Donald Trump Presidency discussion thread III

notobtuse

Kiith wrote: »

everlast75 wrote: »

How the people who voted for him could not see that he was a snake oil salesman beggars belief.

I've been curious for a while now just what it would take for his die hard base to stop supporting him. Cause it seems like he can say or do anything, and they will continue to swear by the man.

Simple... When his negatives outweigh his positives.  Hasn't happened yet as actions speak louder than words.  And his actions have been mighty positive here, IMO.

Water John

Doubt he's getting much action there, ATM.
Donald has a new cover of Time, to hang in his hotel lobbies. He can use it to replace, the made up ones.

BabyCheeses

pixelburp wrote: »

Honestly, I could see the appeal of Trump during the election, in a certain light: he & his mouthpieces managed to build a narrative that portrayed him as the outsider, the maverick business-man who Got Sh*t Done, and wasn't beholden to Washington (it can't be over-emphasised just how much distrust there is for the concept of 'Washington DC' in certain states; politicians have sewn that hatred for years now - and it works). Equally there's the persistent theory that business people are the ideal candidates to run countries: the lure of the private sector against the waste of the public; think of all the money he could make the nation; etc. etc.

Certainly when Hillary Clinton referred to Trump supporters as 'deplorables', it was the kind of own-goal the architects of the above narrative would never have imagined in their wildest dreams; it played perfectly into this myth. Here was Washington incarnate snubbing its nose at those suffering the most from America's slow decline.

Now, obviously the idea of a trust-fund real-estate billionaire from New York being the champion of the forgotten, rust-belt states was - and remains - the height of foolishness, but again I can see how his core supporters might cling to this idea of Trump swooping in, destroying all the evil liberals and lobby groups in Washington before reopening the steel plants & coal mines (let's ignore the reality of those mine owners generally being lobbyists themselves, not to mention awful employers in many cases).

It's the sunk cost fallacy in action: better to maintain said fallacy, than admit that you might have been conned into believing the blustering braggadocio of someone very far from being self-made - or as successful as he laboriously claims. Mind you, I've read more than a few accounts from Trump supporters, of reality sinking in and quietly conceding that maybe he wasn't the best choice and is doing more harm than good. The mid-terms will be the real litmus test there, and whether those with voters remorse will validate the presidency or kick against it.

Even from the very beginning most of us could see how it would go, even one of the excuses made for him was that he would act differently once he was president.

How is it that we could tell how things would go but they couldnt and had to come up with increasingly stupid excuses to defend him. Eventually the dems will be back in control, mines won't reopen and people waiting to be handed a job will eventually go back to complaining and repeat the cycle.

Eventually they will have to cut their losses by making more decisions decided by the states and leaving those areas to live in the messes made by their tantrum.

MarinersBlues

Ah his supporters are completely detatched from reality.


Hannity on Fox today:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2018/04/12/sean-hannity-comey-wouldnt-know-real-mob-boss-if-investigated-one-for-illegal-server.html

Since Comey can’t distinguish between homicidal criminals and a politician he disagrees with, it is worth reminding him what an actual mob boss looks like. Al Capone plagued society with illicit gambling, prostitution, tax evasion and an untold number of murders. Lucky Luciano was responsible for widespread extortion, prostitution rings, bootlegging and murder. John Gotti was convicted of 13 murders, and also profited from racketeering, tax evasion and gambling.

Trump has paid for sex with women, won't release his tax statements, has accusations of money laundering, obstruction of justice and bribery hanging over him, and owns casinos!

wes

PopePalpatine wrote: »

Something along the lines of watching the Supreme Neckbeard of Da'esh having sex with Melania.

They would probably enjoy that, and would suddenly realize that they hate a lot of the same groups.

The question would be do they hate each other more than that.

circadian

everlast75 wrote: »

For those following politics, you wonder going to bed at night what on earth he might say or do the next morning. That is an outrageous situation.

This is what I check in the morning. The fact that I have no idea what kind of world I'm waking up to each day is unnerving. The USA is not a nation I should be worried about engaging in something that could lead to market crashes or wars.

Igotadose

MarinersBlues wrote: »

Trump has paid for sex with women, won't release his tax statements, has accusations of money laundering, obstruction of justice and bribery hanging over him, and owns casinos!

There's a rumor of a love child too; guess this was just a matter of time. The mother denies it, though let's see the DNA! Birther II: Is Don the daddy?!
https://www.vanityfair.com/style/2018/04/donald-trump-love-child-national-enquirer-ami-catch

everlast75

Igotadose wrote: »

There's a rumor of a love child too; guess this was just a matter of time. The mother denies it, though let's see the DNA! Birther II: Is Don the daddy?!
https://www.vanityfair.com/style/2018/04/donald-trump-love-child-national-enquirer-ami-catch

I think it has already been debunked...

everlast75

20 mins ago RR was seen leaving the White House....

Hande hoche!

everlast75 wrote: »

20 mins ago RR was seen leaving the White House....

Forgive my ignorance but RR?

everlast75

Hande hoche! wrote: »

Forgive my ignorance but RR?

Sorry - assistant Attorney General Rod Rosenstein

UsedToWait

I know this is a serious political thread, but I must admit to slight schadenfreude seeing Little Smart Bomb Man sitting with his arms folded, like a chastised schoolboy, saying today we may strike soon or not at all.

Enjoyment only slightly tempered by the realisation of the extent that Putin really has a malign hold over most of the planet.

As we know, the Americans themselves are not averse to a bit of manipulation of other countries political systems, up to and including exploding cigars.
They'd want to get their act together if they plan on holding on to their World Police badge.

Mumha

MJ Lee @mj_lee (CNN) 2:37 PM - Apr 12, 2018

NEW: Trump doorman Dino Sajudin releases statement: "I was instructed not to criticize President Trump's former housekeeper due to a prior relationship she had with President Trump which produced a child.” (via @soniamoghe)

Mumha

Trump, Mueller teams prepare to move forward without presidential interview

Apparently talks have broken down and the Mueller team is now going to bring forward the Obstruction report sooner than was expected.

everlast75

Mumha wrote: »

Trump, Mueller teams prepare to move forward without presidential interview

Apparently talks have broken down and the Mueller team is now going to bring forward the Obstruction report sooner than was expected.

Unfortunately the report will not see the light of day if the Reps control the houses...

Leroy42

Is refusing to talk to an official investigation not in itself obstruction?

Mumha

everlast75 wrote: »

Unfortunately the report will not see the light of day if the Reps control the houses...

I have a feeling that the country would shut down if they tried to do that. In any case, the Obstruction case is just one strand of the Mueller investigation.

Mumha

Leroy42 wrote: »

Is refusing to talk to an official investigation not in itself obstruction?

No, but if Mueller wanted to he could subpoena Trump to appear before a Grand Jury, where he would have no legal representation inside the courtroom. At that point Trump could just keep taking the 5th, but that would look terrible.

Mueller might not want to push it just now anyway, as he has so many other leads.

aloyisious

Leroy42 wrote: »

Is refusing to talk to an official investigation not in itself obstruction?

Maybe if the refusal was given after being subpoenaed. Re the breakdown, if not from an earlier time, that was coming down the tracks from the day of the raids as Don's people were just sitting down in the W/House with Rob Muellers team to discuss the terms of the interview when the news broke on TV.

Mumha

Stormy Daniels lawyer MIchael Avenatti is currently on MSNBC in relation to the NDA suit, and has just said that he has been informed that Michael Cohen intends to plead the 5th if his motion fails !

Mumha

Mumha wrote: »

MJ Lee @mj_lee (CNN) 2:37 PM - Apr 12, 2018

NEW: Trump doorman Dino Sajudin releases statement: "I was instructed not to criticize President Trump's former housekeeper due to a prior relationship she had with President Trump which produced a child.” (via @soniamoghe)

https://twitter.com/louchenightout/status/984527227923595264

Itssoeasy

Defense secretary Jim Mattis who was supposed to be travelling to New York tonight has apparently cancelled that trip. Didn't trump say he wouldn't telegraph what he'd do but because of his lack of self control he's already played his hand.

Itssoeasy

Also Trump's Defense that there was no collusion and therefore he's innocent means nothing really. Clinton and Andrew Johnson weren't and nixon wouldn't have been impeached because of collusion.

It's not the crime it's the cover up. Clinton was impeached for amongst other things lying under oath to a grand jury, and Andrew Jackson had 11 articles of impeachment brought against him, of which two were "Making three speeches with intent to show disrespect for the Congress among the citizens of the United States." and "Bringing disgrace and ridicule to the presidency by his aforementioned words and actions."

Obstruction of justice btw is an impeachable crime for a US president, so Trump can shout no collusion all he bloody well likes but obstruction of justice could get him, if not impeached them certainly in trouble.

Mumha

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Defense secretary Jim Mattis who was supposed to be travelling to New York tonight has apparently cancelled that trip. Didn't trump say he wouldn't telegraph what he'd do but because of his lack of self control he's already played his hand.

It's also worth noting that Rosenstein was at the WH today.

aloyisious

According to Bloomberg, Don has hinted at a return by the US to the Trans-Pacific Trade Pact, the pact he broke with and that he's said there may be no trade tariffs with China. The reported statements may be part of his trade-deal tactics as usual keeping the O/P off balance.

Mumha

Breaking .... Trumpers fear the FBI may have lifted taped conversations from Cohen's phone etc as he was known for doing such recordings...

everlast75

Mumha wrote: »

Breaking .... Trumpers fear the FBI may have lifted taped conversations from Cohen's phone etc as he was known for doing such recordings...

If only there was some sort of lesson from recent history from which they could have learned to avoid such a scenario....

Akrasia

Leroy42 wrote: »

Good post, and to further that I think that is why Ryan is going. I'm sure he does want to spend time with the kids (although bizarrely he also stated that the last thing his kids want!) but I think he has fought hard to get to the place where the GOP was in complete control. House, Senate and POTUS. He has dealt with a GOP POTUS with a DNC controlled house, and the 8 years of Obama and this was the holy grail.

And now he finds that rather than being perfect, he is faced with a POTUS that is totally off the wall and almost makes things more difficult. H Even if the GOP hands on to the majority in November, with Trump as POTUS nothing will be done. The more likely is that the DNC take over the house and then he loses even the semblance of power. Added with that, if things continue on, it is likely that the DNC will win back the POTUS at 2020. Why would he hang around for.

When even your own party cannot see an advantage in you being there it really is open time on the point of it all.

Ryan is leaving because having passed the tax bill his donors wanted, he can now cash in. He'll be given all kind of cushy kickbacks after he leaves as delayed payment for corrupt services rendered. A trillion dollar tax cut passed by the 'fiscal conservative'

He knows he'll be haunted by that politically at reelection so why bother getting reelected when he can get paid instead

ECO_Mental

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/04/12/politics/comey-book-golden-showers/index.html

This Comey book is going to be great.....CNN have got an early copy and Trumpski brought up the golden shower thing a couple of times. He wanted the FBI to investigate it. House of cards has nothing on this presidency.

I think Comey is going to go full on attack on Trump. Can't wait, first interview this Sunday I think and he's doing interview all week...

The only thing that could spoil this if there was a war......wait What!

everlast75

ECO_Mental wrote: »

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/04/12/politics/comey-book-golden-showers/index.html

This Comey book is going to be great.....CNN have got an early copy and Trumpski brought up the golden shower thing a couple of times. He wanted the FBI to investigate it. House of cards has nothing on this presidency.

I think Comey is going to go full on attack on Trump. C

Not knowing how much of the book is dedicated to salacious gossip, but IMHO he should have just stuck to the important facts about mismanagement, incompetence etc rather than sex tapes and tiny hands. The gossip detracts from the weight of his serious comments and gives the critics plenty to aim at