Fodder Crisis

Keepgrowing

kevthegaff wrote: »

How much a ton?

175/tonne I think. I’ll check in am

mengele

Keepgrowing wrote: »

175/tonne I think. I’ll check in am

Is there a minimum you would have to order. It would need to be kept in a dry shed so.

Keepgrowing

mengele wrote: »

Is there a minimum you would have to order. It would need to be kept in a dry shed so.

Must be kept dry.

stretch film

mengele wrote: »

Is there a minimum you would have to order. It would need to be kept in a dry shed so.

Def kept dry .
Read somewhere there are issues with it when wet.

High bike

Keepgrowing wrote: »

Must be kept dry.

What feed value is in it??

mahoney_j

High bike wrote: »

What feed value is in it??

Frig all in a ration or nut u wouldn’t want it’s inclusion as it’s merly a filler ,however it worked ok for lads thru last years drought and stretching silage over winter

Bass Reeves

High bike wrote: »

What feed value is in it??

Palm Kernel is according to GP feeds
89%DM,
12.7%ME
17.9% crude protein
3.9% Starch
1% sugars

It more than likly varies I taught it was about 15%P, ME looks very good. It is a Hi protein fibres source with low sugar content. I think Kerry group imported it last Autumn but it was costing 220ish/ton for 10 ton loads tipped in the yard. You can buy from most millers. Not sure what you would mix it with if going into a bin or if you can Nut or Cube it. Nut or cubing should cost about 15/ton but more than likely something like molasses would need to be added. If looking for smaller amounts 4-5 ton loads ring local miller and get a price. Consider going 50/50 with maize. This would give you a feed as follows not sure of the price of maize but it is cheaper than barley

89%DM,
13.6%ME
13.7% crude protein
36% Starch
1% sugars

Another options better if blowing into a bin is adding soya hulls but hullls are expensive this winter AFAIK.

89%DM,
12.3%ME
14.7% crude protein
4.5% Starch
0.5% sugars

TBH if blowing into a bin I would consider nutting it for an extra 15/ton. Having said that if you will be feeding it fast (emptying the bin in 3-4 weeks it should be ok) Adding citrus pulp would be another option. Ring any good independent merchant and they should be able to advise you on the different options

I says

Silage count done am fine till last week of March, if shed stays full otherwise if spring is alright cattle will be turned out from 1st of March in batches if co diction’s allow

Bass Reeves

Checked the price of Palm Kernel today. It 210/ton for half loads and 225/ton for 4-5 ton blown into a bin that is from Kerry group similar to last Autumn

Bass Reeves

Checked ground temperature today it is slightly above 6C. Expect growth this week did a farm walk covers are quite good. Looking at a turn out day in 2 weeks time. Expect to turn out over 40% of cattle then expect to turn rest out before Mid March. Some serious covers on the farm only thing is I do not think DM is as high as other years. No brown tip on the leaves to any extent. Have about 20% of the farm that did not get Urea expect to spread on that this week.

Timmaay

Near perfect utilitiization at least though, and very little poaching, unlike the whole of last spring.

Mooooo

Timmaay wrote: »

Near perfect utilitiization at least though, and very little poaching, unlike the whole of last spring.

A bit of poaching here and cleanout not great but I may be in too high a cover. Heavier ground was grazed around Oct 20 but good growth has a high cover on it. Was trying to get some of it now as March may come wet or dry. I'd say I will pull out and head for the drier ground to get thru covers.

Timmaay

I drove by at least 5 local farms today with with zero stock out, but loads of big covers of grass. After the whole panic all last year are they all now trying to just use up fodder ha?

dzer2

Ah no they are building up cover for the drought

Mooooo

Timmaay wrote: »

I drove by at least 5 local farms today with with zero stock out, but loads of big covers of grass. After the whole panic all last year are they all now trying to just use up fodder ha?

A lot of lads delayed calving a week or two so numbers may not be there. Edit fcuking covered me phone in iodone

whelan2

Timmaay wrote: »

I drove by at least 5 local farms today with with zero stock out, but loads of big covers of grass. After the whole panic all last year are they all now trying to just use up fodder ha?

They are probably all saying that looper Timmaay has his cows out again, he'll have no grass when he needs it

Timmaay

Mooooo wrote: »

A lot of lads delayed calving a week or two so numbers may not be there. Edit fcuking covered me phone in iodone

3 of them are in winter milk..

Bass Reeves

Timmaay wrote: »

I drove by at least 5 local farms today with with zero stock out, but loads of big covers of grass. After the whole panic all last year are they all now trying to just use up fodder ha?

I am like that this year. As a drystock farmer when they go out 100% of diet will be grass. I have an issue this year in that I am away for two weeks in April so do not want to leave lad looking after the p!ace with a grass issue.

Say my name

Timmaay wrote: »

I drove by at least 5 local farms today with with zero stock out, but loads of big covers of grass. After the whole panic all last year are they all now trying to just use up fodder ha?

Everyone has stock being let out around this area. Some as far as I can see never even put them in a shed yet.
There's one lad has the milkers out night and day now. Now he's the talk of the parish...

There's some serious grass growers about though. You'd be miles trailing behind them. They're very coy with their secrets though.

I think some people just don't like to have silage left in the pit or just aim for a full-time grazing start. Crazy though. If you want to grow grass you have to graze grass.

whelan2

My dad was at a funeral last week another farmer from a good bit away came over to him to say is it true whelan had her cows out in January. My dad said yes for about ten days. The other lad said that someone had told him and he didn't believe it. I don't see the problem. If grazing conditions are right work with it. Edited to say we are opening second pit tomorrow that would normally have been opened mid January

Timmaay

Say my name wrote: »

Everyone has stock being let out around this area. Some as far as I can see never even put them in a shed yet.
There's one lad has the milkers out night and day now. Now he's the talk of the parish...

There's some serious grass growers about though. You'd be miles trailing behind them. They're very coy with their secrets though.

I think some people just don't like to have silage left in the pit or just aim for a full-time grazing start. Crazy though. If you want to grow grass you have to graze grass.

If they are out night and day only now then he's 6wks behind many others ha. I have a load of maize, hayage and straw still, alongside 30ft of pit silage, the aim is to buffer the milkers with maize whole way thro rd1 (with barely enough nuts to cover the cal mag), maize and hay or straw to the drys, and hold onto the pit silage to next winter (or the summer, who knows after 2018 haha), that 30ft of silage is about 17days of full time feed, or the best part of 4k worth of, will go a long way towards my aim of having a buffer of about 6wks full time feed for everything here for any future 2018s ha.

Mac Taylor

Get a few sheep, no problem with too much grass then:D

Say my name

whelan2 wrote: »

My dad was at a funeral last week another farmer from a good bit away came over to him to say is it true whelan had her cows out in January. My dad said yes for about ten days. The other lad said that someone had told him and he didn't believe it. I don't see the problem. If grazing conditions are right work with it. Edited to say we are opening second pit tomorrow that would normally have been opened mid January

I don't think there is a problem.
If there is a talk it'll be of admiration. I know that's the case around here.
Michael Doran was on the radio there now again cows out day and night. Talk will be generated again. It'll be of incredulity that cows are out day and night a month sooner than normal.
I take pride in being talked about!

Keepgrowing

Winter herd out by day since 12/1
Spring calvers out day and night since 28/1 ie first calf. They’re in two groups main herd and penno/fresh group.
All weanlings out since 3/2.

It really makes life much easier

Buford T. Justice XIX

Keepgrowing wrote: »

Winter herd out by day since 12/1
Spring calvers out day and night since 28/1 ie first calf. They’re in two groups main herd and penno/fresh group.
All weanlings out since 3/2.

It really makes life much easier

And grass growing well for the tightest period of the year at the start of the second rotation.

Dakota Dan

whelan2 wrote: »

My dad was at a funeral last week another farmer from a good bit away came over to him to say is it true whelan had her cows out in January. My dad said yes for about ten days. The other lad said that someone had told him and he didn't believe it. I don't see the problem. If grazing conditions are right work with it. Edited to say we are opening second pit tomorrow that would normally have been opened mid January

That's good going and didn't you have them out until early December? Plenty with cows out here by day, I'd say they want to graze the grass while its there if we get a March like last year all the grass that's there now will melt. They can use the feed they saved by grazing if that happens.

Bass Reeves

Dakota Dan wrote: »

That's good going and didn't you have them out until early December? Plenty with cows out here by day, I'd say they want to graze the grass while its there if we get a March like last year all the grass that's there now will melt. They can use the feed they saved by grazing if that happens.

I do not where lads have this idea that grass melts. A cold spell will stop growth
but grass will not melt. What will happen is that the DM will rise as water leaves the grass. Biggest issue with a col spell is no growth there is no such thinh as grass melting. If I have one fear about this year is while covers are high DM content of grass could be lower than other springs. Last year was a cold spring grass did not melt in me the f@@king thing stopped growing and there was no second rotation.

Dakota Dan

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I do not where lads have this idea that grass melts. A cold spell will stop growth
but grass will not melt. What will happen is that the DM will rise as water leaves the grass. Biggest issue with a col spell is no growth there is no such thinh as grass melting. If I have one fear about this year is while covers are high DM content of grass could be lower than other springs. Last year was a cold spring grass did not melt in me the f@@king thing stopped growing and there was no second rotation.

Did you ever see grass getting burnt with hard frost? Think back to 2013.

GrasstoMilk

Say my name wrote: »

I don't think there is a problem.
If there is a talk it'll be of admiration. I know that's the case around here.
Michael Doran was on the radio there now again cows out day and night. Talk will be generated again. It'll be of incredulity that cows are out day and night a month sooner than normal.
I take pride in being talked about!

We're out day and night here for the last ten days. No one can see where we are though. Madness not too. Serious saving on silage. Where we probably would have ran out silage at paddys day will be much closer to the start of the second round. Half of our maiden heifers are out aswell.
There's no secrets to growing grass. Follow the teagasc guidelines and you'll grow as much as any one. Our farm has gone from growing 10t in 2013 to 16t in 2017 and back to 9t in 2018. I really know the value of grass after last year!

Bass Reeves

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Did you ever see grass getting burnt with hard frost? Think back to 2013.

Yes it will happen on heavier covers and on lighter covers where there in no N. I have no issue as a beef man on heavier covers as this rises the dry matter and lowers the P in the grass. Dairying needs the P in the grass to keep solids in the milk. Those burnt tip on the grass are often above 70%DM and will raise the DM in the grass to the very high 20's and even low 30's. Cattle digest best at 40%DM excess water needs to be got rid of and takes energy just like wet turf and timber in a fire. As a finisher too much P will only grow not flesh cattle.

Nearly all research in Ireland is dairy based and Teagasc and other transfer it without looking further at it to transfer to beef. Them burnt tip are the enemy of the dairy man who is feeding 3+kgs of nuts and silage as he needs the P for solids and the ration will counteract the lower DM. This is why cattle growth is so poor in the autumn due to low DM in grass and the dairy man feeds higher rates og nuts to counteract same.

The most important thing about spring grass is you have enough of it. As a beef man I would not rush out cleaning off low covers it takes grass to grow grass. Like i said earlier in a normal year I be out now but I am away for a few weeks in April and need to make sure I have enough grass.

Mooooo

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Yes it will happen on heavier covers and on lighter covers where there in no N. I have no issue as a beef man on heavier covers as this rises the dry matter and lowers the P in the grass. Dairying needs the P in the grass to keep solids in the milk. Those burnt tip on the grass are often above 70%DM and will raise the DM in the grass to the very high 20's and even low 30's. Cattle digest best at 40%DM excess water needs to be got rid of and takes energy just like wet turf and timber in a fire. As a finisher too much P will only grow not flesh cattle.

Nearly all research in Ireland is dairy based and Teagasc and other transfer it without looking further at it to transfer to beef. Them burnt tip are the enemy of the dairy man who is feeding 3+kgs of nuts and silage as he needs the P for solids and the ration will counteract the lower DM. This is why cattle growth is so poor in the autumn due to low DM in grass and the dairy man feeds higher rates og nuts to counteract same.

The most important thing about spring grass is you have enough of it. As a beef man I would not rush out cleaning off low covers it takes grass to grow grass. Like i said earlier in a normal year I be out now but I am away for a few weeks in April and need to make sure I have enough grass.

The stuff you graze now will be back in for april

I says

Looking for smelling salts for the boss man let cattle out today grazing silage ground. I’ll rehouse if weather turns if not they’re out for the season now.

Keepgrowing

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

And grass growing well for the tightest period of the year at the start of the second rotation.

It’s the second round tests your mettle

Timmaay

Bass you told me a week ago your beef margins are too tight to justify having any sort of silage reserve, yet right at the second you have a totally open goal to get in an extra rotation, reduce your silage, labour input, straw use etc and your not taking it for the fear that you won't believe able to graze in April. What if April is wet? Your stock will be going into big covers with very poor utilisation. I know its harder for a part time farmer to operate any sort of on off systems like dairyfarmers get away with, but at the minute ground conditions are good enough in alot of places to let animals out full time without any problems

TooOldBoots

Sold 100 bales of 1st cut silage last year, best of feeding, €35/bale. The young upstart rang yesterday reneging on the deal, gave me a load of guff about how silage wasn't making anything near what we agreed and that and that there's loads of grass everywhere now.
I didn't bother arguing just told him grand job. I thought it was bad form, a deal is a deal and to me a handshake is a mans contract.
I had to ring another customer I sold bales to last year and tell him what happened, wasn't on the phone 2 minutes when he told me he'd take the bales no question, said his cows were pumping milk last spring on the silage I sold him.
We might get an early spring but thats no reason to burn lads, its not as if I am making a fortune out of the bales

Timmaay

Take a deposit in future unless you absolutely trust them.

Reggie.

TooOldBoots wrote: »

Sold 100 bales of 1st cut silage last year, best of feeding, €35/bale. The young upstart rang yesterday reneging on the deal, gave me a load of guff about how silage wasn't making anything near what we agreed and that and that there's loads of grass everywhere now.
I didn't bother arguing just told him grand job. I thought it was bad form, a deal is a deal and to me a handshake is a mans contract.
I had to ring another customer I sold bales to last year and tell him what happened, wasn't on the phone 2 minutes when he told me he'd take the bales no question, said his cows were pumping milk last spring on the silage I sold him.
We might get an early spring but thats no reason to burn lads, its not as if I am making a fortune out of the bales

You'll have some craic next spring if he rings you looking for them bales

Dakota Dan

TooOldBoots wrote: »

Sold 100 bales of 1st cut silage last year, best of feeding, €35/bale. The young upstart rang yesterday reneging on the deal, gave me a load of guff about how silage wasn't making anything near what we agreed and that and that there's loads of grass everywhere now.
I didn't bother arguing just told him grand job. I thought it was bad form, a deal is a deal and to me a handshake is a mans contract.
I had to ring another customer I sold bales to last year and tell him what happened, wasn't on the phone 2 minutes when he told me he'd take the bales no question, said his cows were pumping milk last spring on the silage I sold him.
We might get an early spring but thats no reason to burn lads, its not as if I am making a fortune out of the bales

So sorry to hear you got done old boots.

TooOldBoots

Reggie. wrote: »

You'll have some craic next spring if he rings you looking for them bales

Be even more craic of we get the beast from the east in a few weeks time.
The artic truck booked for Tomorrow, says it was the only day he could get anyone free as they are flat out trucking fertilizer. So there will be zero bales left in the yard by the evening for the young upstart

So sorry to hear you got done old boots

I'll survive, you come across all types I guess

Bass Reeves

Mooooo wrote: »

The stuff you graze now will be back in for april

Keepgrowing wrote: »

It’s the second round tests your mettle

Timmaay wrote: »

Bass you told me a week ago your beef margins are too tight to justify having any sort of silage reserve, yet right at the second you have a totally open goal to get in an extra rotation, reduce your silage, labour input, straw use etc and your not taking it for the fear that you won't believe able to graze in April. What if April is wet? Your stock will be going into big covers with very poor utilisation. I know its harder for a part time farmer to operate any sort of on off systems like dairy farmers get away with, but at the minute ground conditions are good enough in alot of places to let animals out full time without any problems

I was posting more about this thing of grass melting due to frost or cold weather. As I posted there is another lad looking after the place for a few weeks during April so as KG posted i am watching the second rotation more than normal. Put 5 off today into a small paddock near the shed with an extra heavy cover, I expect to turn out another 30% of the stock in 10 days time. Depending on growth from now on will decide if I let more off. I stll have to house the lads on the rape they will finish it tomorrow. Now too often you are housing some after turning more out:rolleyes:

Expect to have more silage left over than I taught. My farm is very dry so utilisation is not an issue unless it buckets it in March and April. Drystock farms do not supplement after turnout and usually I have no issue turning out at this stage but for the April issue. My bullocks with compensatory growth will eat through covers very fast and they will clean out paddocks when in big bunches. I still expect to have average turnout date back by 7-10 days as it is when I let the remainder off will decide this.

lab man

TooOldBoots wrote:

Sold 100 bales of 1st cut silage last year, best of feeding, €35/bale. The young upstart rang yesterday reneging on the deal, gave me a load of guff about how silage wasn't making anything near what we agreed and that and that there's loads of grass everywhere now. I didn't bother arguing just told him grand job. I thought it was bad form, a deal is a deal and to me a handshake is a mans contract. I had to ring another customer I sold bales to last year and tell him what happened, wasn't on the phone 2 minutes when he told me he'd take the bales no question, said his cows were pumping milk last spring on the silage I sold him. We might get an early spring but thats no reason to burn lads, its not as if I am making a fortune out of the bales

Same has happened here the next bad year they can go whistle

wrangler

lab man wrote: »

Same has happened here the next bad year they can go whistle

If I sell something it's not sold till I get money, I tell every enquiry from done deal that nothing is held until the cheque is cleared.
As you see here it's madness doing it any other way

theaceofspies

Winter always comes - it doesn't have to be in the months you (or farm experts) expect. We haven't had a winter since last March.

gerryirl

TooOldBoots wrote: »

Sold 100 bales of 1st cut silage last year, best of feeding, €35/bale. The young upstart rang yesterday reneging on the deal, gave me a load of guff about how silage wasn't making anything near what we agreed and that and that there's loads of grass everywhere now.
I didn't bother arguing just told him grand job. I thought it was bad form, a deal is a deal and to me a handshake is a mans contract.
I had to ring another customer I sold bales to last year and tell him what happened, wasn't on the phone 2 minutes when he told me he'd take the bales no question, said his cows were pumping milk last spring on the silage I sold him.
We might get an early spring but thats no reason to burn lads, its not as if I am making a fortune out of the bales

he's the sort of fella youd want ringing you back in a month looking for them when they are all gone...

liosnagceann75

Asked a neighbour for silage bales a few years ago and was turned down. Fast forward to New Years Day some time later when he stopped me on the road looking for assistance. 2 bullocks had fallen into a slatted tank and i used my loader to lift them out. He said if I ever needed anything to give him a shout. Asked him last Spring for silage and was turned down again. Needless to say i wont be lifting anymore animals out of tanks for him.
I also had agreed to buy 51 silage bales lately be because i believed i was going to be short. When the time came for the contractor to draw them i had plenty of my own silage left and didn't need them. I kept my word and took them. Im new enough to farming and there are some **** out there who have no word

older by the day

That's a lesson for any young farmer. Be self reliant. I am always helping neighbours and relatives, but I do because, thank God I have the ability and health to do it. But don't be dependant on anyone 99.9% percent of people are good, you will recognise the w**kers after a while

Pidae.m

older by the day wrote: »

That's a lesson for any young farmer. Be self reliant. I am always helping neighbours and relatives, but I do because, thank God I have the ability and health to do it. But don't be dependant on anyone 99.9% percent of people are good, you will recognise the w**kers after a while

No man's an island...... except Aran :}

Never wrestle with pigs

TooOldBoots wrote: »

Sold 100 bales of 1st cut silage last year, best of feeding, €35/bale. The young upstart rang yesterday reneging on the deal, gave me a load of guff about how silage wasn't making anything near what we agreed and that and that there's loads of grass everywhere now.
I didn't bother arguing just told him grand job. I thought it was bad form, a deal is a deal and to me a handshake is a mans contract.
I had to ring another customer I sold bales to last year and tell him what happened, wasn't on the phone 2 minutes when he told me he'd take the bales no question, said his cows were pumping milk last spring on the silage I sold him.
We might get an early spring but thats no reason to burn lads, its not as if I am making a fortune out of the bales

Whatever you do, don't even sell him a small square bale of hay again. People like that need a lesson every now and again. Hopefully he'll be short again.

TooOldBoots

liosnagceann75 wrote: »

Asked a neighbour for silage bales a few years ago and was turned down. Fast forward to New Years Day some time later when he stopped me on the road looking for assistance. 2 bullocks had fallen into a slatted tank and i used my loader to lift them out. He said if I ever needed anything to give him a shout. Asked him last Spring for silage and was turned down again. Needless to say i wont be lifting anymore animals out of tanks for him.
I also had agreed to buy 51 silage bales lately be because i believed i was going to be short. When the time came for the contractor to draw them i had plenty of my own silage left and didn't need them. I kept my word and took them. Im new enough to farming and there are some **** out there who have no word

Fair play to you for keeping to your deal. Its hard enough to get the balance of fodder right without going down the road of messing with lads

Never wrestle with pigs wrote: »

Whatever you do, don't even sell him a small square bale of hay again. People like that need a lesson every now and again. Hopefully he'll be short again.

No not a chance he'll get any. What was really annoying was he said he'd bring them by Christmas then not a word till now.
I only decided to sell him some bales as he's not long at it plus I didn't want to be selling to just one man.

As it turns out 1 good buyer is better than a dozen time wasters

older by the day

Pidae.m wrote: »

older by the day wrote: »

That's a lesson for any young farmer. Be self reliant. I am always helping neighbours and relatives, but I do because, thank God I have the ability and health to do it. But don't be dependant on anyone 99.9% percent of people are good, you will recognise the w**kers after a while

No man's an island...... except Aran :}

When it comes to silage, get rid of animals or buy during the summer. Because this time of the year you should try and be an island