

I think at the end of the day I will end up buying a model S , just have to get these silly thoughts about REX out of my head. I am not going to pay €500 a month for an i3 when I could have a model S for €700-750, you know?

I intend to head down to Sandyford and get a test drive, in the new year.
I am betwixt and between getting a model S next year, or getting a stopgap for 2-3 years first (this is where the i3, along with the Outlander, Volt, etc come in) before getting a better specced model S in 2-3 years time.