Jordan Peterson interview on C4

Ulysses Gaze

20Cent wrote: »

The alt right love him.
He gives an intellectual justification and veneer to their victimisation.

I think he is more a useful idiot to them.

He riles up elements of the Radical Left and there are a significant number of "trolls" within the Alt-Right/Kekistanis that get off on watching videos of SJW meltdowns.

JRant

Sand wrote: »

20 cent spent most of the Trump campaign in 2016 denouncing the alt-right. After the Trump victory he then opened a thread asking the question "So, what is this alt-right thing?".

The lad clearly has little idea of what the alt-right is beyond a pejorative for people he disagrees with.



So if someone is challenged by a person to a debate, they agree with the views and comments of the challenger? Whats the point of the debate then? Spencer clearly *needs* the fame/infamy of a debate with Peterson far more than Peterson needs it. Of course he is going to be polite and suck up in the request. As it was, Peterson wisely ignored or rejected it. You're going to have to do a lot better than that.

Like maybe take some view of Peterson, and establish how it aligns with the idealogy of the alt-right.

Yeah, just came to that conclusion myself. Should have known better really seeing as that poster is heavily involved in the cesspool that is the Donald Trump's thread.

markodaly

20Cent wrote: »

Backtracking now and moving the goalposts.
Those companies had employees embedded and working with the trump campaign. That's the claim I made and it has been shown to be true.
.

The claim that Google and Facebook worked hard to get Trump elected? No, you have, you are just wilfully lying away now and have been for a while now on this thread.

markodaly

20Cent wrote: »

Stand up straight, clean your room, like your kids etc reminds me if a bit Chris Rock does about people boasting about doing obvious things.

I presume you are male, do you not care about the higher suicide rates or males, or their mental health.

Sure, you may not like his methods or his politics but its irrefutable that he is reaching people and helping them, especially young males. Yet, here you are, pouring scorn on them, just for kicks and trying to win some petty political argument.

20Cent

JRant wrote: »

Ah, I get where you are coming from now. Basically you have no idea what Peterson actually believes, despite the fact he is quite clear in his views. You would do well to find a single example of him saying that minorities are not in someway disadvantaged. What he typically argues for is an examination of multi-variant statistics, instead of just parroting out unsubstantiated statistics. You know, look at the actual data and try to figure out how to improve the situation.

Judging by what is coming out of the university systems in Canada and the US then cultural Marxism is a very real thing. I'm sceptical on whether to this will destory society but it's good to have someone shining a light on it.

He claims that there is no such thing as white privilege. Only recently two black guys were arrested after a starbucks called the cops two minutes after they entered and were waiting for a friend.

20Cent

markodaly wrote: »

The claim that Google and Facebook worked hard to get Trump elected? No, you have, you are just wilfully lying away now and have been for a while now on this thread.

I said they were embedded with the trump campaign, this is a fact. You added the proviso "worked hard".

Ipso

If these people were the alt right, there would be hysterics.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/activists-workers-mark-may-day-slideshow-wp-173645080.html

20Cent

Have asked a few times but no Peterson supporters have replied yet.

Do you agree that postmodern neo-Marxists have infiltrated the education system to undermine western values in order to pave the road to totalitarianism?

This is a 911 truther level conspiracy theory.

JRant

20Cent wrote: »

He claims that there is no such thing as white privilege. Only recently two black guys were arrested after a starbucks called the cops two minutes after they entered and were waiting for a friend.

He is right though and as for those 2 Yahoo's, they refused to leave when asked by the store manager because they were not buying anything. Fairly standard stuff really but the lads decided to shout racism instead.

Stonedpilot

20Cent wrote: »

Have asked a few times but no Peterson supporters have replied yet.

Do you agree that postmodern neo-Marxists have infiltrated the education system to undermine western values in order to pave the road to totalitarianism?

This is a 911 truther level conspiracy theory.

Neo-Marxists are blinded beyond belief. Where did Jordan say they have infiltrated?.
Anyone with eyes can see Neo Marxism liberalism is all the rage in so called education. If these blind fools are undermining values as they dont have any themselved.

Peterson is disliked as he is an intelligent man who uses logic and rationale that comes from decades of experience. A modern day treasure as his mind has not being poisoned by political correctness.

20Cent

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

I think he is more a useful idiot to them.

He riles up elements of the Radical Left and there are a significant number of "trolls" within the Alt-Right/Kekistanis that get off on watching videos of SJW meltdowns.

I think he is a useful idiot for them as well just for a different reason.
He's rails against equality, diversity, inclusiveness and says black people have lower IQ's than white people. The there is also the marxists taking over society thing. No wonder they love him.

Stonedpilot

People will always be hated for telling the truth.

ALWAYS.

We live in lies, deceit and blissful ignorance. Please dont pop that bubble.

Ulysses Gaze

20Cent wrote: »

I think he is a useful idiot for them as well just for a different reason.
He's rails against equality, diversity, inclusiveness and says black people have lower IQ's than white people. The there is also the marxists taking over society thing. No wonder they love him.

Please link to where he has said this.

If he had said any of that, particularly the last part, he'd have been vilified and would not be interviewed on mainstream television and you know that.

Hector Savage

Swanner wrote: »

Social media also plays a massive role in the growing sensitivities and insecurities.

It's highly addictive and designed to feed off people's insecurities.

I honestly rate it up there with alcohol, prescription drugs, illegal drugs, sugar etc..

Spot on really.

20Cent

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Please link to where he has said this.

If he had said any of that, particularly the last part, he'd have been vilified and would not be interviewed on mainstream television and you know that.

A nice short (for Peterson) about how evil inclusivenss, diversity and equality are.
https://youtu.be/TqcRVmOpIbY

Dicussing race and IQ with Stefan Molyneux (alt right nut)
https://youtu.be/iF8F7tjmy_U

markodaly

20Cent wrote: »

I said they were embedded with the trump campaign, this is a fact. You added the proviso "worked hard".

Oh really? More lies. Maybe your username should be Lying_20Cent?

20Cent wrote: »

Wouldn't have twigged Silicon Valley as left wing. Google and Facebook worked hard to get trump elected.

markodaly

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Please link to where he has said this.

You are wasting your time. That poster will not post up that quote or a link to where he said that because he knows that its not true. Instead they will post up a few videos, in an effort to waste our time.

johnp001

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Please link to where he has said this.

If he had said any of that, particularly the last part, he'd have been vilified and would not be interviewed on mainstream television and you know that.

Peterson discusses the question of IQ and answers questions related to race and IQ here:

interviewer cited NYT article by geneticist David Reich

David Reich in NYT wrote:

This is why knowledgeable scientists must speak out. If we abstain from laying out a rational framework for discussing differences among populations, we risk losing the trust of the public and we actively contribute to the distrust of expertise that is now so prevalent. We leave a vacuum that gets filled by pseudoscience, an outcome that is far worse than anything we could achieve by talking openly.

in his questions to Peterson.

MrKingsley

20Cent wrote: »

A nice short (for Peterson) about how evil inclusivenss, diversity and equality are.
https://youtu.be/TqcRVmOpIbY

But did you actually watch that video? If you did I imagine you had your mind made up beforehand. He discusses how 'Equity' (ie equality of outcome) is a terrible idea. Not equality of opportunity.

Regarding inclusiveness and diversity he asks an incredibly relevant point. At what point will diversity/inclusiveness achieved? How are they defined? By Gender? Race? Disability? Economic status? Height? Appearance? Eye colour? Birthplace?

Dyr

Nixonbot wrote: »

Is he a mod here?

He isn't but that isn't stopping him from trying to backseat mod and you and the rest of the knitting circle seem happy enough to let him work away

We had a really big thread recently about ****ty moderation and mods getting passes, I think you AH mods locked it a few times.

Have a read through it some time.

20Cent

MrKingsley wrote: »

But did you actually watch that video? If you did I imagine you had your mind made up beforehand. He discusses how 'Equity' (ie equality of outcome) is a terrible idea. Not equality of opportunity.

Regarding inclusiveness and diversity he asks an incredibly relevant point. At what point will diversity/inclusiveness achieved? How are they defined? By Gender? Race? Disability? Economic status? Height? Appearance? Eye colour? Birthplace?

Another reason I dislike him the ridiculous extremes.

Normal person: "it's good to be inclusive and encourage diversity".

Jordan Peterson: "but how can everyone play the guitar the same and have the same experiences waaaa gulags the marxists will get us".

Dyr

20Cent wrote: »

Another reason I dislike him the ridiculous extremes.

Normal person: "it's good to be inclusive and encourage diversity".

Jordan Peterson: "but how can everyone play the guitar the same and have the same experiences waaaa gulags the marxists will get us".

mcmoustache

What's this neo-marxism thing that people are on about? Is it like cultural marxism or something? It sounds like a phrase that was made up so that people rant about something when they aren't really sure what they're ranting about.

benjamin d

mcmoustache wrote: »

...people rant about something when they aren't really sure what they're ranting about.

This pretty much sums up what one or two on this thread are doing.

Dyr

mcmoustache wrote: »

What's this neo-marxism thing that people are on about? Is it like cultural marxism or something? It sounds like a phrase that was made up so that people rant about something when they aren't really sure what they're ranting about.

Brett Weinstein, has a short description here. Given that he was a lefty who was a victim of what the likes of Peterson call Cultural Marxism, its worth a watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9osjKN5VWfM

milehip

irishguitarlad wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwXAB6cICG0&t=136s

A great video. Shows up Peterson for what he is.

Was expecting footage of him slapping children or some other nefarious act, you really over sold it with the showing him for what he really is hyperbole.

20Cent

Which is more likely?

1. A secret cabal of cultural marxists are helbent on destroying society for some reason.

2. People are better off these days, more empathetic to other groups and minorities have more of a platform to voice opinions so we hear about their issues.

benjamin d

20Cent wrote: »

Which is more likely?

1. A secret cabal of cultural marxists are helbent on destroying society for some reason.

2. People are better off these days, more empathetic to other groups and minorities have more of a platform to voice opinions so we hear about their issues.

What Peterson is saying is that:

1) There is a huge cohort in North American universities who ARE hellbent on creating some weird dystopia based on victimhood and identity politics. He's not saying they have the power, ability, or wherewithal to do it, but that some people are buying into the nonsense and he's pointing it out for what it is. He is not saying it's a cabal or conspiracy theory, he's saying it's a loose group of well paid idiots on a power trip who are determined to destroy anyone who doesn't wholeheartedly subscribe to their newspeak.

2) He's saying that the people who are being left behind in this brave new world need to take a good look at themselves and do it for themselves rather than relying on some groupthink bullcrap to sort their lives out.

Why you seem to think this is so dangerous I'd love to know.

mcmoustache

Bambi wrote: »

Brett Weinstein, has a short description here. Given that he was a lefty who was a victim of what the likes of Peterson call Cultural Marxism, its worth a watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9osjKN5VWfM

As the video was only 6 minutes, I gave it a watch.

I get his point that the loopers on the left of US campus politics, in an effort to gain "equality of outcome" or even turn the tables, are fond of publicly attacking those who don't share there feelings strongly enough. They try to shame, guilt, bully or otherwise coerce people into following their rather absurd ideas. Making things worse are lecturers and other staff by endorsing and even encouraging this nonsense. This creates an environment in US universities where expressing disagreement creates more trouble than it's worth and ends up in a form of self-censorship. I get that.

Presumably that's what he's describing as cultural marxism - a forced orthodoxy where there are sanctions for not being right-on enough or something like that.

What has been confusing me is that I'm hearing these terms thrown around a lot in an Irish context. It's similar to the nonsense about rape culture being freely bandied about by unoriginal "Social Media Influencers". It's like somebody coined the phrase to describe something that's rather confined to some subsection of society and people here picked up on it and apply it to Irish society as a whole.

I get that it's a problem over there but it's a bit overblown in an Irish context.

johnp001

Start the Week
Jordan Peterson on BBC radio 4 talking with a few others about 12 rules book.
Louise O'Neill comes across as spectacularly unselfaware.
Peterson doesn't get to say much but it was laughable when Peterson rejected some insinuations on the basis that they were unsupported by evidence but the insinuator defended his position by saying that Peterson couldn't prove that no evidence did exist.