Kia Niro EV

Krusty_Clown

xboxdad wrote: »

Well, I don't believe I can skip the queue, but at this stage I can't even put an order in. At least this could possibly be resolved I guess, even if dates are moving. Having a slot on a list is still better than not having one at all.

Well, it might be worth giving the earlier posted Donegal garage a call, if you could live with a FE in the wrong colour and had the means to get up there. But other than that, sticking the name on the list seems like the best way to go. I'm due to pick up mine in a couple of weeks, but I'm resigned to that not happening given the current circumstances.

championc

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Well, it might be worth giving the earlier posted Donegal garage a call, if you could live with a FE in the wrong colour and had the means to get up there. But other than that, sticking the name on the list seems like the best way to go. I'm due to pick up mine in a couple of weeks, but I'm resigned to that not happening given the current circumstances.

While you might not be able to collect it, it should certainly still arrive.

In the case of Liffey Valley, they were as good as closed when I collected mine but they were going to open up just for me if necessary to get the money in and the car out

graememk

I was asking when I picked up my car if they had any more coming, they said one more and they can't order any more right now.

I had good service from my dealership, don't understand why you can't even order one now.

xboxdad

What is the best charger to get installed for the Niro SE?

Is this OK or there are better ones? (I'm utterly confused about the 3 phase topic related to the SE on this thread)


https://shop.electricireland.ie/products/install-detail/electric-vehicle-home-charger

Thanks.

KildareMan

graememk wrote: »

I was asking when I picked up my car if they had any more coming, they said one more and they can't order any more right now.

I had good service from my dealership, don't understand why you can't even order one now.

5 letter word beginning with a C followed by two numbers the first of which is 1

graememk

xboxdad wrote: »

What is the best charger to get installed for the Niro SE?

Is this OK or there are better ones? (I'm utterly confused about the 3 phase topic related to the SE on this thread)


https://shop.electricireland.ie/products/install-detail/electric-vehicle-home-charger

Thanks.

To clarify the Single Phase/Three Phase

99.9% of Homes in ireland have single phase. (uses 3 wires, Live, Neutral and earth)

Three phase electricity is usually used in Industry (5 wires, 3 live, Neutral and earth) The AC Current on the 3 wires are 120 degrees out of phase with each other. But dont worry about that. 3 phase = more power.

What rate a car can charge at on AC is dependent on the charger IN the car.

So the e-Niro SE has a 11kW, Charger.
This is a 3 phase charger, But can also work on single phase.

If connected to a Ecars AC charge point it can charge up to 11kW (3 phases using 16amp) & As long as you have a 3 phase cable

These are capable of supplying 22kw AC. (eg a Renault Zoe can use the full 22kw, and some P models of the Tesla Model S also can charge at this rate. Because the charger in the car can support it.)

When on a single phase supply, The car can charge at 7.4kW (1 phase at 32Amp).


So when you are at home it will be a Single phase 32Amp connection.

The home charge points are a fancy Socket with a bit of electronics for safety/relays.

The ones electric ireland are installing (afaik) are normal "non smart" charge points. They supply power to the car (up to 32amp) The car only takes what it can/what it needs.

The smart charge points can integrate with solar, remote management etc.

TLDR electric Ireland one will charge the car perfectly fine. Ive heard that they are moving to EO Minis which is a very neat little box.

xboxdad

graememk wrote: »

To clarify the Single Phase/Three Phase

99.9% of Homes in ireland have single phase. (uses 3 wires, Live, Neutral and earth)

Three phase electricity is usually used in Industry (5 wires, 3 live, Neutral and earth) The AC Current on the 3 wires are 120 degrees out of phase with each other. But dont worry about that. 3 phase = more power.

What rate a car can charge at on AC is dependent on the charger IN the car.

So the e-Niro SE has a 11kW, Charger.
This is a 3 phase charger, But can also work on single phase.

If connected to a Ecars AC charge point it can charge up to 11kW (3 phases using 16amp) & As long as you have a 3 phase cable

These are capable of supplying 22kw AC. (eg a Renault Zoe can use the full 22kw, and some P models of the Tesla Model S also can charge at this rate. Because the charger in the car can support it.)

When on a single phase supply, The car can charge at 7.4kW (1 phase at 32Amp).


So when you are at home it will be a Single phase 32Amp connection.

The home charge points are a fancy Socket with a bit of electronics for safety/relays.

The ones electric ireland are installing (afaik) are normal "non smart" charge points. They supply power to the car (up to 32amp) The car only takes what it can/what it needs.

The smart charge points can integrate with solar, remote management etc.

TLDR electric Ireland one will charge the car perfectly fine. Ive heard that they are moving to EO Minis which is a very neat little box.

Thank you very much, that clears it up for me.

xboxdad

Oh, one more question on home charger installation:

Is it a big deal to install?

In our estate, according to other residents, installers said they'd need to pull a cable across the entire house and back. From the meters on the side of the house to the utility room which is exactly in the middle of the house.

Also, they talked about digging up the public footpath.

I'm hoping this all got a lot more mainstream / sophisticated since...

graememk

xboxdad wrote: »

Oh, one more question on home charger installation:

Is it a big deal to install?

In our estate, according to other residents, installers said they'd need to pull a cable across the entire house and back. From the meters on the side of the house to the utility room which is exactly in the middle of the house.

Also, they talked about digging up the public footpath.

I'm hoping this all got a lot more mainstream / sophisticated since...

It depends...

A) do you have off street parking?
Having a cable go across a public footpath is not a good idea, trip hazard etc
there is trials in the uk that have put like a cable track in the footpath to put the cable into but nothing here yet.

If you have a driveway/garage then its not a problem

Wheres your Consumer unit (fuseboard)
They will have to bring a 6mm2 cable (prob armoured too) from your consumer unit to near where you park your car.

if you could plan a route say from the utility room to outside then clipped along the bottom of the house to where you would want the charge point installed

C) do you have an electric shower?
if you have an electric shower, there will have to be some sort of priority switch installed, or load management on the charge point side. (as not to blow your main fuse)

championc

xboxdad wrote: »

Oh, one more question on home charger installation:

Is it a big deal to install?

In our estate, according to other residents, installers said they'd need to pull a cable across the entire house and back. From the meters on the side of the house to the utility room which is exactly in the middle of the house.

Also, they talked about digging up the public footpath.

I'm hoping this all got a lot more mainstream / sophisticated since...

Installers will need to run a new connection off your fuse board. So a cable should only be needed from the board to where your charger will be located.

However, it may be that the main ESB feed cable is inadequate / insufficient to support the 7kw charger and may therefore be why there is talk of digging up the pathway

xboxdad

graememk wrote: »

It depends...

A) do you have off street parking?
Having a cable go across a public footpath is not a good idea, trip hazard etc
there is trials in the uk that have put like a cable track in the footpath to put the cable into but nothing here yet.

If you have a driveway/garage then its not a problem

Wheres your Consumer unit (fuseboard)
They will have to bring a 6mm2 cable (prob armoured too) from your consumer unit to near where you park your car.

if you could plan a route say from the utility room to outside then clipped along the bottom of the house to where you would want the charge point installed

C) do you have an electric shower?
if you have an electric shower, there will have to be some sort of priority switch installed, or load management on the charge point side. (as not to blow your main fuse)

A, Driveway
B, Fuse board is in the utility room, in the middle of the ground floor
C, No electric shower

Pff, this doesn't sound good. I was very glad the electricity meter/box is right next to the driveway. Can they not install a fuse around there instead of drilling through multiple walls and feed like 10m of cables through them?

championc

xboxdad wrote: »

Can they not install a fuse around there instead of drilling through multiple walls and feed like 10m of cables through them?

You could maybe get a small sub distribution board installed at the meter. So the meter would connect into a House main fuse, which could then have two MCB's - one with the rest of the house hanging off it, and the other being the car charger RCBO

graememk

My electrician is taking about something like that for me (not for the charger, but for taking more power to the farmyard but same idea)

That sort of install would be out of the scope of the electric Ireland base price. Thus leading to a more expensive install. If you have an electrician to talk to they would be able to guide you much better than we can.

But taking a cable from the middle of the house would be a complete pain.

Johnboy1951

You could break the line from the meter to house, suitably housed and protected.
Insert the necessary fuses/MCB/whatever and take two feeds from that line ....... one to the house and the other to a charger.

xboxdad

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

You could break the line from the meter to house, suitably housed and protected.
Insert the necessary fuses/MCB/whatever and take two feeds from that line ....... one to the house and the other to a charger.

This sounds like what I thought is the default/only way anyone would go about it today.

Johnboy1951

xboxdad wrote: »

This sounds like what I thought is the default/only way anyone would go about it today.

It can be difficult to near impossible, and very costly to achieve ...... depending on the physical situation on site.
Or indeed it can be quite simple to do.

zg3409

xboxdad wrote: »

A, Driveway
B, Fuse board is in the utility room, in the middle of the ground floor
C, No electric shower

Pff, this doesn't sound good. I was very glad the electricity meter/box is right next to the driveway. Can they not install a fuse around there instead of drilling through multiple walls and feed like 10m of cables through them?

No, the Meter box is reserved for the Meter. I would recommend getting a few in person quotes after free surveys. Prices vary widely. Any standard car charger will work and give you 7kw which is about the Max for any domestic install.

Alun

Disappointed that I had to change the clock to summer time manually. My last car, a Nissan Pulsar, did it completely automatically. It's hardly rocket science.

Silent Running

zg3409 wrote: »

No, the Meter box is reserved for the Meter. I would recommend getting a few in person quotes after free surveys. Prices vary widely. Any standard car charger will work and give you 7kw which is about the Max for any domestic install.

My meter box has more than just the meter. It has a sub board to power a shed and a changeover switch to connect a genny. All installed by RECI electricians.

xboxdad

Silent Running wrote: »

My meter box has more than just the meter. It has a sub board to power a shed and a changeover switch to connect a genny. All installed by RECI electricians.

This sounds promising.
Can you share the installer's details with me please?

KCross

Silent Running wrote: »

My meter box has more than just the meter. It has a sub board to power a shed and a changeover switch to connect a genny. All installed by RECI electricians.

It’s against regulations and ESB rules but you are not alone. Plenty examples of it.

Getting a RECI to sign off on it would be very hit and miss. If they got an audit they’d be in trouble.

Johnboy1951

Silent Running wrote: »

My meter box has more than just the meter. It has a sub board to power a shed and a changeover switch to connect a genny. All installed by RECI electricians.

That gear really should have been placed in a separate meter-style box in your ownership and control, IMO.

Silent Running

xboxdad wrote: »

This sounds promising.
Can you share the installer's details with me please?

He's Wexford based, if you're in that area...

KCross wrote: »

It’s against regulations and ESB rules but you are not alone. Plenty examples of it.

Getting a RECI to sign off on it would be very hit and miss. If they got an audit they’d be in trouble.

If it ever becomes an issue, the box is mounted on a shed wall and it would be fairly simple to put up another box beside it, and move the extra gubbins out to it.

xboxdad

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

That gear really should have been placed in a separate meter-style box in your ownership and control, IMO.

As for my original question, a separate box would be perfect too..
The only solution that's nonsense is expecting ppl to upgrade to cars that'll put cables through their living rooms.

xboxdad

Silent Running wrote: »

He's Wexford based, if you're in that area...



If it ever becomes an issue, the box is mounted on a shed wall and it would be fairly simple to put up another box beside it, and move the extra gubbins out to it.

I'm in Dublin, thanks anyways.

KCross

xboxdad wrote: »

The only solution that's nonsense is expecting ppl to upgrade to cars that'll put cables through their living rooms.

There shouldn’t be any reason why a cable can’t be pulled from the consumer unit to the outside and be hidden.

If you have a lazy spark or you are trying to cheap out on the install then you’ll get a cable in trunking along your living room wall but you don’t have to go that route.

Cables can be fished through floor boards, attics, fascia etc. You just need a decent spark.

My consumer unit is in the middle of the house on an internal block wall. I ran the cable into the ceiling above the board, fished it across to the attic space and then out to the fascia where the charge point is. It’s not impossible.

If you are happy with an extra consumer unit on your outside wall then that’s fine too but I’d prefer one consumer unit if at all possible.

xboxdad

KCross wrote: »

There shouldn’t be any reason why a cable can’t be pulled from the consumer unit to the outside and be hidden.

If you have a lazy spark or you are trying to cheap out on the install then you’ll get a cable in trunking along your living room wall but you don’t have to go that route.

Cables can be fished through floor boards, attics, fascia etc. You just need a decent spark.

My consumer unit is in the middle of the house on an internal block wall. I ran the cable into the ceiling above the board, fished it across to the attic space and then out to the fascia where the charge point is. It’s not impossible.

If you are happy with an extra consumer unit on your outside wall then that’s fine too but I’d prefer one consumer unit if at all possible.

I see it very differently.
I live in an estate with hundreds of houses, built 2 years ago by one of the biggest builders in the country. Meaning very similar houses in multiple other estates built since.

All the greenery and incentives will be meaningless if thousands of young families - who are most likely to go electric - will have two bad options.
1. Expensive mega-project, drilling tons of holes into your new house and picking up floor boards you just paid thousands for
2. Still too many holes, for cheap, but looking bad

KCross

xboxdad wrote: »

...will have two bad options.
1. Expensive mega-project, drilling tons of holes into your new house and picking up floor boards you just paid thousands for
2. Still too many holes, for cheap, but looking bad

I didn’t lift any floor boards or drill any walls. It wasn’t a mega project either. It’s fishing cables.... the bread and butter of every spark.

You are over complicating things.

xboxdad

KCross wrote: »

I didn’t lift any floor boards or drill any walls. It wasn’t a mega project either. It’s fishing cables.... the bread and butter of every spark.

You are over complicating things.

All I'm going by is examples shown/described by other residents with the same house type.
Only one of them - I'm aware of - did the neat solution and he did say it was a big project / lot of work.

All I'm saying is that the legislation / regulations can't keep assuming fuse boards are close to driveways, so "no big deal".
Or they can, but then I don't see masses picking EV-s over ICE or non-plug-in Hybrid (most don't even know Hybrids aren't green).

Anyways, I'm quite determined, so I'll get it done one way or another. ...but for a regular car upgrade on a Saturday afternoon, this will be a show stopper.

Johnboy1951

KCross wrote: »

I didn’t lift any floor boards or drill any walls. It wasn’t a mega project either. It’s fishing cables.... the bread and butter of every spark.

You are over complicating things.

That is only possible if the timbers are parallel to the direction you need the cable to go, and if there are no impediments along the route.

I can state categorically that what you describe would not be possible in my house.

It seems to me that essentially you got rather lucky.