Disposable Income Gone

lisasimpson

Ronaldinho wrote: »

Is that not part of parenting?

Exactly..a mirror of the situation i think. Not taking responsiblity do we have to get someone else to do evreything for us...a bit like healthy eating..out informative years start in the home by setting examples..but again only work so much

Wanderer78

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

In time I wonder if the working week will be cut or will 2 workers share the 1 job?

what evidence have we that the working week will be reduced, not forgetting we were promised this in times past?

the future doesnt look good for the worker, as workers have less bargaining power compared to the past. i suspect this will eventually all come to a head, and we ll be forced to address our inequality issues. as it stands, wealth is moving in one direction, this is unsustainable.

Ronaldinho wrote: »

Is that not part of parenting?

it is of course, but i do believe many parents, particularly young parents are caught in a trap of debt, and are spending a large portion of their time servicing these debts by working, and working longer hours, thus spending less time attending to their kids actual needs.

_Brian wrote: »

The problem here is the snowflakes who want everything, preferably without working for it or making an effort like savings and cutting back on luxuries.

I know a chap who dropped out of college because he couldn’t be bothered. Married but his wife won’t work, just pop’d out the third kid he works a factory job in €12.50 and hour and they are on FIS.
But they moan they can’t afford everything they’d like, jealous of those going on holidays. Would love to build a house but not a hope of getting the money - ever.
People like this need to look at themselves before moaning about everything, I see them both on social media bitching about the government not creating housing and employment opportunities.

our educational system only truly works for certain type of people with certain abilities, it actually penalises those that is doesnt work for, leaving many in vulnerable positions.

the world of marketing has a lot to answer for to regarding out wish wants and needs!

oh but 'the market', i will say this again, 'we shall not speak ill of the market'!:rolleyes:

Akrasia

hurler32 wrote: »

the majority going around in Tracksuits with their Lidl Plastic bag....

You can afford the lidl plastic bag?

well your majesty, it's nice to grace us with your presence

Tigerandahalf

Wanderer78 wrote: »

what evidence have we that the working week will be reduced, not forgetting we were promised this in times past?

The alternative is having a huge swathe of people out of work and that wouldn't be a good thing for society. People need to feel they have something to offer/gain from existing.

Big corporations like Google/Apple/Amazon will have to be tackled. They are paying peanuts in tax while workers are paying close to 50% in some cases. Europe is starting to tackle this in some way.

A global tax deal (akin to the climate change deal) will be needed to stop tax havens and help distribute wealth.


Upto now everything re production has been about making things faster and cheaper. But in future sustainability will play a bigger role.

The 5 day working week was needed to keep factories going and 2 days off for workers to rest. That type of template is no longer needed.

If workers are only paid for a 4 day week homes would have to get cheaper. Many of our costs are driven by double incomes.

hurler32

Panda bins would be a good example , 10-20 years ago plenty of Dublin men unskilled if you want to be blunt worked on lorries collecting bins getting 550-600 a week .... now panda does the bins with Albanians and Romianians earning 380 a week ... 15 of them living in a house ... scavenging in Lidl in the evenings to stay going ....
This is becoming the model employers want ...Hardly the model we want for our children ?

PCeeeee

For the love of God. Again and again in this thread.

Scavenge: search for and collect (anything usable) from discarded waste.

For once and for all people. Shopping in Lidl or Aldi is not scavenging.

The J Stands for Jay

PCeeeee wrote: »

For the love of God. Again and again in this thread.

Scavenge: search for and collect (anything usable) from discarded waste.

For once and for all people. Shopping in Lidl or Aldi is not scavenging.

The fruit and veg in Aldi is decent, I stopped going to Tesco because so much of theirs is almost entirely inedible.

kylith

My dad, a lorryman, raised a family of 6 in a house with a mortgage, on one wage in the 70s-90s. He and my mum would go away on a sun holiday and then we'd have a family camping holiday.


There's not a hope in hell you could do that now, not in Dublin anyway.

Heres Johnny

I have seen all ends of the spectrum. I worked in financial services for years and carried out thousands of financial planning reviews with people.

I have seen it all from the high earners that know the value of money and have a modest lifestyle, older car, budget phone although usually a nice house and putting money away towards children's futures and their own retirement to the person on minimum wage that borrowed and borrowed and even queued to afford the latest expensive iPhone and genuinely has no scope to plan.

Then there are the vast majority in the middle, good jobs but suffering from lifestyle creep as it's known. Lifestyle creep means no matter how much your earnings rise, your spending rises to meet it.

Newer car, upgraded tv package, that kind of thing so they are no better off than before earnings rose.

We now have internet bills, Spotify subscriptions, lunch and coffee from the local spar, mobile phone bills, sky sports to pay that we didn't before.

However, everyone has scope to improve their situation but very few do. I think its still over 55% of people are not retirement planning at all which is a crazy amount of people.

MRnotlob606

MRnotlob606 wrote: »

What about precarious work? zero-hour contracts, and jobs not paying enough? but no people have haplessly put it down to poor business management because we know that the baby boomers were so good at managing their money they decided to throw it away on grossly over priced houses and create a housing and credit bubble.

I think that you'll find that a lot of baby boomers bought houses in lieu of pensions because of government policies in the 1990s that removed the guarantees that the pensions would actually pay out.

Putting savings into housing and selling when you retire became the norn for a whole group of people, it only really went wrong when some got greedy and bought several with mortgages.

somefeen

whisky_galore wrote: »

Parents were supposed to impart this, why aren't they doing that now?

Plus all of the above is now easily found with the smartphone that almost everyone has in the palm of their hand, there really is no excuse.

Probably because the parents haven't a clue either.
No there is no excuse, plenty of info on net but in my case I didn't even realise I was terrible with money or that how I saw money was screwing me over.
We all know about the lotto winners who go from zero to millions over night and then end up back where they started. I reckon that's because your attitude towards money when you have very little is not compatitable with having a lot.
In my case anyway. Plenty of people get it right from the start to.

Heres Johnny

Heres Johnny wrote: »

However, everyone has scope to improve their situation but very few do. I think its still over 55% of people are not retirement planning at all which is a crazy amount of people.

They're probably the same people who believe we will still have welfare in 2-3 decades from now. Reality doesn't play into it.

I worked as a credit controller for well over a decade, and it was awe-inspiring the lengths that people went to convince themselves (and others) that their income was much more than it was. They needed the newest tech, the reasonably new car (preferably two of them in the household), and the best of the best for their kids. And when their salaries didn't meet their "needs", they signed up for every kind of deal that companies offered without considering the actual costs involved. And then looked surprised when everything (and more) was taken back from them... It's truly shocking how many people sign contracts without reading the terms, blindly believing that the banks and businesses have their best interests in mind for them, or that their stupidity is covered by the law.

My own stupidity was credit cards. Wracked up a fortune in interest, and was forced to ask for help from my family. That cured me. Now, I'm very careful with what I buy and avoid impulse buys like the plague.

Lastly, about things being much better twenty or more years ago... dream on. My first professional job (around 2000) was working as an accounts exec for Esat, and I barely covered rent/living costs in Dublin. My second job was marginally better, and so on. It took time to build up enough experience and skills to warrant the better salaries. Nowadays, people seem to believe that they should graduate and get a great salary from the beginning. The sense of entitlement is staggering.

Idbatterim

Stheno wrote: »

Bad news is that the Midlands is rising even faster than Dublin.

I've a house there that is being sold next year and it was valued recently for 30% more than I expected

Five years ago it would have gone for 125k now it's more than double that

rising quicker in percentage terms maybe! the prices in dublin in actual euro will be rising much quicker!

Idbatterim

Idbatterim wrote: »

rising quicker in percentage terms maybe! the prices in dublin in actual euro will be rising much quicker!

Yes as 20% rise in rents in Longford, would in Euro terms equate to 5% (or less) rise in Dublin.

donegaLroad

Idbatterim wrote: »

rising quicker in percentage terms maybe! the prices in dublin in actual euro will be rising much quicker!

This is one of the main reasons that there is less disposable income. People are mortgaged out of it, and with mortgage interest in Ireland almost double the European average.

19 years ago, I was earning a bit more than I am earning now, I was considering buying a house which was a 4 bed bungalow on a third of an acre. It was on the market for £75k punt, the reason I didn't buy it at the time is because I still wanted to see some of the world, and I didn't want to be tied to a house.

If I went to buy the same house today, I have no doubt that it would be over €200k, and thats still reasonable by today's prices, but wages have not risen proportionately with house prices.

Idbatterim

With the cost of inflation and no increases virtually in welfare (which i agree with) and after tax barely any real wage increases. throw in a few ecb rate increases and things could get very interesting. I wonder what each 1% increase from the ecb would suck out of the economy...

storker

McGaggs wrote: »

The fruit and veg in Aldi is decent, I stopped going to Tesco because so much of theirs is almost entirely inedible.

In my experience the staff in Lidl tend to be far more professional than I've seen in Tesco. The only annoyance about the stuff in Lidl is that you can never be sure if what you want will be there again next time.

Fond memories of that depth-charge-sized tin of turkey ravioli they used to sell years ago. Mmmmmm.....

hurler32 wrote: »

[...] as the young eat their frozen burgers etc

That's terrible. It must be so hard on their teeth too...

namloc1980

McGaggs wrote: »

I don't get this attitude. I avoid having cash because it just disappears without trace. Using cards hurts me straight away. I can see my bank balance instantly dropping, reminding me how far away payday is.

Do you not get your cash from your bank account also?

server down

Heres Johnny wrote: »

I have seen all ends of the spectrum. I worked in financial services for years and carried out thousands of financial planning reviews with people.

I have seen it all from the high earners that know the value of money and have a modest lifestyle, older car, budget phone although usually a nice house and putting money away towards children's futures and their own retirement to the person on minimum wage that borrowed and borrowed and even queued to afford the latest expensive iPhone and genuinely has no scope to plan.

Then there are the vast majority in the middle, good jobs but suffering from lifestyle creep as it's known. Lifestyle creep means no matter how much your earnings rise, your spending rises to meet it.

Newer car, upgraded tv package, that kind of thing so they are no better off than before earnings rose.

We now have internet bills, Spotify subscriptions, lunch and coffee from the local spar, mobile phone bills, sky sports to pay that we didn't before.

However, everyone has scope to improve their situation but very few do. I think its still over 55% of people are not retirement platnning at all which is a crazy amount of people.

So the rich are prudent and the middle income groups profligate. That’s not what I see. Nor is it what was visible in the Celtic tiger when plenty of rich people went bankrupt.

And (once again) how people spend their disposable or discretionary income doesn’t actually change what disposable or discretionary income they have.

Idbatterim

Idbatterim wrote: »

With the cost of inflation and no increases virtually in welfare (which i agree with) and after tax barely any real wage increases. throw in a few ecb rate increases and things could get very interesting. I wonder what each 1% increase from the ecb would suck out of the economy...

Last time they tried to raise interest rates it become one of the triggers that brought about the great recession, people's capacity to consume non-essentials simply evaporated in increased interest payments. Many people are still have jumbo mortgage arrangements and any increase in interest will cause a (smaller) repeat of the last recession.

Pithythefool

Its a titre procedure in process.

Take one drop of black paint (representing the "top%" of the worlds wealth, the majority of Ireland included).

Take a litre of white paint (representing the rest of world's wealth)

Mix together with the magic of globalisation, and the black paint disappears. This is the tip of the iceberg about to hit us over the next 10 years +, that when you equalise everything across the board (planet), the likes of Ireland as a whole takes a severe nosedive in terms of quality of life.

These vague hints of disparity, a growing unease with stability and things seeming more difficult/less attainable are just the start.

As someone else said earlier, you want the cheapest prices, you end up pulling the rug out from underneath yourself, now you need even cheaper prices, and so on. A vicious circle that cycles downwards, because at the end of the day an irish person/business just cannot compete with the economic realities of, say, china/india.

Unless, of course, you lower yourself to the quality of life enjoyed by those in china or india, which is precisely where we are heading.

Or, more quickly said, unfettered and unregulated capitalism.

kerryjack

Interesting tread anyone willing to through up a few figures I will start of and ye can give me feed back on how we are doing ok
1 income family of 6 take home 3200 a month thats wages and CB
Out goings are
Mortgage 420
Health insurance 140
2 car insurance 100
Life insurance 22
House insurance 40
ESB 92
Heating 100
Broadband 45
1 phone 30
Property tax 25
We shop in aldi 600
Total 1614
We are left with disposable income of about 1600 which is not too bad could be worse I reckon.

Pithythefool

Pithythefool wrote: »

Its a titre procedure in process.

Take one drop of black paint (representing the "top%" of the worlds wealth, the majority of Ireland included).

Take a litre of white paint (representing the rest of world's wealth)

Mix together with the magic of globalisation, and the black paint disappears. This is the tip of the iceberg about to hit us over the next 10 years +, that when you equalise everything across the board (planet), the likes of Ireland as a whole takes a severe nosedive in terms of quality of life.

These vague hints of disparity, a growing unease with stability and things seeming more difficult/less attainable are just the start.

As someone else said earlier, you want the cheapest prices, you end up pulling the rug out from underneath yourself, now you need even cheaper prices, and so on. A vicious circle that cycles downwards, because at the end of the day an irish person/business just cannot compete with the economic realities of, say, china/india.

Unless, of course, you lower yourself to the quality of life enjoyed by those in china or india, which is precisely where we are heading.

Or, more quickly said, unfettered and unregulated capitalism.

In actual fact there is also a tin of grey paint that represents the middle income earners (in global terms the remainder of the "western" population) that is being spun to separate some of the the black paint out to combine with the tiny drop of black paint and the remainder is mixed with the white.

In reality the wealth transfer is from the middle to the top and the bottom.

Wanderer78

Deleted User wrote: »

In actual fact there is also a tin of grey paint that represents the middle income earners (in global terms the remainder of the "western" population) that is being spun to separate some of the the black paint out to combine with the tiny drop of black paint and the remainder is mixed with the white.

In reality the wealth transfer is from the middle to the top and the bottom.

id argue about the bottom, but id completely agree with the middle getting hammered. enough is enough with this crap

SCOOP 64

kerryjack wrote: »

Interesting tread anyone willing to through up a few figures I will start of and ye can give me feed back on how we are doing ok
1 income family of 6 take home 3200 a month thats wages and CB
Out goings are
Mortgage 420
Health insurance 140
2 car insurance 100
Life insurance 22
House insurance 40
ESB 92
Heating 100
Broadband 45
1 phone 30
Property tax 25
We shop in aldi 600
Total 1614
We are left with disposable income of about 1600 which is not too bad could be worse I reckon.

One thing you got going for you, that mortgage of €420.

kylith

SCOOP 64 wrote: »

One thing you got going for you, that mortgage of €420.

Could triple that, depending on area

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

id argue about the bottom, but id completely agree with the middle getting hammered. enough is enough with this crap

I was thinking about Chinese & Indian factory workers who are earning an income for the first time ever.

Pithythefool

Deleted User wrote: »

In actual fact there is also a tin of grey paint that represents the middle income earners (in global terms the remainder of the "western" population) that is being spun to separate some of the the black paint out to combine with the tiny drop of black paint and the remainder is mixed with the white.

In reality the wealth transfer is from the middle to the top and the bottom.

Theres more picking to be had from the middle class of course, but the vast majority is from the lower paid.

Would you rather 10 euro a day from 100 people, or 1 euro a day from 10'000 people?

Better yet, just take it all. According to my calculations on the paint index of wealth, better than anything the ILO have, I'd say there is 1 drop of black paint, a liter of grey paint, and a swimming pool of white paint.

It all goes white by mixing, regardless.

kylith

kylith wrote: »

Could triple that, depending on area

and when the house was bought, there are many who bought in the 1990s and are approaching the end of a $100 or less a month mortgage plus quite a few on tiger mortgages that could easily be $1000 per month.

Wanderer78

Deleted User wrote: »

I was thinking about Chinese & Indian factory workers who are earning an income for the first time ever.

interesting twist, met an Indian business owner in Singapore a few years ago, said he was struggling to run his business, couldnt compete with the Chinese. found it shocking at the time

Pithythefool

Deleted User wrote: »

I was thinking about Chinese & Indian factory workers who are earning an income for the first time ever.

I think the reality of the matter is that nobody can even somewhat accurately determine average wages or labour division across the world. Nobody!

There are very many people that don't get money at all, or its equivalent. You can also argue the PPP thing (purchasing power parity) that adjusts what a euro will buy you in different environments (like the "big mac" economy).

The problem with PPP is that it just is NOT comparable on a world scale. You can say that a Chinese person can afford a house after 10 years worth of wages, but what is not counted is the quality of the house. Or healthcare, or education etc.

But qualitatively speaking, everyone is feeding upwards in terms of production. And none of it bodes well.

Pithythefool

Pithythefool wrote: »

I think the reality of the matter is that nobody can even somewhat accurately determine average wages or labour division across the world. Nobody!

Until you've been to India or China, it's really quite difficult to imagine the sheer levels of poverty that a rather hefty portion of the world population has to live through. I've seen literally thousands of people standing in a street hoping to be picked for construction work or any other temp work that might be available, and the wages are truly tiny.

I'd agree with you than averages mean squat in these kinds of situations.

On a side note, when I entered China in 2010, I could buy a bowl of noodles with a bit of beef from a street vendor for 4-5 RMB. When I left this year, it would be difficult to find the same for 11 RMB. Cost of living has risen quite a bit even with the government trying to keep the costs down (although their 'encouragement' for people to move to the cities has had the side effect of fewer people on the farms for growing food, generally increasing the costs overall in the cities). Rents have doubled or tripled also in most city areas too, including the coffin type apartments (just room for a single bed in the room and the door doesn't open fully. Externally shared toilets too. )

The J Stands for Jay

namloc1980 wrote: »

Do you not get your cash from your bank account also?

Why would I do that?

Doltanian

Open borders and immigrant labour is entirely responsible for this, if Ireland left the EU we would be far better off to restrict the movement of people into the country. Basically the millionaire class have made a fortune and are the upper middle class, the middle class in Ireland has shrunk enormously while the working poor are now the worst off. The welfare scrounger class have better lives than the working poor and you'd want €20/hr or more to pay for a house and rear a family nowadays but companies won't pay that when some Eastern European or South American fraudulent English Language Student will work it for peanuts. Meanwhile families are split apart as people with enough cop on go to places like Australia to forge a new life because of what is happening here.

For me my solution is:

End free movement and leave the EU and negotiate free trade, Free Trade was what the EU was supposed to be about.

Scrap and cut back on benefits enormously, not Irish then no benefits, Irish and on benefits, kicked out on ass after 6 months, sink or swim, end the days of money for nothing.

End all social housing, why should the middle class and working poor killing themselves up at 5am and 6am commuting long journeys for low wages be swamped in debt to buy a house whilst those on the welfare get it for free.

Encourage highly skilled immigration from countries that speak English and share cultural and religious identity. e.g. Nurses from the Philippines. If your non-EU and not skilled then you have no business in Ireland.

What has happened is that crony capitalists control the political system and keep control of it through welfare by paying votes with crumbs from the table. What I would want is real capitalism dog eat dog with minimal state involvement on a conservative right wing basis.

Reform taxation and make business and the rich pay their share, I'm not advocating marxism but what is needed is fairness where corporate companies pay practically nothing yet the working poor pay far more proportionately. Tax avoidance and loopholes should all be closed off, cutting taxes for the small man and making the rich pay slightly more. Cutting Govt waste spending would allow for this. I could write alot more but its too late at night.

eurasian

We are a couple with no children and living in Cork in our own house. Just a few numbers of a one months average spendings:

Food 500 (no aldi or lidl, we shop in Dunnes, Tesco and MS)
Utilities (gas/electricity/rubbish) 150
Transport 100
Phone/Internet 50
Going out 200

Total a grand on average. One income. Minimum wage. Full time.
Remaining 300 go into savings account.

No, we dont buy new phones every year (my phone is 5 years old), spend very little on clothes and foreign travel and ignore Black fridays and Christmas hysterias. And we love to cook and eat at home.

The housing is the problem really.
Another problem is the lack of budgeting and managing your income. I wish we had more money coming every month but I feel it wouldn't change our habits dramatically and most of it would probably end on that regular saver.

jimmycrackcorm

[

hurler32 wrote:

This post had been deleted.

Shortly after the boom collapse I heard a Tiler on the radio giving it that he couldn't make 4k a month.

Permabear wrote:

This post has been deleted.

I almost always agree with your opinions as very sensible PB, but I'm surprised you think it's beneficial that young people today are forced into massive mortgages and that you think the governed and central bank should be supporting that.

There's no reason why the state can't provide the framework that allows for cheaper housing for everyone and still allow for those who wish to pay a premium.

pilly

eurasian wrote:

Food 500 (no aldi or lidl, we shop in Dunnes, Tesco and MS) Utilities (gas/electricity/rubbish) 150 Transport 100 Phone/Internet 50 Going out 200

No mortgage?

A lack of mortgage or rent is a real deal breaker when it comes to having a sustainable lifestyle on a minimum wage.

BuboBubo

I'm in an older demographic than most of the posters on this I'm guessing (40's).

The one thing that really affected my spending power is that bloody USC.

That was money I spent on little things like magazines, coffees, 99's etc. The introduction of USC killed off a lot of small local businesses in my honest opinion.

I shop in Aldi, have a mortgage, a car, and feck all disposable income.

BillyBobBS

grahambo wrote: »

This is par for the course all over the country and indeed the world.

I'm just out of a long term relationship (had a kid and mortgage with the other person)
I ended up moving out, and I'm living back at home because I literally cannot afford to rent a place....

I'm 34 years old with a very good Job....

15 years ago I'd have been able to at least get somewhere to rent at a decent price.
It's pathetic.


There needs to be a world war to force the distribution of wealth away from the 1%'ers to the average Joe.
IE a massive destruction of wealth

Look at the US in the 50's, 60's, 70's and 80's. The quality of life they had at the time was the "American Dream", no one has that now.

As long as the 1%er's have the rest fighting over scraps and each other and the 99% can't see that nothing will change.

Until people organize and start electing politicians who actually view the good of the many over the good of the few the situation will continue to get worse.

BillyBobBS

Doltanian wrote: »

Open borders and immigrant labour is entirely responsible for this, if Ireland left the EU we would be far better off to restrict the movement of people into the country. Basically the millionaire class have made a fortune and are the upper middle class, the middle class in Ireland has shrunk enormously while the working poor are now the worst off. The welfare scrounger class have better lives than the working poor and you'd want €20/hr or more to pay for a house and rear a family nowadays but companies won't pay that when some Eastern European or South American fraudulent English Language Student will work it for peanuts. Meanwhile families are split apart as people with enough cop on go to places like Australia to forge a new life because of what is happening here.

For me my solution is:

End free movement and leave the EU and negotiate free trade, Free Trade was what the EU was supposed to be about.

Scrap and cut back on benefits enormously, not Irish then no benefits, Irish and on benefits, kicked out on ass after 6 months, sink or swim, end the days of money for nothing.

End all social housing, why should the middle class and working poor killing themselves up at 5am and 6am commuting long journeys for low wages be swamped in debt to buy a house whilst those on the welfare get it for free.

Encourage highly skilled immigration from countries that speak English and share cultural and religious identity. e.g. Nurses from the Philippines. If your non-EU and not skilled then you have no business in Ireland.

What has happened is that crony capitalists control the political system and keep control of it through welfare by paying votes with crumbs from the table. What I would want is real capitalism dog eat dog with minimal state involvement on a conservative right wing basis.

Reform taxation and make business and the rich pay their share, I'm not advocating marxism but what is needed is fairness where corporate companies pay practically nothing yet the working poor pay far more proportionately. Tax avoidance and loopholes should all be closed off, cutting taxes for the small man and making the rich pay slightly more. Cutting Govt waste spending would allow for this. I could write alot more but its too late at night.

You do realize most people who avail of social housing are working poor also and work long hours for peanuts. Any civilized society needs social housing and one of the biggest problems we have in Ireland is the lack of it.

But well done let's blame it on immigrants and people in social housing yeah they are the real problem :rolleyes:

pilly

Agreed. It was supposed to be a temporary measure and like all taxes turned permanent.

hurler32

A good example of the race to the bottom and the rich wanting to be richer ..
A factory near me on a substantial sized site employed a groundsman - landscaper about 45k pa , always had the place looking well etc .
Retired lately and now this company who are very profitable are looking for a replacement on just above minimum wage 22K per annum ...Very little interest locally but I guess they will get an Albanian or Romanian to do it ,scavenge in Lidl each week and send home 50 euro every week?
The company owners can put the 26K towards one of their racehorses and perhaps win more money ?
Paying minimum wage is the new standard whilst the rich get richer ? Be nothing in Ireland soon only foreigners in track suits with their Lidl shopping bags 😩... and of course a couple of hundred billionaires laughing at the peasants ?

BillyBobBS

hurler32 wrote: »

A good example of the race to the bottom and the rich wanting to be richer ..
A factory near me on a substantial sized site employed a groundsman - landscaper about 45k pa , always had the place looking well etc .
Retired lately and now this company who are very profitable are looking for a replacement on just above minimum wage 22K per annum ...Very little interest locally but I guess they will get an Albanian or Romanian to do it ,scavenge in Lidl each week and send home 50 euro every week?
The company owners can put the 26K towards one of their racehorses and perhaps win more money ?
Paying minimum wage is the new standard whilst the rich get richer ? Be nothing in Ireland soon only foreigners in track suits with their Lidl shopping bags ��... and of course a couple of hundred billionaires laughing at the peasants ?

Yeah it's a real race to the bottom out there but i wouldn't blame immigrants tbh i'd do the same if i where them. It's the politicians fault as they are in the back pocket of big business and IBEC. The media also play a massive role as in this country media is basically a mouthpiece for parts of the establishment. One or two big players run the show and tell us all what to think and do.

Keep voting for the same people and we will keep seeing the same results.

Allinall

hurler32 wrote: »

A good example of the race to the bottom and the rich wanting to be richer ..
A factory near me on a substantial sized site employed a groundsman - landscaper about 45k pa , always had the place looking well etc .
Retired lately and now this company who are very profitable are looking for a replacement on just above minimum wage 22K per annum ...Very little interest locally but I guess they will get an Albanian or Romanian to do it ,scavenge in Lidl each week and send home 50 euro every week?
The company owners can put the 26K towards one of their racehorses and perhaps win more money ?
Paying minimum wage is the new standard whilst the rich get richer ? Be nothing in Ireland soon only foreigners in track suits with their Lidl shopping bags 😩... and of course a couple of hundred billionaires laughing at the peasants ?

The grounds man that retired.

Where did he shop?

donegaLroad

Allinall wrote: »

The grounds man that retired.

Where did he shop?

Maybe Woodies :-)

All jokes aside though, a lot of people's disposable income have been decimated by the universal social charge, as a previous poster just mentioned.

hurler32

hurler32 wrote: »

A good example of the race to the bottom and the rich wanting to be richer ..
A factory near me on a substantial sized site employed a groundsman - landscaper about 45k pa , always had the place looking well etc .
Retired lately and now this company who are very profitable are looking for a replacement on just above minimum wage 22K per annum ...

I should let this go, but I'll bite.

How do you know the factory is profitable? The organisational ownership of the company? Is it a private or public company? etc.

Lowering the salary of the job could be down to cost-saving measures. And honestly, I don't see why lowering the salary amount after the previous employee left is an issue.

Very little interest locally but I guess they will get an Albanian or Romanian to do it ,scavenge in Lidl each week and send home 50 euro every week?

Very little interest locally, but you're bothered that an immigrant takes the work?

The company owners can put the 26K towards one of their racehorses and perhaps win more money ?

It's their money... I'm sure they can decide where to spend it. Would you be happy with posters on boards deciding where you spend yours?

Paying minimum wage is the new standard whilst the rich get richer ? Be nothing in Ireland soon only foreigners in track suits with their Lidl shopping bags ��... and of course a couple of hundred billionaires laughing at the peasants ?

Utterly Bizarre. a couple of hundred billionaires in Ireland? Exaggerating a bit, perhaps?

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

I should let this go, but I'll bite.

How do you know the factory is profitable? The organisational ownership of the company? Is it a private or public company? etc.

Lowering the salary of the job could be down to cost-saving measures. And honestly, I don't see why lowering the salary amount after the previous employee left is an issue.



Very little interest locally, but you're bothered that an immigrant takes the work?



It's their money... I'm sure they can decide where to spend it. Would you be happy with posters on boards deciding where you spend yours?



Utterly Bizarre. a couple of hundred billionaires in Ireland? Exaggerating a bit, perhaps?

As many have already stated, it's a race to the bottom, undercutting the wages of established employees, now locals who want a decent standard of living won't be able to achieve such on the wages offered. The migrant on the other hand has set his sights very low and can achieve that as they only intend to stay a short while.

Sierra Oscar

pilly wrote: »

Agreed. It was supposed to be a temporary measure and like all taxes turned permanent.

It was never really meant to be temporary in nature though. Some politicians sold it like that, but in reality it could never have been temporary. The USC essentially was just an amalgamation of the Income Levy and Health Levy, with a hike over a few years thrown in for good measure.

The Income Levy and Health Levy have been around for decades so completely abolishing the USC is pretty much impossible.

Permabear

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