Fighter jets for the Air Corps?

Tigger

Ellen Thankful Lavender wrote: »

Kinda holed your own canoe with that one.

Even so, in a country with over 3,000 homeless children one will have a difficult time persuading people to spend tens or hundreds of millions on jets to "defend our own airpsace" against something.

That’s with an interesting definition of homeless

tac foley

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

Another funny from the Swe booklet is to stock up on 'car radios', all cars have radios already, don't they?

They are not talking about regular car radios, they are suggesting that you obtain two-way radio communicaton sets á la CB radio.

Some people make a lot of fun of the Swedes - Swedish chef of the Muppets comes to mind - and the Americans have lots of jokes about Sven and his buddies, but they are not dummies. Anything you see with SAAB-Scania on it, or Hagglund, or Bofors, or Volvo, or Svensson, comes from Sweden. So does much more that is not so obvious in the electronic warfare field.

Every round of Norma ammunition shot by Irish sportsmen is made in Sweden. Every round of ammunition of all calibres fired by the Swedish armed forces is made in Sweden. Heck, they even make their own artillery up to 155mm and multiple rocket-launchers, and the world's fastest-into-action wheeled artillery system...not too bad for a bunch of funny people, I'd say. Every rifle and carbine in the Swedish military is made right there in Sweden, and every rifle with Carl Gustaf or Husqvarna stamped on it is Swedish. I'm going to stop there, since the RoI does none of this, in spite of being better off, on paper, at least.

tac

4068ac1elhodqr

tac foley wrote: »

They are not talking about regular car radios, they are suggesting that you obtain two-way radio communicaton sets á la CB radio.

Some people make a lot of fun of the Swedes - Swedish chef of the Muppets comes to mind - but they are not dummies. Anything you see with SAAB-Scania on it, or Hagglund, or Bofors, or Volvo, comes from Sweden. So does much more that is not so obvious in the electronic warfare field.

tac

Ah strange they didn't state hand-held '2-way', PSR, PMR, PSB, CB radio instead of 12v car radio, unless that's the norm there in Volvos.

Low range MHz is indeed probably the only thing that would still work without a network. (Assuming it's portable, USB/dynamo chargeable and stored in a faraday cage).

As stated already, they are to be commended on their heavy industrial manufacturing.

No mention of 'iodine tablets', conditioner risk, or 45° shelters in the booklet though?

tac foley

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

Ah strange they didn't state hand-held '2-way', PSR, PMR, PSB, CB radio instead of 12v car radio, unless that's the norm there in Volvos.

Low range MHz is indeed probably the only thing that would still work without a network. (Assuming it's portable, USB/dynamo chargeable and stored in a faraday cage).

As stated already, they are to be commended on their heavy industrial manufacturing.

No mention of 'iodine tablets', conditioner risk, or 45° shelters in the booklet though?

Dear Mr Winter Melodic Beehive - please point me at the Citizens' Survival documentation published by the government of the Republic of Ireland in case of a national emergency.

TIA

ohnonotgmail

tac foley wrote: »

Dear Mr Accumulator - please point me at the Citizens' Survival documentation published by the government of the Republic of Ireland in case of a national emergency.

TIA

They distributed an A4 sheet of paper with "Ah sure it'll be grand" to every house in the country

gctest50

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

......

Another funny from the Swe booklet is to stock up on 'car radios', all cars have radios already, don't they? Is it implying stocking up on a stack of old AM/FM/Cassette 12v blaupunkts, along with the 3 types of cheese^?

EMP pulse from a high altitude blast will knock out car radios that are installed -maybe


A solar storm knocked out Quebec power :


https://edubirdie.com/blog/sun-darkness

tac foley

Those of us in Ontario had a great laff about that. Very sorry for all those poor folks that were really reliant on hydro at the time, but in general, anything that happens in the rest of Canada is a totally 'nothin' t'do wid'us' as far as our dear neighbours are concerned.

The only time I go to QC is to act as an interpreter for members of my non-Francophone family, and even I often have a hard time.

tac

roadmaster

whatever about fighter jets if you look at fr24 the cadets seam to have some craic looking at there flight paths in the PC9's

jonnybigwallet

The Alenia Aermacchi M 346 looks pretty affordable and fast into the bargain. Been around a while so well proven and in service with a number of air forces.

4068ac1elhodqr

Says on the news-tabliods, that x4 of those new shinny F35 yokes just landed from US to Eng tonight.
Cost Estimates are up to £150m each, and they pledged to purchase x138 of them.

£20,700,000,000 could buy rather a few new schools, hospitals and beat bobbies.

prinzeugen

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

Says on the news-tabliods, that x4 of those new shinny F35 yokes just landed from US to Eng tonight.
Cost Estimates are up to £150m each, and they pledged to purchase x138 of them.

£20,700,000,000 could buy rather a few new schools, hospitals and beat bobbies.

Take it you have been reading the comments section of the Daily Mail or watching RT.

The cost is a lifetime cost.

They can fly in bad weather. This was a ferry flight in peacetime so safety comes first. The want calm seas to increase the chances of a downed pilot being rescued.

Good weather makes refuelling easier. 10-12 on the trip by two tankers. No the F-35 does not have small tanks. They want to keep the tanks as full as possible just incase something goes wrong. The F-35 then has 2000 miles worth of fuel to divert.

Its not a bag of bolts as the Russian trolls keep calling it.

Israel flew one over Iran and the super-duper Russian F-35 killing missiles did not even know it was there. I would say Putin is embarrassed by this after all his boasts.

https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/aviation/a20872619/israel-first-f-35-combat-mission/

4068ac1elhodqr

prinzeugen wrote: »

Take it you have been reading the comments section of the Daily Mail or watching RT.

The cost is a lifetime cost.

They can fly in bad weather. This was a ferry flight in peacetime so safety comes first. The want calm seas to increase the chances of a downed pilot being rescued.

Good weather makes refuelling easier. 10-12 on the trip by two tankers. No the F-35 does not have small tanks. They want to keep the tanks as full as possible just incase something goes wrong. The F-35 then has 2000 miles worth of fuel to divert.

Its not a bag of bolts as the Russian trolls keep calling it.

Israel flew one over Iran and the super-duper Russian F-35 killing missiles did not even know it was there. I would say Putin is embarrassed by this after all his boasts.

https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/aviation/a20872619/israel-first-f-35-combat-mission/

Yep the Mail ran it as their headline story. But some comments suggest 'Lifetime use' may only be 10yrs before technology (detection) superseeds it's USP effectiveness.

It currently can't ping any ships without making itself known, and is considered as one of the most expensive, clumsy, delayed and painstaking engineering projects in the history of mankind.

The next generation after this will probably be pilotless autonomous, so no worries about g-forces, training, human error or packed lunches.

x138 of them, could probably inflict some pain on the Argies all the same. Or if the whole Brexit thing goes sour in the coming decade.

prinzeugen

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

Yep the Mail ran it as their headline story. But some comments suggest 'Lifetime use' may only be 10yrs before technology (detection) superseeds it's USP effectiveness.

It currently can't ping any ships without making itself known, and is considered as one of the most expensive, clumsy, delayed and painstaking engineering projects in the history of mankind.

The next generation after this will probably be pilotless autonomous, so no worries about g-forces, training, human error or packed lunches.

x138 of them, could probably inflict some pain on the Argies all the same. Or if the whole Brexit thing goes sour in the coming decade.

Thats the thing about the F-35. Its an ongoing, evolving program over the next 40-50 years.

The 138th RAF plane will be very different to the ones that arrived in the UK today. The UK are not buying 138 in one go and there will not be 138 in service at the same time.

138 over a number of decades. When a block is life expired, a new block will be built.

Same with the Eurofighter. Some tranche 1 planes are being scrapped as tranche 4 planes are delivered.

4068ac1elhodqr

prinzeugen wrote: »

Thats the thing about the F-35. Its an ongoing, evolving program over the next 40-50 years.

The 138th RAF plane will be very different to the ones that arrived in the UK today. The UK are not buying 138 in one go and there will not be 138 in service at the same time.

138 over a number of decades. When a block is life expired, a new block will be built.

Same with the Eurofighter. Some tranche 1 planes are being scrapped as tranche 4 planes are delivered.

40-50yrs time it'll be all that hypersonic anti-gravitational, ion-propulsion, inter-planetary jazz.

Guess if you asked folks on the streets of Ldn what they would want '£150m a pop' spend on, it might involve - reducing the 1,000% (3yr) rise in moped crime gangs, and stopping the 21% (single year) rise in general voilent crime. Not forgetting the daily zombie blade wavers claiming 70 or so this year.

Even funny man michael mcintyre isn't laughing about it now.

prinzeugen

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

40-50yrs time it'll be all that hypersonic anti-gravitational, ion-propulsion, inter-planetary jazz.

Guess if you asked folks on the streets of Ldn what they would want '£150m a pop' spend on, it might involve - reducing the 1,000% (3yr) rise in moped crime gangs, and stopping the 21% (single year) rise in general voilent crime. Not forgetting the daily zombie blade wavers claiming 70 or so this year.

Even funny man michael mcintyre isn't laughing about it now.

Stop reading the comments section of the Daily Mail.

4068ac1elhodqr

prinzeugen wrote: »

Stop reading the comments section of the Daily Mail.

What about the Metropolitan police's (who's budget is down 20% since 2010) own comments - that say the number of such offences (Moped-enabled crime) has risen from just over 1,000 in 2014 to more than 19,000 in the year to last September, with 2018 looking worse still. Approx 60 per day! Send in the jets.

sparky42

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

What about the Metropolitan police's (who's budget is down 20% since 2010) own comments - that say the number of such offences (Moped-enabled crime) has risen from just over 1,000 in 2014 to more than 19,000 in the year to last September, with 2018 looking worse still. Approx 60 per day! Send in the jets.

You are aware that the UK's defence budget has been equally gutted over the years to the point that there's significant gaps/weaknesses?

4068ac1elhodqr

sparky42 wrote: »

You are aware that the UK's defence budget has been equally gutted over the years to the point that there's significant gaps/weaknesses?

Yes, they spent 1.98% instead of the of '2% of GDP'.

Meanwhile Tory austerity sees 3,000 computers with internet stripped from libraries, a NHS on it's knees and an upcoming small Brexit tab to pay for.

Today, Khan demands another 6,000 officers, and blames the Tory's cuts. Ms Dick even described the recent spate of knife crime in London as a "horrible phenomenon"... that there was no doubt that "reduced numbers of officers on the street" (-21,000 since 2010, E&W) had had an impact.

But look at those nice shinny jets, just in time for the next TopGun movie (they won't be using them in it).

sparky42

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

Yes, they spent 1.98% instead of the of '2% of GDP'.

Meanwhile Tory austerity sees 3,000 computers with internet stripped from libraries, a NHS on it's knees and an upcoming small Brexit tab to pay for.

Today, Khan demands another 6,000 officers, and blames the Tory's cuts. Ms Dick even described the recent spate of knife crime in London as a "horrible phenomenon"... that there was no doubt that "reduced numbers of officers on the street" (-21,000 since 2010, E&W) had had an impact.

But look at those nice shinny jets, just in time for the next TopGun movie (they won't be using them in it).

If you think that's all the cuts the UK forces have taken you are totally ignoring the time period since the Tories came into power, the RN can barely put together a strike group at this stage, the RAF had to retire both their MPA's and Harriers unreplaced, and the Army has seen 10's of thousands of people cut.


There's no question the UK has problems, I fail to see how you think the F35 buy is the answer to any of that however, also I fail to see why you are complaining on an Irish forum about it?

jonnybigwallet

Hear Hear!

roadmaster

prinzeugen wrote: »

Stop reading the comments section of the Daily Mail.

I think stop reading the daily mail in general would be better

4068ac1elhodqr

roadmaster wrote: »

I think stop reading the daily mail in general would be better

The comments section does have some comedy gold now and again.

Suppose one could blacklist the 'most read (en)online newspaper in the world', from all web bookmarks (and avoid their 1.5m daily print circulation which is 'tenfold' the guardian). Maybe add in the Independent, Express, the Mirror group if deemed unagreeable.

A bucket of sand is really the best thing, to avoid any unsuitable news headlines.

Interesting to see Ankara has opted to buy up to 100 of these aircraft, despite some opposition in US to selling them to Turkey.

roadmaster

Winter Melodic Beehive wrote: »

The comments section does have some comedy gold now and again.

Suppose one could blacklist the 'most read (en)online newspaper in the world', from all web bookmarks (and avoid their 1.5m daily print circulation which is 'tenfold' the guardian). Maybe add in the Independent, Express, the Mirror group if deemed unagreeable.

A bucket of sand is really the best thing, to avoid any unsuitable news headlines.

Interesting to see Ankara has opted to buy up to 100 of these aircraft, despite some opposition in US to selling them to Turkey.

In fairness your right about the comedy especially there views on brexit. I think there sucess is alot to do with there gossip and celebrity section rather than informed and researched news articles. Its a bit ironic the yanks selling the f35 to the turks and at same time arming the kurds with as much weapons as possible

sparky42

roadmaster wrote: »

In fairness your right about the comedy especially there views on brexit. I think there sucess is alot to do with there gossip and celebrity section rather than informed and researched news articles. Its a bit ironic the yanks selling the f35 to the turks and at same time arming the kurds with as much weapons as possible

And while the Turks are buying Russian SAMs, but that's just the normal "international affairs" type thing, I mean the UK sold plenty to Argentina before a minor dispute for example.

roadmaster

If somehow in a few years the air corps managed to end up with a squadron of gripens or second hand F16’s that will be coming on the market with the arroval of the F35 in several nato countrys, what works would need to be done to casement to handle them? Would new hangers have to he built or runway Have to be upgraded?

sparky42

roadmaster wrote: »

If somehow in a few years the air corps managed to end up with a squadron of gripens or second hand F16’s that will be coming on the market with the arroval of the F35 in several nato countrys, what works would need to be done to casement to handle them? Would new hangers have to he built or runway Have to be upgraded?

I'd say new hangers, weapon stores, test stands for maintenance, arming stands for the planes...

thomil

roadmaster wrote: »

If somehow in a few years the air corps managed to end up with a squadron of gripens or second hand F16’s that will be coming on the market with the arroval of the F35 in several nato countrys, what works would need to be done to casement to handle them? Would new hangers have to he built or runway Have to be upgraded?

Forget Casement. With the noise modern fighters make on take-off, every environmentalist, militant pacifist, and NIMBY between Dun Laoghaire and Kildare will be up in arms every time there's a scramble, or there's some nighttime training. It would be better to build a new facility next to a civilian airport such as Knock or Farranfore, somewhere out in the middle of nowhere. I can't see Casement being of any use for a fast jet squadron other than a heavy maintenance depot.

prinzeugen

thomil wrote: »

Forget Casement. With the noise modern fighters make on take-off, every environmentalist, militant pacifist, and NIMBY between Dun Laoghaire and Kildare will be up in arms every time there's a scramble, or there's some nighttime training. It would be better to build a new facility next to a civilian airport such as Knock or Farranfore, somewhere out in the middle of nowhere. I can't see Casement being of any use for a fast jet squadron other than a heavy maintenance depot.

Shannon would be ideal. Has the runway etc. A couple of hardened hangers, ammo stores and crew buildings and you could start very, very basic operations in theory.

roadmaster

i wonder would there be any opposition in a move from casement to Shannon from personal

sparky42

roadmaster wrote: »

i wonder would there be any opposition in a move from casement to Shannon from personal

If you were talking standing up a new squadron level Jet capability you'd need a significant increase in manpower so I suppose you could make it clear that they would be based there instead of Dublin.