Dubious banking investment advice: opinions please

gnalpp

Hello,

I was recently bereaved and recieved inheritance. I opened an account with a prominent banking institution and visited a branch to lodge the inheritance. I was brought aside by a banking agent who wanted to discuss investment opportunities. What follows has caused me some distress.

The agent began asking me my plans for the inheritance. They involve buying a house in a number of years time, but leaving Ireland in the interim. The agent proceeded to ask me what I would do if I fell ill with cancer, how would I afford treatment. This took me aback. The agent then proceeded to say that if that happened I wouldn't be able to afford to leave the country or buy a house down the line. They then began to say that they could help me plan for this by helping me with financial investments. I left at this point.

Can someone let me know if this is hugely inappropriate / should I make a complaint about this behaviour.

I'm a bit shocked and unsure what to do about it.

blindside88

To be honest these are quite relevant questions to be asked and to think about for yourself. They probably went about it in a poorly judged way by the sounds of it. It would be no harm in meeting with a financial advisor (in a different institution or brokers if you feel more comfortable) as in my experience most people have not greatly though about there financial future (you may have though about all of this previous). As regards the recent bereavement you should be classed as a vulnerable customer in my eyes and any advisor worth there salt should still give you the same options as anyone else but should definitely advise you not to rush into any decision and take some time to consider your options.

coylemj

gnalpp wrote: »

Can someone let me know if this is hugely inappropriate / should I make a complaint about this behaviour.

I wouldn't bother. If you outlined to the bank what you just posted here, he was doing exactly what is expected of him - identify customers with lump sums to invest and steer them towards the bank's products. That is all that banks care about these days - selling financial products.

'Hugely inappropriate' to you but as far as the bank is concerned, doing exactly what's expected of him. Or her.

Bubbaclaus

You're not seriously offended by that are you?

Mongfinder General

Buy the house. Money spent. No more lump sum. No more questions.

skippy2

Nothing changed with Irish Banks obviously...........and pretty insensitive and inappropriate. They have only one interest and it is not you
I would go in and close my account  and tell them why.......... not that they care but the only things banks in Ireland care about is money so hit them where it hurts when you can......Never buy anything from a bank re insurance etc you will always get a better deal elsewhere in my experience

Peregrinus

gnalpp wrote: »

I was recently bereaved and recieved inheritance. I opened an account with a prominent banking institution and visited a branch to lodge the inheritance. I was brought aside by a banking agent who wanted to discuss investment opportunities. What follows has caused me some distress.

The agent began asking me my plans for the inheritance. They involve buying a house in a number of years time, but leaving Ireland in the interim. The agent proceeded to ask me what I would do if I fell ill with cancer, how would I afford treatment. This took me aback. The agent then proceeded to say that if that happened I wouldn't be able to afford to leave the country or buy a house down the line. . . .

Seriously? Did it not occur to the agent if that if, God forbid, you did get cancer and need treatment, you might no longer wish to leave the country? And you might well reconsider or defer your plans to buy a house?

This looks like a piss-poor attempt to cross-sell products for the advantage of the bank, dressed up as financial advice but with only a token attempt to find out the client's circumstances, needs, objectives, attitude to risk, etc. Couple of standard questions, and then regardless of the answers get straight in to flogging the bank's products.

gnalpp wrote: »

I left at this point.

Good call. You need financial advice, but not like this.

gnalpp wrote: »

Can someone let me know if this is hugely inappropriate / should I make a complaint about this behaviour.

I'm a bit shocked and unsure what to do about it.

You should think about yourself first, and the bank second. A few thoughts.

You're recently bereaved, and probably should let things settle for a while before you make any major commitments. Looks like that's already your strategy.

When you feel ready, you should take financial advice but, as is now obvious, not from the bank. Go to a personal financial planner and pay him a fee to help you work out what you want, what you need, what suits your circumstances and objectives. If you don't pay him a fee, the only way he's going to get remunerated for his time and expertise is through commission on financial products that he sells you, which gives him a strong incentive to sell you stuff.

In the meantime, you have done the right thing in depositing the money in the bank. Banks may be lousy at providing financial advice, but they are pretty good at keeping your money safe for a few months while you come to terms with what has happened to you, and work out where you want to go from here. You don't want to leave the money on deposit for ever, but as a holding position for a few months it's the right thing to do.

Should you complain to the bank about your experience? Don't expect too much joy out of them if you do; you haven't actually lost any money as a result of this ham-fisted marketing effort. And, if the agent was out of line in the way they approached you, the bank will deal with that internally; you will not be told what has been said or done with respect to the agent.

But there's no harm at all in telling the bank that you felt you were treated badly at a time when you were vulnerable, that the episode did not inspire confidence in you as to the soundness of the bank's financial advice, and that when the time does come to take advice you will be taking it elsewhere. If enough customers say such things to banks, they might reconsider whether the hard sell is really the best thing.

ArthurG

gnalpp wrote: »

Can someone let me know if this is hugely inappropriate / should I make a complaint about this behaviour.

I'm a bit shocked and unsure what to do about it.

Presumably they didn't put a gun to your head and force you to accept financial planning advice, which it appears they were trying to do. You probably should have just refused their offer and walked away.

Marcusm

gnalpp wrote: »

Hello,

I was recently bereaved and recieved inheritance. I opened an account with a prominent banking institution and visited a branch to lodge the inheritance. I was brought aside by a banking agent who wanted to discuss investment opportunities. What follows has caused me some distress.

The agent began asking me my plans for the inheritance. They involve buying a house in a number of years time, but leaving Ireland in the interim. The agent proceeded to ask me what I would do if I fell ill with cancer, how would I afford treatment. This took me aback. The agent then proceeded to say that if that happened I wouldn't be able to afford to leave the country or buy a house down the line. They then began to say that they could help me plan for this by helping me with financial investments. I left at this point.

Can someone let me know if this is hugely inappropriate / should I make a complaint about this behaviour.

I'm a bit shocked and unsure what to do about it.

Other than ask to meet his supervisor on the spot and have his report his suggestions I would just pass on. He's clearly very poorly trained and has few if any social skills. He won't succeed and will be out of that job pretty quickly.

gnalpp

Thanks for all of the repsonses folks.

coylemj

Marcusm wrote: »

Other than ask to meet his supervisor on the spot and have his report his suggestions I would just pass on. He's clearly very poorly trained and has few if any social skills. He won't succeed and will be out of that job pretty quickly.

What have social skills got to do with it And by 'report his suggestions' you make it sound like the official invited the OP to a swinger's party.

Can we get real here for a moment? OP walked into a branch 'to lodge the inheritance' which I'm assuming is a large lump sum. They were then 'brought aside by a banking agent who wanted to discuss investment opportunities'. You don't just get talking to any old official in those circumstances, you get steered to a person whose sole job is to sell the bank's products.

That person is in that job because they are good at selling. The branch manager and the other staff may not like the way that person does the selling but at the end of the day you can be sure that hold their noses and get on with it because if the branch achieves it's targets, it keeps the regional manager and head office off their backs, they all get their bonuses and everyone is happy.

gnalpp

coylemj wrote: »

Marcusm wrote: »

Other than ask to meet his supervisor on the spot and have his report his suggestions I would just pass on.  He's clearly very poorly trained and has few if any social skills.  He won't succeed and will be out of that job pretty quickly.

What have social skills got to do with it And by 'report his suggestions' you make it sound like the official invited the OP to a swinger's party.

Can we get real here for a moment? OP walked into a branch 'to lodge the inheritance'. They were then 'brought aside by a banking agent who wanted to discuss investment opportunities'. You don't just get talking to any old official in those circumstances, you get steered to a person whose sole job is to sell the bank's products.

That person is in that job because they are good at selling. The branch manager and the other staff may not like the way that person does the selling but at the end of the day you can be sure that hold their noses and get on with it because if the branch achieves it's targets, everyone is happy.

I think you are missing the point. The issue is not with an individual doing their job. I sat in that room with the individual and felt like I was being emotionally manipulated - this is what has concerned me. My understanding is that investing for your financial future should be based upon rational decision making, not predicated by fear and emotional response - which is what the individual at hand was attempting to foster.

coylemj

gnalpp wrote: »

I think you are missing the point. The issue is not with an individual doing their job. I sat in that room with the individual and felt like I was being emotionally manipulated - this is what has concerned me. My understanding is that investing for your financial future should be based upon rational decision making, not predicated by fear and emotional response - which is what the individual at hand was attempting to foster.

I see your point but at the end of the day, all selling involves emotional manipulation. If you want tea and sympathy, meet up with an old friend, don't expect to get it from someone who is on commission to sell financial products.

BTW, I was at the end of the sales technique myself once. My bank offered me a 'free financial consultation' a while back so I went to a branch near my place of work and met a sleazebag who's only agenda was to sell me critical illness insurance. Couldn't wait to get out of the place but I put it down to experience and needless to say I didn't purchase anything he was offering.

dotsman

Just to add to this.

I wouldn't complain about the content of the financial adviser. He/she was doing the right thing, both from a back perspective and from a customer perspective. They are the hard questions that should be asked of everyone when it comes to financial planning and if you go to an independant adviser, you should expect to have the same discussion.

Now, if the language/tone etc of the advisor was wrong (ie the delivery of the message was wrong) then, yes, perhaps mention it to the bank that the adviser was to "salesy/pushy etc". But, I would reiterate that the content (what fallback do have if you or a dependent get seriously sick or you lose your job etc) is correct and important.

Jim2007

gnalpp wrote: »

I think you are missing the point.

No, you are the one missing the point! And is this, the advisor was asking the right questions and there are questions you need to face up to and address, no matter how unpleasant it may make you feel. Ensuring that you are covered for such issues is one of the first steps in putting a decent financial plan in place for you.

What will you do if you get up tomorrow morning stumble going down the stairs and incapacitated for life? Or if you need to have modifications doing to you living accommodation to be able to use a wheelchair... These things happen! One of my neighbours was doing a bit of DIY, he hopped up on a chair to touch up some painting and it gave way. Today he is in a wheelchair at 37... these things happen and preferring not to address them is not the way to go.

ZeroThreat

Jim2007 wrote: »

No, you are the one missing the point!

What will you do if you get up tomorrow morning stumble going down the stairs and incapacitated for life? Or if you need to have modifications doing to you living accommodation to be able to use a wheelchair...

ffs! There's only so far we can let the fear of freak accidents or the remote possibility of getting a serious illness guide our decisions(as in the bank official who tried to use a cancer scare to flog his BS to the OP).

At the end of the day no one can predict the future and you just have to get on with it.

Maybe I should stop all discretionary spending in case some motorist mounts the foot path and runs me over on the way home from work today, hmm?

Jim2007

ZeroThreat wrote: »

ffs! There's only so far we can let the fear of freak accidents or the remote possibility of getting a serious illness guide our decisions(as in the bank official who tried to use a cancer scare to flog his BS to the OP).

At the end of the day no one can predict the future and you just have to get on with it.

Except we are not talking about freak accidents, we're talking about common occupational injuries and the likes. Now in thirty years advising people I have found that most adults have responsibilities and commitments that they like to ensure they can cover should anything happen to them.

But you are right that such situations are not that common, which is why the premiums to get cover are usually not that high. So not a reason to take your BS for anything else.

ZeroThreat wrote: »

Maybe I should stop all discretionary spending in case some motorist mounts the foot path and runs me over on the way home from work today, hmm?

Not that is just silly! But if you have dependents it would probably be an idea to ensure that you are in a position to support them should anything happen. As unfortunately cars mount pavements have become a thing, as you well know.

Man dies after fall while taking down Christmas lights

I'm sure this father of two did not expect to die taking down Christmas lights. One can only hope for the sake of his family that his approach to risk was a bit more sensible than yours.

In a previous job I would get complaints off customers who “in their words” were “forced” and “scared” into purchasing an optional service.

They felt that the salesperson had listed off all these scary scenarios in order to manipulate them into purchasing the service
They would then ask for a refund as (lucky for them) they did not have to avail of the service

On the flip side. People who did not agree to the same service, and were then responsible for additional charges, would complain that they were NOT forced into purchasing the service and that the salesperson should have done more to scare them at the point of purchase as they never would have declined the service “if they had known”

While I agree that I would have been annoyed with the salesperson you described, it’s clear that one approach does not suit every customer. It’s also clear that some of the biggest hurdles in life that we face are scary and very sensitive, and sometimes have to be discussed with employees at a bank

Geuze

gnalpp wrote: »

I think you are missing the point. The issue is not with an individual doing their job. I sat in that room with the individual and felt like I was being emotionally manipulated - this is what has concerned me. My understanding is that investing for your financial future should be based upon rational decision making, not predicated by fear and emotional response - which is what the individual at hand was attempting to foster.

Many insurances are sold based on fear.

Health insurance is sold based on the fear of waiting lists.

The sellers attempt to instill fear in you.

This is nothing new.

Geuze

gnalpp wrote: »

The agent proceeded to ask me what I would do if I fell ill with cancer, how would I afford treatment. .

Note that healthcare is mainly financed by your taxes in Ireland, so treatment would cost you max 800 pa.

Heres Johnny

If he phrased it the way you say it's a bit blunt and over the top.

I did this sales/advisory job for a long time but I always had more empathy. But I was self employed and I was building up a client bank and I had their interests at heart as well as making a living for myself. When I sold my book of approx 500 clients many of them asked could they still keep in touch, many of them do and I provide advice for free and refer them on to people I trust. They call about all kinds of things, policies I sold them, pensions, mortgages, investments properties, inheritance, buying a car.....anything really.

In your situation I would have sat you down and had a proper chat to find out what your own plans were. I'd do a factfind then to match your own plans to affordability/reality and then advise.

If the clients dream was to buy a holiday home in France in 5 years time and retire there but couldn't afford it yet, I'd get them to invest lump sum in a very low risk fund and add to it through regular savings.
But you can bet your bottom dollar I'd also make sure they were aware of protection policies that could be put in place in the event of being unable to work due to illness or accident. The pay out there could be the difference between a dream being realised or being completely scuppered forever. I wouldn't be doing my job if I didn't. Some of my clients have become sick or injured and the policy helped them and their families. 2 clients died.

He is correct in what he was saying, protection is deemed the first thing an advisor should be talking about. It's relatively cheap for most people and should form part of any financial planning discussion.

But the way the banks go about it is cold and impersonal, I was trained to listen, be empathetic and advise.

I'm still in the industry in a consultancy/training/education role and the amount of people taking redundancy from banks the first chance they get and coming over to what I used to do is huge. The banks have to recapitalise and start turning a profit, sometimes at any cost. Look at the tracker mortgage scandal for example. There is huge pressure in banks these days.

Do talk to an advisor, but not a bank advisor. Place the money on deposit only with a bank and find someone you trust to talk to or recommend someone to you.