County council are happy with their tenants overholding

beauf · 09-02-2018 1:36pm

At the end of the day its about picking the least expensive option going forward. That would seem to be raising the rent at the legal limit, and staying a LL until it can be sold at a acceptable price.

....... · 09-02-2018 1:37pm

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pc7 · 09-02-2018 1:38pm

beauf wrote: »

At the end of the day its about picking the least expensive option going forward. That would seem to be raising the rent at the legal limit, and staying a LL until it can be sold at a acceptable price.

The fear among many landlords I know (myself included) is that going forward the government will stop you being able to sell. I cannot think of any other industry/sector where the government interferes so much.

whoopsadoodles · 09-02-2018 1:40pm

....... wrote: »

Why?

The bank will certainly have more legal power behind them than the OP will.

What? You don't see why that's such an abysmal idea?

Because the OP will be in bad credit for years for one.

....... · 09-02-2018 1:42pm

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beauf · 09-02-2018 1:43pm

pc7 wrote: »

The fear among many landlords I know (myself included) is that going forward the government will stop you being able to sell. I cannot think of any other industry/sector where the government interferes so much.

Its seems like that are making it an miserable business that you can't get out of. Which is way so many are trying to get out of it.

beauf · 09-02-2018 1:44pm

....... wrote: »

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Its a last resort in my opinion.

....... · 09-02-2018 1:55pm

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Bass Reeves · 09-02-2018 3:08pm

....... wrote: »

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whoopsadoodles wrote: »

What? You don't see why that's such an abysmal idea?

Because the OP will be in bad credit for years for one.

Aside from a bad credit rating the bank will charge penalties and interest on unpaid payments and have show that they are unwilling to let mortgage debt let off lightly. This is not even an option unless you cannot afford the rep[ayments

....... · 09-02-2018 4:07pm

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Fkall · 10-02-2018 1:21pm

hawkelady wrote: »

They have been asked by me and my solicitor and the council have said that they are interested in putting in an offer but the councils rules are that the property has to be vacant before they put in an offer !

I know I know. Madness

One option to explore would be to sell the house with the tenant in-situ. Without doubt this will substantially reduce the sales price however the council may very well be liable for the loss suffered.

Without doubt the threat will evoke a response

hawkelady · 10-02-2018 1:53pm

Fkall wrote: »

hawkelady wrote: »

They have been asked by me and my solicitor and the council have said that they are interested in putting in an offer but the councils rules are that the property has to be vacant before they put in an offer !

I know I know. Madness

One option to explore would be to sell the house with the tenant in-situ. Without doubt this will substantially reduce the sales price however the council may very well be liable for the loss suffered.

Without doubt the threat will evoke a response

Are you saying I tell the council I'm prepared to sell with tenant still living there?? The EA I was in discussions with have said to me that I'm to have it empty and a deep clean before they will put the for sale sign up.
I might say it to the council anyway to get a reaction at least. Is there any way they can come back to me and say I can't do this ?

whoopsadoodles · 10-02-2018 1:58pm

hawkelady wrote: »

Are you saying I tell the council I'm prepared to sell with tenant still living there?? The EA I was in discussions with have said to me that I'm to have it empty and a deep clean before they will put the for sale sign up.
I might say it to the council anyway to get a reaction at least. Is there any way they can come back to me and say I can't do this ?

Well that seems like a lot of nonsense for a start. Estate agents begin the sale of houses with tenants in situ every day of the week. Talk to someone else.

hawkelady · 10-02-2018 2:08pm

whoopsadoodles wrote: »

hawkelady wrote: »

Are you saying I tell the council I'm prepared to sell with tenant still living there?? The EA I was in discussions with have said to me that I'm to have it empty and a deep clean before they will put the for sale sign up.
I might say it to the council anyway to get a reaction at least. Is there any way they can come back to me and say I can't do this ?

Well that seems like a lot of nonsense for a start. Estate agents begin the sale of houses with tenants in situ every day of the week. Talk to someone else.

It's one of the top 3 estate agents !! They told me cause the council are involved this is the best route !! Maybe they knew more than they let on when I went into them. I have heard stories of tenants having the place in a tip when viewings were going on as it's in the tenants interests to stall a sale !!

scouserstation · 10-02-2018 5:19pm

hawkelady wrote: »

It's one of the top 3 estate agents !! They told me cause the council are involved this is the best route !! Maybe they knew more than they let on when I went into them. I have heard stories of tenants having the place in a tip when viewings were going on as it's in the tenants interests to stall a sale !!

Different estate agents have different sales strategies, some will not take on a sale with in-situ tenants as its more difficult to sell the property, some agents specialise in selling such houses, these would have the best experience with this type of sale. I know of at least 1 of the bigger estate agents in Dublin which sells a lot of property with tenants in-situ, though cant name them here

hawkelady · 10-02-2018 6:28pm

scouserstation wrote: »

hawkelady wrote: »

It's one of the top 3 estate agents !! They told me cause the council are involved this is the best route !! Maybe they knew more than they let on when I went into them. I have heard stories of tenants having the place in a tip when viewings were going on as it's in the tenants interests to stall a sale !!

Different estate agents have different sales strategies, some will not take on a sale with in-situ tenants as its more difficult to sell the property, some agents specialise in selling such houses, these would have the best experience with this type of sale. I know of at least 1 of the bigger estate agents in Dublin which sells a lot of property with tenants in-situ, though cant name them here

Can you pm me with the name please ?

scouserstation · 10-02-2018 7:58pm

hawkelady wrote: »

Can you pm me with the name please ?

Pm sent

hawkelady · 10-02-2018 8:27pm

Got it. Thanks a million

11-02-2018 10:36am

I don’t think it’s allowed in this country but I’d love if you could set up a competition to buy your house.

You base it off the Saturday night bonus ball. So divide the selling price of the house by however many numbers in the lotto. That’s the buy price of a number and whoever chooses the bonus ball wins the House (tenant in situ).

I’ve seen it done with bikes, boats and cars. I’m also still a bit tipsy but trying to think outside the box for ya

KellyXX · 11-02-2018 10:41am

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

I don’t think it’s allowed in this country but I’d love if you could set up a competition to buy your house.

You base it off the Saturday night bonus ball. So divide the selling price of the house by however many numbers in the lotto. That’s the buy price of a number and whoever chooses the bonus ball wins the House (tenant in situ).

I’ve seen it done with bikes, boats and cars. I’m also still a bit tipsy but trying to think outside the box for ya

I bought a raffle ticket for a house being raffked by the local gaa club a good few years ago.
I didn't win.

11-02-2018 3:21pm

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

I don’t think it’s allowed in this country but I’d love if you could set up a competition to buy your house.

You base it off the Saturday night bonus ball. So divide the selling price of the house by however many numbers in the lotto. That’s the buy price of a number and whoever chooses the bonus ball wins the House (tenant in situ).

I’ve seen it done with bikes, boats and cars. I’m also still a bit tipsy but trying to think outside the box for ya

People do that with cars, but the difference is the price.

Lets say your house is worth €150k. There are 50 numbers in the lotto, i believe. That means everyone has to pay €3k for a ticket. Cant see you finding 50 people all willing to spend €3k knowing that 49 of them will walk away with nothing.

perhaps if youve a lot of cash to spare,but the trick is finding 50 people.

KellyXX · 11-02-2018 4:34pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

People do that with cars, but the difference is the price.

Lets say your house is worth €150k. There are 50 numbers in the lotto, i believe. That means everyone has to pay €3k for a ticket. Cant see you finding 50 people all willing to spend €3k knowing that 49 of them will walk away with nothing.

perhaps if youve a lot of cash to spare,but the trick is finding 50 people.

When I entered the raffle for the house there were 2500 tickets at €100 each.

12-02-2018 5:04am

KellyXX wrote: »

When I entered the raffle for the house there were 2500 tickets at €100 each.

Thats your local GAA club? The idea floated was to use the lotto.

Out of curiousity, what was the situation that lead to a GAA club raffling a house? In my head I envisage that it was it only worth half the price of the raffle or so (ie; 125k or 150k or such?) and it was a player's? The idea behind the raffle being to raise money (the difference) for the club?

or am I way off?

April 73 · 12-02-2018 8:59am

I think in your shoes OP I would start the RTB case rolling so that eventually you will get your tenant out by due legal process.

I would have my solicitor write to the council to tell them you are putting the house on the market with the tenant in-situ and if you do not receive the market rate for your property with the tenant still there you will sue for the amount you lost.
Find an estate agent who will take on the property with the tenant there. Put a sign up outside & have scheduled visits. The tenant will see the writing on the wall & they need to start applying pressure to the council to find them accomodation. At the moment it suits the council & the tenant to maintain the status quo. You need to have the tenant agitating the council too.

Completely random idea here but if the tenant could be placed in short term accomodation, your property would be empty & could be purchased by the council. Is there any possibility of this?

My big fear is that the next legislation change will be to remove the right to have your propert back when you want to sell or move in yourself. What the council officer told you about “this coming from the top” is nonsense. Just to put the pressure on I would put in a Freedom of Information request to see where & from whom that has been communicated as council policy. Turn the pressure up!

KellyXX · 12-02-2018 9:15am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Thats your local GAA club? The idea floated was to use the lotto.

Out of curiousity, what was the situation that lead to a GAA club raffling a house? In my head I envisage that it was it only worth half the price of the raffle or so (ie; 125k or 150k or such?) and it was a player's? The idea behind the raffle being to raise money (the difference) for the club?

or am I way off?

Close. Someone willed the house to the club.

12-02-2018 10:14am

And just like that, a post comes up on my Facebook feed for a raffle for a house in donegal. Sorry mods for the off topic posts

4ensic15 · 13-02-2018 8:12am

April 73 wrote: »

I think in your shoes OP I would start the RTB case rolling so that eventually you will get your tenant out by due legal process.

I would have my solicitor write to the council to tell them you are putting the house on the market with the tenant in-situ and if you do not receive the market rate for your property with the tenant still there you will sue for the amount you lost.
Find an estate agent who will take on the property with the tenant there. Put a sign up outside & have scheduled visits. The tenant will see the writing on the wall & they need to start applying pressure to the council to find them accomodation. At the moment it suits the council & the tenant to maintain the status quo. You need to have the tenant agitating the council too.

Completely random idea here but if the tenant could be placed in short term accomodation, your property would be empty & could be purchased by the council. Is there any possibility of this?

My big fear is that the next legislation change will be to remove the right to have your propert back when you want to sell or move in yourself. What the council officer told you about “this coming from the top” is nonsense. Just to put the pressure on I would put in a Freedom of Information request to see where & from whom that has been communicated as council policy. Turn the pressure up!

The council will not be liable for a tenant overholding and will not be ordered to pay compensation. they have a clause in the agreement with the landlord limiting their liability to one months rent.
Having viewings with a tenant in situ is a breach of the tenants right to quiet enjoyment and could lead to a complaint from the tenant. There is no obligation on the tenant to allow viewings. Even putting up a for sale sign in the garden coud be an interference with the tenants right of quiet enjoyment.

dechol · 13-02-2018 9:06pm

This happened me too earlier in year.Ras Tenant was supposed to move out in mid December. Didn't leave. I lodged a dispute with PRTB immediately. Dispute hearing was set for late Jan but Council moved tenant once dispute hearing date was set. So only took about about four weeks to sort. DCC paid me for that time. I now have keys back. However DCC council said they would check house and call me if any issues. I couldn't meet them at house as only time offered was morning and I work! No phonecall to say any issues so I assumed all was ok. House is wrecked.loads of stuff left behind. Took two skips to clear. Wardrobes broken, rooms painted bright colours, dog **** everywhere even though no pets allowed. Lots missing from house....kettle, toaster, tv was smashed out the back yard and left . Tenant even took all the light bulbs! Bins full and account closed and not collected. I am now trying to get money back from DCC as way beyond wear and tear.

April 73 · 13-02-2018 9:44pm

4ensic15 wrote: »

Having viewings with a tenant in situ is a breach of the tenants right to quiet enjoyment and could lead to a complaint from the tenant. There is no obligation on the tenant to allow viewings. Even putting up a for sale sign in the garden coud be an interference with the tenants right of quiet enjoyment.

The tenant has been given s valid notice to quit. Once they go past that date and are overholding do they still retain their tenants rights? So they can breach their side of an agreement and stay beyond their notice but woe betide a LL putting a For Sale notice in the garden of the property he owns. Because it might interfere with the tenant’s quiet enjoyment of the house they have legitimately been asked to leave? There’s something very wrong with the balance of rights between tenant & landlord these days.

Claw Hammer · 14-02-2018 5:40pm

April 73 wrote: »

The tenant has been given s valid notice to quit. Once they go past that date and are overholding do they still retain their tenants rights? So they can breach their side of an agreement and stay beyond their notice but woe betide a LL putting a For Sale notice in the garden of the property he owns. Because it might interfere with the tenant’s quiet enjoyment of the house they have legitimately been asked to leave? There’s something very wrong with the balance of rights between tenant & landlord these days.

The notice has not been determined to be valid by anyone but the landlord at this stage. If the tenant stays the landlord has to open a dispute with the RTB. It is specifically provided that the tenancy continues during the processing of a dispute. Only when there has been a determination order which has not been complied with does the possibility of the tenant losing rights to quiet enjoyment arise.

County council are happy with their tenants overholding

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