Cork Crash/Traffic thread

D'Agger

Ludo wrote: »

I would respectfully disagree here I must say. If I am driving along at 120 and come across a string of cars in the overtaking lane at 110, as far as I know I am not allowed pass them on the left.
Only time to pass on the left as far as I learned was in congested slow moving traffic.

Yes the guy at the front of the line of cars in the overtaking lane is an a-hole and should move in, but AFAIK that doesn't mean undertaking is allowed. 2 wrongs and all that.
I may be completely wrong but IMHO lane-hogging is wrong but passing at speed on the left is dangerous (even if you are under the limit).

Quick search found this thread: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055922731

Looks like a hot topic in the motoring forum every so often :-)

munstermagic11 wrote: »

In your scenario, it probably is dangerous and unnecessary.
But if the person is doing 70 or 80? Maybe slower (I have come across such people)?
If you continue on and drive past them on the left, I don't believe it's any more dangerous than a backlog of traffic on two lanes (and a lot of frustrated drivers) to match their speed.

Difficult to capture or run through every possibility in such cases of course; but unless you are reckless I couldn't see a conviction.

The focus here should be on the person in the over taking lane. It's a prime example of a broken system where there are so many people on the road that shouldn't be. Cars can be tested every year by the NCT, but the person driving it gets tested once and then a few decades later. Lack of enforcement is another problem.

I agree with both of you here. If I'm in the overtaking lane, and I'm being held up, then I'll flash, blast the horn, raise awareness to the car in front that he's doing something wrong. Ideally, they'll figure out that perhaps they should be in the other lane. Sometimes you get fúckers who will realise, and won't pull in anyway...but what really galls me, is if I'm behind a car like this, I flash the lights or beep - and before that car can pull in, you have cars undertaking at speed, then also blaring the horn. Patience is required and it's sorely lacking from the majority on our roads, myself included at times.

The issue is ultimately drivers, one test isn't enough and a review of theory and practical driving needs to be done every 5 years. They've updated the parameters to be met in order to get your full license which will hopefully breed a new generation of drivers, but the old school need to be bucked up also. It would create jobs, generate income & make the roads safer.

I heard some reports this week on the radio about 2017 being the best year for road death numbers in a long time. The additional reform being called for? tougher sanctions for those caught speeding - one strike and you're out stuff.

The issue for me lies in the mentality of driving - you're in a bubble, buckled into your own optimism bias (Listen to George Carlin on driving). Maybe this is pie in the sky - but I see the RSA ads for speeding and I don't see myself - if they showed me a guy cursing in traffic, calling another motorist a díckhead, or rambling about how incorrectly somebody is driving then I'd see myself - they should promote the fact that they're our roads and actively look for feedback on what's bothering people on our roads.

I've said before that with big data tools available to us, there's no excuse why the nation can't be asked a question and the results be used to target certain problems. Say the RSA launched a media campaign called #OurRoads - everybody sends in what they think is the biggest problem on Irish roads, advertise for people to let them know. Then take the results and push targeted campaigns for certain areas i.e. Dublin - the overtaking lane problem is probably larger there than in Kerry, maybe in Kerry indicating isn't done enough - then push your adverts to those areas via local radio or advertising boards or on google feeds etc.

Somebody read that there and burst my idealist bubble :pac:

j8wk2feszrnpao

D'Agger wrote: »

Somebody read that there and burst my idealist bubble :pac:

You make a lot of good points.
A big problem is those in charge of the system and then the enforcement when changes are made.
For example, you mention an increase in penalty points for an offense. Sounds great, and is a cheap option without any real work involved. But will there be an increased Gardai presence on the road to enforce it, speed vans actually in areas where there are accidents (rather than handy 'catchment' areas), addition speed bumps in required areas to get people to slow down, retesting of drivers who have know idea of what an overtaking lane is ........

D'Agger

munstermagic11 wrote: »

You make a lot of good points.
A big problem is those in charge of the system and then the enforcement when changes are made.
For example, you mention an increase in penalty points for an offense. Sounds great, and is a cheap option without any real work involved. But will there be an increased Gardai presence on the road to enforce it, speed vans actually in areas where there are accidents (rather than handy 'catchment' areas), addition speed bumps in required areas to get people to slow down, retesting of drivers who have know idea of what an overtaking lane is ........

I don't think increasing penalty points is the answer - I referenced that as what I heard on the radio - I think people in power are determined to push harsher sentences/penalties when it's my belief that it's a mentality shift that's required.

There would be an increased cost in looking to have people re-tested but I think it's better than beefing up a traffic corps. Yes people need policing, but prevention is better than cure. If you've better educated, more relaxed drivers on the road, then you reduce the problem - I'm under no illusions that you'll eradicate it however.

whisky_galore

D'Agger wrote: »

I don't think increasing penalty points is the answer - I referenced that as what I heard on the radio - I think people in power are determined to push harsher sentences/penalties when it's my belief that it's a mentality shift that's required.

There would be an increased cost in looking to have people re-tested but I think it's better than beefing up a traffic corps. Yes people need policing, but prevention is better than cure. If you've better educated, more relaxed drivers on the road, then you reduce the problem - I'm under no illusions that you'll eradicate it however.

There's an awful lot of people who have clearly forgotten all the rules of the road since their driving instruction and test and then we have those older drivers who got their driving licences out of a cereal packet without doing any test at all.

walsh08

Lads,don't get me started on the amount of poor driving out there.
I unfortunately have to use the south ring road for work most days.
Just out of safety I stick to the exact speed limit and always leave plenty of room between myself and the vehicles in front of me.



The amount of people who overtake me or take advantage of the gap I leave between myself and the preceding vehicle is unbelievable.And don't get me started on the tailgaters who think that driving right up behind you is going to get you to break the limit especially on quieter roads of 50km/hr limit.


Especially in busier places eg. when you come down Forge Hill and turn left. Have met some nutters on that road.
If someone does this to me I slow things right down to 45...maybe even 40 depending on their driving.
I genuinely cannot comprehend people who rush to work every day.I leave so much spare time to arrive safely and on time.


One fella took the biscuit there though recently.Was going from Maryborough Woods to Carrigaline,again sticking right to the limit along the Carrigaline road and he tailgated me before getting really annoyed on the most dangerous part of the road by the nursing home.

He proceeded to overtake me on the bend but what he didn't see was the cyclist round the bend in front of him and the car coming towards us from the opposite direction seconds later.

All to sit in the ever present queue of traffic going towards Carrigaline.Idiot almost killed us all.Kicking myself I din't have a dashcam.

Dbu

walsh08 wrote: »

Lads,don't get me started on the amount of poor driving out there.
I unfortunately have to use the south ring road for work most days.
Just out of safety I stick to the exact speed limit and always leave plenty of room between myself and the vehicles in front of me.



The amount of people who overtake me or take advantage of the gap I leave between myself and the preceding vehicle is unbelievable.And don't get me started on the tailgaters who think that driving right up behind you is going to get you to break the limit especially on quieter roads of 50km/hr limit.


Especially in busier places eg. when you come down Forge Hill and turn left. Have met some nutters on that road.
If someone does this to me I slow things right down to 45...maybe even 40 depending on their driving.
I genuinely cannot comprehend people who rush to work every day.I leave so much spare time to arrive safely and on time.


One fella took the biscuit there though recently.Was going from Maryborough Woods to Carrigaline,again sticking right to the limit along the Carrigaline road and he tailgated me before getting really annoyed on the most dangerous part of the road by the nursing home.

He proceeded to overtake me on the bend but what he didn't see was the cyclist round the bend in front of him and the car coming towards us from the opposite direction seconds later.

All to sit in the ever present queue of traffic going towards Carrigaline.Idiot almost killed us all.Kicking myself I din't have a dashcam.

And you think this is responsible driving? Stupid actions like this can be the cause of an accident

TheChizler

Dbu wrote: »

And you think this is responsible driving? Stupid actions like this can be the cause of an accident

Reducing speed cause someone is already right up your arse on a winding road?

If anyone's going to cause an accident it's them and if it happens you're better off crashing slower. 40 km/h isn't exactly slow on that road anyway.

j8wk2feszrnpao

TheChizler wrote: »

Reducing speed cause someone is already right up your arse on a winding road?

If anyone's going to cause an accident it's them and if it happens you're better off crashing slower. 40 km/h isn't exactly slow on that road anyway.

Isn't the road 80kph?
Not saying you need to hit the limit, but driving at 1/2, just to piss off the person behind them (and maybe others), isn't safe driving. Not excusing the person driving up their arse, but two wrongs.....

D'Agger

Dbu wrote: »

And you think this is responsible driving? Stupid actions like this can be the cause of an accident

This is what I meant when I was banging on about the 'mentality' of driving

Somebody drives behind you too closely and they're a maniac, and you need to slow down to teach them a lesson because you're the master of this road. This mentality is strikingly similar to the man/woman who wants to drive faster, has a slow driver in front and drives too close because he's the master of the road and you should get out of the way/let them pass.

Neither party is in the right, in fact, both are wrong.

If you're upset by the proximity of the driver behind you, pull in if the opportunity arises and let the car(s) pass. If you're in a rush and encounter a slow driver, have patience and trust that they will pull in eventually. Drivers need to be taught how to respect each other on the roads, this isn't done, it isn't even mentioned.

Road rage and forceful driving causes people to increase speeds and take unnecessary risks - this is something that needs to be covered before we allow people to take to the roads and even then that won't be enough

TheChizler

D'Agger wrote: »

This is what I meant when I was banging on about the 'mentality' of driving

Somebody drives behind you too closely and they're a maniac, and you need to slow down to teach them a lesson because you're the master of this road.

Who said anything about teaching them a lesson or intentionally pissing them off? On a thing winding road where you're going to have to slow down for corners anyway it's surely better to slow down in advance so the idiot behind you doesn't plough into you when you have to slow down suddenly. It's self preservation, not being the master of the road. Besides, much easier for them to pass you if you're going slower.

j8wk2feszrnpao

TheChizler wrote: »

Who said anything about teaching them a lesson or intentionally pissing them off?

walsh08 wrote: »

I slow things right down to 45...maybe even 40

What else is that trying to achieve?

TheChizler

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Isn't the road 80kph?
Not saying you need to hit the limit, but driving at 1/2, just to piss off the person behind them (and maybe others), isn't safe driving. Not excusing the person driving up their arse, but two wrongs.....

TheChizler

munstermagic11 wrote: »

What else is that trying to achieve?

Driving safely on a steep road with blind bends with no footpath and regularly has people pushing buggies in sections where two cars should slow down to pass?

j8wk2feszrnpao

TheChizler wrote: »

Ah, I was thinking of a different road.

j8wk2feszrnpao

TheChizler wrote: »

Driving safely on a steep road with blind bends with no footpath and regularly has people pushing buggies in sections where two cars should slow down to pass?

Wait, they aren't driving safely. They are intentionally slowing down, cause someone is up their arse. They aren't slowing down cause the road is unsafe, it's to piss off the person behind them.

boardsuser1

I’d there a crash in around the tunnel?

backed up beyond the Mahon exit at 3.20pm.

j8wk2feszrnpao

TheChizler wrote: »

That's Forge Hill, I think they meant Pouladuff Road (which may be 50kph anyway, been a while since I was on it).

TheChizler

munstermagic11 wrote: »

That's Forge Hill, I think they meant Pouladuff Road (which may be 50kph anyway, been a while since I was on it).

Ah possibly, I think it's 50 for a good bit though.

ShamoBuc

Cork Truck Driver wrote: »

I’d there a crash in around the tunnel?

backed up beyond the Mahon exit at 3.20pm.

Just passed through the tunnel. Fella in a ford s-max, just outside the tunnel is broken down in the inner most left hand lane, Glanmire lane, slowing things down but still moving ok, that will change in the next hour if he is still there though.

Roger Hassenforder

D'Agger wrote: »

If you're upset by the proximity of the driver behind you, pull in if the opportunity arises and let the car(s) pass. If you're in a rush and encounter a slow driver, have patience and trust that they will pull in eventually. Drivers need to be taught how to respect each other on the roads, this isn't done, it isn't even mentioned.

While its the recommended thing to do, its only rewarding the fcukers though. He/she gets past you, shoots on up the road to get stuck behind the next car, and repeats their behaviour relying on peoples manners while having none themselves.
Im no speed merchant/miss daisey, but If theres someone up my hole, i wouldnt be pulling in for them, unless there was something seriousky reckless about them.
Agree with the rest of your post tho, people just dont respect other road users, be it cyclists, pedestrians, cars etc.

Roger Hassenforder

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Just passed through the tunnel. Fella in a ford s-max, just outside the tunnel is broken down in the inner most left hand lane, Glanmire lane, slowing things down but still moving ok, that will change in the next hour if he is still there though.

Smax.
Poor fcuker probably with a car full of kids, antlers and a red nose.

boardsuser1

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Just passed through the tunnel. Fella in a ford s-max, just outside the tunnel is broken down in the inner most left hand lane, Glanmire lane, slowing things down but still moving ok, that will change in the next hour if he is still there though.

It was very heavy, bad beyond the Douglas exit when I was heading for Ballincollig, just shows how something minor can wreak havoc

who_me

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Wait, they aren't driving safely. They are intentionally slowing down, cause someone is up their arse. They aren't slowing down cause the road is unsafe, it's to piss off the person behind them.

The person driving behind is driving unsafely, but not allowing enough distance for safe braking.

I might do exactly the same if someone were tucked in right behind me, slow down gradually to a speed where the person behind can brake safely. If they're risking rear-ending me, better it happens at low speed than high. Nothing to do with pissing off the person behind.

j8wk2feszrnpao

who_me wrote: »

The person driving behind is driving unsafely, but not allowing enough distance for safe braking.

I might do exactly the same if someone were tucked in right behind me, slow down gradually to a speed where the person behind can brake safely. If they're risking rear-ending me, better it happens at low speed than high. Nothing to do with pissing off the person behind.

They are driving dangerously. But so are you if you are slowing down just to “control” the person behind you.

whisky_galore

It's not your job to control behaviour or to 'teach lessons' unless you're in the Garda Traffic Corps.

Roger Hassenforder

munstermagic11 wrote: »

They are driving dangerously. But so are you if you are slowing down just to “control” the person behind you.

in fairness MM, reducing speed because because someone is up your hole isn't dangerous driving. jamming on the brakes in corners might see you done for without due care/consideration. You're controlling "him" to the extent of letting him know his driving is unacceptable.

when someone is up your arse on single carriageway, what are your options?
Slow down to let him pass easier...
Speed up and hope to maintain greater distance...
Pull over when safe...(onto a hard shoulder...) and allow pass.

If someone is behind me they can pass when its safe, I'll even tinkle an indicator when I can see its safe, and drop my speed a little to give him a chance. Until then and they're up my arse, they can fcuk right off!

j8wk2feszrnpao

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

If someone is behind me they can pass when its safe, I'll even tinkle an indicator when I can see its safe, and drop my speed a little to give him a chance. Until then and they're up my arse, they can fcuk right off!

That's kinda how I approach it. If I'm driving to the speed limit, and no where to let them pass, then I drive on.
I don't slow down to control their driving, risk agitating them further to perform some type of dangerous overtaking. If someone wants to play Garda, then get a dash-cam and report them.

whisky_galore

Multi vehicle collision this evening...back to 'normal' it would seem.

kub

whisky_galore wrote: »

It's not your job to control behaviour or to 'teach lessons' unless you're in the Garda Traffic Corps.

You are right, but its not only the Traffic Corp, any Garda for that matter.

ofcork

They will have to do something about grenville place by the mercy a&e ambulance backed in there and we in traffic behind a truck which couldn't pass,driver had to get the ambulance driver to move.