Berlin "safe zone" for women on NYE

PeterParker957

Grayson wrote: »

1) that's not a definition. If it is then it's literally the only time it's ever occurred. The poster I replied to said the majority of mass rapes were committed by non white people. If thee's only ever been one in the history of humanity, or even in the last decade, then he's creating a hysteria.
2) the crimes in Cologne were committed by a range of people. There were even americans. Show some statistics. Otherwise I would be able to counter with a case where white men committed sexual assaults and that would be pointless. You have to show actual statistics for your point to be valid. So you have to show that it occurs often and that it is non white people who committed the acts on the majority of occasions.
3) you still haven't shown that it occurs often enough for women to be rationally more scared of non white people than of a white person.

Keep the blinkers on, that'll make Europe safer.

Kivaro

tomwaterford wrote: »

All joking aside....why was noone ever convicted for that?

Or it picked up more widely by news media??.....Internet has left me somewhat skeptical of what is the exact truth what occurred??



It obv lies somewhere in middle of what the internet reports happened and what the German police offialy said about it??

Why obviously? What do you know?
Sounds like victim blaming again.
Somewhat akin to when Liam Cunningham said on live television that there was only anecdotal evidence of what happened in Cologne. Cunningham will say and do anything to keep the borders open for economic migrants.

As a result of the carnage on that New Year's Eve night in Cologne, 1,139 crime victims filed complaints, 529 of whom were victims of sexual assault.
The victims did what they were supposed to do in reporting the crimes, so it looks like the German authorities failed them twice.

It is astounding that in a modern society, women have to find "safe zones" in order to enjoy the freedom that men take for granted. It is a truly terrible idea because it tells the perpetrators that the police cannot properly control their criminal actions and it tells women that they are not safe from assault outside of these safe zone. They might as well have told all women in Berlin to stay away from celebrating New Year's Eve.

Captain Obvious

That's not a definition, that's an example.

Why have you excluded examples from war? Are sex crimes committed during war ok with you? How many gang rapes do you generally hear about in the news in Ireland? The answer is not many. Do you think that's because they don't happen?

I think women all over Europe feel wary around gangs of young men of any ethnicity.

They don't censor the information.

And I'd say you don't hear about them because it's not standard practice to report them. Do you think when the police receive a report of a sexual assault from a victim they should be on Twitter letting everyone know what happened and the ethnicity of the attackers? The only time you are likely to hear about it is if it goes to court.

Diehard? Would that be like someone who keeps registering on a forum to spout the same stuff over and over?

PeterParker957

Possibly just till the car blows up !!!

Grayson

It's an example not a definition. I suggest you look up the difference in a dictionary.

Once you've figured out what a definition is, you can define mass rapes.

Then you can provide figures for how often they occur.
And you can then provide figures for the race of the attackers.

Otherwise you're just making stuff up.

Captain Obvious

Maybe they don't keep it. Can you show me the Garda statistics on the ethnicity of criminals?

Captain Obvious

Do you not understand what a definition is?

enricoh

Grayson wrote: »

It's an example not a definition. I suggest you look up the difference in a dictionary.

Once you've figured out what a definition is, you can define mass rapes.

Then you can provide figures for how often they occur.
And you can then provide figures for the race of the attackers.

Otherwise you're just making stuff up.

Yeah good one, maybe the organizers of the Nye celebrations in Berlin are just making up the need for a women only safety zone too!

Captain Obvious

No it isn't.

I mean I could try but I'm really looking for your own definition to better understand what you are talking about. I'd probably define a mass sexual assault as an incident where there were multiple victims who suffered sexual assault committed by multiple offenders.

PeterParker957

I haven't been to Germany in a few years so I can't comment n their exact problems but I was in southern France in November this year.

In the town square there was a public toilet surrounded by seats. One of those old fashioned ornate ones.

Throughout the 4-5 hours we were there we passed this square a few times. On each occasion the same group of young North African men were there. There is no way on this earth I would have used that facility. Each time a lone woman walked past two or three of the group would walk towards them. At least one was behind them.

I can only describe them as menacing. How else would you see a gang threatening lone women ??

But I guess that's my racism huh ?

Ulysses Gaze

Captain Obvious wrote: »

No it isn't.



I mean I could try but I'm really looking for your own definition to better understand what you are talking about. I'd probably define a mass sexual assault as an incident where there were multiple victims who suffered sexual assault committed by multiple offenders.

So NYE 2015 in Koln, Berlin et al then would be incidents that exemplify that definition.....

As we have been saying all along.......

Skullface McGubbin

It's because he's a leftist. His Ideology tells him "immigrants & refugees = good, virtuous & innocent".
So when certain facts come out contradicting that message, it upsets his world view. He would rather cling to the message that his ideology tells him. This cognitive dissonance causes a great amount of pain & discomfort in his mind, i would guess. So he gets angry at people for pointing out those certain facts.

Odhinn

Kivaro wrote: »

It is astounding that in a modern society, women have to find "safe zones" in order to enjoy the freedom that men take for granted. It is a truly terrible idea because it tells the perpetrators that the police cannot properly control their criminal actions and it tells women that they are not safe from assault outside of these safe zone. They might as well have told all women in Berlin to stay away from celebrating New Year's Eve.

You misread the article.

Captain Obvious

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

So NYE 2015 in Koln, Berlin et al then would be incidents that exemplify that definition.....

As we have been saying all along.......

Yes, had they happened the way some have described them they would indeed fit my definition. I've been looking for a definition from Tom O'Dwyer so I know what would fit into his definition. This would help me in complying with the request to find mass sexual assaults committed by white people.

wakka12

Omackeral wrote: »

Is this you?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilCmywMin8I

Cant believe people like this exist. Couldn't do anything but cringe at that video

suicide_circus

Skullface McGubbin wrote: »

It's because he's a leftist. His Ideology tells him "immigrants & refugees = good, virtuous & innocent".
So when certain facts come out contradicting that message, it upsets his world view. He would rather cling to the message that his ideology tells him. This cognitive dissonance causes a great amount of pain & discomfort in his mind, i would guess. So he gets angry at people for pointing out those certain facts.

It reminds me of that period in which all the scandals started coming out about the RCC. A lot of churchgoers got very angry and defensive. They couldn't abide to have faults in the keepers of their ideology pointed out.

wakka12

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Yeah it's absolutely hilarious isn't it? It only matters when the perpetrator is someone brown from a big evil far away country, sure where else would you get a great crime like it?

Do you actually have any proof that white men in europe are convicted at lower rates than middle eastern men? If anything I thought it'd be the opposite, re: mass cover up of crimes by muslim paedophile gangs across the UK.

Anyway lots of people on this thread do genuinely care about the decreasing levels of freedom of women in europe, and you certainly do not seem to be one of them.

suicide_circus

Just because your ideology comes from a good place (enlightened, caring, philanthropic) doesn't mean it can't have gaping holes in it. Multiculturalism without careful planning, vetting and dare I say it confidence in your own culture and way of life can and does go wrong.

JPCN1

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Fcuk Germany.

Let them import half the third world in to fcuck their women. Who gives a sh1t , let them go, it doesn't mean that we have to allow them to mess up the world for the third time in 100 years.

If only it were that easy. Ze Germans are going to cherry pick and then insist the rest of Europe shares the burden and most will do what they're told with the exception of the Poles and Hungarians. They couldn't achieve it by military means but yet most of EU now controlled by them.

Captain Obvious

JPCN1 wrote: »

If only it were that easy. Ze Germans are going to cherry pick and then insist the rest of Europe shares the burden and most will do what they're told with the exception of the Poles and Hungarians. They couldn't achieve it by military means but yet most of EU now controlled by them.

Such nonsense. Typical ignorance of how the EU even works.

PeterParker957

Captain Obvious wrote: »

JPCN1 wrote: »

If only it were that easy. Ze Germans are going to cherry pick and then insist the rest of Europe shares the burden and most will do what they're told with the exception of the Poles and Hungarians. They couldn't achieve it by military means but yet most of EU now controlled by them.

Such nonsense. Typical ignorance of how the EU even works.

So once someone has German residency or a passport they can't travel or settle anywhere else in the EU??

JPCN1

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Such nonsense. Typical ignorance of how the EU even works.[/Q

The EU is supposed to work by agreement such as the Dublin Convention which Germany unilaterally set aside for its own ends and by doing so put enormous pressures on its neighbours.

ArchXStanton

JPCN1 wrote: »

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Such nonsense. Typical ignorance of how the EU even works.[/Q

The EU is supposed to work by agreement such as the Dublin Convention which Germany unilaterally set aside for its own ends and by doing so put enormous pressures on its neighbours.

There's no doubt Germany\France seem to be the agenda setters in the so called "democratic" EU

Odhinn

PeterParker957 wrote: »

So once someone has German residency or a passport they can't travel or settle anywhere else in the EU??

What, in those posts, refers to german residency or passports?

Noel82

wakka12 wrote: »

Anyway lots of people on this thread do genuinely care about the decreasing levels of freedom of women in europe, and you certainly do not seem to be one of them.

Of course he doesn't, all he cares about is hopping from thread to thread thanks whoring shoving his virtue signalling nonsense down our throats. Any thread of this nature he's there talking out of his arse.

Meanwhile Iran's public are rebelling and such are the numbers that the Police are no longer arrested Women for refusing to wear hijabs and other items of clothing that cover them up. This is incredible to see so are the symbols they are using.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/12/29/police-tehran-women-headscarves/989822001/

This type of segregation in Berlin isn't a one off, there's the same nonsense going on in Sweden. There's only one reason for this and it's the large scale influx of uneducated immigrants from third world countries.

"Sweden's biggest music festival will be replaced next year by a women-only alternative after reports of a series of rapes and sexual assaults at this year's event."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/music/news/swedish-music-festival-go-women-only-following-string-sexual/

Odhinn

Noel82 wrote: »

.........

This type of segregation in Berlin isn't a one off, there's the same nonsense going on in Sweden. ]

The area being put aside in Berlin is for women to go/report to if they feel they've been attacked or harassed, not a women only segregated area per se.

Noel82

Odhinn wrote: »

The area being put aside in Berlin is for women to go/report to if they feel they've been attacked or harassed, not a women only segregated area per se.

Fair enough, I'm just looking at the bigger picture. Things are only to get worse in the next 5,10,20 years.

Odhinn

Noel82 wrote: »

Fair enough, I'm just looking at the bigger picture. Things are only to get worse in the next 5,10,20 years.

According to many in the late 1800's and early 1900's, Western Europe was to be overrun by Slavs and Jews, based on notions of higher birth rates, patterns of migration, terrorism and influxes of refugees. Quite a common view in France, Britain and Germany.

Loueln

I fear concentrating people in a safe zone, will make them a target for large gangs a la Cologne, or mass casualty terror attack.
Secondly it smacks of surrender having a safe zone rather than trying to secure the public streets for everybody

suicide_circus

Odhinn wrote: »

According to many in the late 1800's and early 1900's, Western Europe was to be overrun by Slavs and Jews, based on notions of higher birth rates, patterns of migration, terrorism and influxes of refugees. Quite a common view in France, Britain and Germany.

Nearly goodwining there nodhinn

Odhinn

suicide_circus wrote: »

Nearly goodwining there nodhinn

I'm pointing out, fairly clearly, that popular notions of what will happen demographically are often far far off the mark, and based on cultural biases.

suicide_circus

Odhinn wrote: »

I'm pointing out, fairly clearly, that popular notions of what will happen demographically are often far far off the mark, and based on cultural biases.

True but back then there was no evidence of bad behaviour by Jews. No poisoning of wells recorded on smartphones. It was all down to blood liable etc. With the current situation, there is evidence of bad planning, loose controls, hearts over minds. It's not this same.

meeeeh

I'm always amazed how people who can write can't read. Police requested same type of safe zone as it's available at Oktoberfest since 2003, well before last wave of immigrant influx. But yeah if you want to get all hysterical about it so be it but at least read what it actually is and how it operates.

http://littlemunichblackbook.com/the-sichere-wiesn-a-women-only-safe-haven

4068ac1elhodqr

Odhinn wrote: »

According to many in the late 1800's and early 1900's, Western Europe was to be overrun by Slavs and Jews, based on notions of higher birth rates, patterns of migration, terrorism and influxes of refugees. Quite a common view in France, Britain and Germany.

Human geography and big data projections are probably just slightly more accurate than in the late 1800's.

Current (medium scenario) PEW projections puts places like Sweden at 20% Muslim. Poland and Hungry have their own views on mass unchecked migration, as such their figures are 0.2 - 1.3%.

Odhinn

suicide_circus wrote: »

True but back then there was no evidence of bad behaviour by Jews. .....

Anti-tsarist violence was associated with Jews, far left terrorism was associated with jews, anarchist violence was associated with jews. Not just the jews involved, but all Jews generally.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/politics/blood-rage-history-the-worlds-first-terrorists-1801195.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/30/opinion/the-first-global-terrorists-were-anarchists-in-the-1890s.html

Secular or reformed jews were blamed for lapses in 'public morals', something which continues to this day. Richard Nixon was a prominent believer in the notion. There is unfortunately very little new under the sun. Islamophobia and anti-semitism are really two cheeks of the same arse.

meeeeh

monnies wrote: »

wow it's only 12 short months ago since the scania artic flattened 13 people dead at the christmas market at breitschiedplatz in berlin,
but i would argue that the real terrorismus is the fact that german girls now are getting paranoid aboout going out on new years eve
danke schoen merkel

ps vladimir putin said "syria is safe now, it's time for the refugees to go home"

There were more and bigger attacks in UK. (Not to mention France). And again why do you say 'now' since Oktoberfest has same set up since 2003.

wakka12

Odhinn wrote: »

I'm pointing out, fairly clearly, that popular notions of what will happen demographically are often far far off the mark, and based on cultural biases.

Just because they were wrong in the past about that doesnt mean we are wrong now. We are far better at predicting long term birth rates and migration patterns for instance. Not saying we'll be overrun or whatever, personally I don't care whether europe has a large muslim population or not, but just because europeans were wrong then doesnt mean they are wrong this time about a similar issue.
Muslim birth rate is extremely high for instance, theres no debate there, combined with high migration rates into europe too..means there is some valid discussion to be had on the effects of this on european social structure. I wouldn't say its as big a cause for alarm as many on here seem to think though, at the same time

pitifulgod

meeeeh wrote: »

I'm always amazed how people who can write can't read. Police requested same type of safe zone as it's available at Oktoberfest since 2003, well before last wave of immigrant influx. But yeah if you want to get all hysterical about it so be it but at least read what it actually is and how it operates.

http://littlemunichblackbook.com/the-sichere-wiesn-a-women-only-safe-haven

And the music festival thing doesn't relate to immigrants either. An extraordinarily unfortunate aspect of all music festivals is that rapes occur at them. This includes one in Ireland where you go can back years and find examples.

I've also seen a fair few users on this thread with pretty awful views on rape and violence against women. Where they've blamed Weinstein's victims for example. So the concern doesn't seem exactly genuine, sadly.

Odhinn

wakka12 wrote: »

Just because they were wrong in the past about that doesnt mean we are wrong now. We are far better at predicting long term birth rates and migration patterns for instance. Not saying we'll be overrun or whatever, personally I don't care whether europe has a large muslim population or not, but just because europeans were wrong then doesnt mean they are wrong this time about a similar issue.

It's rather striking how similar the attitudes and "predictions" are. There certainly will be a growth in the population with a muslim background, but outside of that.....

wakka12 wrote: »

Muslim birth rate is extremely high for instance, theres no debate there, combined with high migration rates into europe too..means there is some valid discussion to be had on the effects of this on european social structure. I wouldn't say its as big a cause for alarm as many on here seem to think though, at the same time

The birth rate tales off eventually. Theres no religous obligation to have a large family, nor is there a contraceptive ban.

wakka12

Odhinn wrote: »

It's rather striking how similar the attitudes and "predictions" are. There certainly will be a growth in the population with a muslim background, but outside of that.....


The birth rate tales off eventually. Theres no religous obligation to have a large family, nor is there a contraceptive ban.

The birth rates falls after several generations. The present one will have large families. And the number of muslims in europe will grow significantly over the next few decades, this is fact. And as I said, this will have some relatively noticeable effects on life in europe. Some will be good and some will be bad. I don't see why it shouldn't be discussed

Odhinn

wakka12 wrote: »

The birth rates falls after several generations. The present one will have large families. And the number of muslims in europe will grow significantly over the next few decades, this is fact. And as I said, this will have some relatively noticeable effects on life in europe. Some will be good and some will be bad. I don't see why it shouldn't be discussed

I said that there would be growth, and we are, in fact, discussing it.

Grayson

enricoh wrote: »

Yeah good one, maybe the organizers of the Nye celebrations in Berlin are just making up the need for a women only safety zone too!

You could address the points I made

I do actually think women need a "Safe space" but not because of refugees. If there's one thing this year has shown it's that women are victimised by men. The MeToo hashtag has shown that women are harassed and assaulted by men.

In places like japan women have separate train carriages so they don't get molested. Not many muslims/arabs there.

The weird thing is that Sweden, which treats all sexual assault as rape, has seen numbers decrease. And it's because they take it seriously. They educate their population and make sure that their police and judiciary know how to handle these cases. The numbers there have decreased at the same time that they took in a large number of refugees. If what people say here was true then you'd think they would have seen an increase.

But that's all slightly off topic.

All I wanted to know was what defines a mass rape. How often does it occur? And proof that non white people perpetrate it more often.

wakka12

Odhinn wrote: »

I said that there would be growth, and we are, in fact, discussing it.

The fact that there will be growth simply goes without saying. You seem to be implying that actual predicted growth is not true though, based on the fact that europeans also wrongly predicted a demographic growth of jewish community nearly a century ago before computers even existed

suicide_circus

Is mass immigration always a positive for the in situ population? We should be allowed to ask these questions without vague comparisons to 19th century persecutions being bandied around. I absolutely recognise the readiness for xenophobia in the human psyche but that shouldn't deter a genuine inquisitive mind from hashing out the pros and cons. Multiculturalism, like every other ideology, should be open to scrutiny.

NollagShona

suicide_circus wrote: »

Is mass immigration always a positive for the in situ population? We should be allowed to ask these questions without vague comparisons to 19th century persecutions being bandied around. I absolutely recognise the readiness for xenophobia in the human psyche but that shouldn't deter a genuine inquisitive mind from hashing out the pros and cons. Multiculturalism, like every other ideology, should be open to scrutiny.

Surely best to be discussed at a higher level in Humanities then, then a base “they tuk r jabs” AH level?

suicide_circus

NollagShona wrote: »

Surely best to be discussed at a higher level in Humanities then, then a base “they tuk r jabs” AH level?

I don't know. I think the serfs and plebs should be allowed to discuss things too.

Grayson

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

No. You are making **** up. And, once again, obsfucating.

Read the article in the OP and hone in on this line.



This thread is about the fallout from NYE 2015 & 2016 celebrations in Germany and the Taharrush (i.e. mass sexual assaults) that took place there. And that there are now "Safe Zones". Something not needed before.

Is that clear now?

Let me clarify it for you again in case it is not.....

Berlin never needed this type of Safe Zone for Women before on New Years Eve.


Maybe you'd like to comment on the fact that in Berlin they have had to introduce a Safe Zone for women for the first time. In a Western European city. Because of fears of a repeat of Taharrush.

Or are you going to continue to bull****, obsfucate and introduce those wonderful straw men.

I think you need to look up "obfuscating"

You said
The vast majority of mass sexual assaults on women in Western Europe are not being committed by white men though, are they?


I asked you what a mass sexual assault was and proof that the majority of mass sexual assaults, in Europe are committed by non white people.

I replied directly to your post. I asked questions about a statement you made. That's not obfuscating.

Here's an example (not a definition as someone else here would say)

You say "Trump is fatter than Leo".
I ask what's the definition of fat? Is it width or weight? Also what figures are you using?
You say "Stop obfuscating"

See how silly you look?

Now, just answer my questions or provide any statistics to back up your claim. Otherwise we can both agree that you were making sh1t up when you said

The vast majority of mass sexual assaults on women in Western Europe are not being committed by white men though, are they?

meeeeh

suicide_circus wrote: »

Is mass immigration always a positive for the in situ population? We should be allowed to ask these questions without vague comparisons to 19th century persecutions being bandied around. I absolutely recognise the readiness for xenophobia in the human psyche but that shouldn't deter a genuine inquisitive mind from hashing out the pros and cons. Multiculturalism, like every other ideology, should be open to scrutiny.

Genuine inquisitive mind would actually check what the safe zones are about and how long they are around. That is inquisitive. Using safe zones for cheap shots on immigration without informing themselves in them is just being ignorant.

Yes there should be discussion on immigration and how to ensure liberal way of life in Europe can be preserved. But please don't make it as dumb as this thread.

suicide_circus

meeeeh wrote: »

Genuine inquisitive mind would actually check what the safe zones are about and how long they are around. That is inquisitive. Using safe zones for cheap shots on immigration without informing themselves in them is just being ignorant.

Yes there should be discussion on immigration and how to ensure liberal way of life in Europe can be preserved. But please don't make it as dumb as this thread.

Fair enough. These safe zones may be a swing and a miss but there is no shortage of other worrying stats. I do agree that maintaining the liberal ethos of Europe should be the number one priority. But that requires us to recognise that our culture is good. Not only that, it's actually superior to others. The values of the enlightenment are worth fighting for.

Grayson

suicide_circus wrote: »

Is mass immigration always a positive for the in situ population? We should be allowed to ask these questions without vague comparisons to 19th century persecutions being bandied around. I absolutely recognise the readiness for xenophobia in the human psyche but that shouldn't deter a genuine inquisitive mind from hashing out the pros and cons. Multiculturalism, like every other ideology, should be open to scrutiny.

True but the problem with these heads is that they are led by emotion rather than actual logic and facts. Wild statements fly around the place and there's nothing to back them up.

There's also a ridiculous number of rereg's who drive off serious discussion. The reregs are the ones who come out with the wildest claims. They are the ones who are obviously racist and have gotten banned time and time again.