Jordan Peterson interview on C4

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

Perhaps we could alter the meaning of the word gender again and incorporate different species into it..

So it's ridiculous to identify as another species is it?

Why?

Do you think transgender people are insincere?

Why are they doing it then?

Junkyard Tom

Brian? wrote: »

What the hell has an economic theory got to do with Trans issues?

Probably refers to their Cultural Marxism conspiracy theory (or in Peterson's nomenclature 'Postmodern Neomarxism') trying to destroy western civilisation from within or some shit.

There are a number of well researched debunk vids on YouTube that heap scorn upon the pseudo-intellectual bullshit of those who cite the Cultural Marxist 'enemy within' conspiracy theory.

Enemy within
+
External threat
+
Reclaiming lost virtue/greatness
______________________________
= recipe for dictatorship

Penn

[Deleted User] wrote: »

And if a person decides that during their development, Chimp cells were activated, but there are no physical signs of such in their development, would they be allowed to identify themselves as a Chimp... demanding whatever pronouns they wished to be addressed by?

No, because that's f*cking stupid because it's not possible. It is possible between male and female though for the reasons I stated above.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Yeah loads ffs..
There was a load of pages about bathrooms and changing rooms.

But not per the list that you wrote. You're reaching.

Wouldn't it have been better to not have been called that?

Why? It did happen.. and it prepared me for worse when I became an adult. You don't seem to get this. The world is not a Disney paradise of flowers and dancing bears. People are nasty sometimes. People are often ignorant. You cannot shelter people completely, and they have to develop a thicker skin if they wish to live/look different from the majority.

Take my shaking disorder, for example. It's not terribly obvious unless you get close to me, but my body is always shaking. I get tremors in my hands, and spine, which results in my overall body shaking. It would be nice if people accepted it, and didn't comment on it.... but a great many do. And even when some people don't comment on it directly, they change their behaviors around me, and usually, the comments are made when I'm not in the room...

Safe spaces don't work to prepare people to live in the real world.. Be realistic.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Why?

Do you think transgender people are insincere?

Why are they doing it then?

I actually think it's some weird subject-object distortion.. like, beautiful women have been put on pedestals in our culture, and kind of been worshiped..I think it's a distortion of identification where the person wants to become the object of such adoration..

And I think there's a more societal thing now where it's just another label.. people are very quick to label themselves and to try to find something to identify as, that might explain why they're not happy and are kind of anxious..and this is the latest.. like to be cutting edge (pardon the pun) now in your late teens you probably have to have gender issues..

I think the movement pushing it politically is purely sinister..

20Cent

Penn wrote: »

No, because that's f*cking stupid because it's not possible. It is possible between male and female though for the reasons I stated above.

Same as during the same sex referendum.
They will want to marry their mothers, sisters, cat etc
Just a way to invalidate peoples identity.

coffee_cake

Penn wrote: »

Yes. From conception, as the child grows from a clump of cells to a child, it's possible for the brain to develop with female characteristics .

pretty sure that was debunked a while ago?
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2019/feb/24/meet-the-neuroscientist-shattering-the-myth-of-the-gendered-brain-gina-rippon

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

I actually think it's some weird subject-object distortion.. like, beautiful women have been put on pedestals in our culture, and kind of been worshiped..I think it's a distortion of identification where the person wants to become the object of such adoration..

And I think there's a more societal thing now where it's just another label.. people are very quick to label themselves and to try to find something to identify as, that might explain why they're not happy and are kind of anxious..and this is the latest.. like to be cutting edge (pardon the pun) now in your late teens you probably have to have gender issues..

I think the movement pushing it politically is purely sinister..

So they are faking it?

Pretty extreme thing to do for attention.

Junkyard Tom

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Probably refers to their Cultural Marxism conspiracy theory (or in Peterson's nomenclature 'Postmodern Neomarxism') trying to destroy western civilisation from within or some shit.

Well, why does it seem to be pushed by the same political factions?

Tony EH

Deleted User wrote: »

I actually think it's some weird subject-object distortion.. like, beautiful women have been put on pedestals in our culture, and kind of been worshiped..I think it's a distortion of identification where the person wants to become the object of such adoration..

And I think there's a more societal thing now where it's just another label.. people are very quick to label themselves and to try to find something to identify as, that might explain why they're not happy and are kind of anxious..and this is the latest.. like to be cutting edge (pardon the pun) now in your late teens you probably have to have gender issues..

I think the movement pushing it politically is purely sinister..

Wait...you think transgender people are faking it because they want to be hip?

Penn

Penn wrote: »

No, because that's f*cking stupid because it's not possible. It is possible between male and female though for the reasons I stated above.

You used possible a lot. This theory of yours been proven somewhere?

"Chimps, Humans 96 Percent the Same, Gene Study Finds"

""The goal is to answer the basic question: What makes us humans?" said Eichler.

"Scientists also discovered that some classes of genes are changing unusually quickly in both humans and chimpanzees, as compared with other mammals. These classes include genes involved in the perception of sound, transmission of nerve signals, and the production of sperm."

"Eichler and his colleagues found that the human and chimp sequences differ by only 1.2 percent in terms of single-nucleotide changes to the genetic code.

But 2.7 percent of the genetic difference between humans and chimps are duplications, in which segments of genetic code are copied many times in the genome."

Maybe if there's a discrepancy between your mental state and your physical body you're mentally ill as opposed to being in the wrong body..

Tony EH

Tony EH wrote: »

Wait...you think transgender people are faking it because they want to be hip?

How would you explain it's rise of late?

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

How would you explain it's rise of late?

More people coming out because it is more socially acceptable than the past.
Same as with homosexuality.

Tony EH

Deleted User wrote: »

How would you explain it's rise of late?

I don't see much of a "rise". To much time on the internet may give you that impression.

But seriously, you think transgender people are doing something for a fad? Really?

20Cent

bluewolf wrote: »

pretty sure that was debunked a while ago?
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2019/feb/24/meet-the-neuroscientist-shattering-the-myth-of-the-gendered-brain-gina-rippon

What do you think the reason is?

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Tony EH wrote: »

Wait...you think transgender people are faking it because they want to be hip?

I think there is research happening on social contagion in teenagers when it comes to transgenderism or at least somebody wants to study it.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Tony EH wrote: »

I don't see much of a "rise". To much time on the internet may give you that impression.

But seriously, you think transgender people are doing something for a fad? Really?

Look at the increase in numbers referred to the Tavistock clinic over the last decade or so.

Tony EH

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

I think there is research happening on social contagion in teenagers when it comes to transgenderism or at least somebody wants to study it.

There's a difference between somebody studying it or people being more open to transgender people's wishes...

...and people wanting to transgender cos they think it's cool.

Tony EH

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Look at the increase in numbers referred to the Tavistock clinic over the last decade or so.

Again though. I don't think it's that much of a "rise". I don't think we're going to be swamped by transgender people any time soon.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Tony EH wrote: »

There's a difference between somebody studying it or people being more open to transgender people's wishes...

...and people wanting to transgender cos they think it's cool.

Well, if there is an element of social contagion, what would be driving that?

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

How would you explain it's rise of late?

Well, it's not permanent is it anymore? Before the definition was pretty exclusive to people who had done the transition through surgery or hormonal treatments. So a long, painful and expensive procedure which would turn off a lot of people from committing to it.

But now Transgender includes people who can change their Gender whenever they want. Flip back and forth depending on how they feel.

So, the numbers are going to rise in a major way because they don't need to drastically change their lives to do it. In the case of those undergoing actual procedures, I think the increase was something like 20%. Don't have the article on hand now, but I found it on a google search so shouldn't be hard to find.

Junkyard Tom

Deleted User wrote: »

Well, why does it seem to be pushed by the same political factions?

As Zizek said to Peterson [paraphrasing] 'who are these people pushing Postmodern Neo-Marxism'?

What political factions exactly?

20Cent

Same argument was made about homosexuality.
They are just doing it for attention or because it's "cool" or similar nonsense.

Tony EH

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Well, if there is an element of social contagion, what would be driving that?

More people discussing the issue? People feel that it's less of a taboo subject to broach and are willing to talk about it more openly.

And, frankly, the internet makes it seem more prevalent than it actually is.

However, I certainly don't believe that there are men getting their dicks chopped off cos they think it's a cool thing to do. Certainly not in any numbers anyway.

Tony EH

Tony EH wrote: »

More people discussing the issue? People feel that it's less of a taboo subject to broach and are willing to talk about it more openly.

And, frankly, the internet makes it seem more prevalent than it actually is.

However, I certainly don't believe that there are men getting their dicks chopped off cos they think it's a cool thing to do. Certainly not in any numbers anyway.

What would you define transgender as? Who is covered under the term?

I tried asking 20Cent but he skipped over the question. Seems to me that the term has expanded in scope in recent years,... would you agree?

AllForIt

Gynoid wrote: »

I mean did you ever think you would see the day when a senior UK politician says on a mainstream tv program that babies have no sex.
It is fcuking bewildering what we have arrived at.

The same woman who a few years ago argued giving woman lighter sentences, non-custodial sentences ,where a man would get one - because woman who are involved in crime are associated with men. Thank God Labour plonked in the last election.

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

What would you define transgender as? Who is covered under the term?

I tried asking 20Cent but he skipped over the question. Seems to me that the term has expanded in scope in recent years,... would you agree?

The American Psychological Association uses this definition:

Transgender: An umbrella term encompassing those whose gender identities or gender roles differ from those typically associated with the sex they were assigned at birth.

Tony EH

Deleted User wrote: »

What would you define transgender as? Who is covered under the term?

I tried asking 20Cent but he skipped over the question. Seems to me that the term has expanded in scope in recent years,... would you agree?

I'm not sure it has to be honest and if there are some people who wish to expand it, I think they are very much a minority group. But, their will always be people who wish to expand terms to what they feel they should be expanded to. I'm sure bisexual people came in for some flak when they wanted their terms to be accepted.

As for what I determine it as, I can only say from meeting the few that I've met that it's transitioning from a gender to another.

However, that doesn't mean that there's been a "rise" or that these people are engaging in a life changing activity for the luls.

markodaly

OP here.

Over two years on and still people are triggered by Peterson.
The guy afaik is in rehab and has been out of the public spotlight for more or less the past year, yet people are still triggered by him and his opinions?