Donald Trump Presidency discussion thread III

Christy42

Err the numbers are all largely similar to Obama's era. As I said a slight increase is not a massive achievement.

Especially when you are pumping in tax breaks and ratcheting up the debt (as you mentioned for Obama but left out for Trump). The difference of course being Trump is desperately pumping money into a healthy economy looking for a win he can claim while Obama did it to save a collapsing economy.

You keep claiming best ever figures for Trump but left out best ever is just a small bit better than what we had (after the guy who did all the work).

A carbon rod would have achieved the same figures.

Captain Obvious

RIGOLO wrote: »

And like all economic numbers it has to be looked at in tandem with many others wage earnings, debt , deficit, GDP, inflation , interest rates, yield curve etc.
All of which are very positive and reflect Trump Administration achievements on the multi-strategy multi-pronged economic strategy.

This is just nonsense, or more likely, flat out lies. National debt is projected to soar by ten trillion dollars over the next ten years. The deficit is expected to rise to a trillion annually. Inflation has hit a six year high and wiped out the meager wage benefits anyone has gotten.



https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/09/us/politics/federal-deficit-tax-cuts-spending-trump.html


https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2018/07/12/inflation-hits-year-high-wiping-out-wage-gains-average-american/?__twitter_impression=true&utm_term=.87f98c4986ec


What world are you living in?

weisses

RIGOLO wrote: »

All this guff about the economic progress being the result of Obama has to stop at some point, at some point anti-Trumpers will have to accept its now become Trumps economy.. or do ye plan on saying any positive economic data is the result of Obama right up to November 2020,

Obama came into power just after the biggest economic collapse in decades, Under him the economy turned and is on a upwards trend ever since, and is continue to grow under Trump

Piece here who explains it nicely

So what is the most honest way of talking about the Trump economy? It goes like this: The president inherited an economy that had come a long way toward healing. During his administration, the economy has continued growing at about the same rate it did before he took office, pushing incomes, employment and output to yet higher levels.

There are plenty of problems that remain in the United States, economic and otherwise, and the degree of credit the president deserves for the state of the economy is an open debate. But this is a bathtub that is already pretty full, and the water’s rising nicely.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/09/upshot/how-good-is-the-trump-economy-really.html

sameoldname

RIGOLO wrote: »

As any economist will tell you creating jobs in rising market is far harder than creating jobs when you have injected $4Trillion in QE into the economy. 
And like all economic numbers it has to be looked at in tandem with many others wage earnings, debt , deficit,  GDP, inflation , interest rates, yield curve etc. 
All of which are very positive and reflect Trump Administration achievements on the multi-strategy multi-pronged economic strategy.
All this guff about the economic progress being the result of Obama has to stop at some point, at some point anti-Trumpers will have to accept its now become Trumps economy.. or do ye plan on saying any positive economic data is the result of Obama right up to November 2020, or perhaps do ye plan to extend that into the second term 2020-2024 and if the US economy is doing well then its because of Obama 8 years ago.Besides your ignoring the reality of what the American voters experienced in their pockets.. 
Remember Obama and the DNC lost over 1000 local, state and congress seats in his 8 years , and ultimately the voters rejected more of the same economic policy when HRC was offered to them in 2016. 
Its Trumps Administrations economy and its booming. Roll on November , the blue wave will lock in the house and Senate a, perhaps another SCOTUS pick, and 2020 will be a lock in also. 

ohh and before the usual typical remarks about 'whatabouttery ' cos I mentioned Obama, Im responding to a post where someone else brought up Obama. 
Max Foster CNN reporting from outside Windsor said theres no sign of much of a protest, alot of barriers but not many protestors is what he said. I dont see that massive protest materialising, even the numbers in London look pretty small so far.

He's reduced taxes and increased government spending so the economy would want to be growing. Unfortunately it's not growing fast enough to offset the money he's spending with taxes coming in, so he's essentially just borrowing from tomorrow to bribe people today. All the while safe in the knowledge that it's not his own money he's wasting.

everlast75

A page from The Scotsman newspaper, on the cusp of his visit (to his own golf course. Gotta line those coffers)

Incredible to think that they felt the need to say this about the US President



Bravo

robinph

RIGOLO wrote: »

Max Foster CNN reporting from outside Windsor said theres no sign of much of a protest, alot of barriers but not many protestors is what he said. I dont see that massive protest materialising, even the numbers in London look pretty small so far.

That's why they have gone to Windsor, Blenheim, Chequers etc. They are locations within easy helicopter distance, but not great for the general public to get to in large numbers.

The protests are in the centre of London. Windsor is outside of the M25, has a relatively small train station, he's only popping in for tea and biscuits, and I doubt the locals would really want to be messing up the Queens back yard much.

everlast75

robinph wrote: »

That's why they have gone to Windsor, Blenheim, Chequers etc. They are locations within easy helicopter distance, but not great for the general public to get to in large numbers.

The protests are in the centre of London.

They are holding up Obama signs too. Hilarious

dr.fuzzenstein

RIGOLO wrote: »

As any economist will tell you creating jobs in rising market is far harder than creating jobs when you have injected $4Trillion in QE into the economy. 
And like all economic numbers it has to be looked at in tandem with many others wage earnings, debt , deficit,  GDP, inflation , interest rates, yield curve etc. 
All of which are very positive and reflect Trump Administration achievements on the multi-strategy multi-pronged economic strategy.
All this guff about the economic progress being the result of Obama has to stop at some point, at some point anti-Trumpers will have to accept its now become Trumps economy..

OK, I am willing to say that Trump has, so far, not managed to destroy the economy.
But he's a republican, give it time.

Quin_Dub

RIGOLO wrote: »

As any economist will tell you creating jobs in rising market is far harder than creating jobs when you have injected $4Trillion in QE into the economy. 

No. No they won't , ever.

That's like saying it's easier to get wet in the rain then it is in a swimming pool..

RIGOLO wrote: »

And like all economic numbers it has to be looked at in tandem with many others wage earnings, debt , deficit,  GDP, inflation , interest rates, yield curve etc. 
All of which are very positive and reflect Trump Administration achievements on the multi-strategy multi-pronged economic strategy.

Again, No.. No they are not.. All of those measures are moving in the wrong direction for a long term healthy economy and in some cases dramatically so.

RIGOLO wrote: »

All this guff about the economic progress being the result of Obama has to stop at some point, at some point anti-Trumpers will have to accept its now become Trumps economy.. or do ye plan on saying any positive economic data is the result of Obama right up to November 2020, or perhaps do ye plan to extend that into the second term 2020-2024 and if the US economy is doing well then its because of Obama 8 years ago.Besides your ignoring the reality of what the American voters experienced in their pockets.. 
Remember Obama and the DNC lost over 1000 local, state and congress seats in his 8 years , and ultimately the voters rejected more of the same economic policy when HRC was offered to them in 2016. 
Its Trumps Administrations economy and its booming. Roll on November , the blue wave will lock in the house and Senate a, perhaps another SCOTUS pick, and 2020 will be a lock in also. 

ohh and before the usual typical remarks about 'whatabouttery ' cos I mentioned Obama, Im responding to a post where someone else brought up Obama. 
Max Foster CNN reporting from outside Windsor said theres no sign of much of a protest, alot of barriers but not many protestors is what he said. I dont see that massive protest materialising, even the numbers in London look pretty small so far.

I think the general consensus is that it takes about 18 months or so for a new administrations policies to start being influential to the overall economic indicators.. So for Trump , that's around now.

And guess what?.. The numbers don't look great moving forward from here. The net set of bond yields are likely to be ugly.

The approval ratings for his Budget changes is dropping as people see the full implications of the change - Yes most people are seeing a few extra dollars in their pay checks (nothing like the huge windfall for the mega wealthy and Corporations though ) , but they have lost far more that they have gained through price increases etc. and they are seeing the inequality of the benefits more clearly as well.

So , no the outlook for the "Trump Economy" is not great at all. It's probably fair to say that the longer term negative implications of his policies will not be seen fully before November so it's impact one way or the other is unclear..

The Dems are unlikely to be able to use the economy as a weapon against Trump in November (but absolutely will in 2020) , but equally the GOP aren't going to have a whole lot to crow about either..

manual_man

It's actually surreal and hilarious to see this trump baby balloon stuff. TDS spreads far further than the U.S. itself

StringerBell

Wouldn't it be great if one of the Trump lads had an original thought or something now and then instead of taking something from elsewhere and just parroting it ad nauseum?

Though I suppose parroting the latest buzzword is symptomatic of the president too.

Thargor

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

OK, I am willing to say that Trump has, so far, not managed to destroy the economy.
But he's a republican, give it time.

Rigolo can you please look at this graph and tell us how you can claim any of it is Trumps doing with a straight face? You're either lying or completely economically illiterate.

RIGOLO

Captain Obvious wrote: »

RIGOLO wrote: »

And like all economic numbers it has to be looked at in tandem with many others wage earnings, debt , deficit,  GDP, inflation , interest rates, yield curve etc.
All of which are very positive and reflect Trump Administration achievements on the multi-strategy multi-pronged economic strategy.

This is just nonsense, or more likely, flat out lies. National debt is projected to soar by ten trillion dollars over the next ten years. The deficit is expected to rise to a trillion annually. Inflation has hit a six year high and wiped out the meager wage benefits anyone has gotten.



https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/09/us/politics/federal-deficit-tax-cuts-spending-trump.html


https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2018/07/12/inflation-hits-year-high-wiping-out-wage-gains-average-american/?__twitter_impression=true&utm_term=.87f98c4986ec


What world are you living in?

Id hazard a guess that you dont actually understand the implications of the numbers and what they mean. 
A slight rise in inflation coupled with rising wages in a near 'fully' employed economy is far better option than the prior administration of low inflation no wage growth and high unemployment. The Fed had in fact been targetting, trying but failing to hit its 2% target for many years. They want to increase rates and reduce their balance sheet and have been waiting for healthy inflation.
Do you have any posts you made expressing concern about the 7Trillion Obama actually added to the debt (the highest $$ amount of any POTUS) , or are you only concerned with US debt cos its a something you percieve can be used to bash Trump ? 
The markets have not hit the panic button yet, the only ones pulling random economic numbers out of context and screaming look at this number , are the anti-Trumpers.

Hande hoche!

He is striking a conciliatory tone during the press conference. Of course that might not last long...

DrumSteve

Did he just say he didn't criticise her?

:rolleyes:

Good lord.

RIGOLO

Thargor wrote: »

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

OK, I am willing to say that Trump has, so far, not managed to destroy the economy.
But he's a republican, give it time.

Rigolo can you please look at this graph and tell us how you can claim any of it is Trumps doing with a straight face? You're either lying or completely economically illiterate.

Frankly mollysmiddleamerica.blogspot isnt on my bookmarks.
I have Reuters, Bloomberg, CNBC, FT etc  to name but a few, I look to their charts, Ive not been tracking mollysmiddleamerica economic reports. 

As Ive said before 
And like all economic numbers it has to be looked at in tandem with many others wage earnings, debt , deficit, GDP, inflation , interest rates, yield curve etc. 
All of which are very positive and reflect Trump Administration achievements on the multi-strategy multi-pronged economic strategy.
All this guff about the economic progress being the result of Obama has to stop at some point, at some point anti-Trumpers will have to accept its now become Trumps economy.. or do ye plan on saying any positive economic data is the result of Obama right up to November 2020,
Remember Obama and the DNC lost over 1000 local, state and congress seats in his 8 years , and ultimately the voters rejected more of the same economic policy when HRC was offered to them in 2016. 
Its Trumps Administrations economy and its booming. Roll on November , the blue wave will lock in the house and Senate a, perhaps another SCOTUS pick, and 2020 will be a lock in also. 
Perhaps molly can also chart the loss of legislative seats, wage earnings, GDP and a few others onto Obamas jobs record.. perhaps then people might ask what really went on in the US in that time period, and perhaps people will understand then why Trump won. 
And why he will win in 2020 and November.

B0jangles

Hande hoche! wrote: »

He is striking a conciliatory tone during the press conference. Of course that might not last long...

Isn't that what he always does? He's all smiles and compliments when the person's in the room with him; he's usually only brave enough to start with the insults when he's safely out of the country.

Hande hoche!

B0jangles wrote: »

Isn't that what he always does? He's all smiles and compliments when the person's in the room with him; he's usually only brave enough to start with the insults when he's safely out of the country.

There's also the mandatory mention of fake news. Usually with a shot at CNN. The Putin meeting should be interesting on Monday.

RIGOLO

Quin_Dub wrote: »

I think the general consensus is that it takes about 18 months or so for a new administrations policies to start being influential to the overall economic indicators.. So for Trump , that's around now.

And guess what?.. The numbers don't look great moving forward from here. The net set of bond yields are likely to be ugly.

The approval ratings for his Budget changes is dropping as people see the full implications of the change - Yes most people are seeing a few extra dollars in their pay checks (nothing like the huge windfall for the mega wealthy and Corporations though ) , but they have lost far more that they have gained through price increases etc. and they are seeing the inequality of the benefits more clearly as well.

So , no the outlook for the "Trump Economy" is not great at all. It's probably fair to say that the longer term negative implications of his policies will not be seen fully before November so it's impact one way or the other is unclear..

The Dems are unlikely to be able to use the economy as a weapon against Trump in November (but absolutely will in 2020) , but equally the GOP aren't going to have a whole lot to crow about either..

18 months.. theres zero serious economic commentators that would consider Obamas shadow has lasted that long.
 
The Trump Administration made so many and such sesimic changes in such a short space of time theres very little if anything left of Obama economic policy. 
I suspect the 18 months ohh it was all Obama concept ,is a  head in the sand outlook , a sort of  comfort blanket for those who see progress under Trump but cling to a fallacy that any progress is due to Obama... cling to it, cling to it .. it will keep you warm in November when GOP romp home  but it will be worn out by 2020 when Trump II begins.

DrumSteve

Here comes Fox with the softball.

everlast75

https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1017759398377205761

Will someone now please get this guy mentally assessed?

Thargor

RIGOLO wrote: »

Frankly mollysmiddleamerica.blogspot isnt on my bookmarks.
I have Reuters, Bloomberg, CNBC, FT etc  to name but a few, I look to their charts, Ive not been tracking mollysmiddleamerica economic reports. 

As Ive said before 
And like all economic numbers it has to be looked at in tandem with many others wage earnings, debt , deficit, GDP, inflation , interest rates, yield curve etc. 
All of which are very positive and reflect Trump Administration achievements on the multi-strategy multi-pronged economic strategy.

No, they dont, they show a continuation of the economic improvements that started under Obama, can you show a single improvement that backs up your claims or are you just making them up?

DrumSteve

I call it the "Riiiiiiigggged Witchhunt" (repeat Ad Nauseum)

everlast75

RIGOLO wrote: »

Max Foster CNN reporting from outside Windsor said theres no sign of much of a protest, alot of barriers but not many protestors is what he said. I dont see that massive protest materialising, even the numbers in London look pretty small so far.

https://twitter.com/TideLineArt/status/1017743560744095744

Thargor

Ive said it before but look at Rigolos posts, quote them and see all the crazy BB code, broken quote tags, font size changes and other odd things, what is going on there? Is he a paid shill using some weird software? Ive seen him pop up in other places the instant Trump is mentioned aswell, its really bizarre.

Thargor

This press conference is excruciating

Larbre34

B0jangles wrote: »

Isn't that what he always does? He's all smiles and compliments when the person's in the room with him; he's usually only brave enough to start with the insults when he's safely out of the country.

Its not bravery, its textbook psychopathy.

Even for him though, declaring an interview which was audio recorded and given to a preferred organisation owned by a friend, as fake news, is quite some stretch.

I must say I genuinely feel sorry for Theresa May these last few days. She is trying to square an impossible circle domestically, attempting to mitigate the greatest act of national self harm in the modern age, all the while having to placate the biggest herd of utterly moronic man-children both foreign and domestic.

Leroy42

RIGOLO wrote: »

18 months.. theres zero serious economic commentators that would consider Obamas shadow has lasted that long.
 
The Trump Administration made so many and such sesimic changes in such a short space of time theres very little if anything left of Obama economic policy. 
I suspect the 18 months ohh it was all Obama concept ,is a  head in the sand outlook , a sort of  comfort blanket for those who see progress under Trump but cling to a fallacy that any progress is due to Obama... cling to it, cling to it .. it will keep you warm in November when GOP romp home  but it will be worn out by 2020 when Trump II begins.

But none of the results currently show anything seismic. All the positives you spout are in line, as has been pointed out to you numerous time, with what was already in place with Obama.

I would have expected that seismic changes could be spotted on the indicators. Maybe you have a different meaning of the word seismic.

Or is this like you postings about Nato increase in spending. Where, despite many claims, you have failed to back them up with anything other than some comments from a press briefing.

What effect has the massive corporate tax cut, costing the US trillions of dollars of tax revenue, had on the economy? Again, it really should be easy enough to show a graph showing the increase (or decrease depending on what you are measuring) that has happened at a clearly different rate under Trump.

You appear to be letting you bias get in the way of the actual evidence.

mcmoustache

everlast75 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1017759398377205761

Will someone now please get this guy mentally assessed?

He really makes it difficult to have a serious political discussion about him. Whether he believes what he says or not, neither option reflects well on him. The most astounding thing is the lengths that people will go to defend him.

I don't remember seeing such a defence of GWB back in the days when the neocon agenda was in vogue. I also don't remember people defending him with the same sycophantic fervour that we see with Trump. These are strange times.

irishash

RIGOLO wrote: »

Frankly mollysmiddleamerica.blogspot isnt on my bookmarks.
I have Reuters, Bloomberg, CNBC, FT etc  to name but a few, I look to their charts, Ive not been tracking mollysmiddleamerica economic reports. 

How about Forbes....that good enough for you?? Pretty much identical to molly.....

Source - https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamhartung/2017/04/08/march-jobs-report-10-impacts-on-you-including-falling-unemployment-and-rising-wages/#482e5d7e7462