Electrical Damage to Phone and iPad while charging on a bus.

money411

I was recently travelling from Dublin on a bus. I plugged in both my iPhone and iPad directly into the USB ports provided on the bus. Both devices died straight away. I had a diagnostics done on them and the chips were fried. This would be caused by to much power coming from the USB port. The bus company have refused to take responsibility. They claim no other person has had any issues so it can not be their fault. Does anybody have any advice on how to resolve this?

Xterminator

Hi Op

were you using an official apple cable?

http://appleinsider.com/articles/14/06/19/third-party-chargers-lightning-cables-reportedly-damage-iphone-power-management-ic-

"in theory cheap third-party products like USB adapters could potentially damage the sensitive circuitry of any iPhone model as they may not be built to acceptable tolerances and are thus unable to properly regulate voltage and current. As evidenced by Apple's recent recall of European market 5-watt power adapters, even the world's largest tech company runs into problems with manufacturing power regulating accessories.

Apple previously issued a warning to Chinese iPhone users last July asking that they use only official power adapters like those supplied with the device. The notice was issued after two people were electrocuted, one fatally, by iPhones connected to "counterfeit" adapters. "

This would be caused by to much power coming from the USB port

this is an opinion stated as fact. but the cable and the charging circuits on the device should prevent oversupply. 'If' they didnt, it wouldn't be a dublin bus issue.

money411

The device will draw the required amps but the voltage is supplied by the power outlet. My device was not plugged into an adapter. The device was plugged directly into the USB ports provided so there was no external fuse on the plug. The USB cable was a genuine apple one.

ED E

If they won't play ball you'd have to take them to the SCC but the cost of an engineers report would likely outway the depreciated value of the items.

money411

Would the SCC judgement not also include for the cost of the Engineers report?

seamus

No, the SCC generally doesn't award legal costs, only out-of-pocket expenses arising directly from the claim. Expenses incurred in proving your claim wouldn't be included.

Can you prove that the damage was definitely caused by the USB ports and not by the cable?

coylemj

Xterminator wrote: »

Hi Op

were you using an official apple cable?

http://appleinsider.com/articles/14/06/19/third-party-chargers-lightning-cables-reportedly-damage-iphone-power-management-ic-

"in theory cheap third-party products like USB adapters could potentially damage the sensitive circuitry of any iPhone model as they may not be built to acceptable tolerances and are thus unable to properly regulate voltage and current.

By 'USB adapter' they mean a mains plug-in adapters with a USB port. Even an official Apple cable isn't able to 'regulate voltage and current'.

Cabaal

You can prove whatever damage you like to the phone, unless you can prove the port is faulty by having it examined the bus compare right to tell you to go away.

Your device already could have had an issue before being connected

njs030

Cabaal wrote: »

You can prove whatever damage you like to the phone, unless you can prove the port is faulty by having it examined the bus compare right to tell you to go away.

Your device already could have had an issue before being connected

I was just about to say this. Without proving the port was faulty the damage could have happened anywhere.

Did you take the details of the bus op?

L1011

You would have to prove the damage was caused by the bus and also that you ensured to limit your exposure to the damage -plugging a second device in stops that approach dead. If the first was damaged by the bus power supply you became liable for causing the damaged to the second after being aware it was faulty.

eurokev

Well they are lying for a start that no one else have had problems, because I just replaced a pcb in a ghd hair straightener for someone in work whose daughter plug it in to the bus outlet

njs030

eurokev wrote: »

Well they are lying for a start that no one else have had problems, because I just replaced a pcb in a ghd hair straightener for someone in work whose daughter plug it in to the bus outlet

A ghd doesn't use a USB port so it can't have been the same outlet.
If she was doing her hair on the bus (ewww) she probably didn't report it as there's quite a major health and safety issue there.

Dj Tom

eurokev wrote: »

Well they are lying for a start that no one else have had problems, because I just replaced a pcb in a ghd hair straightener for someone in work whose daughter plug it in to the bus outlet

Are you Mcgyver!

L1011

eurokev wrote: »

Well they are lying for a start that no one else have had problems, because I just replaced a pcb in a ghd hair straightener for someone in work whose daughter plug it in to the bus outlet

USB cannot provide even close the required power for a hair straightener.

Dj Tom

L1011 wrote: »

USB cannot provide even close the required power for a hair straightener.

Could the 2 amp ones though?

L1011

Dj Tom wrote: »

Could the 2 amp ones though?

Not even close.

Low-end hair straightener driven at 5v would be 18A. Higher power ones would be 25A+. Port would go on fire if it even tried to deliver that.

Story is clear delusional nonsense, which is something I rarely get to say on here.

Skedaddle

I think they’re talking about a 230 volt mains socket outlet on a bus for the GHD.

I won’t use public USB sockets with my devices. At the end of the day, you’re plugging a device that could be worth up to a grand into an unknown power adapter of unknown quality.

At least if you’re using your own mains adapter you know what voltage you’re getting.

When I’m traveling outside Ireland and the UK, I just being an Apple 2-pin continental adapter. They’re tiny and practical compared to our giant ones and easily slip into a pocket.

L1011

Skedaddle wrote: »

I think they’re talking about a 230 volt mains socket outlet on a bus for the GHD.

What bus has a mains outlet on it? None.

It it was a mains outlet, its GHDs problem for not at worst failing cleanly for bad mains input. Should be a cartridge fuse at worst for items without an external power supply and a cheap PSU for those with one.

Skedaddle

L1011 wrote: »

What bus has a mains outlet on it?

Quite a few of them have for laptop charging nowadays.

Dj Tom

The trains have a 230 volt socket so presume buses do too.h

L1011

Skedaddle wrote: »

Quite a few of them have for laptop charging nowadays.

Never, ever seen one on a bus - and I work in a transit firm. They're normal on trains and planes now but not buses.

There is zero chance that a bus power supply, inverted from 24V, could kill what is basically just a kettle element anyway. More likely that using a GHD on a limited supply would kill the inverter.

And the supply on trains etc was never intended to be used for hair straightening!

Skedaddle

Bus Éireann advert with sockets : https://youtu.be/rgc16WsCkzA

They’re standard in their new expressway fleet and on some of their commercial competitors. However, usually those sockets are limited to about 3 or 5 amps at 230V as they’re only intended for laptop or phone charging, not heating devices.

The sockets on trains (in Ireland anyway) are usually full spec 13amp 230V just like in any home or office. There’s a lot more room on a train for serious mains power generators and all the air conditioning, lighting, catering equipment, information systems and so on runs off 230V - same as your house. A bus is a bit more challenging.

You could bring a USB tester (you’ll find these on amazon and so on) and check that the voltage is correct on a return journey. They’re a USB key with a little display that shows the voltage etc and typically cost about €15. They look very like a memory stick. Handy for testing chargers and ports.

As for the GHD - very difficult to prove it didn’t just fail randomly. It seems unlikely you’d get a big voltage spike on a system like that. It’s more likely the GHD would trip a fuse / beaker on the socket in the bus trying to draw too much juice.

DesperateDan

This sounds like an interesting challenge. So if I brought a kettle, toaster and hair straightener on my morning commute would any of them work on Bus Eireann buses or intercity trains? Would be nice if I could have all 3 on the go at the same time.

njs030

L1011 wrote: »

Never, ever seen one on a bus - and I work in a transit firm. They're normal on trains and planes now but not buses.

There is zero chance that a bus power supply, inverted from 24V, could kill what is basically just a kettle element anyway. More likely that using a GHD on a limited supply would kill the inverter.

And the supply on trains etc was never intended to be used for hair straightening!

They usually have them around the middle of the bus. I presumed they were for a vacuum cleaner!

If the bus stopped suddenly and she hit herself in the face with them open or worse they flew out of her hand and hit someone else she would be in a world of trouble. I wonder who's fault that would be!

Skedaddle

On a bus those sockets at 230V are typically limited to about 0.5 amps which is more than adequate for even the biggest laptop drawing about 100 Watts.

On a train, they may be normal sockets with 13amp capability but I would NOT suggest plugging in anything other than a laptop as they could also be on very low ampage circuit breakers and you could end up tripping all the sockets on that circuit and annoy everyone else.

Typically they're designed to trip if someone does try to power up a 2000 watt hairdryer or something like that.

As for your mobile, I would suggest ALWAYS using the mains adaptor that came with it or one that you trust and not just plugging into random USB sockets on walls.

eurokev

notjustsweet wrote:

A ghd doesn't use a USB port so it can't have been the same outlet. If she was doing her hair on the bus (ewww) she probably didn't report it as there's quite a major health and safety issue there.

I didn't plug it in. A guy brought it in to work. I'm an electrician.
He said daughter plug it in to the bus socket.
I didn't question it. I haven't been on a bus with a socket before, but I would say I've only been on a bus 2 or 3 times in the last ten years.
I took him at his word.

Anyway being an electrician I was able to diagnose that the PCB was blown and replaced it.
I certainly wouldn't be plugging anything expensive in to a socket on a bus myself

TerrorFirmer

L1011 wrote: »

Never, ever seen one on a bus - and I work in a transit firm.

Nearly all Citylink and Gobus buses have them and have for years, a lot of Bus Eireann ones do also.

I use them all the time, though never USB ports.